Who is the most powerful dragon boss (lore-wise)?

[asdfasdfasdf]

Which of these dragon do you believe is the strongest lore wise (not based on how difficult the battle was in game-play)?

Edited March 3, 2017 by asdfasdfasdf

[Man of Many Faces]

Who are Ein, Khozen, and Mannu?  I don't remember which games these three were from.

[Extrasolar]

58 minutes ago, ManOfManyFaces said:

Who are Ein, Khozen, and Mannu?  I don't remember which games these three were from.

Ain is a Fire Dragon from Binding Blade, Khozen is a dragon servant of Medeus in New Mystery, and Mannu is the dragon ruler of Pyrathi in Shadow Dragon.

I'd say the main running is between Dheginsea, Grima, Loptyr and Anankos. The rest aren't anywhere close, imo, as none of them have power or actions comparable to those four.

Dheginsea was one of the Three Heroes of Ashera way back in the past, not to mention being blessed by a god, which in Tellius pretty much cranks all of your attributes up. He ruled an entire kingdom of dragon laguz (which lore-wise, are extremely powerful though in gameplay they're pretty mediocre) by virtue of being by far the most powerful Black Dragon, and took down the gigantic army of a god with only two other allies by his side. It took an entire army composed of people from every corner of Tellius, including the other laguz royals, themselves immensely powerful, to take him down.

Grima and Loptyr were also very powerful and their foul influence was felt on their respective continents. Grima almost destroyed the entirety of Ylisse and would have had it not been for the First Exalt and Naga herself, while Loptyr pretty much successfully ruled all of Jugdral for centuries before the Twelve Crusaders (with a weapon of Naga's) came in to stop him. Neither of the two was killed for sure, though; Grima fell into a sleep and Loptyr's essence was contained within the tome of the same name. Both had cults that were slavishly loyal to them and worked to ensure their resurrection.

Anankos seems to hold godly power, and he pretty much decimated all of Valla and its population. Not to mention, he showed he had the ability to bring in people from alternate dimensions to serve under him, so there's that too.

I can't choose between them...

Edited March 3, 2017 by Extrasolar

[Magical Glace]

I put Loptyr, but Grima is pretty similar power wise to him, so he'd be next.

[Moblin Major General]

Loptyr never really died, because he was on a totally different continent than Jugdral. Also, I think that, even though he's called an Earth Dragon, he may have actually transformed into a Shadow Dragon before Medeus sealed him with the Binding Shield.

[Jotari]

Grima just needs to lie on top of pretty much anything to destroy it. I guess Anankos is pretty big too but considering he managed to get beat by people walking up to him and stabbing him, I'm going to say Grima. The later basically needed to have his soul destroyed in order to take down the body.

Edited March 3, 2017 by Jotari

[Dragrath]

I have to concur that of the known dragons list here only Dheginsea, Grima, Loptyr and Anankos really are comparable though I would argue there is a fifth dragon on a similar level in Naga.

The rest are far weaker either in raw strength magical experience or a combination there of. It is worth noting that the stronger the dragon the faster there sheer power tends to corrupt their minds into insanity without preventive measures. From that I have to give my Vote towards Grima who seems to be the most purely insane.

And factoring its poorly explained origin's few connecting points being Falchion/Fire Emblem weakness and The Dragon's Table and utterly huge size I wouldn't be surprised if the theory that Grima was formed out of the imprisoned entities after Millennia is correct. It has the size irredeemable insanity. I would even go so far as to speculate Grima's need of a host to be do to needing a vessel to coordinate its Chimeric parts. Loptyr at least had intelligence that could be said to be its own, Grima's behavior didn't go beyond what its host (Future Robin) could have done (namely doing absolutely nothing until it got a new host)... 

[Man of Many Faces]

I think I have to go with Anankos, he has displayed god like powers throughout the game. Which other dragons did display however none of which were even close to the powers Anankos displayed.

Edited March 4, 2017 by ManOfManyFaces

[asdfasdfasdf]

On 3/3/2017 at 10:15 PM, ManOfManyFaces said:

I think I have to go with Anankos, he has displayed god like powers throughout the game. Which other dragons did display however none of which were even close to the powers Anankos displayed.

Which powers are you referring to?

[Original Johan Liebert]

Anankos seems to be the most obviously confused, self-divided and lost. It also seems to be the most powerful?

[Dragrath]

On 3/14/2017 at 7:13 PM, Help said:

Anankos seems to be the most obviously confused, self-divided and lost. It also seems to be the most powerful?

You once again never explained "what" powers. You brought up his mental state but that isn't part of his powers... Power wise all we know is he could make puppets and open cross planar portals, both abilities shown by other dragons.

Also "seems the most powerful" is an arbitrary opinion. It doesn't mean much without something to base it on...

[Slumber]

Loptyr or Grima, though Grima is basically just Loptyr 2.0

Anankos would be in the running if he wasn't the most bipolar dragon to ever exist, and could decide if it wanted to be a good guy or a bad guy.

So I'm gonna say Loptyr, for just being more original than Grima, and his cult actually seemed like it would have been way more likely to succeed. Plus, the end of Awakening made it seem like simply beating Grima would have been no big deal(I'm exaggerating, but it seemed like had Robin not there, Chrom and crew would have been able to put it back to sleep/whatever for a long time), it's just that Robin needed to be there to actually kill Grima.

FE4/5 set it up like without Naga/Julia, the world would have just been completely fucked forever, and this is just to beat Loptyr's vessel, not Loptyr himself. Who the hell would have known what would have happened if Loptyr actually showed up in a physical form, rather than just channeling himself through Julius with the Book of Loptyr.

Edited March 16, 2017 by Slumber

[Jotari]

3 hours ago, Slumber said:

Loptyr or Grima, though Grima is basically just Loptyr 2.0

Anankos would be in the running if he wasn't the most bipolar dragon to ever exist, and could decide if it wanted to be a good guy or a bad guy.

So I'm gonna say Loptyr, for just being more original than Grima, and his cult actually seemed like it would have been way more likely to succeed. Plus, the end of Awakening made it seem like simply beating Grima would have been no big deal(I'm exaggerating, but it seemed like had Robin not there, Chrom and crew would have been able to put it back to sleep/whatever for a long time), it's just that Robin needed to be there to actually kill Grima.

FE4/5 set it up like without Naga/Julia, the world would have just been completely fucked forever, and this is just to beat Loptyr's vessel, not Loptyr himself. Who the hell would have known what would have happened if Loptyr actually showed up in a physical form, rather than just channeling himself through Julius with the Book of Loptyr.

Well in defense of Chrom and crew they did need the Falchion to be imbued with Naga's power to stand a chance of beating Grima without hacking his soul via Robin. Naga was also pretty instrumental in actually getting them up there to fight him. Just imagine how challenging that would be in the first place! (of course Awakening also conveniently ignored the fact that all Grima needed to do to win in the final battle was pull a barrel roll).

[Interdimensional Observer]

4 hours ago, Slumber said:

Who the hell would have known what would have happened if Loptyr actually showed up in a physical form, rather than just channeling himself through Julius with the Book of Loptyr.

I think this begs the question- why Loptyr didn't bother just coming over to Jugdral instead of a soul transmission via blood infusion? Naga and her cohorts are obviously fighting the Earth Dragons during Loptyr's ascendance in Jugdral, and might still be doing so during the playable events of Genealogy. But I wouldn't think the Earth Dragons would be as united and that Loptyr would consider just sailing to Jugdral with Galle and abandoning the fight for Archanea. As the only not-wyvern dragon in Jugdral, he'd be pretty powerful. Does Loptyr's body even exist anymore?

[Slumber]

Just now, Interdimensional Observer said:

I think this begs the question- why Loptyr didn't bother just coming over to Jugdral instead of a soul transmission via blood infusion? Naga and her cohorts are obviously fighting the Earth Dragons during Loptyr's ascendance in Jugdral, and might still be doing so during the playable events of Genealogy. But I wouldn't think the Earth Dragons would be as united and that Loptyr would consider just sailing to Jugdral with Galle and abandoning the fight for Archanea. As the only not-wyvern dragon in Jugdral, he'd be pretty powerful. Does Loptyr's body even exist anymore?

Loptyr seems to imply that his body exists through his death quote, but who knows. There's a large gap that happens in between him making the pact with Galle(When Loptyr still had a body) and Julius being the first person to be able to channel his power(When Loptyr had to be summoned through Julius' blood and the Book of Loptyr).

[Jotari]

2 hours ago, Interdimensional Observer said:

I think this begs the question- why Loptyr didn't bother just coming over to Jugdral instead of a soul transmission via blood infusion? Naga and her cohorts are obviously fighting the Earth Dragons during Loptyr's ascendance in Jugdral, and might still be doing so during the playable events of Genealogy. But I wouldn't think the Earth Dragons would be as united and that Loptyr would consider just sailing to Jugdral with Galle and abandoning the fight for Archanea. As the only not-wyvern dragon in Jugdral, he'd be pretty powerful. Does Loptyr's body even exist anymore?

It's possible he did it as a means to avoid going feral, or rather so his personality would live on even if his body does go feral. I think he timelines would match up given how distant in the past Holy War is (and the first blood being even earlier than that).

[Tetragrammaton]

1 hour ago, Jotari said:

It's possible he did it as a means to avoid going feral, or rather so his personality would live on even if his body does go feral. I think he timelines would match up given how distant in the past Holy War is (and the first blood being even earlier than that).

I think it works in a similar way to Voldemort's Horcrux.

Original Loptous maybe dead in Archanea now, but his spirit still lives on somewhere else.

Edited March 16, 2017 by hanhnn

[Dragrath]

16 hours ago, Interdimensional Observer said:

I think this begs the question- why Loptyr didn't bother just coming over to Jugdral instead of a soul transmission via blood infusion? Naga and her cohorts are obviously fighting the Earth Dragons during Loptyr's ascendance in Jugdral, and might still be doing so during the playable events of Genealogy. But I wouldn't think the Earth Dragons would be as united and that Loptyr would consider just sailing to Jugdral with Galle and abandoning the fight for Archanea. As the only not-wyvern dragon in Jugdral, he'd be pretty powerful. Does Loptyr's body even exist anymore?

Hmm I get the feeling Loptyr's end goal was something else. The earth dragons viewed humans as lesser beings basically tools to use thus I don't think Loptyr was sacrificing all those lives for the Lols seeing as they were beings beneath him/her/it(do we even know Loptyr's real gender?). I suspect there was an endgame that required a large amount of sacrifices and he was more or less using humans as livestock to achieve that goal.

13 hours ago, Jotari said:

It's possible he did it as a means to avoid going feral, or rather so his personality would live on even if his body does go feral. I think he timelines would match up given how distant in the past Holy War is (and the first blood being even earlier than that).

This is honestly what I had always interpreted it as (though someone argued the contrary to me so IDK the prehistory timeline is iffy) now Loptyr's final goals I wouldn't be surprised if they are far beyond just that...

First yeah it is possible Loptyr is now truly dead (but that would be kinda sad as he/she/it is the best dragon antagonist we have had...)

One possibility that I heard a long time ago that re-crossed my mind while reading this is if Grima might be the result of some foiled attempt at ascension of Loptyr I know it is a bit of a jump(FE 13 is a giant plot hole) If his original body was dealt with in a manner similar to the other earth dragons he could have tried to use that as focus to basically assimilate the other degenerate dragons and claim that vessel as his own to gain power comparable to Naga. (which could have either backfired or have been interfered with by Naga and co leading to the mindless mass of destruction known as Grima)

The other (and honestly more interesting possibility) is that Loptyr still survives out there in some manner plotting to return to the world and smite Naga... If so it would spell a interesting possibility for a more intelligent and cunning dragon antagonist. 

FE 13 missed such a good opportunity sigh...

[Interdimensional Observer]

Loptyr is another name for Loki, the Norse trickster god who killed Baldur (with mistletoe (Mystletainn) by giving it to Baldur's brother Hodr (Odo)). So he is in all likelihood male, but I don't think he'd mind a female host if that is his best/only choice. Though there is one funny incident where turned into a mare (female horse) to trick a stallion, had sex with it, and later gave birth to the flying eight-legged horse Sleipnir, who he gave to (his half-brother?) Odin.

[Lightchao42]

I voted for Anankos. Some of his feats include:

Spoiler

• Controlling water.
• Seeing the future (or, more precisely, can see possibilities of the future, which aren't always accurate).
• Reviving the dead (and having complete control over them).
• Creating life on his own.
• Possession.
• Giving part of his power/blood to others.
• Creating a (fantasy, anyway) black hole.
• Terraformation (via Dragon Veins).
• Can only be killed by one weapon (the Omega Yato).
• Creating a song that can weaken himself and others.
• Limited time/dimension traveling (apparently not to Naga's extent).
• Reality/spatial manipulation (assuming that he created Valla, which ignores the laws of physics).
• Undoing everything Grima did to Lucina's future with no visible effort.
• Unlike Loptyr and Grima, he doesn't need a vessel.

Though of course Anri could probably solo him.

Edited March 16, 2017 by Lightchao42

[Man of Many Faces]

On 3/14/2017 at 3:15 PM, asdfasdfasdf said:

Which powers are you referring to?

As someone already mention Anankos has many powers, though one of his stronger feats is placing a curse on anyone who mentions the Valla Kingdom.

[HylianBelmont]

I suppose it's pretty much a three-way tie between Loptyr, Grima, and Anankos really. But Anankos edges out slightly because of the feats that Lightchao42 mentioned however. 

[TheAstraWolf]

Dheg lives up his days blessed by a deity.

Loptyr is a big evil dark god aside from also being a dragon

Grima is spooky, I assume he is from the same lineage as Medeus and Loptyr so...yeah fuk

[The_antithesis]

I'd say the only three with any real hope are Tokyo Mirage Sessions!Medius, Future Past!Grima, and Heirs of Fate!Anankos. Those three have destroyed entire worlds, which is more than any other FE character can boast. As for which of the three gets my vote, Anankos gets the win because he has destroyed at least a dozen timelines in Heirs of Fate, while Medius only got one timeline in Tokyo Mirage Sessions. While this DOES make Medius more powerful than Grima, as Medius could also interrupt the heroes' escape by forcing a lack of memories, Anankos's ability to beat worlds this easily is one that no-one can beat... Well, except for Kana. (NOTE: Medius does not destroy all the timelines in TMS, as the real world is proven to be a canon outrealm by Heroes.)

TL;DR I voted for Anankos.

[asdfasdfasdf]

13 hours ago, The_antithesis said:

I'd say the only three with any real hope are Tokyo Mirage Sessions!Medius, Future Past!Grima, and Heirs of Fate!Anankos. Those three have destroyed entire worlds, which is more than any other FE character can boast. As for which of the three gets my vote, Anankos gets the win because he has destroyed at least a dozen timelines in Heirs of Fate, while Medius only got one timeline in Tokyo Mirage Sessions. While this DOES make Medius more powerful than Grima, as Medius could also interrupt the heroes' escape by forcing a lack of memories, Anankos's ability to beat worlds this easily is one that no-one can beat... Well, except for Kana. (NOTE: Medius does not destroy all the timelines in TMS, as the real world is proven to be a canon outrealm by Heroes.)

TL;DR I voted for Anankos.

I have never played Tokyo Mirage Sessions, but is it canon with all the other Fire Emblem games. Isn't a crossover?