Anacybele Posted November 10, 2016 Share Posted November 10, 2016 (edited) You know, Alain who first debuted in his own mini anime series known as the Mega Evolution specials. The guy in dark clothes whose ace Pokemon is a Charizard that Mega evolves to Mega Charizard X. He used to be Professor Sycamore's assistant, and his companion is a girl named Mairin (whom he pushed away at first). He's slowly become one of my favorite characters. I absolutely adore this guy now. <3 I think he's a badass with pretty deep character and decent development. And I definitely can't complain that he uses Mega Zard X. But I see him get a lot of hate for being "overpowered" or "beating Ash in the Kalos league" or "never losing." These are all ridiculous reasons to hate him. If you don't like his personality or his design or something, that's fine, I'm not going to complain about that. He's not really overpowered because his Charizard is really the only very strong Pokemon he has (Ash beat the rest of his team fairly easily). Him winning in the Kalos league was honestly really good for him if you ask me, because if he'd lost, I'm not sure he would realistically have had nearly as much motivation to continue with his goals as he did after winning (and if he didn't continue with his goals, we don't really have anymore story to see here). He might not have even been compelled to turn against Lysandre (I haven't seen this part yet, but it looks to me like this happens). He felt that losing wasn't an option at all (even if that may not really be true in itself), so if he did, it most likely would've dealt him a major blow not easy to come back from. It helped with his development and ambitions here. Although, I also don't mind Alain winning because it's Alain, of course. :P And the third point is just plain false. Alain has lost battles before, namely to Siebold, and he most likely would've lost to Steven as well. Groudon overpowered his Charizard as well, to the point where Alain was knocked out cold trying to protect it and Mairin had to go rescue him. This also shows some of his flaws. He seems rather naive since Lysandre appears to be manipulating him. He's too rash and too serious at times, and doesn't seem to think Mairin's admiration and companionship is useful to him at all. He doesn't seem to understand these concepts at first, or the concept of having fun. His battle with Ash changed some of this, and there we see some of his development. He didn't really have fun or smile much before this. Now he does! He said himself that he hadn't had this much fun in a long time, and he smiled nearly the whole time. He didn't do this before. I actually think this was the most important thing we see here, rather than whether he wins or loses. And even before this, he finally showed some fondness for Mairin when her Chespin had the lab accident (you really need to see the look he had on his face after this, holy shit). He felt he was mainly to blame for it and wanted to wrong the right. He finally showed another, more caring side of him here. However, I do think at this point now, it WOULD be good for Alain to take a notable loss. It could help him realize that one big loss doesn't mean the end of his journey, because his attitude still feels like it leans more toward that belief. So, am I the only one that really likes Alain or do others here like him too? Edited November 10, 2016 by Anacybele Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Magical Glace Posted November 10, 2016 Share Posted November 10, 2016 I've only seen the specials, and despite my opinion of Charizard I'd say I like the guy and his miniseries far more than the main anime. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alex95 Posted November 10, 2016 Share Posted November 10, 2016 Gah! Spoilers! Haven't seen the end of the Pokemon League yet! ...Heh, kidding. I don't really care. :P I haven't really heard too much hate for Alain, though I am disappointed that Ash didn't call in his own Charizard to fight Alain's. Is this the first league where Ash doesn't use his Charizard? While I think it would be nice for our would-be-Pokemon-Master to win a league for once, I am rather impressed with how quickly Alain rose to the top. But then again, my expectations for the Pokemon Anime are rather low... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Anacybele Posted November 10, 2016 Author Share Posted November 10, 2016 (edited) I admit, I was kind of hoping for Ash to get Mega Zard Y to parallel Alain's Mega Zard X, but I figured the developers thought having both Ash's Charizard AND Trevor's Charizard get Mega Stones might've been repetitive. And I can understand that (and to be honest, a bigger question I have is why didn't Tierno's Blastoise Mega evolve? Like...seriously). I see most of the Alain hate on Bulbagarden as well, not really here, truth be told. As for spoilers, I really should've put a spoiler warning in the title anyway, my bad. I'll do that now. xP Edited November 10, 2016 by Anacybele Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roflolxp54 Posted November 10, 2016 Share Posted November 10, 2016 I haven't really heard too much hate for Alain, though I am disappointed that Ash didn't call in his own Charizard to fight Alain's. Is this the first league where Ash doesn't use his Charizard? While I think it would be nice for our would-be-Pokemon-Master to win a league for once, I am rather impressed with how quickly Alain rose to the top. But then again, my expectations for the Pokemon Anime are rather low... Ash hasn't used his Charizard for a Pokémon League battle since the Silver Conference (Johto). Afterwards, Ash's Charizard's major appearances include the Battle Frontier and the journey between Unova region and Vermilion City. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Punished Dayni Posted November 10, 2016 Share Posted November 10, 2016 Hmm, I haven't seen the anime since 2003, so I'm going to have to ask why this guy's hated. I've been keeping up on some of the events (especially when Ash might have won a league for the first time since I was watching it), so I know he was working for obviously evil hair Lysandre and was in the league. Aside from that and beating Ash (Oh shocker, not beating Ash! It's not like people haven't been doing it for years /s) I can't think of anything much. I don't know the character much at all, so any personality traits to lash out at I wouldn't know. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Anacybele Posted November 10, 2016 Author Share Posted November 10, 2016 ...I stated why he's hated. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Punished Dayni Posted November 10, 2016 Share Posted November 10, 2016 ...I stated why he's hated. Yeah, you stated it in what he did, but I was wondering about his personality. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Anacybele Posted November 10, 2016 Author Share Posted November 10, 2016 Yeah, you stated it in what he did, but I was wondering about his personality. And I described that too... (the seriousness, the brashness, being somewhat naive, he didn't welcome friendship too openly at first as shown by his pushing away Mairin when they first met, etc) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nym Posted November 10, 2016 Share Posted November 10, 2016 I think people are still salty because of the defeat. But I can't very blame them, after the failure of an anime that is Best Wishes, people really liked this season. Also because Ash had finaly 6 pokémon and those who could evolve, evolved. The problem is that they use the scenario to teach the kids that: ''It's okay to lose.'' but the problem is this turned into: ''Ash is a loser, he'll never make his dreams come true.'' which is why a lot of people felt angry. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Punished Dayni Posted November 10, 2016 Share Posted November 10, 2016 And I described that too... (the seriousness, the brashness, being somewhat naive, he didn't welcome friendship too openly at first as shown by his pushing away Mairin when they first met, etc) Well, you did describe it, but you didn't put it so clearly (bit tired myself, which certainly doesn't help), hence why I asked. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alex95 Posted November 10, 2016 Share Posted November 10, 2016 Ash hasn't used his Charizard for a Pokémon League battle since the Silver Conference (Johto). Afterwards, Ash's Charizard's major appearances include the Battle Frontier and the journey between Unova region and Vermilion City. I thought Charizard made an appearance during the Unova League? I didn't finish the season, so idr. I think people are still salty because of the defeat. The problem is that they use the scenario to teach the kids that: ''It's okay to lose.'' but the problem is this turned into: ''Ash is a loser, he'll never make his dreams come true.'' which is why a lot of people felt angry. This is probably it. Everyone wants the main protagonist to win, so when they don't, they take it out on the bad guy. In this case, Alain. Ash has been failing his dream ever since the start, tbh. I don't recall him ever winning a league, he never catches any Legendary Pokemon, Pikachu is too easily defeated in some cases, etc. Red is a far better trainer :P Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Magical Glace Posted November 10, 2016 Share Posted November 10, 2016 Tbh I think the fandom's real issue with Alain beating Ash in the league is the apparent meta reason it happened: a pointless status quo that quite frankly has no reason to continue existing and hasn't since Hoenn at the latest. Ash losing was literally just to prevent him from ever actually reaching his goal and keep him on a futile loop of failure to ensure he remains on the show. People say he's kept around to advertise to kids... but who's a "target audience kid" is changing, and constantly. People who were kids 20 years ago when the series started aren't today, so why is Ash specifically required to advertise to today's kids? It's not to advertise the new generations of the games, otherwise he would have been shafted in favor of the new protagonist in Gen II. It's not his age, since other game protagonists are pretty young as well. It's not his experience, because another character can fill the role of n00b far better than a character who has been on a show for so long can. All it really causes is harm to the series quality to keep him in this loop. Alain is being hit with the blame for something pointless in the meta, which isn't really Alain as a character's fault. It's something that the older fandom is getting frustrated with, and they're directing that at someone directly associated with something in that loop. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Anacybele Posted November 10, 2016 Author Share Posted November 10, 2016 (edited) Why would Ash stop traveling around for badges and such if he won a Pokemon League though? I see no reason to. Hell, I would do that myself, keep traveling to regions for more badges and league challenges even if I already won a league. Where is it even stated that Pokemon League win = you're a Pokemon Master and must end your journey and go home? I think people are still salty because of the defeat. But I can't very blame them, after the failure of an anime that is Best Wishes, people really liked this season. Also because Ash had finaly 6 pokémon and those who could evolve, evolved. The problem is that they use the scenario to teach the kids that: ''It's okay to lose.'' but the problem is this turned into: ''Ash is a loser, he'll never make his dreams come true.'' which is why a lot of people felt angry. Yeah, I don't blame people for wanting Ash to win a league, I'd like him to win one too. But that's no reason to hate the character that beat him. Edited November 10, 2016 by Anacybele Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Magical Glace Posted November 10, 2016 Share Posted November 10, 2016 Why would Ash stop traveling around for badges and such if he won a Pokemon League though? I see no reason to. Hell, I would do that myself, keep traveling to regions for more badges and league challenges even if I already won a league. Where is it even stated that Pokemon League win = you're a Pokemon Master and must end your journey and go home?That's the thing, it's not. But after 20 years of failing through one means or another, even across different writing teams, you can't help but notice that it's almost like the writers have no "choice" but to keep this character losing. It makes no sense at all why "Ash must lose" beyond a bizarre, and tiring, status quo to ensure he doesn't get a satisfying conclusion to his story for the sake of keeping him around. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Anacybele Posted November 10, 2016 Author Share Posted November 10, 2016 That's the thing, it's not. But after 20 years of failing through one means or another, even across different writing teams, you can't help but notice that it's almost like the writers have no "choice" but to keep this character losing. It makes no sense at all why "Ash must lose" beyond a bizarre, and tiring, status quo to ensure he doesn't get a satisfying conclusion to his story for the sake of keeping him around. Yeah, I wish the writers would change their mindset on this... I just can't see Ash suddenly going home and never battling for a badge or championship again after he wins ONE league. In fact, he's technically already won a league! The Orange League! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nym Posted November 10, 2016 Share Posted November 10, 2016 Yeah, I don't blame people for wanting Ash to win a league, I'd like him to win one too. But that's no reason to hate the character that beat him. I think it's also because the majority of the audience overestimated Ash-Greninja vs Alain's Mega Charizard Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MC1 Posted July 24, 2021 Share Posted July 24, 2021 oh yeah WELL EXPLAIN EPISODE 14 XY&Z ASSHOLE OHHHH I WISH HE NEVER ARRIVED THERE WHAT AN ASSHOLE FUCKER Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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