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Arena Discussion Thread (inc. Assault)

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Just now, daisy jane said:

you can practice. (and i'm not saying this to sound cheeky). @Diovani Bressan  was helping me this time last year - i was still using repo and everything. now i'm used to not having it on my arena core, and it's helped me in OTHER modes (when i can use repo etc,because sometimes i can run a rally instead)

...Okay, first, even though you quoted me, the text you actually quoted is not mine... So what the heck happened here?

Second, I don't think so. I'd love to try, but I don't believe I can be any better at the game than I already am. I just feel my mind is not suited to working with more advanced stuff.

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13 minutes ago, Diovani Bressan said:

Fish for 748+. Some time I promoted to T21 with 744-746. So to keep Tier 20, I dont think 748 is that needed.

Hmm...

Does anyone know the threshold to safely stay in Tier 20, even during Water Season? If it is in the high 3,700s, I think I might be willing to work towards it. If it is high 3,700s, I think I might be able to get by with running Reposition instead of Rallies too if I run a bunch of Duo Heroes.

Edited by XRay

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11 minutes ago, XRay said:

Hmm...

Does anyone know the threshold to safely stay in Tier 21, even during Water Season? If it is in the high 3,700s, I think I might be willing to work towards it. If it is high 3,700s, I think I might be able to get by with running Reposition instead of Rallies too.

I think depends on the Season. The last Three seasons, that had Legendary Alm as bonus and all three were earth seasons... Those week's were cruel. 

13 minutes ago, Anacybele said:

Second, I don't think so. I'd love to try, but I don't believe I can be any better at the game than I already am. I just feel my mind is not suited to working with more advanced stuff.

I mean... It's up to you if you dont want to improve.

One thing that I said to Daisy is to practice Arena everyday. We get 3 free matches in Arena every day. Just play them without using Movement assists. You will get experience from these matches, and since its training you dont need to surrender after losing a unit. Just say to yourself "I lost a unit this time, so next match I will be more careful", and not " Aaaahh, its toooo haaaaarrrddd, I caaaannnt without repositiooooonn".

You will learn how AI works this way, and learn that its not hard to play without those assists.

Edited by Diovani Bressan

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3 minutes ago, Diovani Bressan said:

I mean... It's up to you if you dont want to improve.

One thing that I said to Daisy is to practice Arena everyday. We get 3 free matches in Arena every day. Just play them without using Movement assists. You will get experience from these matches, and since its training you dont need to surrender after losing a unit. Just say to yourself "I lost a unit this time, so next match I will be more careful", and not " Aaaahh, its toooo haaaaarrrddd, I caaaannnt without repositiooooonn".

You will learn how AI works this way, and learn that its not hard to play without those assists.

That would potentially take a long time. I'd have to find an opportunity where I would be fine with spending a few hours or so doing that practice. It can already take me an hour or so to get a deathless streak in arena as is. Not always, but sometimes.

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26 minutes ago, Anacybele said:

...Okay, first, even though you quoted me, the text you actually quoted is not mine... So what the heck happened here?

Second, I don't think so. I'd love to try, but I don't believe I can be any better at the game than I already am. I just feel my mind is not suited to working with more advanced stuff.

yeah that is weird. 

and i will say - bumpkis. complete and utter. I mean. i still get obliterated and stuff too  because i forget basic things - but just try and practice. it it won't happen over night. and it won't always stay in your head, but more will stick with you than you think. like. just even try with one unit to start. then move to two. then three. then four. i believe that you can do it 👏

Edited by daisy jane

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2 minutes ago, daisy jane said:

yeah that is weird. 

and i will say - bumpkis. complete and utter. I mean. i still get obliterated and stuff too  because i forget basic things - but just try and practice. it it won't happen over night. and it won't always stay in your head, but more will stick with you than you think. like. just even try with one unit to start. then move to two. then three. then four. i believe that you can do it 👏

As I said above, it would take a long time, but whenever I feel like taking the time to do so, maybe I'll give it a try. That's provided I've got enough rally fodder to go around though, since I typically never kept much of it. I never used rallies much at all.

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1 hour ago, Diovani Bressan said:

I think depends on the Season. The last Three seasons, that had Legendary Alm as bonus and all three were earth seasons... Those week's were cruel. 

Hm... I think I will just stick with bouncing between Tier 19 and Tier 20 for now. If it takes too much effort and investment and the pay off to stay in Tier 20 is just slightly more Feathers and 0.5 more Orbs per week, I think I rather spend that effort and investment into Aether Raids instead.

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Just now, XRay said:

Hm... I think I will just stick with bouncing between Tier 19 and Tier 20 for now. If it takes too much effort and investment and the pay off to stay in Tier 20 is just slightly more Feathers and 0.5 more Orbs per week, I think I rather spend that effort and investment into Aether Raids instead.

Yeah. It works.

I mean, the last change I did to my Arena team was back in April when I added Young Marth. I run the same team for months, and I don't even have a high merged Legendary (my highest merged Legendary is Guunthrá at +3, and we all know she doesn't score well). Once I got my team ready, I didn't have to add much and it's enough to make me bounce between Tier 20 and 21 without any stress.

Aether Raids is the more that needs more investment, like you said. Since new Mythic Heroes can totally change the approach and what units to use... I didn't have Null Follow-Up in my light team until Bramimond showed up, and it's been months that I didn't use Aversa but because of Hel she is back to one of my teams.

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23 minutes ago, Diovani Bressan said:

I mean, the last change I did to my Arena team was back in April when I added Young Marth. I run the same team for months, and I don't even have a high merged Legendary (my highest merged Legendary is Guunthrá at +3, and we all know she doesn't score well). Once I got my team ready, I didn't have to add much and it's enough to make me bounce between Tier 20 and 21 without any stress.

Is the investment to bounce between Tier 20 and Tier 21 not much higher than the investment required to stay in Tier 20?

I am thinking about investing in two Duo Heroes for their 185 BST and VS!Azura in the future. For me, I think the challenge is getting all those VS!Azura merges since pity breakers on Legendary and Mythic Foci is like 66% when you snipe, although the cost per 5* is cheaper, so I am not sure if that will balance out the total cost. I also still have to decide on who my second Duo Hero should be, although I am leaning a bit towards OM!F!Byleth right now.

This is going to be a long term project though. It took me around eight to nine months to get DM!Ephraim to +10 and it took a chunk out of my wallet, so I do not think I will be able to get a second Duo Hero to +10, let alone VS!Azura to +10, until next year.

Now that I am thinking about it more, TSOIA!Palla, OM!F!Byleth, and VS!Azura sounds better as a core team. Having a flier core makes that stupid double parallel bridge map a ton more bearable in case Intelligent Systems get any funny ideas and give out Duel Cavalry skills.

Edited by XRay

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The cutoff to stay in T21 the last two weeks was 3860, due to earth seasons lining up with bonus LAlm, on top of 2 commonly +10'd f2p units Sheena/FCorrin.

It's expected to drop to somewhere in 3820s-40s since this week doesn't have any outrageous factors like the above.

Cutoff for promoting to T21 this week is predicted to be back down to 3790s, but I could be wrong.

Merged legends aren't mandatory for T20.5, a core of 170s-185 should be sufficient. I used a mix of Nino/Effie/Surtr before Flame Emperor came out and it's always overkill for T20.5, and can even stay in T21 when a good bonus permits.

The bigger issue is making a core that can handle all the ranged units in arena, which are the true threat (Alm/Chrom/Leif/Julia/Ranged Duos/Dancers). Armors outside of Surtr and LEdelgard stopped being big threats ages ago when Duel skills came out.

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1 minute ago, XRay said:

Is the investment to bounce between Tier 20 and Tier 21 not much higher than the investment required to stay in Tier 20?

I am thinking about investing in two Duo Heroes for their 185 BST and VS!Azura in the future. For me, I think the challenge is getting all those VS!Azura merges since pity breakers on Legendary and Mythic Foci is like 66% when you snipe, although the cost per 5* is cheaper, so I am not sure if that will balance out the total cost. I also still have to decide on who my second Duo Hero should be, although I am leaning a bit towards OM!F!Byleth right now.

This is going to be a long term project though. It took me around eight to nine months to get DM!Ephraim to +10 and it took a chunk out of my wallet, so I do not think I will be able to get a second Duo Hero to +10, let alone VS!Azura to +10, until next year.

I don't think the investment to bounce between Tier 20 and 21 is that different from staying on Tier 20. Maybe Not having hight tier passive skills or not having Rally +, I think. Here's my Arena team:

  • OG Marth, with Refined Falchion, Rally Atk/Def+, Aether, R Duel Infantry 3, Def/Res Ruse 3, Infantry Breath 3 and Spur Atk/Spd 2 Seal. I used to have Rally Atk/Def, Chill Def B skill and Spur Def/Res C skill before having the skills I have now. I still use Spur Def/Res when the bonus unit is not infantry
     
  • OG Soren, with Refined Wind's Brand, Rally Spd/Def+, Aether, G Duel Infantry 3, Chill Res 3, Close Guard 3 and Distant Guard 3 Seal. I got some Rally Spd/Def+ in 2018 by Quan pitybreaking me. I got like... 2, going for Ophelia in Eir's Hero Fest. Before having Distant Guard 3 seal, I used to have Drive Res 2, I think.
     
  • Young Marth, with Rapier, Rally Atk/Res+, Hero's Blood, Distant Counter, Special Spiral 3, Joint Hone Atk, Brazen Atk/Spd 3 Seal.  I got a Winter Nino going for Winter Marth last year, so I foddered her to Young Marth, and also one of the two Young Caedas that I got as well, for both DC and Joint Hone Atk. He has his Spd/Def Oath and Def Smoke if I want to use them.

Others units that I used in Arena are:

  • Aversa, with Aversa's Night, Rally Spd/Def+, Aether, R Duel Flying 3, Chill Spd 3, Odd Res Wave 3, Guidance 3 Seal, Before Young Marth, I didn't have a way to buff Res, so I gave her Res Wave to help. When the bonus was not infantry, I was able to run Res Tactic seal on her. She was in place of Young Marth, so you could he that I have all Chill Skills in my Arena team (Marth with Chill Def, Soren with Chill Atk and Res, and Aversa with Chill Spd)
     
  • Saizo, with Refined Saizo's Star, Rally Spd/Def+ (too many Quans), Aether, C Duel Colorless 3, Watersweep 3, Infantry Rush 3, Chill Spd 3 seal. I used Saizo for a while in Arena after he got his refinement. I gave him Watersweep so he was able to debuff dragons without problems. Infantry Rush was to give Heavy Blade do Soren and Marth. Later in September, I foddered a Thrasir to him so he got Panic Smoke.
     
  • Reyson, with Heron Wing, Sing, Aether, G Duel Flying, Wings of Mercy 3, Joint Hone Spd, Guidance 3 seal. I got Reyson done with year, and I used him sometimes in Arena. Having a dancer is pretty nice, especially one that can heal. I usually use him when my bonus unit is someone that scores pretty well... like a Legendary Hero or a Duo Hero. So I can sacrifice some points by using a dancer because my bonus units scores well.

With the exception of R Duel Infantry that I went for it, and G Duel Flying that I summoned Spring Veronica in her banner, all the others Duel skills were pity breakers. Laegjarn pity broke me when I was trying for Dancer Ishtar last year, I got a random Helbindi somewhere, and I got a Loki in Duma's Banner.

Like you, I was planning to go for a Duo Hero for my team. My plan was Valentine Alm. I was saving for him, but then Young Marth happened. I didn't expect Alm to be in August, so I am not ready for him.

Azura will be back in November... but with Tiki. Tiki is not a bad Legendary. I mean, she scores 180, so for a Earth team that's nice. But Azura is a dancer, which makes Arena even more easier.

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22 minutes ago, Azuni said:

Merged legends aren't mandatory for T20.5, a core of 170s-185 should be sufficient. I used a mix of Nino/Effie/Surtr before Flame Emperor came out and it's always overkill for T20.5, and can even stay in T21 when a good bonus permits.

 

I see. Just to be safe, I want to aim for Duo Heroes as my combat units to offset VS!Azura's lower BST.

19 minutes ago, Azuni said:

The bigger issue is making a core that can handle all the ranged units in arena, which are the true threat (Alm/Chrom/Leif/Julia/Ranged Duos/Dancers). Armors outside of Surtr and LEdelgard stopped being big threats ages ago when Duel skills came out.

Oof. I forgot about CE!Chrom. He is a huge pain in the ass. Now I am a little hesitant about running a flier core.

4 minutes ago, Diovani Bressan said:

Like you, I was planning to go for a Duo Hero for my team. My plan was Valentine Alm. I was saving for him, but then Young Marth happened. I didn't expect Alm to be in August, so I am not ready for him.

DM!Ephraim and LG!Alm do go well together. CE!Chrom is a complete anus, so having LG!Alm with Distant Counter sounds like a really good plan.

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1 minute ago, XRay said:

DM!Ephraim and LG!Alm do go well together. CE!Chrom is a complete anus, so having LG!Alm with Distant Counter sounds like a really good plan.

Yeah. Alm is pretty good against Chrom.

I am kinda surprised that, with all allies around him, Soren can survive and kill Chrom. Young Marth already survived Chrom sometimes, but I think he was in a defensive time and not at full HP.

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Wind-Water week is absolutely fucking insufferable. Especially with a bonus unit list as horrendously awful as the current one.

Chrom, Azura, and Leaf are fucking everywhere. Eliwood is fucking useless because everything has Lull something or another. Wind has the absolute worst selection of Legendary Heroes in terms of scoring.

Fuck the Arena.

 

EDIT: Just spent about 70 dueling sword restores and almost 2 hours getting a score of 3,842, which for now seems safe. Fuck the Arena.

Edited by Ice Dragon

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1 hour ago, Ice Dragon said:

Wind-Water week is absolutely fucking insufferable. Especially with a bonus unit list as horrendously awful as the current one.

Chrom, Azura, and Leaf are fucking everywhere. Eliwood is fucking useless because everything has Lull something or another. Wind has the absolute worst selection of Legendary Heroes in terms of scoring.

Fuck the Arena.

 

EDIT: Just spent about 70 dueling sword restores and almost 2 hours getting a score of 3,842, which for now seems safe. Fuck the Arena.

Pretty much this. 
I am not even bothering anymore with this week. I might just build a Body if I ever get G Duel Infantry since he shuts down every water legendary.

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3 hours ago, Ice Dragon said:

Wind-Water week is absolutely fucking insufferable. Especially with a bonus unit list as horrendously awful as the current one.

Chrom, Azura, and Leaf are fucking everywhere. Eliwood is fucking useless because everything has Lull something or another. Wind has the absolute worst selection of Legendary Heroes in terms of scoring.

Fuck the Arena.

 

EDIT: Just spent about 70 dueling sword restores and almost 2 hours getting a score of 3,842, which for now seems safe. Fuck the Arena.

I do not recall seeing CE!Chrom nor GA!Lucina this week, or at least not during my actual run. I do see VS!Azuras a lot. I think I died to UOT!Leif once but I have not seen him a lot either. I guess I got pretty lucky this week.

Is 3,842 safe for staying in Tier 20 or Tier 21?

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1 minute ago, XRay said:

Is 3,842 safe for staying in Tier 20 or Tier 21?

Has to be T21. I've even heard reports of the cutoff being down as far as 3810s, which I guess makes sense with Wind week dragging the score down on top of the awful bonus unit set.

Guess I way overshot with a 3854, but it didn't take many crests anyways.

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33 minutes ago, XRay said:

I do not recall seeing CE!Chrom nor GA!Lucina this week, or at least not during my actual run. I do see VS!Azuras a lot. I think I died to UOT!Leif once but I have not seen him a lot either. I guess I got pretty lucky this week.

Chrom was literally everywhere for me to the point where I had to give Grima Svalinn shield to deal with it. Azura just makes dealing with Chrom even worse, and it doesn't help that there's also the occasional Duo Micaiah or Duo Byleth to deal with.

Leaf wasn't so much a problem for me to kill this week as much as he was a problem for me to not kill. He's often the easiest unit for Eliwood to take out due to his inability to counterattack and abysmal Spd, so I often had to bend over backwards to make sure he wouldn't just walk into one of my armors and instantly die.

Lucina doesn't exist in my score range.

 

39 minutes ago, XRay said:

Is 3,842 safe for staying in Tier 20 or Tier 21?

Tier 21. I think I was around rank 340 when I finished my run with the top 1,000 staying. So I should be safe.

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I bit the bullet last week and spent 180.000 feather for all my Fav Healers and gave them all Gravity+ and Savage blow. Instant 7 Streak and no losses and no items used. I'll get those feather back in due time. It immediately relieves the stress from AA. Even in a sucky season like this one.

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I'm not a fan of two of the new Arena maps, it so easy for the opposing team to drive you into a corner. My bad for not having a offensive oriented team I guess. No DC on my Corrin so its free real estate for random range units. Caeda feels redundant since I'm using Eliwood, but random Surtr messes me up. At least my consistent 750 scores should get me into tier 20 this week.

I feel like they made these maps to get people more wins on their defense. Even if I invest in a more offensive team, how does my bonus unit even get a chance to get a kill.

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Forgot about the new maps. That might explain some things. I had a Wind-oriented team last week built around Legendary Eliwood, who I used for the first time since getting him to 40 (he's unmerged and -Atk so I've never had reason to use him). Last week, no defense wins. Today, two defense wins within 2 hours of reset, when he's out of season.

Since I run the same team for offense as I do for defense, I've since had to select a different team completely, since the one I built wouldn't score enough to even promote to T20. I'll never know how flukey those wins were.

 

P.S. The team was Aversa, Mila and Nino, simply because I sorted the barracks by Atk and those were the first three reasonable choices I had who shared an Atk stat. I'm far too lazy to actually customise individual units just hit a specific value.

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14 minutes ago, Humanoid said:

P.S. The team was Aversa, Mila and Nino, simply because I sorted the barracks by Atk and those were the first three reasonable choices I had who shared an Atk stat. I'm far too lazy to actually customise individual units just hit a specific value.

I think I died to a team with that team composition yesterday or the day before, and I think the fourth unit is a sword unit (I do not remember which one), so I might have faced your team. I got cocky and sent my whole team in an adjacent group (completely forgetting about Aversa) after I killed the sword unit, thinking I can survive a hit on enemy phase, but all my combat units got wiped leaving my Olivia alone.

The loss was fine though since I already did my run, and it is not like I can use Arena Medals for anything right now.

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34 minutes ago, XRay said:

I think the fourth unit is a sword unit (I do not remember which one)

The whole point of the post was that I built the team around Legendary Eliwood. 😉 I've had him for months but until last week's Arena bonus unit lineup had no reason to use him.

He's fun, but I'm not sure about reserving a permanent team slot and being careful to preserve his teammates' Atk stats in the long run since I mix and match a lot and would prefer not to have to lock down three other units exclusively around him. Maybe once I get a merge or two on him to get rid of his Attack bane he'll be able to hold his own without bonus stats.

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