Not sure what skill to inherit or who to inherit it from? Read this! (Please read before posting)

[Absolute Zero]

So, after godly luck from Dauntless Crimeans (4 Focus heroes and 1 off-focus 5*, spending ~40-45 orbs) I have 2 spare nephenee. I also have a spare BIke from last focus. Thinking of doing Steady Breath + Wrath on the Black Knight, but I want to make sure that there isn't another unit that utilizes that combo significantly better.

[Kaden]

I have no idea if I want to give Draw Back or Reposition to Odin.

Getting Renewal 2 from a spare Lissa would let me nab both Draw Back and Renewal 3 from a spare Fae which would let me get rid of two units, however, Odin in general is pretty bulky, so I figure maybe Reposition could work to get someone out of range, but put him in range of an enemy ranged unit instead of just pulling a unit back to safety.

I could just give him both Draw Back and Reposition...

Edit: I guess my question would be other than cavalry and flying mages who make very good use of Reposition, would tanky, enemy phase infantry mages prefer Reposition over Draw Back since they would like to be in the action while nukers can use either or since they care about safety, theirs and their allies?

Edited September 24, 2017 by Kaden

[XRay]

4 minutes ago, Kaden said:

I have no idea if I want to give Draw Back or Reposition to Odin.

Getting Renewal 2 from a spare Lissa would let me nab both Draw Back and Renewal 3 from a spare Fae which would let me get rid of two units, however, Odin in general is pretty bulky, so I figure maybe Reposition could work to get someone out of range, but put him in range of an enemy ranged unit instead of just pulling a unit back to safety.

I could just give him both Draw Back and Reposition...

If you have enough fodder, just give the unit multiple skills. You do not always have to learn the skill immediately. Having multiple skills also allows you to customize them for specific situations if you ever need it.

That being said, I would not invest multiple skills into Odin since there are better units to invest in. But, if you really like him or your other good characters have all the customization options they need, then investing in Odin makes sense.

[Kaden]

30 minutes ago, XRay said:

If you have enough fodder, just give the unit multiple skills. You do not always have to learn the skill immediately. Having multiple skills also allows you to customize them for specific situations if you ever need it.

That being said, I would not invest multiple skills into Odin since there are better units to invest in. But, if you really like him or your other good characters have all the customization options they need, then investing in Odin makes sense.

Yeah, it works, but I'm wondering about if tanky ranged units would work better with Reposition than Draw Back compared to nukers who can use either or. It also dawned on me that aside from BH Lyn and Ursula who are cavalry, I don't have a ranged unit with Reposition.

Also, for context on my I'm building Odin: https://serenesforest.net/forums/index.php?/topic/68792-ask-fire-emblem-heroes-questions-and-get-them-answered-here-thread/&do=findComment&comment=4996146.

I do like Odin, but he's mainly there to deal with the Black Knight and for me to get rid of some units in the barracks since he doesn't really need much to be all right. I can use M!Robin with Swordbreaker, but Odin doesn't get used much, so might as well give him some time to shine.

Edited September 24, 2017 by Kaden

[MrSmokestack]

On 9/23/2017 at 11:50 AM, Absolute Zero said:

So, after godly luck from Dauntless Crimeans (4 Focus heroes and 1 off-focus 5*, spending ~40-45 orbs) I have 2 spare nephenee. I also have a spare BIke from last focus. Thinking of doing Steady Breath + Wrath on the Black Knight, but I want to make sure that there isn't another unit that utilizes that combo significantly better.

The Black Knight is a great user of that combo. If you’re not hurting for merges on Brave Ike or you don’t use him often in arena, I say go for it. Black Luna gets silly with CD reduction and the Black Knight has the Atk, Spd, and Def to make use of Wrath.

There’s also Wrath Brave Ike, but Black Knight does have Distant Counter on his sword for coverage against ranged.

[XRay]

5 hours ago, Kaden said:

Yeah, it works, but I'm wondering about if tanky ranged units would work better with Reposition than Draw Back compared to nukers who can use either or. It also dawned on me that aside from BH Lyn and Ursula who are cavalry, I don't have a ranged unit with Reposition.

Also, for context on my I'm building Odin: https://serenesforest.net/forums/index.php?/topic/68792-ask-fire-emblem-heroes-questions-and-get-them-answered-here-thread/&do=findComment&comment=4996146.

I do like Odin, but he's mainly there to deal with the Black Knight and for me to get rid of some units in the barracks since he doesn't really need much to be all right. I can use M!Robin with Swordbreaker, but Odin doesn't get used much, so might as well give him some time to shine.

Ah okay. That mostly depends on your preferences. I personally prefer Reposition on everyone, except for healers and Arena defense teams. I tried Swap and Draw Back when I was testing out all three Assists for myself, but I do not like those two as much since they do not move the Assisted unit far enough. Whenever I run Reposition, I never regret running that skill over Draw Back or Swap; however, when I run Draw Back or Swap, I frequently regret running those two over Reposition.

For ranged nukes, I generally prefer to bane the higher defensive stat. However, for units with the same or relatively similar defensive stats like Odin, I bane Defense. Against neutral Vanilla units, I find having Resistance being around 0 to 2 points higher than Defense to be the sweet spot in getting the least deaths.

How many characters do you need to get rid of, is your barracks packed? If you are maxed out on 1,000 spaces already, I do not think being cautious about skill inheritance applies anymore (unless it is for an expensive skill), so just inherit skills to whoever you want. If you are not at the point with tons of skill fodder yet, then I would be a little more cautious.

[Kaden]

3 hours ago, XRay said:

Ah okay. That mostly depends on your preferences. I personally prefer Reposition on everyone, except for healers and Arena defense teams. I tried Swap and Draw Back when I was testing out all three Assists for myself, but I do not like those two as much since they do not move the Assisted unit far enough. Whenever I run Reposition, I never regret running that skill over Draw Back or Swap; however, when I run Draw Back or Swap, I frequently regret running those two over Reposition.

For ranged nukes, I generally prefer to bane the higher defensive stat. However, for units with the same or relatively similar defensive stats like Odin, I bane Defense. Against neutral Vanilla units, I find having Resistance being around 0 to 2 points higher than Defense to be the sweet spot in getting the least deaths.

How many characters do you need to get rid of, is your barracks packed? If you are maxed out on 1,000 spaces already, I do not think being cautious about skill inheritance applies anymore (unless it is for an expensive skill), so just inherit skills to whoever you want. If you are not at the point with tons of skill fodder yet, then I would be a little more cautious.

For me, knights run Swap since I tend to not use them in mixed teams -- I'm not good with positioning them. That, and I don't think I have ever used a knight with Pivot. Maybe a friend of mine had a knight as their lead for a past Voting Gauntlet, but anyway, moving on. Melee units run Reposition unless they're a tank in which case I'd give them Swap instead, but that doesn't mean a tank can't have both Reposition and Swap. With ranged units, it's Draw Back or Reposition and from what I gathered searching on the forums, Draw Back should go on fragile units if you want to keep tougher allies in front, otherwise, Reposition if you want to get everyone out of range and Reposition for tankier units since you could put them in range for a counter-kill along with usual Reposition strategies. Also, cavalry mages and fliers, like melee cavalry and fliers, can use Reposition in different ways than infantry can. Anyway, I think I'm settled on Reposition on Odin. He's a weird character who is bulky enough to take hits, but also a functional -- emphasis on functional -- nuker.

As for the -Def or -Res with Odin, I have a +Spd, -Res Odin and considering that Delthea, Linde, Mae, Olwen, and Ursula have low defense, high resistance, having a high defense, low resistance "nuker" could be useful if I needed one who can take a physical hit. Of the blue mages out there, I think only Odin and Reinhardt qualify since M!Robin is more of an enemy phase unit who can, however, nuke particular units. With Fury 3, -Res Odin still has 25 resistance which is average and has both 43 HP and 38 speed to back up his magical bulk. Also,

I currently have 380/400 units with at least 2 more coming in through 5* Black Knight and another Clarisse because of her GHB revival. This is also not counting if I want to summon from the Dauntless Crimeans banner before it ends in hopes of summoning a Nephenee and whenever the new banner comes. I think at least 4 will be used since Odin's getting Reposition and whatever C-skill if I can figure out what I want for him and the Black Knight is going to get Swap and Ward Armor.

The problem with me and skill inheritance other than me being very indecisive and cautious is that I don't really have a lot of characters I want to build. Most if not all of them were done for practical reasons: Camus and Xander are good units who are even better as 5* units and with skills like Quick Ripostion, Reposition, Swap, Vantage, etc., Ursula is in a same boat, but she was also my only other blue mage at the time, so making her a -blade cavalry mage was useful, Eliwood and Odin ended up being TT boss counters with Eliwood mainly being built to make use of the SP he would amass during the mini-TT, masked Marth being a pseudo-medic was helpful for Celica's TT and as a boss Sonya slayer, Zephiel inherited Swap and Ward Armor to make training tower armor quests less hellish even with the training tower re-roll, and a while ago, Cherche and adult Tiki inherited skills to beat Michalis and Navarre's GHBs, respectively. I think the only characters who I built just because were Titania and almost completed, Lukas -- he's only missing a C-skill.

It's weird, since so many people talk about the characters they're building, how they're running out of certain skills, or how they don't have enough feathers to get a unit to 5* or whatever and I'm sitting here like, "Hmm, I have a lot of feathers and too many units."

Edited September 25, 2017 by Kaden

[XRay]

1 minute ago, Kaden said:

For me, knights run Swap since I tend to not use them in mixed teams

Oh yeah, I run Swap o all my armor units too. I complete forgot about them. All my other units run Reposition though. I tried Pivot, but that means they still need a babysitter on a mix team or that they get out of position in an armor team.

 

[ignis_z]

For Black Knight fury 3 on A, wich is better in B QR for a fast special skill or Vantage?

[XRay]

1 hour ago, ignis_z said:

For Black Knight fury 3 on A, wich is better in B QR for a fast special skill or Vantage?

I personally prefer Quick Riposte. Generally, Enemy Phase units should kill as many units as possible in its first round of combat.

[Absolute Zero]

On 9/24/2017 at 2:18 PM, MrSmokestack said:

The Black Knight is a great user of that combo. If you’re not hurting for merges on Brave Ike or you don’t use him often in arena, I say go for it. Black Luna gets silly with CD reduction and the Black Knight has the Atk, Spd, and Def to make use of Wrath.

There’s also Wrath Brave Ike, but Black Knight does have Distant Counter on his sword for coverage against ranged.

Hmm, I guess the question is then is a +1 Brave Ike worth more than steady breath inheritance? I do use Ike almost always in the arena, but I've managed to stay in tier 20 without him being merged, so I'll probably go for it since it seems like a pretty darn fun combo. Now to decide whether to keep the +HP, -Spd Ike or the +Spd, -Def one lol. 

[ignis_z]

10 hours ago, XRay said:

I personally prefer Quick Riposte. Generally, Enemy Phase units should kill as many units as possible in its first round of combat.

Sure in other fórums the people says vantage because he is fast, but i prefer QR, dont know what to do...

[XRay]

3 hours ago, ignis_z said:

Sure in other fórums the people says vantage because he is fast, but i prefer QR, dont know what to do...

It depends on your play style. I prefer Quick Riposte since the Black Knight is not going to be doubling a lot of units. He is fast for an armor unit, but not that fast to double everyone.

[DefaultBeep]

I got a +HP/-Def Sanaki (somehow) from the Crimean banner, which seems like a pretty harmless boon/bane. What kind of build would she be good with? In particular, should she keep her personal weapon, inherit a Rauðrblade+ (as I've said before, I'm not lacking in 5-star Tharjas), or maybe something else? I thought about Rauðrraven, but I feel like -Def wouldn't be very good for that even with Triangle Adept, since healers are the only colorless magic users. I could be wrong though. And what else would be good for her skills and Special? Particularly her B skill and Special, but if something other than Triangle Adept would be better, then I'd be willing to try it.

[XRay]

1 hour ago, DefaultBeep said:

I got a +HP/-Def Sanaki (somehow) from the Crimean banner, which seems like a pretty harmless boon/bane. What kind of build would she be good with? In particular, should she keep her personal weapon, inherit a Rauðrblade+ (as I've said before, I'm not lacking in 5-star Tharjas), or maybe something else? I thought about Rauðrraven, but I feel like -Def wouldn't be very good for that even with Triangle Adept, since healers are the only colorless magic users. I could be wrong though. And what else would be good for her skills and Special? Particularly her B skill and Special, but if something other than Triangle Adept would be better, then I'd be willing to try it.

She is a good green mage wall. Her default skill set is fine, although you can give her a Breaker or Quick Riposte if you wish. I do not think she needs a Special to kill greens, but it does not hurt to give her one either.

[DefaultBeep]

34 minutes ago, XRay said:

She is a good green mage wall. Her default skill set is fine, although you can give her a Breaker or Quick Riposte if you wish. I do not think she needs a Special to kill greens, but it does not hurt to give her one either.

Alright, sounds easy enough. I might just give her G Tomebreaker/R Tomebreaker and Moonbow for now since they're all fairly cheap, though I could give her Swordbreaker 2 with Draw Back from a Sully. I kinda regret promoting Lilina now that I have Sanaki, but oh well.

[Hilda]

I have a hard time how to build the 4 new dancers...

B!(lack)Azura has a nice default skill set with Triangel Adept and high enough Res she can play Reinhardt bait/blue mage bait.

Shigure... i dont know his stats are all over the place none of his stats stands out he cant function as a nuker, he has too low defensiv stats (including SPD) to be somewhat Bulky and effectiv as a bait... Thinking of giving him a Litrblade to make him somewhat usefull as a nuker. Really at a loss here.

Inigo suffers the same, he has the speed, but the attack ugh. and the low RES doesnt help as a Reinhardt bait either. With Triangle Adept he could be Reinhardt bait for sure, but i was hopeing more for Raventome built but his Defense is just garbage to even consider it (he will kiss the floor prolly before the top Tier bows start their second round of attacks) a + SPD or + DEF Inigo could work (with -HP as his bane). but again at a los

Olivia... the best i can see is to substitute her with Breath of Life 3 maybe even Windsweep but i would loose her B-Dance skill boost. yeah will keep her B-Dance skill since she wont attack much at all. Her A-Slot skill seems perfect.

Might give her a Second built as a Aoe Debuffer and Windsweep maybe, or as a Poison Dagger/B-Poison skill poker), She seems to frail to even be able to do anything, since she cant hide behind a wall of Triangel adept/Color Advantage
 

[XRay]

33 minutes ago, Hilda said:

I have a hard time how to build the 4 new dancers...

B!(lack)Azura has a nice default skill set with Triangel Adept and high enough Res she can play Reinhardt bait/blue mage bait.

Shigure... i dont know his stats are all over the place none of his stats stands out he cant function as a nuker, he has too low defensiv stats (including SPD) to be somewhat Bulky and effectiv as a bait... Thinking of giving him a Litrblade to make him somewhat usefull as a nuker. Really at a loss here.

Inigo suffers the same, he has the speed, but the attack ugh. and the low RES doesnt help as a Reinhardt bait either. With Triangle Adept he could be Reinhardt bait for sure, but i was hopeing more for Raventome built but his Defense is just garbage to even consider it (he will kiss the floor prolly before the top Tier bows start their second round of attacks) a + SPD or + DEF Inigo could work (with -HP as his bane). but again at a los

Olivia... the best i can see is to substitute her with Breath of Life 3 maybe even Windsweep but i would loose her B-Dance skill boost. yeah will keep her B-Dance skill since she wont attack much at all. Her A-Slot skill seems perfect.

Might give her a Second built as a Aoe Debuffer and Windsweep maybe, or as a Poison Dagger/B-Poison skill poker), She seems to frail to even be able to do anything, since she cant hide behind a wall of Triangel adept/Color Advantage
 

When in doubt, I just keep their default set and fill in the blanks with whatever cheap skills I have.

PA!Azura can run a Brave Axe build, but her axe is too good though.

PA!Shigure and PA!nigo is um... Yeah, I do not know either. I would just give them Fury or Triangle Adept. You can try to pimp them out with a Blade build, but I do not think the performance justifies the cost unless you are a whale or something.

Olivia is fine as is. If you have spare Cancel Affinity, you can try using her against Raven mages with Poison Dagger in Arena Assault.

 

[mewyeon]

I has more follow-up questions.

What skills would you recommend to Masked Marth? I thought about Astra and Vantage?

Also, am I correct in assuming that Wary Fighter and Darting Blow should be given to your slowest units? Out of my lvl 40 5* units, the one with the lowest speed and an open B slot is Berkut at 22 speed.  Technically Reinhardt has the lowest at 15, followed by Gordin at 20, but their B slots are taken up by Vantage and I don't really want to replace that.  What do y'all think? Since it's so rare I'm kind of tempted to save my Wary Fighter in case I magically pull Hector one day.

 

[DefaultBeep]

3 minutes ago, mewyeon said:

I has more follow-up questions.

What skills would you recommend to Masked Marth? I thought about Astra and Vantage?

Also, am I correct in assuming that Wary Fighter and Darting Blow should be given to your slowest units? Out of my lvl 40 5* units, the one with the lowest speed and an open B slot is Berkut at 22 speed.  Technically Reinhardt has the lowest at 15, followed by Gordin at 20, but their B slots are taken up by Vantage and I don't really want to replace that.  What do y'all think? Since it's so rare I'm kind of tempted to save my Wary Fighter in case I magically pull Hector one day.

 

I believe Wary Fighter can only be used by Armor units, so giving it to Berkut isn't quite an option unfortunately. Hector could be good with it, but I think it cancels his weapon's built-in Quick Riposte, so it's up to you if that's worth losing. Someone like Sheena could probably get some use out of it though. If a unit's speed is already low, Death Blow is normally a better choice, especially if you decide to give them a Brave weapon. Berkut for example still won't double much even with 28 Spd, but he'll do a lot more with his one attack (or two with Brave Lance) if he has the +6 Atk from Death Blow. Otherwise, for Berkut specifically, I think either Swordbreaker or Lancebreaker would be best for his B slot, so he can double those units and avoid being doubled by them even with his poor speed. If he's doing most of his fighting on enemy phase, then Quick Riposte could be good for his B slot as well, maybe with a Def-boosting A skill.

[MrSmokestack]

11 minutes ago, DefaultBeep said:

I believe Wary Fighter can only be used by Armor units, so giving it to Berkut isn't quite an option unfortunately. Hector could be good with it, but I think it cancels his weapon's built-in Quick Riposte, so it's up to you if that's worth losing. Someone like Sheena could probably get some use out of it though. If a unit's speed is already low, Death Blow is normally a better choice, especially if you decide to give them a Brave weapon. Berkut for example still won't double much even with 28 Spd, but he'll do a lot more with his one attack (or two with Brave Lance) if he has the +6 Atk from Death Blow. Otherwise, for Berkut specifically, I think either Swordbreaker or Lancebreaker would be best for his B slot, so he can double those units and avoid being doubled by them even with his poor speed. If he's doing most of his fighting on enemy phase, then Quick Riposte could be good for his B slot as well, maybe with a Def-boosting A skill.

@mewyeon I get a perverse satisfaction from being able to link people to this post:

And yes, Wary Fighter is exclusive to armored units. However, the skill's best users start off with it already: Effie and Zephiel. Hector can use it pretty well too, but only in some very specific setup with +Spd and 3 stacks of Goad for 40 Spd. He won't get doubled by enemies, but Quick Riposte lets him double them on the counter if he outspeeds them, because of how the speed mechanics work.

If you really want to invest in Berkut, Brave Lance with Death Blow and Swordbreaker is the way to go, but his use is limited outside of being a generic physical red check, unfortunately. His skills and unique lance suggest a Res tank, but he has neither the Spd nor the Res to pull that off. At all.

The Pseudo-Healer build is a very popular option that people opt for when building "Marth" running Renewal and Reciprocal Aid for burst heals. In multi-map modes like Tempest Trials, "Marth" recovers a flat 20 HP at the start of the first turn in each map, and every 2nd turn recovers 10 HP, and every 3rd turn recovers another 10 HP. This can provide teams with steady heals in the absence of a proper staff user, and with a generic passive like Fury can also be fairly competent at combat. More aggresive "Marth" builds follow in Lucina's footsteps: LaD and either Swordbreaker or Desperation.

Astra has terrible damage scaling. Use Luna or Draconic Aura as her special instead.

Both Reinhardt and Gordin are poor users of Vantage. Reinhardt's only use for it is in the Close Counter / -Blade Tome / Vantage build, which is extremely expensive and doesn't offer that much return on the investment compared to just running Dire Thunder. Lancebreaker works better as the B passive the majority of the time. Gordin can also opt for Swordbreaker to improve his matchup spread on player phase.

[DefaultBeep]

5 minutes ago, MrSmokestack said:

And yes, Wary Fighter is exclusive to armored units. However, the skill's best users start off with it already: Effie and Zephiel. Hector can use it pretty well too, but only in some very specific setup with +Spd and 3 stacks of Goad for 40 Spd. He won't get doubled by enemies, but Quick Riposte lets him double them on the counter if he outspeeds them, because of how the speed mechanics work.

Ah yes, I had forgotten about that. It's too bad Hector is the only one who can actually use Wary Fighter and Quick Riposte (2) at the same time, an armor with decent speed without buffs could potentially use that combo really well. Sheena is the only other armored unit that doesn't start with Wary Fighter that has poor speed, so she was the only one I thought to mention. 

[eclipse]

5 hours ago, Hilda said:

I have a hard time how to build the 4 new dancers...

B!(lack)Azura has a nice default skill set with Triangel Adept and high enough Res she can play Reinhardt bait/blue mage bait.

Shigure... i dont know his stats are all over the place none of his stats stands out he cant function as a nuker, he has too low defensiv stats (including SPD) to be somewhat Bulky and effectiv as a bait... Thinking of giving him a Litrblade to make him somewhat usefull as a nuker. Really at a loss here.

Inigo suffers the same, he has the speed, but the attack ugh. and the low RES doesnt help as a Reinhardt bait either. With Triangle Adept he could be Reinhardt bait for sure, but i was hopeing more for Raventome built but his Defense is just garbage to even consider it (he will kiss the floor prolly before the top Tier bows start their second round of attacks) a + SPD or + DEF Inigo could work (with -HP as his bane). but again at a los

Olivia... the best i can see is to substitute her with Breath of Life 3 maybe even Windsweep but i would loose her B-Dance skill boost. yeah will keep her B-Dance skill since she wont attack much at all. Her A-Slot skill seems perfect.

Might give her a Second built as a Aoe Debuffer and Windsweep maybe, or as a Poison Dagger/B-Poison skill poker), She seems to frail to even be able to do anything, since she cant hide behind a wall of Triangel adept/Color Advantage
 

I'd keep them as support units.  Of the four:

- Azura with +Atk might be workable with Fury/Desperation, since she'll have 35/34 offenses before Fury.
- Shigure's 31 base Atk is on the higher side of blue mages, because most of them have inexplicably low Atk (Odin I'm looking at you).  Still,29 Speed is underwhelming, to the point where I'd use him purely as dance/chip support.  I think Breath of Life stacks with his weapon, which means massive heals on attack.
- Inigo's stat point total is insanely low (beaten only by Shigure).  He has the second-lowest Atk for his weapon type, and not even his 33 Spd can help him out of that.  Like Shigure, he can act as a pseudo-healer.
- Olivia can work as Felicia Lite.  Distant Def allows her to bait magical ranged units, somewhat.

In other words, most of them have really low stat totals, so trying to turn them into nukes will be an uphill battle.  Azura's stats look better solely because she's the only melee unit of the lot.

[mampfoid]

1 hour ago, mewyeon said:

I has more follow-up questions.

What skills would you recommend to Masked Marth? I thought about Astra and Vantage?

Also, am I correct in assuming that Wary Fighter and Darting Blow should be given to your slowest units? [...]

No, Darting blow on a slow unit doesn't make sense. It doesn't help on defense to prevent being doubled and it gives slow units only few doubles on offense. Slow units want quick riposte, to get two hits on enemy phase. 

Also Vantage is more for enemy phase units, preferably with distant counter (Black Knight, Camus, Xander and so on). Masked Marth would be a better candidate for Darting blow, since it gives him a lot of additional doubles, but also fury would be good on him. 

[Raptok]

I'm unsure as to the special I should give to Inigo. I was thinking that since he won't be seeing much combat that a skill with low cooldown like moonbow would be best for him. Any thoughts?