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Jedi

Archers in Warriors games

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Because so many people ask me this question in relation to FE:W. I decided to record an example of Bianca in DQH. Note this is my first time using her so I likely didn't do anything optimally and I didn't realize the charge stuff till the end. Nor did I show off Rain of Pain oops.

I will do videos on how Sun Shang Xiang in DW6 works, as well as Samurai Warriors Ina, if people want to see their styles (SSX focuses on spreadshots and kicks, while Ina uses a bladed bow so she kinda uses it like a weird bo staff with arrows every now and again).

Theres also Linkle for those who played Hyrule Warriors.

Edited by Jedi

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1 hour ago, The DanMan said:

Better than Zhu Ran/10.

Archers have never really been fun for me.

Oh boy Zhu Ran, -rolls eyes- 

Sometime you might want to give DW6 a go, if just to see how broken Sun Shang Xiang was in it lol.

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2 hours ago, Jedi said:

Oh boy Zhu Ran, -rolls eyes- 

Sometime you might want to give DW6 a go, if just to see how broken Sun Shang Xiang was in it lol.

I have a bone to pick with him because in my DW8E playthrough I picked him as the playable character in a raid and didn't he know his moveset was so weird. After nearly dying, I withdrew-- only for Huang Gai to get captured.
Zhu Ran's ineptness resulted in the loss of Huang Gai.
I was all too happy to cut him down when I rebelled.

 

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7 hours ago, The DanMan said:

I have a bone to pick with him because in my DW8E playthrough I picked him as the playable character in a raid and didn't he know his moveset was so weird. After nearly dying, I withdrew-- only for Huang Gai to get captured.
Zhu Ran's ineptness resulted in the loss of Huang Gai.
I was all too happy to cut him down when I rebelled.

Man you got old super surfer captured, sad. 

6 hours ago, Etheus said:

Not an archer, but as far as ranged characters go in a Warriors style game, I would use Magoichi Saika from Samurai Warriors 4 as a great example of how a ranged character can be fun and effective in these types of games.

Magoichi took till SW4 to be as fun as he was, although Orochi 1/2/3 fixed that somewhat, but he was hard to use in SW1/2 I found. Works though.

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Now that you mention it, I'm wondering how they're going to tackle archers in this game - after all, FE is a series where, far more often than not, archers were boned if anything got close to them.

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Well don't be surprised if they're among the most dangerous enemies. Being incredibly accurate and furious, they whittle away your Life to nothing in no time if you don't keep moving in DW7 (and DW4 or 5 might be even worse). Heck, in DW7 the majority of character deaths were depicted as caused by arrows (see Dian Wei and Sun Ce), though that might be because it's cheap to depict (gashing wounds would require more effort to display) and not that gruesome.

Player-wise, don't expect them to be mega fragile or anything. Isn't the Bow and Rods one of the most powerful weapons in DW8? Though the DW7 Bow does favor putting some distance between the player and the enemy, seeing how it doesn't have much flinch power (still more than those crappy daggers though).

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I agree with every post that said Xiahou Yuan is one of, if not the best archers

*ahem*

EDIT: You above me, you have great timing, the Bow and Rod is a very powerful weapon, indeed.

Edited by Soledai

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1 hour ago, Interdimensional Observer said:

Well don't be surprised if they're among the most dangerous enemies. Being incredibly accurate and furious, they whittle away your Life to nothing in no time if you don't keep moving in DW7 (and DW4 or 5 might be even worse). Heck, in DW7 the majority of character deaths were depicted as caused by arrows (see Dian Wei and Sun Ce), though that might be because it's cheap to depict (gashing wounds would require more effort to display) and not that gruesome.

Player-wise, don't expect them to be mega fragile or anything. Isn't the Bow and Rods one of the most powerful weapons in DW8? Though the DW7 Bow does favor putting some distance between the player and the enemy, seeing how it doesn't have much flinch power (still more than those crappy daggers though).

Well thats partly due to DW7 following the Novel for alot of those deaths, arrows were quite the character ender, both in the novel and in the historical records haha. 

Yeah Bow & Rod is super good. 

1 hour ago, Soledai said:

I agree with every post that said Xiahou Yuan is one of, if not the best archers

*ahem*

I think DW6 SSX beats him out in sheer opness but yeah, lol.

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But really though, I don't think Archers in a Warriors game are units to be concerned about; DW3(and 4 to an extent) had enemy archers that made you kinda regret crossing them, DW7 and 8 had enemy archers that didn't cause stunlock(but still slowed you down a little), while that doesn't sound bad, imagine being swarmed by that.

In my humble onion, mages are the units that warrant the most concern, since I've mentioned before(I think), I haven't seen a good mage in a Warriors game yet. Unless I'm forgetting someone. (Note: haven't played everyone in SW4-II, so I withhold judgement on them)

7 minutes ago, Jedi said:

I think DW6 SSX beats him out in sheer opness but yeah, lol.

You know, I always meant to go back and see that since I don't remember much of 6, I'll get to that sooner than later.
And post all about it for the two people who read stuff like that.

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1 hour ago, Soledai said:

But really though, I don't think Archers in a Warriors game are units to be concerned about; DW3(and 4 to an extent) had enemy archers that made you kinda regret crossing them, DW7 and 8 had enemy archers that didn't cause stunlock(but still slowed you down a little), while that doesn't sound bad, imagine being swarmed by that.

In my humble onion, mages are the units that warrant the most concern, since I've mentioned before(I think), I haven't seen a good mage in a Warriors game yet. Unless I'm forgetting someone. (Note: haven't played everyone in SW4-II, so I withhold judgement on them)

You know, I always meant to go back and see that since I don't remember much of 6, I'll get to that sooner than later.
And post all about it for the two people who read stuff like that.

Yeah, its just for some reason people always bug me about this in particular despite the fact that they work quite well in the setting.

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3 hours ago, Soledai said:

In my humble onion, mages are the units that warrant the most concern, since I've mentioned before(I think), I haven't seen a good mage in a Warriors game yet. Unless I'm forgetting someone. (Note: haven't played everyone in SW4-II, so I withhold judgement on them)

Probably not in the main Dynasty Warriors series, but Hyrule Warriors had Wizzro who was a lot of fun and is pretty good once you learn him. Not to mention Yuga and even Link's Magic Rod. Then again, Hyrule Warriors movesets are steeped in magic use and there's probably other mages I'm forgetting in that game.

Kanbei in Samurai Warriors is also one of my favorites to play as, and he's rather magey.

Of course, enemy archers in Hyrule Warriors are pretty crap unless their name is Linkle or you're playing a mission where any hit takes your health to 1 quarter of a heart.

Edited by Folt

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Playing as characters with ranged options is always a fun time thanks to the lack of retaliation, but enemy archers either cause stunlock and break all your combos, leading to suffering, or they don't and the damage piles up before you can realise it, though generally that's on the higher difficulties. (Not to mention the weird shenanigans that happens with the camera in some cases)

Although to be honest I don't see playable bow characters in the game at launch unless the main man Takumi gets in (I'm still praying for Yukimura tho)

On a related note to the posts above, mages are interesting because they have a lot of freedom in how they depict them. They aren't constrained by traditional physical motions and thus the animations get very silly and awesome. Lana's a good example of hammy mage-ness from HW.

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I always thought that for archers in Fire Emblem Warriors they'd make them play like Ina in Samurai Warriors, in terms of making their bow both a melee and a ranged weapon and having the bow be bladed to be an effective melee weapon. I mean, I don't think they absolutely have to stick to Fire Emblem rules in regards to making archers vulnerable and unable to attack up close..

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17 hours ago, Jedi said:

Magoichi took till SW4 to be as fun as he was, although Orochi 1/2/3 fixed that somewhat, but he was hard to use in SW1/2 I found. Works though.

Which is why I specified. From my experience with the genre (which, full disclosure, is limited to Dynasty Warriors 8 XTREME Legends, Sengoku Basaara Samurai Heroes, Samurai Warriors 4, Arslan Warriors of Legend, and Hyrule Warriors), Magoichi Saika's Samurai Warriors 4 incarnation was the only fully ranged character that I found to be just as fun and useful as the melee.

 

That said, the Musuo genre is one of my favorite genres and has been since I first picked up Dynasty Warriors 8 a couple years ago. Any game recommendations would be much appreciated. 

 

(And Fire Emblem Warriors has basically been my dream game for the past couple years, so I am incredibly excited for it).

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Oh yeah, I hear Farangis in Arslan Musou is a good archer, and possibly the best character in the game(?).

No comment on Hyrule Warriors from me yet, I'm too busy putting that game off for no good reason

12 hours ago, Folt said:

Probably not in the main Dynasty Warriors series, but Hyrule Warriors had Wizzro who was a lot of fun and is pretty good once you learn him. Not to mention Yuga and even Link's Magic Rod. Then again, Hyrule Warriors movesets are steeped in magic use and there's probably other mages I'm forgetting in that game.

Kanbei in Samurai Warriors is also one of my favorites to play as, and he's rather magey.

Not gonna lie, I keep constantly forgetting about Kanbei. (I used him in SW3, but that game is pretty forgettable)

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12 hours ago, DaloDask said:

Although to be honest I don't see playable bow characters in the game at launch unless the main man Takumi gets in (I'm still praying for Yukimura tho)

I'd think that, but after looking at Hyrule Warriors' roster, I'd doubt myself...

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2 hours ago, Randoman said:

I always thought that for archers in Fire Emblem Warriors they'd make them play like Ina in Samurai Warriors, in terms of making their bow both a melee and a ranged weapon and having the bow be bladed to be an effective melee weapon. I mean, I don't think they absolutely have to stick to Fire Emblem rules in regards to making archers vulnerable and unable to attack up close..

It depends on the characters personality I think, in what they'll do. 

14 hours ago, Folt said:

Probably not in the main Dynasty Warriors series, but Hyrule Warriors had Wizzro who was a lot of fun and is pretty good once you learn him. Not to mention Yuga and even Link's Magic Rod. Then again, Hyrule Warriors movesets are steeped in magic use and there's probably other mages I'm forgetting in that game.

Kanbei in Samurai Warriors is also one of my favorites to play as, and he's rather magey.

Of course, enemy archers in Hyrule Warriors are pretty crap unless their name is Linkle or you're playing a mission where any hit takes your health to 1 quarter of a heart.

I think Zhuge Liang in 7/8 worked in terms of mage like character, as did Zuo Ci in 5, just adding onto that, not to mention Lana, because shes super fun with her regular moveset. 

1 hour ago, Etheus said:

Which is why I specified. From my experience with the genre (which, full disclosure, is limited to Dynasty Warriors 8 XTREME Legends, Sengoku Basaara Samurai Heroes, Samurai Warriors 4, Arslan Warriors of Legend, and Hyrule Warriors), Magoichi Saika's Samurai Warriors 4 incarnation was the only fully ranged character that I found to be just as fun and useful as the melee.

 

That said, the Musuo genre is one of my favorite genres and has been since I first picked up Dynasty Warriors 8 a couple years ago. Any game recommendations would be much appreciated. 

 

(And Fire Emblem Warriors has basically been my dream game for the past couple years, so I am incredibly excited for it).

I've been playing Musou games since DW2/3 haha, I'd highly suggest most of them honestly, and i'm having a blast with Dragon Quest Heroes right now which is kind of unique in that its more like a Tower Defense and JRPG with warriors aspects, so it stands out compared to some of the others. 

Orochi 1 & 3 are personal favorites of mine though along with DW3, 5, 7 and 8, as well as Samurai Warriors in general.

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One thing I'd love: If Owain appears using his Odin persona, I'd love to have him cast magic, but his magic would be to conjure energy swords which he could fire as projectiles or wield as melee weapons in his moveset. His ultimate weapon would be Missiletainn, while his lower-ranked weapons would be the tomes of the element he uses to create the swords.

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9 hours ago, Soledai said:

So like, a mage version of Zhong Hui?

Similiar, but the "blades" would be created from pure magic, and we'd see more magey stuff like firing a storm of blades forward as a projectile and the like.

I think it would own in any case.

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59 minutes ago, Folt said:

Similiar, but the "blades" would be created from pure magic, and we'd see more magey stuff like firing a storm of blades forward as a projectile and the like.

I think it would own in any case.

Sounds kind of like what Noctis does in FF15, I don't mind that at all.

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Ooh! I really like the over the shoulder free aim mode. I was worried archers would be limited to firing directly in front of them outside of the big AoE combos

I think our boy Takumi can hold his own with just the bow. The magic arrows that materialize as he draws the string would fit right in with Warriors aesthetics and choreography. And he'll throw a punch or two. Who knows, maybe there's an Oliver Queen in that kid.

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14 hours ago, Gustavos said:

Ooh! I really like the over the shoulder free aim mode. I was worried archers would be limited to firing directly in front of them outside of the big AoE combos

I think our boy Takumi can hold his own with just the bow. The magic arrows that materialize as he draws the string would fit right in with Warriors aesthetics and choreography. And he'll throw a punch or two. Who knows, maybe there's an Oliver Queen in that kid.

More often than not, dedicated Archers in Warriors games tend to fire "spread" shots; several arrows at a time that fan out in front of them. Wonder how they'll handle things in FEW.

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