Jump to content

"Ask Fire Emblem Heroes Questions and Get Them Answered Here" Thread


Randoman
 Share

Recommended Posts

Which axe unit is a better choice to +10? Hawkeye or Libra? Hawkeye has a nice prf that is a better option than any of Libra's builds but Libra has higher BST and an overall superior stat spread. 

I'm leaning towards Hawkeye because he can cripple units relying on bonus doubler or blade tomes. Libra requires dull range or a lull skill to do so but Hawkeye has a free B slot for another skill unlike Libra. 

Edited by Icelerate
Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Replies 22.9k
  • Created
  • Last Reply

Top Posters In This Topic

Top Posters In This Topic

1 hour ago, Icelerate said:

Which axe unit is a better choice to +10? Hawkeye or Libra? Hawkeye has a nice prf that is a better option than any of Libra's builds but Libra has higher BST and an overall superior stat spread. 

I'm leaning towards Hawkeye because he can cripple units relying on bonus doubler or blade tomes. Libra requires dull range or a lull skill to do so but Hawkeye has a free B slot for another skill unlike Libra. 

I think it depends on how long you can wait for Libra's Refine and how you assign value to certain skill effects. As of right now, if we are just looking at the present in terms of super tanking, it seems they are about the same at first glance. Libra leads by 6 points in BST. Guardian's Axe has 25 points in stats, while Refined Rearguard has 30 points in stats.

Basically, you are deciding whether or not Hawkeye's Slaying effect and partial buff nullification is worth a drop of 11 stat points.

If you are nullifying enemies' Atk Tactic and Def Tactic, that is 18 points in stats that you are "gaining" (nullifying enemies' Atk is the same as buffing Def and Res at the same time), but if the enemy does not use buffs, then you are not "gaining" any stats.

Slaying is the equivalent of an Atk boost, and you basically just take the difference in damage between Bonfire and say Ruptured Sky. Bonfire is pretty easy to calculate with 18 damage (36 Def at +10+10 with non-Def Mythic), but Ruptured Sky takes some guessing, so we will just say it does 14 damage (assuming enemies have an average of 70 Atk).

Link to comment
Share on other sites

24 minutes ago, TheSilentChloey said:

Does Peg!Nino want to be +Hp or +Res for a merge base?

Go with +Res. For the Desperation nukes, +HP is the worst Asset ever. Player Phase units want their HP to be as low as possible as it helps with getting into Desperation range.

In Aether Raids, having less than 40 HP is a huge convenience and potentially life saver, as you will face some players with good foresight and have a level 1 Bolt Trap. If your nuke has 41 HP or higher and step on a level 1 Bolt Trap, your nuke will not be Desperation range and it will be harder to get into Desperation range since your nuke is now more likely to die in one hit rather than surviving with low HP.

By the same token, if you have a choice between +HP/Def/Res for Lewyn or Summer Returns Laegjarn, then +HP is better as their Desperations work backwards and need HP to be above 50%.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Decided to try my chances again, since this weeks rotation has 2 characters i've been wanting, and managed to score Katarina, and an off focus Elincia within 40 orbs.

My question is, with Katarina, her IVs came up +speed -attack. I have a spare brave Celica i'm never going to use, and wondering if she'll make good use of death blow 4 to help mitigate that -attack IV. Or is she fine with just her base swift sparrow. Also whats a good B skill for her?

Link to comment
Share on other sites

13 minutes ago, Faellin said:

My question is, with Katarina, her IVs came up +speed -attack. I have a spare brave Celica i'm never going to use, and wondering if she'll make good use of death blow 4 to help mitigate that -attack IV. Or is she fine with just her base swift sparrow. Also whats a good B skill for her?

For nukes with decent Spd, you want an A skill that boosts Atk/Spd together; boosting just Atk or boosting just Spd is never good enough. B skill should almost always be Desperation.

Player Phase nukes with decent Spd or better should rarely deviate from the following build without a good reason:
(Any Player Phase Weapon)
Reposition
Moonbow — Glimmer — Ruptured Sky
(Any A that boosts Atk/Spd)
Desperation
(Any C)
(Any Sacred Seal that boosts Atk, Spd, or Atk/Spd)

Death Blow should only be used on builds where Spd is unnecessary, such as one shot nukes, Desperation-Brash Assault nukes, or slow Brave nukes.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

So now that I got Lul Atk spd I would like some help with sothis. She is +Def +1 and I will give her 5 flowers over time. The skills I am certain she will have are Sublime Surge, Swap, Sirius, Lul Atk spd. What are the best A, C and SS she can have (aside from her base kit she also has Bonus Doubler)? 

 

Edited by SuperNova125
Link to comment
Share on other sites

2 hours ago, SuperNova125 said:

So now that I got Lul Atk spd I would like some help with sothis. She is +Def +1 and I will give her 5 flowers over time. The skills I am certain she will have are Sublime Surge, Swap, Sirius, Lul Atk spd. What are the best A, C and SS she can have (aside from her base kit she also has Bonus Doubler)? 

What are you trying to accomplish with her?

For Enemy Phase, while Lull Atk/Spd is one of the best B skills, I recommend saving Lull Atk/Spd for a super tank in Aether Raids, since that is that is where Lull Atk/Spd is needed the most. I do not recommend using Sothis as a super tank since she does not get stat buffs from other Mythic Heroes since she is a Mythic herself.

If you still want to give her Lull Atk/Spd anyways, you can try something like the following:
Sublime Surge
Swap — Reposition
Sirius
Steady Posture — Swift Stance (Tier 4 of these skills are not released yet.) — Bonus Doubler.
Lull Atk/Spd
Time's Pulse — Atk Smoke
Quick Riposte
The A slot will shut down Specials while the B slot will shut down offensive stat buffs. I do not recommend Bonus Doubler unless you are running her on a Tactics team or with Azura: Vallite Songstress. If you are using her in Aether Raids, I personally do not recommend Bonus Doubler since I see Panic far too often to make Bonus Doubler worth the hassle. People have used Bonus Doubler to great effect in Aether Raids though, so use it at your own risk and be cautious.

If you are using Sothis as a Player Phase unit, Desperation is a far better B skill. As I previously mentioned above in my other post, Player Phase units have little to no reason to deviate from the standard build unless you really need them to do something else specific:

3 hours ago, XRay said:

Player Phase nukes with decent Spd or better should rarely deviate from the following build without a good reason:
(Any Player Phase Weapon)
Reposition
Moonbow — Glimmer — Ruptured Sky
(Any A that boosts Atk/Spd)
Desperation
(Any C)
(Any Sacred Seal that boosts Atk, Spd, or Atk/Spd)

Link to comment
Share on other sites

5 hours ago, XRay said:

If you are using Sothis as a Player Phase unit, Desperation is a far better B skill. As I previously mentioned above in my other post, Player Phase units have little to no reason to deviate from the standard build unless you really need them to do something else specific:

@SuperNova125

If you're using Sothis as a player-phase unit, there's really not much reason to run Desperation. Sirius is her best Special skill since it's better Moonbow and she's unable to run Ruptured Sky. Since Sirius is stronger than a Wo Dao-boosted Noontime, the value of Desperation is much lower.

I'd personally keep Sothis with her default B and C skills, Wrath and Time's Pulse, since that is the current one-hit kill template build for melee infantry.

 

As for your Sothis build, what are you aiming to do with it? Lull Atk/Spd is a defensive B skill, making it more suited for enemy-phase or dual-phase builds (since Sirius + Wrath + Time's Pulse is sufficient for player phase).

On a dual-phase build, you'd ideally run an A skill that boosts stats on both phases, like a Solo or Bond skill, Fury, or Bonus Doubler. For enemy phase, since Lull is already handling enemy bonuses, you'd want to run a tier 4 Stance skill to defend against enemy Special skills or a tier 4 Bond skill to negate your own penalties.

Time's Pulse is one of the best C skills right now for pure combat performance. For enemy-phase and dual-phase builds, you can also run Atk Smoke, Spd Smoke, Panic Smoke, or Pulse Smoke to improve your bulk if you don't need the Special charge from Time's Pulse.

The Sacred Seal slot also depends entirely on what you want to do with her. Sturdy Blow and Darting Blow are typically the best player-phase options (since Brazen Atk/Spd doesn't work well with Sirius). On enemy-phase and dual-phase builds, you can run Darting Stance, Close Def, or Distant Def for more bulk, a Bond skill if you're running a Bond skill in the A slot, Quick Riposte to block Wary Fighter, or a Smoke skill.

Edited by Ice Dragon
Link to comment
Share on other sites

9 minutes ago, Ice Dragon said:

If you're using Sothis as a player-phase unit, there's really not much reason to run Desperation. Sirius is her best Special skill since it's better Moonbow and she's unable to run Ruptured Sky. Since Sirius is stronger than a Wo Dao-boosted Noontime, the value of Desperation is much lower.

Running Sirius means Sothis is on a timer, and if you are running Impact to extend that timer instead of an Atk/Spd A skill, then you are slowing her down and reducing her performance.

Running Desperation means that Sothis can go on forever, and she can better deal with enemies that might be able to one shot her by simply avoiding the counter attack.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

2 hours ago, XRay said:

Running Sirius means Sothis is on a timer, and if you are running Impact to extend that timer instead of an Atk/Spd A skill, then you are slowing her down and reducing her performance.

Running Desperation means that Sothis can go on forever, and she can better deal with enemies that might be able to one shot her by simply avoiding the counter attack.

A fully built Sothis hits 91-102 effective Atk on her first hit (depending on build) from a Wrath-boosted Sirius. That's enough to kill most units outright and heal 10-20 HP. You're not on a timer if you're consistently landing one-hit kills or healing up most or all of your damage.

Desperation is only a side-grade on units with viable one-hit kill builds. In-combat one-hit kill builds are not vulnerable to Special charge rate reduction or follow-up prevention, and on a fast and moderately bulky unit like Sothis, are only vulnerable to bulky units if the opponent can set up a one-hit kill on the first counterattack. If a tank is bulky enough to land a second counterattack to kill your unit, then your Desperation unit was equally dead.

 

As for my numbers, I'm using the following builds:

Low end (lower one-hit kill damage for better performance at full HP):

+10 Sothis [+Spd], +5 Dragonflowers
Sublime Surge
Sirius
Swift Sparrow 3
Wrath 3
Time's Pulse 3
Sturdy Blow 2

34 neutral Atk + 4 merge + 1 Dragonflower + 16 Mt + 6 Swift Sparrow + 10 Wrath + 4 Sturdy Blow = 75 effective Atk without Special
0.3 × (43 Spd Asset + 4 merge + 1 Dragonflower + 7 Swift Sparrow) = 16 Sirius damage

91 total effective Atk, 55 Spd

High end (higher one-hit kill damage for worse performance at full HP):

+10 Sothis [+Atk], +5 Dragonflowers
Sublime Surge
Sirius
Brazen Atk/Spd 4
Wrath 3
Time's Pulse 3
Brazen Atk/Spd 3

37 Atk Asset + 4 merge + 1 Dragonflower + 16 Mt + 9 Brazen Atk/Spd + 10 Wrath + 7 Brazen Atk/Spd = 84 effective Atk without Special
0.3 × (39 neutral Spd + 4 merge + 1 Dragonflower + 10 Brazen Atk/Spd + 7 Brazen Atk/Spd) = 18 Sirius damage

102 total effective Atk, 61 Spd (44 Spd at full HP)

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I'm planning on making Effie my first +10 armor unit. What is the best/some of the best higher investment sets she can run? I have a spare Legendary Hector who could give her DC+Vengeful Fighter, as well as a Brave Hector who could give Bold Fighter if that's better.

Also, I have started merging Mercedes, and until now I've had her as +Atk. Recently I pulled a +Spd copy, is that an asset she would like more or is her speed not really worth investing into?

Link to comment
Share on other sites

How good is Halloween Rolf?  I've got this set up and he's still having issues nuking stuff despite the fact he's pretty speedy.  Also going to post him & his team as well in spoilers:

Spoiler

fire_emblem_heroes_2019_12_16_08_52_12_b

 

fire_emblem_heroes_2019_12_16_08_52_30_b

 

fire_emblem_heroes_2019_12_16_08_52_36_b

 

fire_emblem_heroes_2019_12_16_08_52_42_b

 

I should probably train Nozura (Conquest Azura) to be WoM 3 and possibly give it to Micaiah as well but not much good if Rolf gets killed (which he does a lot).

Link to comment
Share on other sites

39 minutes ago, BoaFerox said:

I'm planning on making Effie my first +10 armor unit. What is the best/some of the best higher investment sets she can run? I have a spare Legendary Hector who could give her DC+Vengeful Fighter, as well as a Brave Hector who could give Bold Fighter if that's better.

 

Enemy phase:

Slaying Lance+ / Reprisal Lance+ / Vanguard+ / Berkut's Lance+ / Barrier Lance+ / Luncheon Lance+ / Casa Blanca+
Swap / Reposition / Pivot
Ruptured Sky (with Slaying Lance) / Ignis / Aether (with Slaying Lance)
Distant Counter / Fortress Def/Res 3 (in game modes that favor melee opponents)
Vengeful Fighter 3
Armor March 3 / Ward Armor
Close Def 3 / Distant Def 3 / Fierce Stance 3

Dual phase:

Slaying Lance+ / Luncheon Lance+ / Flashing Carrot+ / Casa Blanca+
Swap / Reposition / Pivot
Ruptured Sky / Bonfire
Distant Counter
Bold Fighter 3
Armor March 3 / Ward Armor
Quick Riposte 3

Player phase:

Brave Lance+
Swap / Reposition
Ruptured Sky / Aether
Death Blow 4
Bold Fighter 3
Armor March 3
Sturdy Blow 2

Armorslayer:

Slaying Spear+ [unique]
Swap / Reposition
Ruptured Sky / Bonfire
Distant Counter / anything that boosts Atk
Bold Fighter 3 / Wary Fighter 3
Armor March 3
Sturdy Blow 2 / Quick Riposte 3 / anything that boosts Atk

Any refine left blank above can be Atk, Def, or Res, depending on what you need.

 

39 minutes ago, BoaFerox said:

Also, I have started merging Mercedes, and until now I've had her as +Atk. Recently I pulled a +Spd copy, is that an asset she would like more or is her speed not really worth investing into?

Mercedes has 30 base Spd, which is right about on the border of when Spd is worth investing in. It honestly doesn't make too much of a difference since most staves are meant for a support role instead of combat performance. Pain builds gravitate towards Atk so you can chip the last point of HP off of a unit more easily, but otherwise, it really doesn't matter too much which way to go for any unit with ~30 Spd or higher.

 

27 minutes ago, TheSilentChloey said:

How good is Halloween Rolf?  I've got this set up and he's still having issues nuking stuff despite the fact he's pretty speedy.

Rolf's biggest issue is his low Atk stat, and being a Grail unit means he can't boost it with an Asset. Bows don't have a good way to fix that, unlike tomes and daggers. The best that bows have are Short Bow and Shining Bow, which is nowhere even close to how effective Litrblade and Windex are. No matter how fast your unit is, you can't nuke if you can't do damage, and it doesn't help that bows have to target the Def stat, which is usually higher than Res.

Edited by Ice Dragon
Link to comment
Share on other sites

18 minutes ago, BoaFerox said:

I'm planning on making Effie my first +10 armor unit. What is the best/some of the best higher investment sets she can run? I have a spare Legendary Hector who could give her DC+Vengeful Fighter, as well as a Brave Hector who could give Bold Fighter if that's better.

Which mode are you using her in? For non-Aether Raids, I would go with Bold Fighter-Quick Riposte assuming she is also in an armor ball also full of dual phase armors.
+Atk/Def/Res (I lean towards +Atk or +Res)
Slaying Lance — Harmonic Lance
Def Refine — Res Refine (I lean towards Res to balance out her bulk.)
Reposition — Swap
Ignis (with Slaying Lance) — Bonfire — Luna
Warding Breath
Bold Fighter
Ward Armor — Armor March
Quick Riposte
You do not want to use Ignis with Harmonic Lance because you will not be able to activate it consistently on Player Phase. Slaying Lance can work with any of the above Specials. Slaying Lance with Bonfire/Luna allows Effie to activate a Special twice on Enemy Phase if she gets doubled. Between Bonfire and Luna, I recommend double checking the calculator to see which deals more damage on average. I believe Bonfire would be better, but double check to make sure.

For Aether Raids as a super tank, I am a little less sure, since you may also want to bring someone along for Armor March and that kind of complicates things.
+Res
Barrier Lance — Casablanca
Res Refine
Swap
Ruptured Sky
Distant Counter
Special Fighter
Atk Smoke — Pulse Smoke — Armor March
Distant Def — Quick Riposte

54 minutes ago, BoaFerox said:

Also, I have started merging Mercedes, and until now I've had her as +Atk. Recently I pulled a +Spd copy, is that an asset she would like more or is her speed not really worth investing into?

If you are using her as a nuke, I personally would not bother with +Spd unless you are giving them a proper A skill like Atk/Spd Solo or something. Without that Spd boost, it is not really worth trying get to her double things, so just focusing on dealing as much damage as possible in one hit is better in my opinion.

If you are not using her as a nuke, or if you plan to give her a proper A skill down the line, then I would go with +Spd.

31 minutes ago, TheSilentChloey said:

How good is Halloween Rolf?  I've got this set up and he's still having issues nuking stuff despite the fact he's pretty speedy.  Also going to post him & his team as well in spoilers:

  Reveal hidden contents

fire_emblem_heroes_2019_12_16_08_52_12_b

 

fire_emblem_heroes_2019_12_16_08_52_30_b

 

fire_emblem_heroes_2019_12_16_08_52_36_b

 

fire_emblem_heroes_2019_12_16_08_52_42_b

 

I should probably train Nozura (Conquest Azura) to be WoM 3 and possibly give it to Micaiah as well but not much good if Rolf gets killed (which he does a lot).

His build looks fine. Just replace Candlewax with either Brave Bow or Firesweep. If you are going with Brave Bow, then run Luna instead of Moonbow. Firesweep is the more expensive option, but it clashes less with raw damage nukes like Blade mages, Blazing mages, and other one shot nukes; Brave Bow is an okay damage output option, but it pales in comparison to Blade tomes. With Firesweep, the archer can do fulfill a really important niche in shutting down annoying Enemy Phase units that raw damage nukes have trouble dealing with.

Player Phase archers should basically only run Brave Bow or Firesweep Bow. Other bows are crap, even if they have exclusive bows. The only exception right now is Luns Arc from Alm: Saint King; but if they release even stronger A skills down the line, then Brave Bow will be better than Luna Arc too. Thögn from Lucina: Glorious Archer is still serviceable at low investment, but it past its prime once you give her better A skills.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

2 hours ago, Ice Dragon said:

Enemy phase:

Slaying Lance+ / Reprisal Lance+ / Vanguard+ / Berkut's Lance+ / Barrier Lance+ / Luncheon Lance+ / Casa Blanca+
Swap / Reposition / Pivot
Ruptured Sky (with Slaying Lance) / Ignis / Aether (with Slaying Lance)
Distant Counter / Fortress Def/Res 3 (in game modes that favor melee opponents)
Vengeful Fighter 3
Armor March 3 / Ward Armor
Close Def 3 / Distant Def 3 / Fierce Stance 3

Dual phase:

Slaying Lance+ / Luncheon Lance+ / Flashing Carrot+ / Casa Blanca+
Swap / Reposition / Pivot
Ruptured Sky / Bonfire
Distant Counter
Bold Fighter 3
Armor March 3 / Ward Armor
Quick Riposte 3

Player phase:

Brave Lance+
Swap / Reposition
Ruptured Sky / Aether
Death Blow 4
Bold Fighter 3
Armor March 3
Sturdy Blow 2

Armorslayer:

Slaying Spear+ [unique]
Swap / Reposition
Ruptured Sky / Bonfire
Distant Counter / anything that boosts Atk
Bold Fighter 3 / Wary Fighter 3
Armor March 3
Sturdy Blow 2 / Quick Riposte 3 / anything that boosts Atk

Any refine left blank above can be Atk, Def, or Res, depending on what you need.

Thanks, that's very helpful. She sure has a lot of options though... I think I'll give her the skills so I can pick between the dual phase and enemy phase sets as needed. 

In terms of weapon, I see Slaying Lance being used a lot, but I do have an extra Sumia that I could use to give her Reprisal Lance which you recommended on the enemy phase set. What are the advantages of that over Slaying Lance, and is it worth sacrificing a 5-star exclusive like Sumia to get it or is Sumia better used for Close Defense?

2 hours ago, Ice Dragon said:

Mercedes has 30 base Spd, which is right about on the border of when Spd is worth investing in. It honestly doesn't make too much of a difference since most staves are meant for a support role instead of combat performance. Pain builds gravitate towards Atk so you can chip the last point of HP off of a unit more easily, but otherwise, it really doesn't matter too much which way to go for any unit with ~30 Spd or higher.

1 hour ago, XRay said:

If you are using her as a nuke, I personally would not bother with +Spd unless you are giving them a proper A skill like Atk/Spd Solo or something. Without that Spd boost, it is not really worth trying get to her double things, so just focusing on dealing as much damage as possible in one hit is better in my opinion.

If you are not using her as a nuke, or if you plan to give her a proper A skill down the line, then I would go with +Spd.

I think I'll keep +Atk in that case. Thanks!

Link to comment
Share on other sites

23 minutes ago, BoaFerox said:

In terms of weapon, I see Slaying Lance being used a lot, but I do have an extra Sumia that I could use to give her Reprisal Lance which you recommended on the enemy phase set. What are the advantages of that over Slaying Lance, and is it worth sacrificing a 5-star exclusive like Sumia to get it or is Sumia better used for Close Defense?

Armors have a lot of options for boosting their Special charge rate, so whether or not you use Slaying Lance depends on when you want your Special to land and which Special-boosting skill you're using.

For example, with Vengeful Fighter on the first build (pure enemy phase), you can land a 1-cooldown Special on each counterattack or a 4-cooldown Special on the second counterattack. This means you can run Slaying Lance + Ruptured Sky, not-Slaying-Lance + Ignis, or Slaying Lance + Aether. Each of these behaves very differently from each other. Ruptured Sky gives you high up-front damage, but none of the benefits from the weapons that aren't Slaying Lance. Ignis gives you good damage output and a more specialized effect from your weapon, but requires you to survive 2 hits before you get your big hit in (and gets completely shut down by Null Follow-Up and skills that prevent follow-ups). Aether gives up the weapon effect and has lower damage output, but gives you passive healing (and scores better in the Arena).

Additionally, you also have to consider how often you'll be fighting units running some form of Special charge rate reduction. For example, against an opponent with Special Fighter, Vengeful Fighter will only be able to land a 1-cooldown Special on the second counterattack.

As for the particular case of Reprisal Lance + Ignis, it deals slightly more damage than Slaying Lance + Ruptured Sky, but its damage is delayed to the second hit, meaning its more vulnerable to effects that block your follow-up and effects that slow your Special charge rate.

 

Oh, and speaking of boosting Special charge rate, I forgot this build in my list. This one's also for enemy phase:

Slaying Lance+ / Reprisal Lance+ / Vanguard+ / Berkut's Lance+ / Barrier Lance+ / Luncheon Lance+ / Casa Blanca+
Swap / Reposition / Pivot
Ruptured Sky (not Slaying Lance) / Bonfire (Slaying Lance only) / Ignis (not Slaying Lance) / Aether (Slaying Lance only)
Distant Counter
Special Fighter 3
Armor March 3 / Ward Armor
Quick Riposte 3

There's also this player-phase build:

Brave Lance+ / Slaying Lance+
Swap / Reposition
Galeforce
Death Blow 4
Bold Fighter 3
Armor March 3
Sturdy Blow 2 / Quickened Pulse

 

2 hours ago, XRay said:

His build looks fine. Just replace Candlewax with either Brave Bow or Firesweep. If you are going with Brave Bow, then run Luna instead of Moonbow. Firesweep is the more expensive option, but it clashes less with raw damage nukes like Blade mages, Blazing mages, and other one shot nukes; Brave Bow is an okay damage output option, but it pales in comparison to Blade tomes. With Firesweep, the archer can do fulfill a really important niche in shutting down annoying Enemy Phase units that raw damage nukes have trouble dealing with.

Player Phase archers should basically only run Brave Bow or Firesweep Bow. Other bows are crap, even if they have exclusive bows. The only exception right now is Luns Arc from Alm: Saint King; but if they release even stronger A skills down the line, then Brave Bow will be better than Luna Arc too. Thögn from Lucina: Glorious Archer is still serviceable at low investment, but it past its prime once you give her better A skills.

@TheSilentChloey

Rolf's 30 Atk is way too low to run Brave Bow effectively.

Setsuna's 28 Atk was laughably meme-worthy at launch, and defensive stats on enemy phase have seen far more growth since then than offensive stats on player phase. In terms of skills, player-phase Atk has only gone up by 6 points (6 points at launch from Death Blow 3 to 12 points now from Death Blow 4 + Sturdy Blow 2) whereas enemy-phase Def has gone up by 14 points (0 points at launch to 14 points now from Distant Def 4 + Distant Def 3). Furthermore, modern infantry have about 15 points more of stats than infantry at launch, most of which are added to defensive stats. Having 30+ Def is now the norm for melee infantry whereas 30 Def was exceptional at launch.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

@Ice Dragon

Yeah, I guessed as much, which is why I chose to run him with the current set up, which reminds me does Lilina want to be +Atk or +Speed.  She's going to get a merge so her flaw won't exist but I want to know which one so that I can try to make her into a proper nuke.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

14 minutes ago, Ice Dragon said:

 

@TheSilentChloey

Rolf's 30 Atk is way too low to run Brave Bow effectively.

Setsuna's 28 Atk was laughably meme-worthy at launch, and defensive stats on enemy phase have seen far more growth since then than offensive stats on player phase. In terms of skills, player-phase Atk has only gone up by 6 points (6 points at launch from Death Blow 3 to 12 points now from Death Blow 4 + Sturdy Blow 2) whereas enemy-phase Def has gone up by 14 points (0 points at launch to 14 points now from Distant Def 4 + Distant Def 3). Furthermore, modern infantry have about 15 points more of stats than infantry at launch, most of which are added to defensive stats. Having 30+ Def is now the norm for melee infantry whereas 30 Def was exceptional at launch.

2 minutes ago, TheSilentChloey said:

@Ice Dragon

Yeah, I guessed as much, which is why I chose to run him with the current set up, which reminds me does Lilina want to be +Atk or +Speed.  She's going to get a merge so her flaw won't exist but I want to know which one so that I can try to make her into a proper nuke.

Brave Bow is still the superior option. Short Bow and Shining Bow cannot activate Specials consistently. Slaying Bow can, but its damage output is crap.

Until they release Blade Bow or something, Brave Bow will always remain supreme.

Challenger List: Against Hard List. Both sides +10 and got 6/6/6/6 bonus buffs. Challengers at 1 HP.

Spoiler

CHALLENGER LIST  
Rolf (MH) (5*+10)  
Weapon: Brave Bow+  
Special: Luna  
A: Life and Death 3  
B: Desperation 3  
C: Savage Blow 3  
S: Brazen Atk Spd 3  
  
Rolf (MH) (5*+10)  
Weapon: Short Bow+  
Special: Moonbow  
A: Brazen Atk Spd 4  
B: Desperation 3  
C: Savage Blow 3  
S: Brazen Atk Spd 3  
Upgrade Path: 2  
  
Rolf (MH) (5*+10)  
Weapon: Slaying Bow+  
Special: Moonbow  
A: Brazen Atk Spd 4  
B: Desperation 3  
C: Savage Blow 3  
S: Brazen Atk Spd 3  
Upgrade Path: 2  
  
Rolf (MH) (5*+10)  
Weapon: Shining Bow+  
Special: Moonbow  
A: Brazen Atk Spd 4  
B: Desperation 3  
C: Savage Blow 3  
S: Brazen Atk Spd 3  
Upgrade Path: 2  

 

Edited by XRay
Link to comment
Share on other sites

1 minute ago, TheSilentChloey said:

Yeah, I guessed as much, which is why I chose to run him with the current set up, which reminds me does Lilina want to be +Atk or +Speed.  She's going to get a merge so her flaw won't exist but I want to know which one so that I can try to make her into a proper nuke.

Assuming this is vanilla Lilina, she usually wants an Atk Asset due to her low Spd stat. Her standard optimized build is something like

Lilina [+Atk]
Forblaze [unique]
Reposition / Draw Back
Ruptured Sky
Death Blow 4
Special Spiral 3 / Lull */Res 3
Time's Pulse / [flexible]
Sturdy Blow 2 / Quickened Pulse

That is unless you're going to stack her Spd to the moon and back

+10 Lilina [+Spd], +10 Dragonflower
Forblaze [unique / Spd]
Reposition / Draw Back
Ruptured Sky
Swift Sparrow 3 / Life and Death 4
Lull Spd/Res 3 (once it exists) / Lull Atk/Spd 3
Time's Pulse 3 / Joint Hone Spd
Darting Blow 3

which is 51 effective Spd before buffs with the unique refine or 54 with the Spd refine.

 

1 minute ago, XRay said:

Challenger List: Against Hard List. Both sides +10 and got 6/6/6/6 bonus buffs. Challengers at 1 HP.

The Hard List is woefully outdated, and getting a Brave Bow to Desperation range is harder than getting any other weapon into Desperation range in every game mode other than Aether Raids.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

7 minutes ago, Ice Dragon said:

Assuming this is vanilla Lilina, she usually wants an Atk Asset due to her low Spd stat. Her standard optimized build is something like

Lilina [+Atk]
Forblaze [unique]
Reposition / Draw Back
Ruptured Sky
Death Blow 4
Special Spiral 3 / Lull */Res 3
Time's Pulse / [flexible]
Sturdy Blow 2 / Quickened Pulse

That is unless you're going to stack her Spd to the moon and back

+10 Lilina [+Spd], +10 Dragonflower
Forblaze [unique / Spd]
Reposition / Draw Back
Ruptured Sky
Swift Sparrow 3 / Life and Death 4
Lull Spd/Res 3 (once it exists) / Lull Atk/Spd 3
Time's Pulse 3 / Joint Hone Spd
Darting Blow 3

which is 51 effective Spd before buffs with the unique refine or 54 with the Spd refine.

 

The Hard List is woefully outdated, and getting a Brave Bow to Desperation range is harder than getting any other weapon into Desperation range in every game mode other than Aether Raids.

It's normal Lilina and I don't have Ruptured Sky fodder, so will Moonbow do as an alternative?

 

I also don't have Time's pulse either.

Edited by TheSilentChloey
Link to comment
Share on other sites

1 minute ago, Ice Dragon said:

The Hard List is woefully outdated, and getting a Brave Bow to Desperation range is harder than getting any other weapon into Desperation range in every game mode other than Aether Raids.

In PvE, getting into Desperation is not that difficult. Abyssal enemies hit hard, but they do not hit that hard.

In any other game mode, anything Brave Bow cannot kill, other bows are not going to kill either. Getting into Desperation range is not going to help that much without the killing power.

If the player really needs a cheap raw damage output option, bringing a Blade mage would be a better than bringing an archer.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

35 minutes ago, TheSilentChloey said:

It's normal Lilina and I don't have Ruptured Sky fodder, so will Moonbow do as an alternative?

That's just the optimal build as an example.

If I include cheaper options, it looks more like

Forblaze [unique]
Reposition / Draw Back
Ruptured Sky / Moonbow / Glimmer
Death Blow 4 / Life and Death 4 / Swift Sparrow 3 / Atk/Spd Solo 3 / Death Blow 3
Special Spiral 3 / Swordbreaker 3 / Axebreaker 3 / [flexible]
Time's Pulse / [flexible]
Sturdy Blow 2 / Attack +3 / Quickened Pulse

 

35 minutes ago, TheSilentChloey said:

I also don't have Time's pulse either.

It's not necessary for the build to work, hence why "[flexible]" is slashed in.

 

31 minutes ago, XRay said:

In PvE, getting into Desperation is not that difficult. Abyssal enemies hit hard, but they do not hit that hard.

The problem with activating Desperation in Abyssal maps is not that they'll kill you outright, it's that there are a few units that will kill you outright, a few units that will die outright before they counterattack, and the rest simply cannot counterattack. Setting up Desperation is not just surviving a counterattack, it's also making sure at least something that can't kill you got a chance to counterattack in the first place.

 

31 minutes ago, XRay said:

In any other game mode, anything Brave Bow cannot kill, other bows are not going to kill either. Getting into Desperation range is not going to help that much without the killing power.

You are giving Brave Bow too much credit.

Brave Bow has 2 important disadvantages compared to other options. The first is that it hits twice before the opponent can counterattack, which makes it easier to unintentionally charge the opponent's Special for their first counterattack.

The second is its stats. It not only has abysmally bad Mt, but also lowers the unit's Spd by a full tier and also cannot be refined. Short Bow has +10 effective Atk over 2 hits compared to Brave Bow, and Shining Bow has +12 effective Atk over 2 hits compared to Brave Bow (when its effect activates). Both can be refined for another point of Atk. Increasing the effective Atk instead of increasing the number of hits is more effective as units have more Def.

Bow units with low Atk should be leaning towards Firesweep, but as that is expensive, the next best options are Short Bow, Shining Bow, or Slaying Bow, all of which are currently available from units in the 4-star pool.

Edited by Ice Dragon
Link to comment
Share on other sites

3 minutes ago, Ice Dragon said:

The second is its stats. It not only has abysmally bad Mt, but also lowers the unit's Spd by a full tier and also cannot be refined. Short Bow has +10 effective Atk over 2 hits compared to Brave Bow, and Shining Bow has +12 effective Atk over 2 hits compared to Brave Bow (when its effect activates). Both can be refined for another point of Atk. Increasing the effective Atk instead of increasing the number of hits is more effective as units have more Def.

Bow units with low Atk should be leaning towards Firesweep, but as that is expensive, the next best options are Short Bow, Shining Bow, or Slaying Bow, all of which are currently available from units in the 4-star pool.

I have given Short Bow, Shining Bow, and Slaying Bow Brazen Atk/Spd 4, and compared that to Brave Bow with Life and Death 3, and Brave Bow still performs better. You can even pump up the enemies def by 6 to simulate Distant Def, and only Slaying Bow would manage to match Brave Bow in performance. If Brave Bow is given an equal playing field with Brazen Atk/Spd 4, other bows would not even come close in performance.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.

 Share

  • Recently Browsing   0 members

    • No registered users viewing this page.
×
×
  • Create New...