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Perhaps IS was trying to get into the China market with Tellius- their historical erotic preference is for the legs (hence their liking of leg slits on dresses) I once heard from an East Asia professor. And on that topic, why the meaningless jump towards the enemy at the end of Impale? Is Sentinel Nephenee trying to do a Bayonetta-esque tease of sorts and go "as you die, take a look at what you'll never get"?

Geoffrey is Finn 2.0, that explains why he is what he is. The blue hair, the Brave Lance, a horse- all Finn.

And I'd also like to add to Heather to the pile of bad Tellius characters (alongside Aran and Ilyana). Heather is no Soleil (not that I'd know much given I haven't watched a single scene of plot or support in Fates- I've skipped everything from the beginning due to how much people have criticized them), but Heather is awful in the few conversations she has. She bashes men and is willing to con them for no good stated reason, and is just dying to make love with every lady there is. She hates Ludveck because he kept her from getting to stare at Elincia! A lesbian who is driven wholly by her erotic passions- stereotypical, unrealistic and offensive.

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15 minutes ago, Spoiler Alert said:

I apologize for taking so long to reply to this.  I didn't see it.

No, I haven't.  Anything I know about Gaiden is second hand.

Well then try not to be too intimidated by the Cast from HP Magic. It's not nearly half as bad as it seems. The costs are low, mages have decent HP and there's plenty of equipment that grants renewal.

Edited by Jotari
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1 hour ago, Interdimensional Observer said:

Perhaps IS was trying to get into the China market with Tellius- their historical erotic preference is for the legs (hence their liking of leg slits on dresses) I once heard from an East Asia professor. And on that topic, why the meaningless jump towards the enemy at the end of Impale? Is Sentinel Nephenee trying to do a Bayonetta-esque tease of sorts and go "as you die, take a look at what you'll never get"?

Geoffrey is Finn 2.0, that explains why he is what he is. The blue hair, the Brave Lance, a horse- all Finn.

And I'd also like to add to Heather to the pile of bad Tellius characters (alongside Aran and Ilyana). Heather is no Soleil (not that I'd know much given I haven't watched a single scene of plot or support in Fates- I've skipped everything from the beginning due to how much people have criticized them), but Heather is awful in the few conversations she has. She bashes men and is willing to con them for no good stated reason, and is just dying to make love with every lady there is. She hates Ludveck because he kept her from getting to stare at Elincia! A lesbian who is driven wholly by her erotic passions- stereotypical, unrealistic and offensive.

Technically speaking, the whole "long dress with slits on the side" started way back when with Linde, and especially with Lyn. I just feel like Callil and Path of Radiance female sages were an extension of the former. But yeah...it could get a little bit distracting at times.

I see it as just a fancy punctuation of the skill. Everyone in Radiant Dawn is twirling weapons, backflipping and somersaulting all over the place, after all.

Heather... I definitely agree that she tends to come off as one-note and very flat, but having a blatant lesbian in games at the time was a pretty big novelty, especially in the west. I remember her conversations with Nephenee being somewhat sweet, with Heather referring to Nephenee as beautiful despite her shyness in the matter. Of course, I could be remembering wrong, since I bench her and ignore her pretty much as soon as I get her in that game.

3 hours ago, Jave said:

I never said that the later games should be excused. My point is that the previous games could be just as guilty of the things the later games did, it's just standards were different back then.

Disagree. I still see this as false equivalence. Calling the Tellius series "just as guilty" in the shallow, manipulative fanservice department is inaccurate, as while Tellius did have elements of fanservice, they were never the main focus the way Camilla's, ahem, bust is. Camilla's Birthright introduction and even her Conquest ending moment is straight-up objectification, boobs and/or ass first, any semblance of character later. Hell, the first time we saw a glimpse of her, she was walking suggestively at the camera, in the it was in the midst of her overly-exaggerated jiggle physics. Cringe. So much cringe.

With the Tellius games and the older FE games as a whole, it was character first, possible elements of fanservice (which were far more downplayed) later.

I wouldn't even say standards have changed. Older anime had fanservice up the wazoo just as much, but as anime as a whole was much more obscure in the west, a lot of the time we just plain didn't get them localized; the first example that sticks out in my mind is Bulma of Dragon Ball, way back before Shadow Dragon and the Blade of Light even came out. Now, the localization requirements were a whole lot stricter, so a lot of it was edited, changed or just plain cut on the transition to the west, but games have always had sexual/sexualized elements to them; granted, they were more limited in scope due to system limitations.
 

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21 minutes ago, Jotari said:

Well then try not to be too intimidated by the Cast from HP Magic. It's not nearly half as bad as it seems. The costs are low, mages have decent HP and there's plenty of equipment that grants renewal.

Yeah, it's why I mentioned I'm just going to hang back and watch.  I'm not going to write off a game pre-release for having one mechanic I don't agree with.  At first, and second, glance it seems like HP cost would be more of a nuisance since it's sometimes hard enough to keep mages alive sometimes.

I'm also concerned about supporting for Gaiden.  I'm not sure if I mentioned that in my other post.  I really didn't like Radiant Dawn for removing them, and if Gaiden takes that route I just hope there are enough conversations in the game to make up for it.

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I really hope they add supports/base conversations like in New Mystery of the Emblem. Preferably with the same system where units just have to fight a certain number of maps together and not stand next to each other for several turns. The map based way has always been my favourite.

I'm not too fond of the "cast from HP" mechanic, but I'm a long time SMT fan, so I can live with it. Honestly a lot of the Gaiden specific mechanics seem weird to me, but I'll have to actually play it to say anything. 60 Avoid graves and the ship maps and dragon valley all seem like a pain though.

I don't think there is any risk of it appearing, but by god I don't want child units again. They were stupid in Fates. They had a reason to be around in Genealogy/Awakening, but I dislike them being there just for the sake of being there. I... don't really care either way about an avatar though as long as it's a bit more low-key? Like more of an observer than main focus like Corrin. 

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On 6.3.2017 at 1:18 AM, Extrasolar said:

 

  Reveal hidden contents

 

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Fire Emblem Heroes. Right? Do I get the cookie?

Nope. Try again. :D

Agreed on pretty much all of this.

It's an issue of exaggeration and scope, and how blatant things became. While elements of fanservice have always existed in FE, the older games downplayed them much, much, much more. Male berserkers lacking shirts wasn't meant to be fanservice, but as a way for them to show off all of their impressive muscles; Largo's design in POR is much and the same. He's shirtless, but in full, thick pants and with crossing straps and ornamentation on his shoulders. He's not a fanservice design, but a power fantasy design.

Charlotte, on the other hand, the same class as Largo, is literally wearing nothing but a bikini and inexplicable pieces of armor stuck on. And Camilla's..."armor" is practically designed to show off the sexy bits, and Camilla's introduction cutscene in Birthright goes out of its way to objectify her by focusing on her bust and backside. On the contrary, women in the older titles (even the ones with more revealing outfits like Ilyana's miniskirt) were never drawn or depicted in objectifying poses.

The fanservice elements in FE could easily be overlooked in the older games, since they weren't as in-your-face as they were played in Awakening (Tharja and Olivia), and Fates (Charlotte, and most of all Camilla as mentioned above).

I do know that there are also more conservatively-dressed women alongside them (you brought up Miriel and Oboro, who are good examples of that), but it's the sheer amount of transparency in their goals (Camilla and Charlotte are pretty much exclusively designed to appeal sexually to people attracted to women).

It's very possible to do a more "revealing" design tastefully - I point to Nailah of RD's design, as it's more revealing than other Tellius designs, but she doesn't have everything but the essential bits hanging out the way Charlotte does. Even Nephenee's design, which is inexplicably lacking leg armor, is fully covered as far as her torso goes. The worst Calill has is a long dress with slits up the side, which is similar to Lyn, and actually less revealing overall.

Okay, this actually makes sense. Thank you for explaining!

Replies in bold. Sorry to have replied so late. I haven't checked this topic in a while. :P

Nailah's outfit being a little more revealing actually makes sense if you think about it, considering she lives in the freakin' desert and all...

Edited by DragonFlames
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I've never played Gaiden, but here's my hopes and fears.

I hope Shadows of Valentia will have the Casual/Classic and Normal/Hard/Lunatic difficulties to appeal to all of the fanbase. I don't know how hard Gaiden is, but if it's hard they could add Phoenix mode to ease less experienced fans into it I guess lol. I hope Shadows of Valentia adds supports. I like the characterization and relationship building of FE.

About the kids, Awakening fit but it was shoehorned into Fates very badly. As much as I liked the kids as characters, if they must feel the need to add kids, they should do a time skip at endgame or Outrealms shenanigans. Less fanservice or at least keep it out of the main plot unlike what Fates did with Camilla. I think an avatar would be fine if they aren't the focus of the story. I'd like to see them support with other characters and be used in battle like Robin, but be lowkey in the plot like FE 7's tactician. I saw Robin as a deuteragonist in Awakening but that role for the avatar probably won't work in Shadows of Valentia since Alm and Celica seem to be the focuses.

I heard they got rid of unbreakable weapons? I actually kinda liked weapons breaking since being conservative with your weapon use was another part of the strategizing in FE. Though I did like going all out with special weapons like killing edges in Fates without worrying about breaking it haha. I'm interested in how they'll be changing up the combat system, and I really like that minidungeon exploration idea.

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43 minutes ago, desertbriar said:

I heard they got rid of unbreakable weapons? 

Purely speculation on a meter that has no confirmed function. It might be related to boosts or something else as well.

If it is supposed to be faithful as most everything has suggested so far, unbreakable weapons is something that would be most likely kept.

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5 hours ago, Lord-Zero said:

I just hope Walhart makes an appearance in the game as a special boss or a paralogue. 

Hard to do considering this is thousands of years before Awakening. Maybe through an outrealm gate or something, but I highly doubt they will do anything in that regard.

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13 minutes ago, Tolvir said:

Hard to do considering this is thousands of years before Awakening. Maybe through an outrealm gate or something, but I highly doubt they will do anything in that regard.

Walhart laughs at your idea of common sense and mortals' perception of chronology. 

Edited by Thane
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2 hours ago, Thane said:

Walhart laughs at your idea of common sense and mortals' perception of chronology. 

He transcends the mortal concepts of time and understanding, for he is Walhart, The Original Lobster King!

Edited by Tolvir
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