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CrimeanRoyalKnight

Do you like Corrin?

Do you like Corrin?  

219 members have voted

  1. 1. Do you like Corrin?

    • Yes.
      45
    • No.
      116
    • I'm indifferent.
      58


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As a unit, I like him a lot. Mixed (and relatively high) growths gives the Avatar a lot of room to play different classes. The Yato is a strong weapon and Dragon Stones are an interesting defensive option (although I wish we had more variety). Both of his promotions are also worthwhile with staves providing support and tomes giving you a strong magic user. 

I think the outfit fits (no pun intended) him well, which only some minor nitpicks like Femui's thigh-holes and the unexplained lack of shoes. The black and white color scheme represents their situation as being torn between two worlds and the skin-tight suit morphs perfectly into their dragon form. There aren't as many male hairstyles that I like, but honestly, almost all of my MUs cycle through only a few hairstyles anyway. It's pretty neat that you can change your hairstyle in My Room.

Story-wise is where everything goes to shit. I want to start off by saying that I LOVE the premise behind the character and thought it was brilliant, new direction for Fire Emblem protagonists. Chapter 6 of the game really shows the potential this had by how it makes you feel like shit no matter what side you choose. Unfortunately, like the rest of Fates' writing, the quality ends at the premise. I won't write an essay on it because I feel Etrurian emperor, Brightbow and Sunwoo already made good posts on this but in summary:

- All of Kamui's traits are tacked on without much consideration. He's a naive and sheltered lord but he is still acts as the leader when more qualified people are available. He's a manakete but no one really cares (and he doesn't even resemble his 'dad').
-He's a plot absorbing Mary Sue that everyone is forced to love, no matter how much villainy or general stupidity he commits.
-He's actually a horrible person in Conquest and some supports, as Brightbow explains.

5 hours ago, BrightBow said:

As the full game showed, this kind of behavior is a pattern with this guy. He tells a Hoshidian assassin that "You intent to buy peace with death? That's madness!" and then proceeds to buy peace with the death of countless Hoshidians in the very same chapter, with no self-awareness whatsoever. Corrin is a master of self-pontification but otherwise he is nothing more then a self-centric hypocrite. One shouldn't mistake superficial niceness for genuine kindness.

Of course what makes Corrin truly awful is that nothing of it is intentional. The game is very consistent in treating him like he is basically Ultra Super Jesus MK II, which starts out being cringy and just becomes more uncomfortable and infuriating as the game goes on.

And then you have this gem in C15

"My happiness is a small price to pay for the good of the whole world. [...]If I must sacrifice my soul and walk the path of evil to end this war, so be it. Even if no one understands why I'm doing this... even if they grow to hate me..."

How very noble, Corrin. I'm so glad that your happiness is going to be the only casualty of war and not thousands of innocent Hoshidan lives. He even has to audacity to want to be friendly with Hinoka after invading her country, killing her brother and letting Sakura's soldiers get massacred. Kamui comes across as a self-absorbed sociopath, and it's amazing that IS couldn't recognize all the contradictions they were writing.

Edited by NekoKnight

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I thought she was fine all things considered. Not my favorite Fates character or anything, but then again most lords aren't my favorites in their games anyways.

Her loneliness (mentioned in the m!Kana-father support, so idk if m!Corrin has the same issues) added an interesting layer to her interactions and issues. Since I usually paired her with Xander, it bundled in quite nicely with their support, too.

Maybe I'm just that easy-going, but I didn't really have a problem with her in the story. Her struggles did a pretty good job catching my sympathy, and it was nice having a full-blown, standalone lady lord.

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They are the one of few lords that I can probably pick out of a line up. The lord characters are normally interchangeable to me, Corrin circumstances helps in making them stand out to me (Chrom doesn't even have that going for them).

But gameplay wise, they are a force deployment that doesn't make me scream fuck by the fact that I have to use them (I haven't played Radiant Dawn but Micaiah's growth rates have me screaming that and I would drop Eirika and Chrom in a heartbeat for Joshua and Lucina any day of the god damn week).

They have supports I find amusing... so we cool tbh.

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They were alright. Story was shit, but I don't count that anymore.

It really feels like all the Avatar's have gotten one thing right, and that it IntSys could just put it all together the Avatar system would be a lot better:

-Kris had the Avatar as a unit down. Variety of backstories to choose from, no unique class (just another unit), tutorial that gives the impression of being good whilst not the hottest shit on the block ETC.

-Robin had the story portrayal. Even if they took over the plot towards the end and I thought their tactical genius (CREEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEED!) got way out of hand after the first part, being a supporting character to the main lord/s enables them to be important without being overly so.

-Corrin had the personality, story non-withstanding. Their enough of a blank slate that you can easily project onto them without being bland and how they act in supports is engaging and endearing enough to make them likable without self-inserting.

Now all that needs to happen is for IntSys to figure out how to get all of it right without bungling something else.

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As a unit? Corrin works wonders. Good all around growths, good unique weapons, and access to a fair number of skills (through both heart seals and buddy/marriage seals) Corrin rarely, if ever, disappoints.

Design wise, male Corrin looks alright. Not amazing or or awful, but alright. Female Corrin looks pretty good, thigh-gaps and her entire nohrian noble getup non-withstanding. Like the Spheal said, you can at least pick out Corrin from a Fire Emblem lord/lady line up.

Story wise..... to use the most common term on the Fates subforum, "wasted potential." So many others, such as nekoknight, put it far better than I could. To be brief though, Corrin is a naive, stupid, hypocrite who gets those around him killed even if there was clearly a better way to avoid conflict like the character so desperately wants to. The level of worship directed towards him is almost insulting to the player, and that all of his bad choices (including those that result in massive loss of life) are glossed over by the other characters. The way he is written makes the game worse in the story department. 

Edited by warchiefwilliams

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Let me put this gently: Corrin is a bloody scumbag. He/She is the epitome of thoughtless character writing. Pure trash.

Corrin enrages me because there was so much wasted potential. We could have had the second coming of Denam Pavel, but noooo, we were stuck with a bland, shallow, clueless goody-two-shoes that spent the majority of the time reacting to things around him/her instead of becoming an active participant in the story.

I could write an essay on how terrible Corrin is and what should have been done to improve their story. UGH. 

I like Female Corrin's two left feet.

That's about it.

I love how Kozaki's original Female Corrin artwork had two left feet as well! It foreshadowed the complete disaster that would be Corrin's "character arc".

Edited by Leif

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Frankly, it depends on the route.

-In Conquest, he's just an idiot and hypocrite. He thinks he's doing good, but just fails. Like in the beginning of Conquest he somehow manages to suppress a number of rebellions without killing anyone, but in Ch. 19 he kills an army of Kitsune, and regrets it. Like, did you forget how to not kill people? I could go on and on on his mistakes and inconsistencies and my dislike of him here, but then I'd never stop, so...

- I, honestly, forget most of Birthright. I think he was the best here, but that's just because everyone else is instead idiotic (Flora, Xander, etc.) and the story was generic "we're the good guys, their the bad guys."

- Revelations Corrin was interesting in theory, but like everything in Fates, it was executed poorly. He is naive and sheltered, which would be cool if these traits were better developed and he managed to overcome it. However, he only stays naive through the entire story, and fails to grow beyond it.

In the end, I'm indifferent towards him. Yes, he is an idiot most of the time, but he is a good unit, and it was the first attempt of IS to make the avatar the true main character.

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Design wise, I hated male corrin. It was too much of the typical anime protagonist, which is the same reason I don't like Marth. Right off the bat you are told everything you need to know off of appearance when they are designed like that. Young, Kind Hearted, Wants to save the world or become the best there ever was. Female Corrin was better.

Personality wise, eh. They had some interesting ideas with it, but it all kind of fell flat due to Fate's rushed and pieced together nature. With a bit of fleshing out and character growth, Conquest Corrin could of been great.

Story wise, same as above. With a bit of fleshing out and character growth, the story would of been greatly improved, and that really applies to all the characters of Fates.

So in the end, I wasn't big on Corrin. I still kind of like him due to him being my own customizable unit, but he was by far not the best lord.

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As a Unit and physically, I was alright with Corrin. I am one of the few who liked both versions of Corrin appearance wise. As far as concept goes, I think Manakete Lord is another thing that was interesting and I was excited to play.

Story? Uh, well people should know by now I'm not really big on it. So... ignoring that...

I still put down "no" because they were a big disappointment for me.

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Not in the slightest.

Desing wise, I feel like they are serviceable but bland. The clothes look silly, even if you don't count M!Corrin's collar or F!Corrin's thighholes.

Others like Thane and NekoKnight have already gotten into what I really hate about their personality. Conquest is supposed to show just how selflessly heroic they are.. Yet all I see is a selfish brat whith precisely zero self-awareness and no empathy. It's literally all about them. The Broshidos being mad at him for siding with Nohr? Why can't they see how Corrin is only working for the greater good by siding with the hostile conqueror who is also their mother's killer? Hoshido's destruction matters to Corrin only in so far as people might hate them for it. Sakura's trauma and Takumi's presumed suicide don't matter so long as Hinoka and Ryouma still send out christmas cards. 

And the narrative agrees with them. Everyone falls over themselves to absolve them of everything and neither Hinoka or Sakura are allowed to hold a grudge for it. Takumi is literally forced to apologise for saying mean things to Corrin while they get to merrily skip over his and Ryouma's (and hundreds of other Hoshidans') corpses on their way to the happy ending.    

Birthright and Revelations have less of this (although the overt praise is still obnoxious), mostly because Corrin isn't an outright hypocrite and the writers have to do less censoring to have Corrin be viewed as a hero. Nevertheless, the prevailing attitude is still "Corrin can do no wrong, despite being wrong several times.".

IntSys really treated Corrin with kids gloves to coddle their fragile ego. "It's okay, little one, be as naive and helpless as you like, everyone still loves you and thinks you are a GREAT leader.". I think it is prett obvious that this was done to coddle the player. Since Corrin is meant exclusively as a self-insert. And the worst thing? They were right on point when it comes to some players. I have seen plenty of players who are perfectly fine with condemning Hoshido to be wiped out because "Takumi was mean to me!". There are many who react allergic to any kind of criticism when it comes to their self-insert. So why not play it safe and never challenge them on that? That's what IntSys probably thought.

To the people who say they prefer F!Corrin over her male counterpart: No, she isn't more confident. She is exactly like M!Corrin, the only difference is the standards to which we hold different genders. What is seen as already being confident for a female is seen as too wimpy for a male.

I actually dislike F!Corrin more, because of how the fandom treats her as either a proxy to pair up with their favourite males or a lust object "waifu".  

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1 hour ago, Nanima² said:

To the people who say they prefer F!Corrin over her male counterpart: No, she isn't more confident. She is exactly like M!Corrin, the only difference is the standards to which we hold different genders. What is seen as already being confident for a female is seen as too wimpy for a male.

I actually dislike F!Corrin more, because of how the fandom treats her as either a proxy to pair up with their favourite males or a lust object "waifu".  

Question, because most people I asked hadn't played as both genders and I haven't given a shit about Fates in about half a year: aside from differences in certain supports (such as m!Corrin's support coming off as more iffy than f!Corrin's), are male and female Corrin noticeably different in personality? Male and female Robin, although mostly similar, did have a few more subtle differences (such as female Robin being cattier and male Robin being a more supportive guy), but is there anything to that degree in the Corrins?

I agree with you on female Corrin drawing more of my ire due to the way fandom treats her. I wish I didn't, because they're literally the same character and act the same in identical situations, but I just tend to get annoyed with seeing her more often. That said, I notice that female characters get this kind of treatment more often. The waifu treatment from guys the proxy treatment from girls, more so than male characters do. Especially ironic is that according to most "official" material, m!Corrin goes to Hoshido and f!Corrin goes to Nohr. You know, the route that quite a few people consider to be the route with the whiny, useless, selfish, hypocritical Corrin.

Edited by Sunwoo

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Appearance wise, I do prefer female Corrin over male.

But in terms of the story, the thing that irked me the most was how Corrin (regardless of gender) was respected so quickly and easily by their siblings despite being naive and sheltered. It was easier to bear in Revelation because of the chapters with Xander and Ryoma. Corrin's saving grace was their lines in Ch 18. That made me dislike Corrin a little less. Overall, I tend to play through the game focusing on the other units because their supports are more interesting and less vexing.

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29 minutes ago, Sunwoo said:

Question, because most people I asked hadn't played as both genders and I haven't given a shit about Fates in about half a year: aside from differences in certain supports (such as m!Corrin's support coming off as more iffy than f!Corrin's), are male and female Corrin noticeably different in personality? Male and female Robin, although mostly similar, did have a few more subtle differences (such as female Robin being cattier and male Robin being a more supportive guy), but is there anything to that degree in the Corrins?

I haven't really done a deep study on this, but most of the time the interactions are exactly the same. In the Drama CD, F!Corrin seems more outright genki though, while they really doubled down on the sainthood for M!Corrin. The difference is so minute though, that I wouldn't really count it though.

 

Not sure about main game reasoning, but M!Corrin for Hoshido actually fits well narrative wise in the Drama CDs. It's logical that Takumi would feel more implicitly threatened by M!Corrin, getting bumped down the hierarchy and making him feel even more obsolete as "third prince". Which wouldn't have the same feeling with F!Corrin.

F!Corrn in Nohr on the other hand was mostly just used to have Xander and Leo fighting over her. ugh

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3 hours ago, Nanima² said:

IntSys really treated Corrin with kids gloves to coddle their fragile ego. "It's okay, little one, be as naive and helpless as you like, everyone still loves you and thinks you are a GREAT leader.". I think it is prett obvious that this was done to coddle the player. Since Corrin is meant exclusively as a self-insert. And the worst thing? They were right on point when it comes to some players. I have seen plenty of players who are perfectly fine with condemning Hoshido to be wiped out because "Takumi was mean to me!". There are many who react allergic to any kind of criticism when it comes to their self-insert. So why not play it safe and never challenge them on that? That's what IntSys probably thought.

1 hour ago, Sunwoo said:

I agree with you on female Corrin drawing more of my ire due to the way fandom treats her. I wish I didn't, because they're literally the same character and act the same in identical situations, but I just tend to get annoyed with seeing her more often. That said, I notice that female characters get this kind of treatment more often. The waifu treatment from guys the proxy treatment from girls, more so than male characters do. Especially ironic is that according to most "official" material, m!Corrin goes to Hoshido and f!Corrin goes to Nohr. You know, the route that quite a few people consider to be the route with the whiny, useless, selfish, hypocritical Corrin.

I don't blame people for getting attached to certain characters (the developers acknowledged that Leo and Takumi were specifically designed to be attractive to girls) but I think it's pretty sad when people like avatar characters because they treat them as their proxy. The fact that Femui got into the top 3 female characters on the popularity poll, despite sharing all of Mamui's faults is....kind of pathetic.

 

 

Edited by NekoKnight

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I find Corrin unique in the sense that their different from the typical lord. I will admit that his portrayal in story... well bad, but the general idea was interesting. I'm not gonna go on and on about how Corrin was a naive idiot, or how Corrin is the 'true villain' of the series, because it's already been stated and beaten to death, and I honestly can't fault Corrin's shortcomings to themselves. I honestly think Corrin is fine as they are, but more meaning should have been put on people actually calling him out and helping him. Not every lord has to be some badass like Hector to be portrayed human and to be liked. So yeah, I like Corrin. it sucks that the story was bad and puts them on a silver pedestal, but that's more of the writers' fault, like everything else. Not my favorite lord, I'll admit, but I do feel like he gets a lot of undeserved hate because of the writing.

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I think Corrin is a pretty bad character. I think many can agree with me that they are a Mary Sue and that even in their worst moments, their sailing is relatively smooth. The game revolved around them and it's a tragedy: world building and other characters feel like are thrown out of the window to just have more Corrin and emotional romps, simple guilty trips and sob stories over actual content. 

I think their design is garbage, aside from the female Nohrian promotion (it's sexy and evil).

Also I echo the sentiment of Female Corrin not being any better. I will not play male until Revelations and man, I loathed her in Birthright. I loathed how smooth and perfect it went for her, how doubt only came when she attacked her family. Shortly after, I started the Chaos route in Tactics Ogre: LUCT, and I was baffled at how a game from 20 years ago had a much more impactful choice and grim moral implications than a game from now. Siding with the morally sound choice does not necessarily mean everything will go well. 

YOU STILL KILL NOHRIANS IN BIRTHRIGHT. That is not exactly being a saint. Nobody doubts the blood on their hands or even holds a romantic opinion on it like some chivalrous man from Jugdral. Deaths only matter in Conquest and when your beloved siblings die, oh and of course when people die for Corrin. Dang it Corrin.

I wish there were more things in this game not centered around the protagonist. I also fail to see their shades of gray.

If anything Conquest is the route I like the most because it's the route where they somewhat fail.

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Yes and no. Like Conquest Corrin (not her inclusion though, but there are some side of her character I liked), hate Birthright's, he's just a hothead blinded by vengeance and leaves a huge death count.

Edited by Brand_Of_The_Exalt

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Isolated from the narrative, I'm indifferent to them. They're just bland to me, like Ike and Chrom.

If I look at Corrin's character and role in the story, it's just ridiculous. Those two just don't work together, see the way the narration has to jump through unbelievable hoops to make "sense". However, I don't care enough about Fates to feel hate towards it. Too old for that shit.

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19 hours ago, Thane said:

"But Thane, that hasn't anything to do with Corrin as a character; that's just bad writing surrounding them!"

I feel like I should inform anybody who actually tries to use this defense that characters cannot be divorced from "the writing surrounding them" when it comes to trying to assess how good they are as characters overall. "The writing surrounding them" is what causes characters to act and change and do things and generally exist in a meaningful way within a story. All aspects of a plot, including characters, are defined by their relationships and interactions with other aspects of that plot; that's what the plot is built from in the first place.

Edited by Topaz Light

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I definitely do not like Corrin. As many others have said they have no leadership qualities at all, especially compared to Ryoma and Xander. Their blatant naivety alsogods  happens to be very annoying. And other characters seem to worship them as if they were gods even when they do something that is plain stupid.

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9 hours ago, Nanima² said:

F!Corrn in Nohr on the other hand was mostly just used to have Xander and Leo fighting over her. ugh

That sounds very ugh indeed. Unfortunately, I imagine that's what a lot of fangirls who project themselves onto f!Corrin do want, to have two good-looking guys fight over her (regardless of context). I think this is just what IS sees her as: waifubait, while m!Corrin has some shred of dignity, even if it's makes him so nauseatingly pure.

8 hours ago, NekoKnight said:

I don't blame people for getting attached to certain characters (the developers acknowledged that Leo and Takumi were specifically designed to be attractive to girls) but I think it's pretty sad when people like avatar characters because they treat them as their proxy. The fact that Femui got into the top 3 female characters on the popularity poll, despite sharing all of Mamui's faults is....kind of pathetic.

Agreed with you on that, NekoKnight. There's nothing wrong with getting attached to certain characters. But I have seen many fan works where Leon and Takumi are nothing like their actual selves, and the only things they retain are their name and appearance and some parts of their backstory. I'm not sure if people actually like characters if they eschew everything that makes the character who they are, and only care about their pretty faces. Still, I agree with you that it's silly that f!Corrin was the favorite female character while m!Corrin was fifth is ... kind of dumb because they are literally the same character. I get a feeling that most of the voters on the poll were girls, who voted for their lust object (Leon, Xander, and Takumi) and then voted their stand-in (female Corrin) up to first.

I know the Robins, especially the female Robin, had the same problem as well. But for some reason, it feels like it was taken to an even greater extreme with the Corrins and it's actually got to a point where I'm complaining on public forums to it. Usually, I just keep my complaints about fan work to myself, or to friends who don't mind to hear it.

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