Fire Emblem Heroes General Discussion and Links

[Ice Dragon]

6 hours ago, Parrhesia said:

That's a big advantage.

Only subjectively so. There is no objective comparison between how much better 1 additional character in the roster is compared to an increase in the number of 5-star characters you pull, and it clearly varies from person to person.

 

6 hours ago, Parrhesia said:

Efficiency is a lie,

Okay, now this is just plain ignorant, and either assumes that everyone else has the same mindset as you or pretends that math doesn't exist.

[XRay]

6 hours ago, Parrhesia said:

It depends on what you value. Hurling orbs at everything with the possibility of success is for most people, I imagine, more satisfying than building up to 15/20 orbs, opening the circle and Fuck there's no reds.

Unless the player does not care about getting the most out of their Orbs, that is a huge waste of pitybreaking rate, and I find wasting 20 Orbs constantly on every Foci with low pitybreaking rates to be far less satisfying than saving up 300+ Orbs and be almost guaranteed to get a 5* unit.

6 hours ago, Parrhesia said:

In early- and midgame, you need more guys anyway, of any colour

That is what Legendary/Mythic Hero Foci are for.

6 hours ago, Parrhesia said:

by endgame, you've got the tools to clear all content anyway, and it's just about cruising through and maximising enjoyment.

You cannot get to the endgame without at least building up a variety of units and saving for some premium fodder, and better resource management helps you get there a little faster and with a little less stress.

6 hours ago, Parrhesia said:

Efficiency is a lie, anarchy reigns, unless the Only thing that brings satisfaction in the entire gacha system to a person is if they get the Right anime girl PNG.

Not every player just yolos their gameplay and resources. A lot of players seek guidance in the "questions" thread here and on YouTube, Reddit, Gamepress, etc. to make sure they are spending their resources as efficiently as possible.

Telling other players to do whatever they want does not answer their question, and saying things like efficiency is a lie is especially counterproductive for new players who may not know what pity breaking rates are, sending home limited units for Feathers is a bad idea, etc. If they do these things without understanding what the consequences are, they may regret that action later on. These players are relying on veterans' experience and knowledge, and it would irresponsible and unethical to tell them to do what they want without also disclosing material facts and common expected outcomes.

For example, a common question is whether +Atk or +Spd is better. For 90% of the game, the nature honestly does not matter, but players who ask this question are usually asking it because they want to use a unit in Abyssal or Aether Raids, where natures do matter. It would be irresponsible of me to just tell them that natures do not matter for most of the game without also disclosing material facts that Abyssal and Aether Raids have different types of enemies with different vulnerability, where +Atk is better against the high bulk low Spd Abyssal enemies and +Spd is better against super fast enemies seen in Aether Raids.

[Kaden]

Urban's unique refinement made me wonder about a hypothetical question: how would CYL Ike do if he had access to Ice Mirror or to make it crazier, an all range version of Ice Mirror? I know it would be multiplicative, it could be inconsistent depending on if it activates on the first or second hits, and he'd need to inherit Distant Counter to make the most out of Ice Mirror, but I'm curious how this would all play out.

Edited September 13, 2019 by Kaden

[XRay]

1 hour ago, Kaden said:

Urban's unique refinement made me wonder about a hypothetical question: how would CYL Ike do if he had access to Ice Mirror or to make it crazier, an all range version of Ice Mirror? I know it would be multiplicative, it could be inconsistent depending on if it activates on the first or second hits, and he'd need to inherit Distant Counter to make the most out of Ice Mirror, but I'm curious how this would all play out.

Stupid good, especially if it is an all range Ice Mirror.

@Anacybele, this BH!Ike might not get you consistent Aether Raids defense wins, but it sure as hell would annoy any player on offense who forgot to bring a Firesweep nuke or Ophelia.

Behold the glory of the nigh unkillable mighty BH!Ike. Yes, he is [+Res, -HP]! Yes, he is merge+0! Yes, he has no Flowers! And yes, he has no buffs! He can survive against the most fiery of monsters!

Spoiler

CHALLENGER LIST  
Ike (Brave) (5* +res -hp)  
Weapon: Urvan  
Special: Pavise  
A: Distant Counter  
B: Shield Pulse 3  
S: Deflect Melee 3  
Upgrade Path: 5  

Against one of the best little sisters in all of Fire Emblem history, the super cute imouto and spicy hot Carolina Reaper: Laevatein! She got 14 damage, DF+10, 2 Duma cheerleaders, 7/7/7/7 bonus buffs, and fully charged Moonbow.

Spoiler

ENEMIES - CUSTOM LIST  
Laevatein (5*+10 +atk -hp)  
Weapon: Laevatein  
Special: Moonbow  
A: Distant Counter  
B: Vantage 3  
S: Brazen Atk Spd 3  

(I know BH!Ike is using Pavise instead of Escutcheon to simulate Ice Mirror, and charged Glimmer from Laevatein will kill BH!Ike, but we are trying to make BH!Ike look good here.)

Edited September 13, 2019 by XRay

[Kaden]

4 minutes ago, XRay said:

Stupid good, especially if it is an all range Ice Mirror.

I figured so, but I guess I should have been more specific. So, mathematically what would it look like or examples which you did give through the matchup against Laevatein.

Shield Pulse 4 and an inheritable stronger variant of Aegis, Escutcheon, Pavise, and Sacred Cowl would be interesting on CYL Ike. Perhaps overkill, but why not.

Edited September 13, 2019 by Kaden

[XRay]

21 minutes ago, Kaden said:

I figured so, but I guess I should have been more specific. So, mathematically what would it look like or examples which you did give through the matchup against Laevatein.

Oof. Doing math manually is not my forte. There might be mistakes.

Urvan reduces first attack by 40% and Pavise reduces it by another 50%, so 0.6*0.5=0.3. That means it reduces the first attack by a total of 70%.

Laevatein has 113 Atk, so 113*1.2=135 since she is red and he is green.

135 Laevatein's Atk - 35 BH!Ike's Def = 100 damage. That was easy.

100*0.7=70, so BH!Ike hand waved away 70 points of Laevatein's potential damage.

Shield Pulse furthers subtracts 5 damage, so 70+5=75. Not so spicy anymore!

I guess the whole formula looks something like this:
Neutral Matchup
(Foe's Atk - Unit's Def)*(0.6*0.5) + 5 = deflected damage
Weak Matchup
(1.2[Foe's Atk] - Unit's Def)*(0.6*0.5) + 5 = deflected damage
Strong Matchup
(0.8[Foe's Atk] - Unit's Def)*(0.6*0.5) + 5 = deflected damage

Edited September 13, 2019 by XRay

[Baldrick]

 

6 hours ago, XRay said:

You cannot get to the endgame without at least building up a variety of units and saving for some premium fodder, and better resource management helps you get there a little faster and with a little less stress.

For a new player, good resource management isn't about finding the best chance of getting a 5* unit. It's about making the most of what's they already have (between the free units and the guides, a new player can reach endgame level without spending a single orb) and learning what they lack so they know what units/fodder will help them complete their specific goal. Effectiveness is more important than efficiency.

 

[Anacybele]

3 hours ago, XRay said:

@Anacybelethis BH!Ike might not get you consistent Aether Raids defense wins, but it sure as hell would annoy any player on offense who forgot to bring a Firesweep nuke or Ophelia.

Behold the glory of the nigh unkillable mighty BH!Ike. Yes, he is [+Res, -HP]! Yes, he is merge+0! Yes, he has no Flowers! And yes, he has no buffs! He can survive against the most fiery of monsters!

  Reveal hidden contents

CHALLENGER LIST  
Ike (Brave) (5* +res -hp)  
Weapon: Urvan  
Special: Pavise  
A: Distant Counter  
B: Shield Pulse 3  
S: Deflect Melee 3  
Upgrade Path: 5  

 

Damn. lol I wish I could build that, but I don't have fodder for either Distant Counter Or Shield Pulse. xP

[XRay]

55 minutes ago, Baldrick said:

For a new player, good resource management isn't about finding the best chance of getting a 5* unit. It's about making the most of what's they already have (between the free units and the guides, a new player can reach endgame level without spending a single orb) and learning what they lack so they know what units/fodder will help them complete their specific goal. Effectiveness is more important than efficiency.

Efficient Orb spending helps. You are not guaranteed to get anything, but being able to take advantage of pity rates and focusing on Legendary/Mythic Hero Foci increases your chances of getting useful fodder and units. And for new free players who have limited Orbs and need a variety of ready-to-use units quickly, Legendary/Mythic Hero Foci are a great way to accomplish that.

Players can also spend Orbs on regular Foci if they feature the players' favorite characters or desired skill fodder, but if the Focus is something they can do without, they should avoid spending Orbs on it just because they hit 20 Orbs. You cannot budget for end game if you keep spending Orbs here and there whenever you hit 20 Orbs. In my opinion, if players are committed to summoning from a Focus, they should at least budget enough Orbs to break their pity rate at least once.

54 minutes ago, Anacybele said:

Damn. lol I wish I could build that, but I don't have fodder for either Distant Counter Or Shield Pulse. xP

You can probably skip Distant Counter and just stick with Steady Breath if you just want to focus on annoying players who utilize melee units. Running Steady Breath would help BH!Ike charge Pavise faster. If might be even more effective than Distant Counter since you just want BH!Ike to stall rather than dealing damage.

Shield Pulse is kind of expensive, but Fjorm reappears every 3 to 4 months in Legendary/Mythic Hero Foci, so players can always save up during that time and grab Shield Pulse when it shows up.

[Anacybele]

6 minutes ago, XRay said:

You can probably skip Distant Counter and just stick with Steady Breath if you just want to focus on annoying players who utilize melee units. Running Steady Breath would help BH!Ike charge Pavise faster. If might be even more effective than Distant Counter since you just want BH!Ike to stall rather than dealing damage.

Shield Pulse is kind of expensive, but Fjorm reappears every 3 to 4 months in Legendary/Mythic Hero Foci, so players can always save up during that time and grab Shield Pulse when it shows up.

I see. I'll have to consider it for when Fjorm's on a banner I don't need much from.

[Parrhesia]

19 hours ago, XRay said:

Unless the player does not care about getting the most out of their Orbs, that is a huge waste of pitybreaking rate, and I find wasting 20 Orbs constantly on every Foci with low pitybreaking rates to be far less satisfying than saving up 300+ Orbs and be almost guaranteed to get a 5* unit.

That is what Legendary/Mythic Hero Foci are for.

You cannot get to the endgame without at least building up a variety of units and saving for some premium fodder, and better resource management helps you get there a little faster and with a little less stress.

Not every player just yolos their gameplay and resources. A lot of players seek guidance in the "questions" thread here and on YouTube, Reddit, Gamepress, etc. to make sure they are spending their resources as efficiently as possible.

Telling other players to do whatever they want does not answer their question, and saying things like efficiency is a lie is especially counterproductive for new players who may not know what pity breaking rates are, sending home limited units for Feathers is a bad idea, etc. If they do these things without understanding what the consequences are, they may regret that action later on. These players are relying on veterans' experience and knowledge, and it would irresponsible and unethical to tell them to do what they want without also disclosing material facts and common expected outcomes.

For example, a common question is whether +Atk or +Spd is better. For 90% of the game, the nature honestly does not matter, but players who ask this question are usually asking it because they want to use a unit in Abyssal or Aether Raids, where natures do matter. It would be irresponsible of me to just tell them that natures do not matter for most of the game without also disclosing material facts that Abyssal and Aether Raids have different types of enemies with different vulnerability, where +Atk is better against the high bulk low Spd Abyssal enemies and +Spd is better against super fast enemies seen in Aether Raids.

If you consider spunking out your orbs to be a waste, I'm genuinely not sure where gacha holds its appeal.

If you resolve to only pull for six days a month, sure.

I mean, maybe you can't? I know a guy who has a barracks of like 30 units, because he's insane. I've never saved for a skill in my life, and yet here I am, tier 21 AR, 20 arena, all single-player maps outside the abyssal LHBs (and, like, a couple Hard CCs, lol) cleared. Good things will accumulate over time. Sure, you can make it there faster, but bluntly, is speedrunning really the goal here? You can say I'm being subjective about it. I am. Sniping vs. full-pulling being more satisfying is obviously subjective, which is why I'm not sweating contesting the point on four-person banners feeling better (beyond to contest some idea that three-person banners feel better for everyone). It's not impossible that someone out there panics over every expenditure unless it's the Most Efficient in this mobile all-stars game. But 'less stress'? Why the hell is stress coming into play? And why will spartan resource-rationing help that, outside of the two guys in the world whose sole objective is to very quickly build a hyper-efficient squad regardless of personal feelings? And why do we do these maps? To get resources. Outside of the Abyssal HBs, pretty much the entire game is a cycle to get and subsequently spend orbs and feathers to have more and bigger and cooler units, and if that process instead becomes about having four Eirs with Close Counter and one +10 4* Cecilia, what is the point? (I am gonna fucking die laughing if anyone whines that I'm not using a ~correct~ example.)

Effort-posting on the fucking obvious joke that 'there is no such thing as efficiency' sure is some kind of move, I guess. Yes, I'm aware that people can look for guidance. Yes, I'm aware that guidance exists. If some guy asks if +speed or +defence Effie is better, yeah, it's +defence. Hell, between this quote and my post, we're seeing some good advice !!on this very page!! by, yes, you! But holy everloving fuck does the vocal meta on-site seem to have lost sight of the forest for the trees. And what precisely the commentary on 'sometimes people ask questions' has to do with my overarching point, I'm not certain.

(While we're here, though? A lot of the time here, that advice seems to become 'want to beat that map? Well, stop playing the game for two months until a better unit drops into your lap!' Blowing 500 orbs on what will probably become three Hectors (or whatever) is never going to be a solution worth the cost, unless you have a very specific set of priorities. Most people do not, and simply asking a question does not indicate that one does.)

20 hours ago, Ice Dragon said:

Only subjectively so. There is no objective comparison between how much better 1 additional character in the roster is compared to an increase in the number of 5-star characters you pull, and it clearly varies from person to person.

So. Hypothetically, every new unit that comes out has a chance of being one that you like, and also a chance of having a cool skillset that you can either use on their chassis or cannibalise. The numbers don't actually matter here. Rolling more dice means more guys you like and, if you have no opinions at all on the cast (which, I mean, you're called Ice Dragon and your avatar is Ninian), more skills. If the sole metric that matters is maximum number of 5* guys, then like XRay says, why not pull on exclusively 8% banners? 'Because it's absolutely fucking insane?' Correct! But you'd be better served doing that than hoping for some marginal increase in likelihood on a 6%. One that, look, I'm not a fucking expert, but I'm guessing that only counts for sniping, which is unpalatable to most people in most situations. (If I'm wrong, I don't honestly care. It's not gonna be 2%.)

Edited September 14, 2019 by Parrhesia

[Anacybele]

Elibe Lost Lore? Yawn...

Oh well, at least there's some decent rewards.

So, I've been coming up with ideas on what Sylvain could be like in Heroes since I reaaally want him in the game now. 😛 I've just fallen in love with him! He'll surely be the now rather boring lance cavalry unit type due to the Lance of Ruin and his "canon" class line being cavalier, but I'll do my best to give him some kind of niche despite.

Sylvain: Gautier's Lady Lover

Color: Blue (Lance)
Movement Type: Cavalry

Weapon: Lance of Ruin - Mt 16. Grants Atk/Def+2. Effective against dragon and flying foes. If user's Def is higher than foe's Def, calculates damage using the lower of foe's Def or Res.
Special: Ruined Sky - 2 Cooldown. Boosts damage by 20% of foe's Atk. If in combat against a dragon foe or flying foe, boosts damage by 40% instead of 20%. (Prerequisites are Dragon Gaze and Draconic Aura.)

A: Sturdy Ground (an enemy phase version of Sturdy Impact) or Sturdy Stance 3 (both would be new)
B: Vantage 3
C - Def Tactic 3

HP: 42
Atk: 37
Spd: 27
Def: 35
Res: 24

BST: 165

Hope this doesn't seem too powercreepy or anything. I don't actually believe IS will give Sylvain a full ABC set due to how they tend to treat males in this game. 😕 But if he were to get one, I feel like this is a realistic idea. And the idea's nice anyway. Lance of Ruin gets dragon and flying effectiveness because in Three Houses, Ruined Sky has that and it's the Lance of Ruin-only combat art. And here, I decided Ruined Sky is just a slightly different version of Byleth's Ruptured Sky. Makes sense, I think.

Stats and skills are partly based off of my own experiences using Sylvain in Three Houses (which is more or less him hitting like a freakin' truck and taking hits like a boss), and partly to compliment the effects I gave the Lance of Ruin. And as an enemy in TH, he's basically a tank on a horse anyway, so yeah. But I gave him a more decent Res stat here so he doesn't simply look like Silas/blue Frederick statwise.

What do you all think? I want to post this in the "create a character" thread too, but it seems to have gotten buried somewhere.

Edited September 14, 2019 by Anacybele

[EricaofRenais]

This last GC map was annoying and kept tripping me up so I missed out on getting to tier 25 this time.  I guess I was just careless playing this time.  This is the first time I didn't make tier 25 and I am just mad at myself because I normally do it without problems.  I guess I was just having an off day.

[XRay]

4 hours ago, Parrhesia said:

Sure, you can make it there faster, but bluntly, is speedrunning really the goal here?

Based on most players' responses to various game modes, I would say yes. Hardly anyone wants to grind through Tier 20 Aether Raids and most people want to achieve Tier 21 as soon as possible and just chill there.

The same can be said for Arena when that was the most end game mode.

A lot of people would also like to clear Abyssal with or without guides as soon as possible.

4 hours ago, Parrhesia said:

But 'less stress'? Why the hell is stress coming into play? And why will spartan resource-rationing help that, outside of the two guys in the world whose sole objective is to very quickly build a hyper-efficient squad regardless of personal feelings?

If you check out the Aether Raids thread, especially the beginning pages, people were stressed and frustrated because the mode was difficult. It has died down quite a bit as players either gave up on the mode, has reached Tier 21, or has just come to terms with it, although there are still vocal complaints time to time.

The same can be said for Arena, especially during the first year when players scored high enough to encounter maxed out pony teams but not high enough to score out ponies as opponents.

PvE maps are usually have less complaints, but people were up in arms over Relay Defense. I think Abyssal was also not well received by some people when it was first introduced as it was too difficult for some to solve.

More efficient resource management means you have more options. Players who save and break their pity rates generally have more 5* units and skill fodder at their disposal compared to a player who just spends 20 Orbs whenever they get the chance.

4 hours ago, Parrhesia said:

And why do we do these maps? To get resources. Outside of the Abyssal HBs, pretty much the entire game is a cycle to get and subsequently spend orbs and feathers to have more and bigger and cooler units, and if that process instead becomes about having four Eirs with Close Counter and one +10 4* Cecilia, what is the point?

Completing maps is not always about resources. Players may want to complete it because they are completionists or that it feels good to see it checked off. About half the quests the game rewards us with are rather near useless items like Shards and Crystals, and most players honestly are not completing them for Shards and Crystals.

4 hours ago, Parrhesia said:

(While we're here, though? A lot of the time here, that advice seems to become 'want to beat that map? Well, stop playing the game for two months until a better unit drops into your lap!' Blowing 500 orbs on what will probably become three Hectors (or whatever) is never going to be a solution worth the cost, unless you have a very specific set of priorities. Most people do not, and simply asking a question does not indicate that one does.)

The only time I see people recommend a super specific setup is in regards to using super tank team for Aether Raids, since the concept of that team is very specific. I specifically recommend Sharena for players who want to climb Aether Raids with the least effort because she is a frequent bonus unit that everyone has and Fensalir is a great tanking Weapon. The only Orbs the player needs to spend is on Distant Counter and a second Eir. And if the player wants to reduce their Orb costs further, they can use Nowi instead, but the Feather cost is going to skyrocket by an additional 200,000 Feathers and they might need to spend Orbs on a premium A skill anyways to achieve similar effectiveness.

That might not seem cost effective for you, but I have yet to see anyone suggesting a cheaper, more reliable, and more brain dead team than what I have suggested. Counter-Vantage is only brain dead easy against defense teams that are unprepared for it, it is not as reliable in higher tiers, and it requires the sacking of the free Takumi that players might want to keep for guides. Galeforce requires experience to use effectively and Player Phase teams in general can be mentally taxing after heavy use.

For difficult PvE maps, the most often recommended set up is to use a nuke with 3 Dancers/Singers or some variation of pony teams if they want to cheese it. It is cheap and effective and it does not require the player to spend Orbs on any 5* exclusive units. It might not work for every new Abyssal map, but it should work for most of the old ones and all other difficulties.

Edited September 14, 2019 by XRay

[silverserpent]

Working on building M!Robin and trying to decide on his B-skill. I've got Bow Breaker in there for the moment as a place holder, but I'm debating on if Null C-disrupt would be a good fit for him due to Tactical Bolt? He's already fully flowered, just waiting on feathers for merges since he's sitting at +3.

[Fire Emblem Fan]

That GC put me on all three teams. I would have preferred to just be on Helbindi's but eh. Diversity.

Elibe Lost Lore? Heck yeah! Best continent here we go! Definitely gonna be making use of every Elibe character I can here.

[Sunwoo]

Obviously this is wishful thinking, but it'd be nice if the next new heroes banner was an Elibe banner with Rath (and Nils).

[SockPuppet]

Random thought: we might receive a second set of hot springs heroes in January. Three Houses might receive a DLC update that allows us to use the sauna as a monastery activity. First round of 3H alts then?

[Fire Emblem Fan]

5 hours ago, SockPuppet said:

Random thought: we might receive a second set of hot springs heroes in January. Three Houses might receive a DLC update that allows us to use the sauna as a monastery activity. First round of 3H alts then?

I hope not, I'd rather get more new 3H characters and let at least a year pass before we start getting alts of anyone.

[Sunwoo]

Echoes units didn't get alts until like Fallen Celica anyway. Besides, our only seasonal Echoes alts are picnic Genny and picnic Lukas.

[Michelaar]

1 hour ago, Sunwoo said:

Echoes units didn't get alts until like Fallen Celica anyway. Besides, our only seasonal Echoes alts are picnic Genny and picnic Lukas.

Berkut and Rinea say hi.

[DraceEmpressa]

I noticed that this year, with the exception of 3H and Brave banner, each New Heroes banner has at least one beast or dragon unit. So that's the new plan? They seem to milk all non-humans  they had into FEH. In b4 not only Morva or Dheginsea, they'll even make Almedha , Gotoh, and Xane as dragon units. 'cause dragons are easy to make broken of.

[Hilda]

6 hours ago, DraceEmpressa said:

I noticed that this year, with the exception of 3H and Brave banner, each New Heroes banner has at least one beast or dragon unit. So that's the new plan? They seem to milk all non-humans  they had into FEH. In b4 not only Morva or Dheginsea, they'll even make Almedha , Gotoh, and Xane as dragon units. 'cause dragons are easy to make broken of.

they are adressing the complaints from last year. We had like what? 6 Dragon units or so?

What the Alternativ overinflated sword infantries or Lance Flyers? I am not a fan of dragons (still think they are too strong with adaptiv damage) But it makes more sense to release units people want, and Dragons seem to be very welcome.

We could use though some Axe flyers cavs and infantry units. Also Lance infantry units.

Maybe some regular Armor Tome users

[Anacybele]

13 hours ago, Fire Emblem Fan said:

I hope not, I'd rather get more new 3H characters and let at least a year pass before we start getting alts of anyone.

Agreed. I need Sylvain! So bring on more Three Houses, IS! ^^

[EricaofRenais]

Well Elphin is mentioned by name in the latest Lost Lore, I wonder if this means he has any chance of getting to the game?  Elphin is my favorite Binding Blade character, so I would love it if he was added, but IS loves mentioning people but not adding them, or adds them years later.