Jump to content

"Ask Fire Emblem Heroes Questions and Get Them Answered Here" Thread


Randoman
 Share

Recommended Posts

Fair warning, I'm not @XRay or @Ice Dragon, this is just my opinion based on what I know.

1 hour ago, Usana said:

. . . well I got blessed with another Summer Leggy just as I used up the last of my orbs.

One will almost certainly be used as Swift Sparrow 4 fodder. Though one of my prime candidates, Brave Lyn, would be kinda disappointing to inherit to since it would literally only be Sparrow 4 that is inherited.

Anyways they are both +SPD, so my choice is of bane. The first one I got that is now leveled and built is -HP. The other is -DEF. Obviously the -HP hits both sides so on the surface it seems like the -DEF would be slightly better since it only hits 1 defense? Worth taking the the time to level the -DEF one up to take the -HP one's place? Honestly I am not sure it matters much since she doesn't have to survive a hit to get into desperation thanks to her weapon and her HP is too low to avoid panic type effects anyways. But figured I would ask.

Summer Laegjarn does not care about her defensive stats. Does she have +Atk or +Spd and -not Atk or -not Spd? Then she's good to go.

Worldsea Wave makes it so she doesn't need to care about taking hits, so any defensive Flaw is acceptable on her. All you need to do is give her the ability to kill before she takes that one hit, because most units will be able to get her to under 50% regardless, and then the ability to GTFO once she's done her job.

As such, the Laegjarn you trained can be kept as-is, and the one you summoned can be a fine smoothie to your Brave Lyn or whoever.

14 minutes ago, SuperNova125 said:

So I recently got this +Def -Res Laevatain. I like Laevatain (and the blade and the character) so I thought I would make her a nuke/vantage sweeper. 

  Reveal hidden contents

PSX_20190808_165005.thumb.jpg.22a172682b0b162c41f7096a90d5b92e.jpg

What is better to use Glimmer, Raptured sky or Moonbow on her(all are available on her) ? 

I personally prefer Glimmer. Ruptured Sky I'm sure is a fine skill, but I've yet to use it (though if you need score, then having a 500 SP 2-cooldown skill is noteworthy), while Moonbow won't usually be adding much damage compared to Glimmer (12 or 15 at most, depending on how many merges you are up against), which is necessary if you are going for a Bladetome Vantage sweeper.

I'd recommend Glimmer anyway, as Laev will be doing so much damage that the bonus 50% will add on as much damage as most potent Bonfire or Ignis triggers. It'll be overkill, but I prefer overkill to gambling with if Moonbow will be enough, which Moonbow I'd rather save for less Atk-gifted units.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Replies 22.9k
  • Created
  • Last Reply

Top Posters In This Topic

Top Posters In This Topic

2 hours ago, Usana said:

. . . well I got blessed with another Summer Leggy just as I used up the last of my orbs.

One will almost certainly be used as Swift Sparrow 4 fodder. Though one of my prime candidates, Brave Lyn, would be kinda disappointing to inherit to since it would literally only be Sparrow 4 that is inherited.

Anyways they are both +SPD, so my choice is of bane. The first one I got that is now leveled and built is -HP. The other is -DEF. Obviously the -HP hits both sides so on the surface it seems like the -DEF would be slightly better since it only hits 1 defense? Worth taking the the time to level the -DEF one up to take the -HP one's place? Honestly I am not sure it matters much since she doesn't have to survive a hit to get into desperation thanks to her weapon and her HP is too low to avoid panic type effects anyways. But figured I would ask.

I generally almost always prefer -HP for nukes nowadays. It helps Players Phase units reach Desperation and Vantage range easier since you can just step on a Bolt Trap. But if you merge, it does not matter. Since -HP is so useful, I would avoid merging unless you can get it over merge +4 or +5 so the Atk/SPD+2 is worth the +5 increase in HP.

For SR!Laegjarn though, it honestly does not matter what Flaw she has as @Xenomata mentioned.

1 hour ago, SuperNova125 said:

So I recently got this +Def -Res Laevatain. I like Laevatain (and the blade and the character) so I thought I would make her a nuke/vantage sweeper. 

  Reveal hidden contents

PSX_20190808_165005.thumb.jpg.22a172682b0b162c41f7096a90d5b92e.jpg

What is better to use Glimmer, Raptured sky or Moonbow on her(all are available on her) ? 

All three are fine. Moonbow is better against super high Def units, Glimmer is better against medium to low Def units, and Ruptured Sky is better against dragons and beasts.

Between Glimmer and Moonbow, I personally went with Moonbow. Properly buffed, Laevatein kills anything with less than than 93 bulk, and that is just for Counter-Vantage. That number could be even higher if you are running a Player Phase build.

37Atk + 19Weapon + 7Brazen + 6Bonus + 24Combat = 93 Atk

What Laevatein has trouble killing are bulky high Def high bulk units, which Glimmer is less effective against.

Let X = Enemy Def

93 - 0.7X = 1.5(93 - X)

93 - 0.7X = 139.5 - 1.5X

0.8X = 46.5

8X = 465

X = 58.125

Hopefully I set up the equations right. Any enemy with 58 or less Def is better handled by Glimmer. Higher than 58 Def, Moonbow is better.

Between Moonbow and Ruptured Sky

X = Def, Y = Atk

93 - 0.7X = 93 + 0.2Y - X

0.3X = 0.2Y

3X = 2Y

X = 1.5Y

Ruptured Sky is better when the enemies Atk is higher than 1.5 times the enemies Def. Other wise, Moonbow is better

93 + 0.2Y - X = 1.5(93 - X)

93 + 0.2Y - X = 139.5 - 1.5X

0.2Y + 0.5X = 46.5

2Y + 5X = 465

Y = 232.5 - 2.5X

I am not really sure how to explain this. Ruptured Sky is better if the enemy's Atk is higher than that equation to the right. Basically, the inverse relationship between an enemy's Atk and Def means that Glimmer does worse the more Def a unit has compared to its Atk. I hope that makes sense.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

@Ice Dragon and @XRay with tanks, mixed or specialized, who have average or slowly, probably becoming below-average base attack like Beruka, Boey, Gordin, Gwendolyn, Jagen, Henry, and Sheena would taking +Def or +Res not be as good of an option compared to +Atk because outside of specials and a lot of attack buffs, they wouldn't be doing enough damage? This is considering that while they can be better tanks with +Def or +Res, I feel like we are getting to a point where units, mainly new ones, can have or have higher defenses that not being able to do decent damage can become very dangerous.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

1 minute ago, Kaden said:

@Ice Dragon and @XRay with tanks, mixed or specialized, who have average or slowly, probably becoming below-average base attack like Beruka, Boey, Gordin, Gwendolyn, Jagen, Henry, and Sheena would taking +Def or +Res not be as good of an option compared to +Atk because outside of specials and a lot of attack buffs, they wouldn't be doing enough damage? This is considering that while they can be better tanks with +Def or +Res, I feel like we are getting to a point where units, mainly new ones, can have or have higher defenses that not being able to do decent damage can become very dangerous.

We have different views on this matter, but I agree that Jagen and especially Henry should run +Atk since their Atk is so abysmally low.

For others though, while their Atk is low, I think it is still usable in my opinion. If an enemy nuke fails to kill your tank on the double and your tank activates a Special with Quick Riposte, the nuke most likely is not going to survive a Bonfire or Ignis to their face. I prefer +Def/Res because it helps ensure that the tank survives the double from a larger selection of enemies.

From @Ice Dragon's perspective, it is assumed that your tank is going to survive whatever they are tanking (since you should not send a tank to fight a questionable match up in the first place), so +Atk is better for damage output and killing something. It can also be argued that if you managed to kill something in the first counter attack, then you do not even have to worry about doubles, although I am not fully convinced that +Atk is going to significantly increase the tank's one hit kill chances.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

@Xenomata@XRay Thanks! Just wanted to make sure there wasn't some edge case I was missing.

@Kaden Hopefully you don't mind me jumping in. 

In the past I considered 30 attack the aim for being usable. If you have at least 30 you could entertain other options, though ATK would still be a decent one most likely. If you had less than 30 you really needed to try and reach it if possible, or at least get close. The reason is simple. There are units that will just barely survive and then end up being a WoM beacon. Also sometimes you need to initiate for various reasons. Or end up in a Tank vs Tank battle where specials may be locked due to guard type effects. As such it can be pivotal to get at least some extra damage in from normal hits. If you have enough ATK for your purposes though, then a defense boost can greatly aid your sustain or let you soak hits from something you normally wouldn't want to but is pivotal for you to clear that particular content. And for me that number is more or less 30.

I am not sure if that 30 number needs revised in the modern day meta since stats have been overall creeping upwards, but it wouldn't surprise me if it does. Old habits die hard though.

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

39 minutes ago, lightcosmo said:

What does merging characters do? I have 3 Lucina's and I was considering it, but wasn't sure exactly what it did.

Buffs the stats of the character that is merged into, and gets rid of flaws. 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

11 minutes ago, 0 Def Cleric said:

Buffs the stats of the character that is merged into, and gets rid of flaws. 

Oh, so then I would not have the HP flaw, that's nice. Sounds useful as well.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

1 hour ago, lightcosmo said:

What does merging characters do? I have 3 Lucina's and I was considering it, but wasn't sure exactly what it did.

>Boosts two of the units stats in order of highest to lowest when the unit is Level 1. HP is always done first because it's always the highest stat, while the others can vary, though in the case of ties the stat distribution will prioritize HP>Atk>Spd>Def>Res. In Lucy's case, it should usually go HP>Spd>Atk>Def>Res. This will repeat 4 times for each stat up to +10 merge, meaning each stat will always be +4 by then regardless of distribution order.
>After the merged units update, it also effectively removes the units Flaw stat by adding one Base Stat and about 10% growth to the flaw stat (at level 40, this usually means +3 or +4 to the flaw stat). The flawed stat is still remembered for the purpose of unlocking a units potential, applying stats in merges, and Dragonflowers. If the unit is Neutral, then a bonus +1 is applied to the units highest 3 stats at level 1. In Lucy's case this usually means HP, Spd, and Atk.
>It also increases the score granted when using the unit in Coliseum content, however a single merge doesn't affect scores that much.

Edited by Xenomata
Link to comment
Share on other sites

22 hours ago, XRay said:

We have different views on this matter, but I agree that Jagen and especially Henry should run +Atk since their Atk is so abysmally low.

For others though, while their Atk is low, I think it is still usable in my opinion. If an enemy nuke fails to kill your tank on the double and your tank activates a Special with Quick Riposte, the nuke most likely is not going to survive a Bonfire or Ignis to their face. I prefer +Def/Res because it helps ensure that the tank survives the double from a larger selection of enemies.

Given Jagen's high resistance and access to Barrier/Berkut's Lance, I feel like making a pure magic tank works with +Res and it's not his neutral attack is that low in the realm of Caeda, Fir, Matthew, Niles, Selena, and Subaki low of <= 25 neutral Atk. Then again, Clair, Eirika, Jaffar, Merric, Olwen, and Sully have 26 neutral Atk, 1 point less than him... It's just that veteran BST screws over Gunter and Jagen. More so for Gunter since Frederick exists with the same stat spread as him and later on Walhart. But I am putting him in a specialized role and having him rely on Iceberg or Glacies for damage.

13 hours ago, Usana said:

@Kaden Hopefully you don't mind me jumping in. 

In the past I considered 30 attack the aim for being usable. If you have at least 30 you could entertain other options, though ATK would still be a decent one most likely. If you had less than 30 you really needed to try and reach it if possible, or at least get close. The reason is simple. There are units that will just barely survive and then end up being a WoM beacon. Also sometimes you need to initiate for various reasons. Or end up in a Tank vs Tank battle where specials may be locked due to guard type effects. As such it can be pivotal to get at least some extra damage in from normal hits. If you have enough ATK for your purposes though, then a defense boost can greatly aid your sustain or let you soak hits from something you normally wouldn't want to but is pivotal for you to clear that particular content. And for me that number is more or less 30.

I am not sure if that 30 number needs revised in the modern day meta since stats have been overall creeping upwards, but it wouldn't surprise me if it does. Old habits die hard though.

I do feel like around 30 Atk is average, but it's probably not right now and 33 Atk might be more accurate even though some people feel like that's low like a comment that was directed at Rutger, but I digress. My concerns over around 30 Atk for a tank now are that most tanks are slow and bulky meaning they are reliant on Quick Riposte, Bold or Vengeful Fighter if they're an armor, or a -breaker if their weapon doesn't have a guaranteed follow-up effect and against unit with Null Follow-Up, those skills would be rendered useless. If their special is charged or closed to being charged and as you noted if they're locked in a tank vs. tank battle or one where nobody can charge their special because of a Guard effect being in play, then one attack with 30-ish base Atk might not do a lot of damage. The other issue is that in the case of if you want them to run Fortress Def/Res or Fortress Def considering Fortress Def/Res is 5* locked and maybe even stack it as their seal, their attack is going to drop lower. On a unit like Lukas, I'm fine with it since his base neutral Atk is high, but on someone like Beruka, it becomes concerning she will drop to 27 to 26 base Atk from her 29 neutral Atk compared to Lukas dropping from 35 neutral Atk to 33 to 32 base Atk.

I've been having a rough time choosing between +Atk or +Def/+Res for Beruka and Boey because of this. Boey at least I can have him run T-Adept 3 which helps his attack and bulk all around against blues and colorless and he targets resistance. Beruka I know that for damage and tanking, mainly physical damage, Gerome, Haar, Michalis, and Minerva would be better, but at the same time, I'm not so sure. +Def works for pure physical tanking and she can work as mixed tank with +Res, but hit per hit, +Atk might be more useful.

22 hours ago, XRay said:

From @Ice Dragon's perspective, it is assumed that your tank is going to survive whatever they are tanking (since you should not send a tank to fight a questionable match up in the first place), so +Atk is better for damage output and killing something. It can also be argued that if you managed to kill something in the first counter attack, then you do not even have to worry about doubles, although I am not fully convinced that +Atk is going to significantly increase the tank's one hit kill chances.

Ice Dragon also comes from a perspective of having +10 or so merged units who would have higher bulk than unmerged ones. To that, I agree, as with merges, a unit would gain extra bulk and might prefer +Atk to add onto the amount of attack they gain from merges over +Def or +Res. At the same time, it depends on what you want to do like if you want to make Lukas into a mixed tank with Barrier/Berkut's Lance, then +Res would scale better even if his base neutral resistance is very low.

Would you consider units like Caineghis, Duma, probably Edelgard, M!Grima, LA Hector, spooky Myrrh, Seliph, Surtr, and arguably Keaton and Laevatein who while they shouldn't get hit when in Vantage range do still have good physical defense letting be physical tanks as edge cases for +Atk increasing a tank's chances to one hit kill? Those units have very high attack or very high bulk in the cases of Caineghis and Seliph. Duma in particular has very high raw attack on his own without the needs of buffs or activating a special given +Atk is a superasset and Fell Breath's Atk+3 and Atk/Res+6 during combat when his opponent's HP isn't full. I guess Sigurd would also fit here too, but Distant Counter means he won't benefit from Crusader's Ward as much when he can't counterattack against ranged units.

Edited by Kaden
Link to comment
Share on other sites

 

4 hours ago, Kaden said:

I've been having a rough time choosing between +Atk or +Def/+Res for Beruka and Boey because of this. Boey at least I can have him run T-Adept 3 which helps his attack and bulk all around against blues and colorless and he targets resistance. Beruka I know that for damage and tanking, mainly physical damage, Gerome, Haar, Michalis, and Minerva would be better, but at the same time, I'm not so sure. +Def works for pure physical tanking and she can work as mixed tank with +Res, but hit per hit, +Atk might be more useful.

For Triangle Adept units, I almost always go +Atk. Triangle Adept gives so much bulk and Atk that aiming for a one shot kill is pretty reasonable, and even if you cannot kill them in one hit, you are not likely to be killed on the double. I would only go +Def/Res if their bulk is really low, like Boey for Res and maybe Cecilia for Def.

For other regular tanks though, I generally stick with +Def/Res.

4 hours ago, Kaden said:

Would you consider units like Caineghis, Duma, probably Edelgard, M!Grima, LA Hector, spooky Myrrh, Seliph, Surtr, and arguably Keaton and Laevatein who while they shouldn't get hit when in Vantage range do still have good physical defense letting be physical tanks as edge cases for +Atk increasing a tank's chances to one hit kill? Those units have very high attack or very high bulk in the cases of Caineghis and Seliph. Duma in particular has very high raw attack on his own without the needs of buffs or activating a special given +Atk is a superasset and Fell Breath's Atk+3 and Atk/Res+6 during combat when his opponent's HP isn't full. I guess Sigurd would also fit here too, but Distant Counter means he won't benefit from Crusader's Ward as much when he can't counterattack against ranged units.

For Keaton and Laevatein, or any Counter-Vantage units, I always go +Atk. They are at the point where +Atk can help kill units reliably in one hit, and once in Vantage range, their bulk is not going to be good enough for +Def/Res to matter unless it is fighting against Wrys or something.

I do not see a point in giving them regular tank builds since they work differently. Regular tanks really rely on bulk since they take hits during combat. On the other hand, Counter-Vantage units are basically Player Phase one shot nukes on both phases, so they do not actually need bulk. Regular tanks are a dime a dozen, but Counter-Vantage units are much rarer outside of Blade mages. And even then, most Blade mages do not even reach 90 Atk at merge +0 (Lilina is the only who reaches it in the 3*/4* pool, and Mae is a close second reaching 89), whereas Laevatein and Ares are in the mid 90s and Keaton hits twice.

Units like Seliph or Omnibreakers I also go with +Atk. Tanks with insane bulk are due to special skill effects, so they can just dump everything into Atk. Seliph has infinite bulk on his second hit and Omnibreakers cannot be taken down without one shot nukes or Null Follow-Up, so in those cases +Def/Res does not really do anything for them and I go with +Atk.

For Myrrh and TLB!Myrrh though, I would stick with +Def since their Def basically also functions as their Spd stat.

For other normal tanks, I generally go with +Def/Res, but +Atk should be fine.

Edited by XRay
Link to comment
Share on other sites

I recently picked up a second Petra (+Def/-Res). My initial copy has Neutral IV's.

I plan on merging them, but can't decide which copy I prefer. Leaning towards the Neutral copy as the extra ATK/SPD points are nice. However, the super boon (4 points) that the +Def option offers plus the same gain in SPD is just as interesting I feel.

Thoughts?

Link to comment
Share on other sites

49 minutes ago, D4RTH said:

I recently picked up a second Petra (+Def/-Res). My initial copy has Neutral IV's.

I plan on merging them, but can't decide which copy I prefer. Leaning towards the Neutral copy as the extra ATK/SPD points are nice. However, the super boon (4 points) that the +Def option offers plus the same gain in SPD is just as interesting I feel.

Thoughts?

Neutral Petra 40+1 is:
42/33/40/25/20

+Def Petra 40+1 is:
41/32/39/29/20

I would stick with neutral. In my opinion, I do not think +Def is worth the Atk/Spd loss.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

11 hours ago, Xenomata said:

>Boosts two of the units stats in order of highest to lowest when the unit is Level 1. HP is always done first because it's always the highest stat, while the others can vary, though in the case of ties the stat distribution will prioritize HP>Atk>Spd>Def>Res. In Lucy's case, it should usually go HP>Spd>Atk>Def>Res. This will repeat 4 times for each stat up to +10 merge, meaning each stat will always be +4 by then regardless of distribution order.
>After the merged units update, it also effectively removes the units Flaw stat by adding one Base Stat and about 10% growth to the flaw stat (at level 40, this usually means +3 or +4 to the flaw stat). The flawed stat is still remembered for the purpose of unlocking a units potential, applying stats in merges, and Dragonflowers. If the unit is Neutral, then a bonus +1 is applied to the units highest 3 stats at level 1. In Lucy's case this usually means HP, Spd, and Atk.
>It also increases the score granted when using the unit in Coliseum content, however a single merge doesn't affect scores that much.

Ah, alright, so is it better to focus on +atk or +spd, or at 10 merge, is there even a difference? Since I have both, I wasn't sure.

Edited by lightcosmo
Link to comment
Share on other sites

44 minutes ago, lightcosmo said:

Ah, alright, so is it better to focus on +atk or +spd, or at 10 merge, is there even a difference? Since I have both, I wasn't sure.

Depends on the mode and enemies. If you use her in low Spd modes like Abyssal or against mostly against slow enemies, +Atk is better. Against high Spd enemies or in Aether Raids, +Spd is better.

If you are unsure, I personally lean towards +Spd. Aether Raids is generally considered the hardest mode in the game, and +Spd generally gives a Player Phase nuke like Lucina a bit higher performance.

Edited by XRay
Link to comment
Share on other sites

15 minutes ago, XRay said:

Depends on the mode and enemies. If you use her in low Spd modes like Abyssal or against mostly against slow enemies, +Atk is better. Against high Spd enemies or in Aether Raids, +Spd is better.

If you are unsure, I personally lean towards +Spd. Aether Raids is generally considered the hardest mode in the game, and +Spd generally gives a Player Phase nuke like Lucina a bit higher performance.

Well I casually play, so I dont worry about the "hardest" modes. She seems a bit slow, If I'm comparing. Legendary Alm is my fastest unit by a longshot, shouldn't i leave that to him?

Link to comment
Share on other sites

4 minutes ago, lightcosmo said:

Well I casually play, so I dont worry about the "hardest" modes. She seems a bit slow, If I'm comparing. Legendary Alm is my fastest unit by a longshot, shouldn't i leave that to him?

It is also down to player preference. So if you feel she is slow, then I would go with +Spd. For nukes like Lucina who almost always utilizes Desperation, I almost always go with +Spd.

SK!Alm is fast, but sometimes you need either a melee unit or some other other type of nuke to cover for him. For example, there might a really hard hitting ranged tank that can decimate SK!Alm on the counterattack, and that is when you send someone like Lucina to take out the tank.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

4 hours ago, XRay said:

It is also down to player preference. So if you feel she is slow, then I would go with +Spd. For nukes like Lucina who almost always utilizes Desperation, I almost always go with +Spd.

SK!Alm is fast, but sometimes you need either a melee unit or some other other type of nuke to cover for him. For example, there might a really hard hitting ranged tank that can decimate SK!Alm on the counterattack, and that is when you send someone like Lucina to take out the tank.

I see alot of "Alm is degenerate" so I assume he's pretty good. There's so much possibility in this game, it makes it so interesting. I dont know alot about unit coverage either, I just use units I like.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

1 hour ago, lightcosmo said:

I see alot of "Alm is degenerate" so I assume he's pretty good. There's so much possibility in this game, it makes it so interesting. I dont know alot about unit coverage either, I just use units I like.

SK!Alm is pretty great, but he is still below Ophelia in my opinion. In players' hands, he is not that much different from other nukes. In the AI's hands, while you cannot tank SK!Alm with just any type of tank, any properly built super tank can counter SK!Alm; on the other hand, tanking Ophelia is far more difficult and even a lot of super tanks just straight up dies to her.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

58 minutes ago, XRay said:

SK!Alm is pretty great, but he is still below Ophelia in my opinion. In players' hands, he is not that much different from other nukes. In the AI's hands, while you cannot tank SK!Alm with just any type of tank, any properly built super tank can counter SK!Alm; on the other hand, tanking Ophelia is far more difficult and even a lot of super tanks just straight up dies to her.

Hey, I use Ophelia as well! I thought she was pretty useful as a offence nuke. 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

On 8/10/2019 at 1:15 AM, XRay said:

For Triangle Adept units, I almost always go +Atk. Triangle Adept gives so much bulk and Atk that aiming for a one shot kill is pretty reasonable, and even if you cannot kill them in one hit, you are not likely to be killed on the double. I would only go +Def/Res if their bulk is really low, like Boey for Res and maybe Cecilia for Def.

For other regular tanks though, I generally stick with +Def/Res.

T-Adept on Boey is a cheap and effective thing to have on him, but he can run other stuff provided player has the resources like Steady Stance 4 would be interesting on him. Boey's resistance unless invested in isn't something I would rely on. He does have Gronnowl and he can have decent resistance, but I would rather use a different green mage with high base resistance than him. Or if I need to use Boey against them, run T-Adept and hope he can one shot them on player phase or possibly enemy phase depending on how safe that would be. On the other hand, his defense is fine, and specializing him as a unit to deal with blue, colorless, and green physical damage threats works for me.

On 8/10/2019 at 1:15 AM, XRay said:

For Keaton and Laevatein, or any Counter-Vantage units, I always go +Atk. They are at the point where +Atk can help kill units reliably in one hit, and once in Vantage range, their bulk is not going to be good enough for +Def/Res to matter unless it is fighting against Wrys or something.

I do not see a point in giving them regular tank builds since they work differently. Regular tanks really rely on bulk since they take hits during combat. On the other hand, Counter-Vantage units are basically Player Phase one shot nukes on both phases, so they do not actually need bulk. Regular tanks are a dime a dozen, but Counter-Vantage units are much rarer outside of Blade mages. And even then, most Blade mages do not even reach 90 Atk at merge +0 (Lilina is the only who reaches it in the 3*/4* pool, and Mae is a close second reaching 89), whereas Laevatein and Ares are in the mid 90s and Keaton hits twice.

I meant more of they can take physical damage hits well, but tanking isn't their main focus when they do Counter, Vantage very well.

On 8/10/2019 at 1:15 AM, XRay said:

For Myrrh and TLB!Myrrh though, I would stick with +Def since their Def basically also functions as their Spd stat.

Regular Myrrh, yes, and also +Spd was a thing to further stack as another speed check, but I don't think it is now with how fast units can be nowadays. Spooky Myrrh on the other hand, could opt for +Atk, Glimmer, and Special Fighter for instant Glimmers on enemy phase. She already comes with Vengeful Fighter, so you'd need to give her a Quick Riposte seal for her to follow-up on enemy phase and she'd pass less defense checks for her Spirit Breath's follow-up effect, but depending on what you want her to do, this would be pretty good given her high attack and targeting resistance or the lower defensive stat of ranged units who don't have Mystic Boost.

Similar dealio with Duma and M!Grima who also have +Atk superassets, but have higher base neutral attack than her at the cost of lower defense and/or resistance.

Edited by Kaden
Link to comment
Share on other sites

On 8/10/2019 at 10:47 PM, XRay said:

SK!Alm is pretty great, but he is still below Ophelia in my opinion. In players' hands, he is not that much different from other nukes. In the AI's hands, while you cannot tank SK!Alm with just any type of tank, any properly built super tank can counter SK!Alm; on the other hand, tanking Ophelia is far more difficult and even a lot of super tanks just straight up dies to her.

I sort of want to know what kind of supertank you use to take on Alm, because I don't think any of mine could do that. Ophelia is troublesome as well, but I can always build enough resistance to make her do 0 damage, at least on Light Season, but Legendary Alm just does more damage the more defense I get. He's way harder to take out on Player phase as well because he's so fast. I might be a bit biased here because of bad memories from Alm bonus weeks in AR, but overall I always have way more trouble dealing with him than Ophelia.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I let Marisa sponge him, since something like 65 effective defence does the trick pretty well. Granted, a lot of that durability stems from SS4, which... obviously means she can't hit back. An adult Tiki or Nowi might do a job, given some love.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

1 hour ago, BoaFerox said:

I sort of want to know what kind of supertank you use to take on Alm, because I don't think any of mine could do that. Ophelia is troublesome as well, but I can always build enough resistance to make her do 0 damage, at least on Light Season, but Legendary Alm just does more damage the more defense I get. He's way harder to take out on Player phase as well because he's so fast. I might be a bit biased here because of bad memories from Alm bonus weeks in AR, but overall I always have way more trouble dealing with him than Ophelia.

I use Sharena during her bonus season. She got 53 Spd from Summoner Support, bonus stats, and 2 M!Corrins to prevent SK!Alm from doubling her. The only way SK!Alm +10 is going to double Sharena is if he Spd stacks with +Spd, Swift Sparrow, and Darting Blow.

Edited by XRay
Link to comment
Share on other sites

2 hours ago, BoaFerox said:

I sort of want to know what kind of supertank you use to take on Alm, because I don't think any of mine could do that.

There are a few strategies for tanking Alm:

  • Extremely high Def: This is pretty much only possible with beast armors and dragons since you pretty much need to have Distant Counter on your weapon so that your A slot can have either Steady Stance 4 or Distant Def 4 (or Bonus Doubler). Even then, it requires a ton of investment and team support to get your Def high enough to pull this off.
  • Extremely high Spd: You want at least 54 Spd to prevent a double from a Spd-stacked +0 Alm or 58 Spd to deal with a Spd-stacked +10 Alm along with bonus nullification.
  • Fjorm shenanigans: Requires a ton of investment, but Ice Mirror's damage mitigation occurs after all other calculation, and she can be built to kill Alm on the counterattack using the absorbed damage.
  • Make Alm explode with Litrblade, Laevatein, Dark Mystletainn, etc., preferably with Vantage to reduce your chances of dying.
  • Make Alm explode with Litrraven + Triangle Adept. Cancel Affinity is still rare since Null Follow-Up is so good.

 

2 hours ago, BoaFerox said:

but Legendary Alm just does more damage the more defense I get.

Not exactly true. Alm has higher effective Atk when you have more Def, but your Def will still go up faster than his Atk does. Raising your Def still decreases the damage he does, just not at a 1:1 ratio.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.

 Share

  • Recently Browsing   0 members

    • No registered users viewing this page.
×
×
  • Create New...