Jump to content

Why I think Alec is an actually good unit (FE4)


OliKad
 Share

Recommended Posts

Hey folks! I just felt like doing a completely unnecessary text on why I feel like Alec is actually a pretty good unit in my opinion. So yeah, just keep on reading...

First off, I just want to clarify that I don't think that he is freakin' amazing and/or better than Sigurd or anything like that, but whatever. But still, I think he does have many redeeming qualities that makes him totally worth using overall. First, let's talk about his skills. Alec, while not having access to any class skills, does have two personal ones permanently attached to him: Pursuit and Nihil/Awareness. Pursuit is possibly the MOST important skill in the game, because it essentially allows a character to function like a ''normal'' unit in the series, and also because it has a near 100% chance of doubling your damage output for a round of combat. But Nihil, while much more situational, also has its cool uses! It basically negates anything that is not Wrath and normal attacks, such as critical hits, effective damage and even enemy offensive skills. I dare to say that this makes Alec into an ideal choice for specific situations, such as recruiting Ayra - dues to Nihil negating the super-nasty Astra - and if he has lucky stat growths, he may even handle most of the dracoknights in Chapter 5 because of the horseslayers being horrible against him, or he could do it with foot-locked units if he's not good enough. Point is, while one of those two skills will not be always useful, they do work quite well in his favor.

Secondly, how is Alec exactly as a combat unit? Well, the big reason why he is salvageable for many people is because of this: Alec is a Cavalier, with perfect availability, in FE4. Since Genealogy is (in)famously known for its HUGE maps, being a mounted unit in this game is perhaps the biggest thing you can going for you, since you can traverse way more rapidly terrain and join the fight before all foot-locked soldiers. And let's not also forget the ability to move the remaining distance after doing an action (Canto). And since he joins at the same time as Zigludo-Senpai Sigurd, Alec can be put to use immediately!

Lastly, what about his stats? Honestly, this is where it kinda falls off. While he does have pretty soolid base HP for FE standards, his other startings stats are otherwise only Okay, especially with a mediocre Defense of 7. As for growth rates, since he is from the famous Cain archetype, Ale sure likes getting good Skill. However, his Speed actually only has one more point than Strength at base (10 vs. 9) and both stats share a 30% growth (and Defense also has a 30% growth, strangely). Even then, since enemies are not terribly fast and that swords are really light, he will pretty much always double anyway, so it barely matters. However, it is true that is Strength is shaky, but I do think that 16 to 17 Power when freshly promoted at Lvl. 20 is good enough to work out. At worst, he could be a solid weakener for others, y'know?

Speaking of, his promotion to Paladin is serviceable, but still one of the weakest gains in the game, with +2 or 3 points in every stat that isn't Magic or Resistance (+5, surprinsingly) and a better rank in Lances. Sure, many would argue that being locked from Silver and Blade weapons is a bummer, but Steel has not exactly garbage might, and should you feel that it's weak, you could still give him a magic sword after promotion, or even Ayra's Brave Sword if you are *ahem* Brave enough. (sorry...). I also think that giving him a high-kill weapon - thanks to his high Skill - is not a horrible idea...

So yeah, this was a stupidly lengthy text about me defending why I think Alec is actually pretty good. Sure, he will not one-round anything on his way, but if you give him the right opportunities, I am certain that he'll fill a spot/niche in your army that is not a benchwarmer!
Please comment and give me your thoughts! ^^
hqdefault.jpg

Edited by OliKad
Link to comment
Share on other sites

The best use of Alec is giving him the magic ring (on promotion) and having him go to town with the light sword. Nobody really needs the magic ring in gen 1 anyway, and it lets him actually kill things. He has 24-25 attack (he might proc magic once) hitting resistance (from two range) and doubles almost all gen 1 enemies with average speed. and it's enough attack to one round enemies like the cross knights in chapter 3, and if he does get his magic proc he can even ORKO the hero bow arch knights in chapter 5 from 2 range, all while doing more damage to other enemies like armours than he'd ever do with other weapons (hero sword aside, but let's face it, Alec isn't getting it when better units for it exist).

It's really very effective, and building kills on the light sword is also really nice since it's an incredibly strong weapon with 50 kill on it for Celice in gen 2. It is reliant on Alec promoting in the chapter 3 base before the map, which can be kinda tough, but very manageable if you plan it out. No other unit can really replicate this either (aside from Azel, but he's a lot less durable and a lot harder to train) and when he promotes he's immediately one of your best units. I used to think Alec was pretty bad since his offence with physical weapons isn't that great and Paladin weapon ranks are lame, but gen 1 enemies are juuuust weak enough for him to pull this off.

Edited by General Horace
Link to comment
Share on other sites

The best use of Alec is giving him the magic ring (on promotion) and having him go to town with the light sword. Nobody really needs the magic ring in gen 1 anyway, and it lets him actually kill things. He has 24-25 attack (he might proc magic once) hitting resistance (from two range) and doubles almost all gen 1 enemies with average speed. and it's enough attack to one round enemies like the cross knights in chapter 3, and if he does get his magic proc he can even ORKO the hero bow arch knights in chapter 5 from 2 range, all while doing more damage to other enemies like armours than he'd ever do with other weapons (hero sword aside, but let's face it, Alec isn't getting it when better units for it exist).

It's really very effective, and building kills on the light sword is also really nice since it's an incredibly strong weapon with 50 kill on it for Celice in gen 2. It is reliant on Alec promoting in the chapter 3 base before the map, which can be kinda tough, but very manageable if you plan it out. No other unit can really replicate this either (aside from Azel, but he's a lot less durable and a lot harder to train) and when he promotes he's immediately one of your best units. I used to think Alec was pretty bad since his offence with physical weapons isn't that great and Paladin weapon ranks are lame, but gen 1 enemies are juuuust weak enough for him to pull this off.

Huh, that's actually a very cool idea! I might try it out for my 3rd playthrough. :)

But yeah, I do know that his physical offense is a little weak because of hi average strength, but it's still pretty good for me, because you could send him into a forest close to a a bunch of enemies - like the Chapter 5 Axe Knights - and see him dodge all attacks thanks to his very solid evasion and weaken everyone so that you can clean up everything on Player Phase. I mean, pretty much anyone could do this, but still.

Ah well, it might be just bias at this point :P

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I know its nitpicking but Alec must proc at least one of HP, Def or Speed to be able to actually bait Ayra since he gets ORKO'd otherwise. And if it's speed he has to not be carrying any weapons or else he'll get doubled.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

The best use of Alec is giving him the magic ring (on promotion) and having him go to town with the light sword. Nobody really needs the magic ring in gen 1 anyway, and it lets him actually kill things. He has 24-25 attack (he might proc magic once) hitting resistance (from two range) and doubles almost all gen 1 enemies with average speed. and it's enough attack to one round enemies like the cross knights in chapter 3, and if he does get his magic proc he can even ORKO the hero bow arch knights in chapter 5 from 2 range, all while doing more damage to other enemies like armours than he'd ever do with other weapons (hero sword aside, but let's face it, Alec isn't getting it when better units for it exist).

It's really very effective, and building kills on the light sword is also really nice since it's an incredibly strong weapon with 50 kill on it for Celice in gen 2. It is reliant on Alec promoting in the chapter 3 base before the map, which can be kinda tough, but very manageable if you plan it out. No other unit can really replicate this either (aside from Azel, but he's a lot less durable and a lot harder to train) and when he promotes he's immediately one of your best units. I used to think Alec was pretty bad since his offence with physical weapons isn't that great and Paladin weapon ranks are lame, but gen 1 enemies are juuuust weak enough for him to pull this off.

I know how to make Noish good (Brave Sword), how to make Midir good (Killer Bow) and now I know how to make Alec good (I'll probably use the Thunder Sword instead of the light one, tho).

Now we just need a way to make Ardan good.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I could argue that Midir is also really good with his Hero Bow that he obtains in Chapter 4 if paired with Aideen (and maybe Brigid?). Noish can also be sorta competent with a Pursuit Ring instead, but he may need a Speed Ring as well to consistently double, since a 20% Speed growth isn't exactly kickass...

( LOVE your sig by the way. Poor Azel xD)

Edited by OliKad
Link to comment
Share on other sites

I know its nitpicking but Alec must proc at least one of HP, Def or Speed to be able to actually bait Ayra since he gets ORKO'd otherwise. And if it's speed he has to not be carrying any weapons or else he'll get doubled.

It should be really easy to proc at least one of these (especially with a 70% HP growth). And even then, if he's standing on a forest, Alec might not be touched both times anyway, so it's not really a big deal. :)

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Baiting out Aira is a task best left to unarmed!Cuan. Just put his lances into the storage when you're at the home castle in the beginning and have him pick them up at a different castle later. He can't deal counterattack Brigands that attack him but he's no longer weighed down by his lances and doesn't face Weapon Triangle Disadvantage anymore so he's well off being used as a tank against Axe users.

It's really very effective, and building kills on the light sword is also really nice since it's an incredibly strong weapon with 50 kill on it for Celice in gen 2. It is reliant on Alec promoting in the chapter 3 base before the map, which can be kinda tough, but very manageable if you plan it out.

It's not even that much of a challange actually. Back when I was crazy enough to LTC run this game I found the promotion of Alec to be one of the easier tasks - Lachesis and Dew were far more difficult under the given time constraints.

The good thing about FE4 is that most units, at least in gen 1, have their own unique niche that makes them useable even if they aren't particularly good. Alec is a good example for that.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Baiting out Aira is a task best left to unarmed!Cuan.

Dew actually has just enough move to bait Ayra and isn't doubled by her. I find this to be better since it means you can leave Quan armed. He loses out on some exp that he might get if you leave him with the group of enemies but he can still promote on time.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Baiting out Aira is a task best left to unarmed!Cuan. Just put his lances into the storage when you're at the home castle in the beginning and have him pick them up at a different castle later. He can't deal counterattack Brigands that attack him but he's no longer weighed down by his lances and doesn't face Weapon Triangle Disadvantage anymore so he's well off being used as a tank against Axe users.

That doesn't make sense, though. Why wouldn't you equip Cuan, he's one of the most useful units you have at that point in the game. Even then, making him go to the castle to reequip means that everyone else will be ahead of him (unless you have him reequip at the second castle, but that's a significant portion of the game where he's doing literally nothing). Actually, him just being unequipped probably wastes turns too if enemies go after him and he doesn't have enough Spd at base to avoid getting doubled by Ayra (ASTRA PROCS) anyways; latter is probably easy enough to avoid though if he got same levels.

I dunno, just use Alec, it's way easier.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

That doesn't make sense, though. Why wouldn't you equip Cuan, he's one of the most useful units you have at that point in the game. Even then, making him go to the castle to reequip means that everyone else will be ahead of him (unless you have him reequip at the second castle, but that's a significant portion of the game where he's doing literally nothing). Actually, him just being unequipped probably wastes turns too if enemies go after him and he doesn't have enough Spd at base to avoid getting doubled by Ayra (ASTRA PROCS) anyways; latter is probably easy enough to avoid though if he got same levels.

I dunno, just use Alec, it's way easier.

In the context of LTC Ayra needs to be recruited very far to the left so you do not lose turns recruiting her. The only units that can make it to the place she needs to be baited are Quan and Dew. Ayra will not attack a unit with a lance if she can avoid it(Unless they are close to death) so Quan would have to be unequipped. Alec doesn't have enough move to make it to the bait point unfortunately.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

That doesn't make sense, though. Why wouldn't you equip Cuan, he's one of the most useful units you have at that point in the game. Even then, making him go to the castle to reequip means that everyone else will be ahead of him (unless you have him reequip at the second castle, but that's a significant portion of the game where he's doing literally nothing). Actually, him just being unequipped probably wastes turns too if enemies go after him and he doesn't have enough Spd at base to avoid getting doubled by Ayra (ASTRA PROCS) anyways; latter is probably easy enough to avoid though if he got same levels.

I dunno, just use Alec, it's way easier.

Those are the LTC strats. There's no other way to recruit Aira [= necessary because of the Hero Sword] while completing the map in the least amount of turns possible. It's the only strat that allows both Sigurd to do the maximum amount of stepts on every turn so no turns are lost.

It's also extremely safe and reliable for Cuan because the few things that hit him don't do a lot. Even without a weapon he's fairly useful just because he deflects a lot of enemy firepower away from units like Midir or Fin.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

In the context of LTC Ayra needs to be recruited very far to the left so you do not lose turns recruiting her. The only units that can make it to the place she needs to be baited are Quan and Dew. Ayra will not attack a unit with a lance if she can avoid it(Unless they are close to death) so Quan would have to be unequipped. Alec doesn't have enough move to make it to the bait point unfortunately.

Not talking about LTC. EDIT Even if I was, you'd want to have Cuan equipped because he needs to be pretty far ahead anyways and doesn't have time to be unequipped/go to a castle.

Those are the LTC strats. There's no other way to recruit Aira [= necessary because of the Hero Sword] while completing the map in the least amount of turns possible. It's the only strat that allows both Sigurd to do the maximum amount of stepts on every turn so no turns are lost.

It's also extremely safe and reliable for Cuan because the few things that hit him don't do a lot. Even without a weapon he's fairly useful just because he deflects a lot of enemy firepower away from units like Midir or Fin.

Point isn't that it loses turns, point is that it's a hipster strat that doesn't have any tangible benefits over just using Alec. Why wouldn't you want Cuan to kill things?

Edited by Refa
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Why would you want your exp thief Jeigan to kill things

In strict LTC, doesn't Cuan need to weaken Gandalf the Brown so Sigurd can kill him immediately? Would he be able to afford a detour to get his lances back?

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Not talking about LTC. EDIT Even if I was, you'd want to have Cuan equipped because he needs to be pretty far ahead anyways and doesn't have time to be unequipped/go to a castle.

I know you weren't but the guy who brought up Quan was referring to LTC. To explain the strategy, in order to recruit Ayra without losing turns she needs to be recruited very far to the left. Quan isn't needed for any combat at the start if you rely on skills from Midir, Noish, and Ethlyn so there is technically no turns lost(Though it requires some RNG abuse). Ayra avoids Quan if he has a lance equipped so to avoid that you don't have him equip one. After you bait Ayra you use Aideen to warp Quan back to the home castle then you use Ethlyn to return Aideen. Once Sigurd seizes Marpha you return him then warp Quan to Marpha and on the next turn you Warp Sigurd to Marpha. To recruit Jamke you return Deirdre then sell warp to her so she can warp Aideen to Marpha. There is barely enough move to pull it off but it works. The strategy is a rather old strategy and I honestly don't think it's very good. You can move Dew his maximum movement each turn and get to the same spot that Quan gets to without going through all of what I listed above. It's much easier!

If you aren't going for a low turn count then you can actually avoid Ayra combat altogether if Sigurd seizes the castle and Ayra is in range of him. Ayra's AI in my tests moves towards Sigurd and then doesn't attack him allowing him to recruit her immediately on the next turn. This does require you to Seize the castle rather quickly but it's the most reliable way to recruit her.

Why would you want your exp thief Jeigan to kill things

In strict LTC, doesn't Cuan need to weaken Gandalf the Brown so Sigurd can kill him immediately? Would he be able to afford a detour to get his lances back?

No you can use either a sibling critical or a hit from Noish to chip enough HP away.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • 2 weeks later...

TBH I always found Alec as a usable just not fantastic support unit. Give him a steel sword and he does perfectly fine what with it being a straight upgrade from iron (and with Sigurd packing silver, what else are you going to use his old steel sword for?). Alec can double hit and is immune to crits and specials, and is balanced enough in his stats to level up without any special babysitting. Paladin is a lame promotion though, B rank lances are barfaroni in a game where all weapons weigh the same regardless of rank.

Alec also has some of the funnier saucier lines in the game, too bad he doesn't actually talk that much. God I'd love for a FE4 remake that gave us more engaging character dialogue. Or supports.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

TBH I always found Alec as a usable just not fantastic support unit. Give him a steel sword and he does perfectly fine what with it being a straight upgrade from iron (and with Sigurd packing silver, what else are you going to use his old steel sword for?). Alec can double hit and is immune to crits and specials, and is balanced enough in his stats to level up without any special babysitting. Paladin is a lame promotion though, B rank lances are barfaroni in a game where all weapons weigh the same regardless of rank.

Alec also has some of the funnier saucier lines in the game, too bad he doesn't actually talk that much. God I'd love for a FE4 remake that gave us more engaging character dialogue. Or supports.

There you go, you just summarized my thousands words into a hundred. I feel like I completely wasted my time! xD

With that said, I'd really like to start the FE4 remake master race. ;)

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.

 Share

  • Recently Browsing   0 members

    • No registered users viewing this page.
×
×
  • Create New...