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Origins of Mila and Duma (unmarked Endgame spoilers)


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On 13-4-2017 at 8:53 AM, sirmola said:

Altrenatly, Forsetti could be an ice dragon. FE games often treat wind and ice as the same element (Blizzard is a wind spell in every game it appears in that has distinct elements), and ice dragons are all over the FE mythos. In fact,  my favorite fan theory is that forseti is nills from fe7 (and nills is an ice dragon). Personally, I like it when games have connections as long as the connections make some sort of sense, and don't distort the plot (although some light retconing is OK). The awakening kids in fates are a great example of how to NOT do this. A better example is the GBA port of "a link to the past", which slightly changes one or two sentences in the opening text crawl so that the events described therein more closely resemble "ocarina of time". It is a retcon, but it has almost no effect on the game's story.

I tend to believe that the world the Elebian dragons fled to is Akenea where they would then have their little war, go insane and proceed to influence their new human neighbors from there on out. So to me Nills being Forseti sounds possible. On the other hand it would be equally possible he's one of those mad ice dragons Marth has to kill on Anri's way. 

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5 hours ago, Emperor Hardin said:

Ss_fe02_casting_megaquake.png

You're right.

So it would made more sense if both of them were Earth Dragons.
On another topic, it would be very interesting to see Kaga's reaction to this remake.

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2 hours ago, Light Master said:

On another topic, it would be very interesting to see Kaga's reaction to this remake.

Kaga: Oh s*** they're remaking Gaiden. I thought they forgot about it.

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10 hours ago, Hero of the Fire Emblems said:

literally every single time I have brought the issue up on multiple sites I'm accused of being a Nohrian apologist and that Hoshido are the victims here, and that they shouldn't have to provide food for Nohr-

Really? Opposite for me. If anything, I tend to see both the good and bad side of Nohr and Hoshido. Also, think about this. On a point of characters, if you're Corrin, the family you know if Nohr. Even if forced a choice to choose between families, you would naturally go back to the family you know more. However, the way Fates set the prologue up, its showing why you SHOULDN'T go back to Nohr and the only reason you'd go back is to be with the family you know your entire life, as Birthright is the path where you openly embrace your ideals and cannot stand Garon's tyranny. However, the moral grey is muddied and thus hard to understand, cause they try to focus so much on black and white. Hell, Hoshido is called the white kingdom and Nohr is the black kingdom. 

I prefer BlazingKnight's version, where both sides have legit reasons for hostility towards the other. 

10 hours ago, Party Moth said:

Can someone tell me why two dragons that have Greek names (akin to Medeus, an Earth Dragon), heavily affect the crops and the earth with their powers, have been referred to as an "earth goddess" and (from the English patch of Gaiden when Doma casts Megaquake) an "earth spirit", and whose final battle music contains a leitmotif from Medeus' enemy phase music, are divine dragons?

Simple: Green hair. Not kidding when I say that. Naga, Tiki, Mila, Duma, they all have green hair. 

10 hours ago, Emperor Hardin said:

Something which no named character brings up other then Gangrel who also says Emmeryn's kindness disgusts him.

Basically the writers used the plot very little unlike Zofia's greed.

Blaming that more on how Awakening's plot was rushed when they actually could have turned this into a Genealogy or Tellius series in its own right. 

10 hours ago, Emperor Hardin said:

Everything does indicate Divine Dragons are limited to Light/Divine Based powers in the natural forms though.

Not really. I mean, their attack is called "Mist Breath" which isn't even really an element in itself. Light is just the more often associated element with Divine Dragons, but by no means are they stated to just control that element solely. Given the vast knowledge and power they wield, and that they are considered the most powerful dragon race that even other dragons fear/respect, being able to command elements or have abilities beyond the limitation they usually possess gives them that much more credibility.

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1 hour ago, omegaxis1 said:

Simple: Green hair. Not kidding when I say that. Naga, Tiki, Mila, Duma, they all have green hair. 

Not really. I mean, their attack is called "Mist Breath" which isn't even really an element in itself. Light is just the more often associated element with Divine Dragons, but by no means are they stated to just control that element solely. Given the vast knowledge and power they wield, and that they are considered the most powerful dragon race that even other dragons fear/respect, being able to command elements or have abilities beyond the limitation they usually possess gives them that much more credibility.

Mila and Duma didn't have green hair until the remake. Also green hair is never stated to be a Divine Dragon trait.

Earth Dragons are just as powerful according to Forsetti in FE4. No, there's no evidence of them controlling other elements.

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1 hour ago, omegaxis1 said:

Really? Opposite for me. If anything, I tend to see both the good and bad side of Nohr and Hoshido. Also, think about this. On a point of characters, if you're Corrin, the family you know if Nohr. Even if forced a choice to choose between families, you would naturally go back to the family you know more. However, the way Fates set the prologue up, its showing why you SHOULDN'T go back to Nohr and the only reason you'd go back is to be with the family you know your entire life, as Birthright is the path where you openly embrace your ideals and cannot stand Garon's tyranny. However, the moral grey is muddied and thus hard to understand, cause they try to focus so much on black and white. Hell, Hoshido is called the white kingdom and Nohr is the black kingdom. 

I prefer BlazingKnight's version, where both sides have legit reasons for hostility towards the other. 

To be completely fair here, a lot of not going back to Nohr involves taking Hans (a man Xander up front tells you not to trust) at his word.

Furthermore, the logic of the situation being that Garon wants you in Hoshido (ergo, BR is playing directly into Garon's hand) makes CQ an equally valid choice for opposing Garon as BR is. I have no doubt in my mind Garon intentionally spun your defection to Hoshido as propaganda for why Hoshido must be destroyed, based on the reactions from the Nohrian Royals in BR; and I have even less doubt that is his plan from Chapter 2 if that is the case. Garon is upset that you returned to Nohr.

Why would he be upset if you can take Dragon Form like Anankos? It seems like he's upset that you didn't stay in Hoshido- where his scheming landed you to start with. Based purely on the first 7 chapters of the two routes, CQ seems pretty plauisble for fucking up Garon's plans even if you think Garon is scum based on taking Hans at his word, and maybe even trying to see if he's too fargone to reason with him (He's possessed by a feral dragon, but you don't know that going in).

BR is also a valid choice to take care of Garon, just a more violent and riskier "Bang down the front door" method of dealing with Garon that very likely involves playing into his hand.

Edited by Hero of the Fire Emblems
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Okay, okay, I think I'm a little lost with this. Help me out where I am wrong here:

Duma and Mila were on Archanea under Naga long before the game

Duma always argued with Naga, so Naga banished him after giving him the Falchion?

Duma traveled West and Mila followed, and they made Valentia

They argued how to set up basically the government in this new land, so they split it off giving two royal families divine dragon blood

Mila sealed off the Falchion in order to protect her brother

Rudolf posed as a destroyer to get a rise of Valentian heroes to rise from the turmoil to eliminate out Duma and Mila..

If it is how I think it is, someone answer me these questions:
Why didn't Rudolf eliminate Duma himself if he had the royal blood to wield the Falchion, and was able to ward off Mila anyway?

How did the Falchion get to Archanea for Marth to use in FE1/11 if it was always in Valentia?

How did it get back to Archanea for FE 3/12?\

How did Mercurius, Gradivus, and Parthia get to Valentia? How did they get back?

Who wrote the Valentian Revelations?

Why does Alm go to Archanea for Chapter 6? The war was over, and foreign affairs shouldn't be strongly addressed after a war.

When Mila says she sealed the Falchion, did she mean when she took a hit from Rudolf?

How did Rudolf get the Falchion? Did Duma give it to him? If so, why did Duma want to break the god's pact?

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7 minutes ago, arctic.fox0708 said:

How did the Falchion get to Archanea for Marth to use in FE1/11 if it was always in Valentia?

It's a different Falchion.  Yeah, it's weird, but Naga has more than one fang... I guess she's toothless now...

The rest I can't really answer, though I think the Regalia are just duplicates as well.

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11 minutes ago, arctic.fox0708 said:

Okay, okay, I think I'm a little lost with this. Help me out where I am wrong here:

Duma and Mila were on Archanea under Naga long before the game

Duma always argued with Naga, so Naga banished him after giving him the Falchion?

Duma traveled West and Mila followed, and they made Valentia

They argued how to set up basically the government in this new land, so they split it off giving two royal families divine dragon blood

Mila sealed off the Falchion in order to protect her brother

Rudolf posed as a destroyer to get a rise of Valentian heroes to rise from the turmoil to eliminate out Duma and Mila..

If it is how I think it is, someone answer me these questions:
Why didn't Rudolf eliminate Duma himself if he had the royal blood to wield the Falchion, and was able to ward off Mila anyway?

How did the Falchion get to Archanea for Marth to use in FE1/11 if it was always in Valentia?

How did it get back to Archanea for FE 3/12?\

How did Mercurius, Gradivus, and Parthia get to Valentia? How did they get back?

Who wrote the Valentian Revelations?

Why does Alm go to Archanea for Chapter 6? The war was over, and foreign affairs shouldn't be strongly addressed after a war.

When Mila says she sealed the Falchion, did she mean when she took a hit from Rudolf?

How did Rudolf get the Falchion? Did Duma give it to him? If so, why did Duma want to break the god's pact?

Apparently Duma was banished before degeneration. No idea on his weird powers that clearly aren't Divine Dragon norm.

In the original, Falchion was an ordinary sword made special by Mila being sealed in it.

Rudolf and Duma came up with the plan to rid the world of Gods themselves, Mila wasn't agree. In the remake, Mila willingly allowed herself to be sealed.

No idea on Gradivus, I'm a little disappointed that Rudolf doesn't wield it. I heard Kaga initially planned a Gradivus and Falchion to appear in every Fire Emblem game and Gaiden is remnant of it.

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4 hours ago, Emperor Hardin said:

Mila and Duma didn't have green hair until the remake. Also green hair is never stated to be a Divine Dragon trait.

Earth Dragons are just as powerful according to Forsetti in FE4. No, there's no evidence of them controlling other elements.

Mila and Duma didn't actually make a humanoid appearance until the Remake if you wanna get technical. Also, Duma was colored green as that slime monster.

Earth Dragons are as powerful as Divine Dragons, but they ultimately still lost the war against the Divine Dragons in the long run. Also, despite being called "Earth" Dragons, their powers are less "earth" based and more "darkness" based.

And were we not just talking about how Mila and Duma, despite being Divine Dragons, controlled elements not light elemental? Earth, darkness, etc? If anything, that pretty much proved Divine Dragons are not limited to single elemental. 

4 hours ago, Hero of the Fire Emblems said:

Why would he be upset if you can take Dragon Form like Anankos? It seems like he's upset that you didn't stay in Hoshido- where his scheming landed you to start with. Based purely on the first 7 chapters of the two routes, CQ seems pretty plauisble for fucking up Garon's plans even if you think Garon is scum based on taking Hans at his word, and maybe even trying to see if he's too fargone to reason with him (He's possessed by a feral dragon, but you don't know that going in).

Actually, I think he's more surprised Corrin was alive, since the sword was rigged to first drag Corrin into the Bottomless Canyon, and then explode and impale Corrin in shrapnel. Also, thinking about it, Anankos controls Garon and created/found/took the sword Ganglari, so the sword dragging Corrin into the Canyon that would lead to Valla means the intention was to make Corrin a vessel possibly, and if that failed, kill him. 

Someone that I debated with talks about how Conquest is the far less bloody route, and how Birthright is the worst one. His main argument on Birthright does make sense, as Corrin is the most ignorant on Birthright as neither Gunter, not Valla ever gets mentioned or heard of in Birthright. Though we do learn about the damaging effects of the song. 

3 hours ago, arctic.fox0708 said:

Why didn't Rudolf eliminate Duma himself if he had the royal blood to wield the Falchion, and was able to ward off Mila anyway?

How did the Falchion get to Archanea for Marth to use in FE1/11 if it was always in Valentia?

How did it get back to Archanea for FE 3/12?\

How did Mercurius, Gradivus, and Parthia get to Valentia? How did they get back?

Who wrote the Valentian Revelations?

Why does Alm go to Archanea for Chapter 6? The war was over, and foreign affairs shouldn't be strongly addressed after a war.

When Mila says she sealed the Falchion, did she mean when she took a hit from Rudolf?

How did Rudolf get the Falchion? Did Duma give it to him? If so, why did Duma want to break the god's pact?

Going in order: 

  1. I'm assuming Rudolf didn't want to be the one to save the continent. He's committed may atrocities and thus what Valentia needed was a hero that could unite the continent under the right banner. Its like how in Avatar: The Last Airbender, Iroh wouldn't face his brother to save the world, because history would see it as more violence, a brother killing brother to grab power, so it needs to be the Avatar that wins, as the Avatar represents justice. 
  2. We learn that there are actually TWO Falchions. The one in Valentia is the first original Falchion. The one in Archanea was made afterwards. Both are likely equal in power. 
  3. It never went back to Archanea. A better question is, "Where is it now by the time of Awakening?"
  4. I think it was only Gradivus that made Valentia, which I don't like, cause it technically should have remained in Archanea, as Hardin took it. 
  5. No idea.
  6. Probably they went to investigate something. 
  7. Does she? Who knows. The game isn't even out for us.
  8. Wasn't it Rudolf that actually made the plan this entire time? 
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14 minutes ago, omegaxis1 said:

Mila and Duma didn't actually make a humanoid appearance until the Remake if you wanna get technical. Also, Duma was colored green as that slime monster.

Earth Dragons are as powerful as Divine Dragons, but they ultimately still lost the war against the Divine Dragons in the long run. Also, despite being called "Earth" Dragons, their powers are less "earth" based and more "darkness" based.

Mila always was shown to have a humanoid appearance via her statues.

Lost at the cost of the lives of virtually ALL Divine Dragons. Actually Earth Dragons are associated with Earth very much, they burrow through the ground and Medeus's death speech in book 2 invokes the Earth again. Earth and Shadow are associated together in many old myths.

Point is Duma being a Divine Dragon is a stretch no matter how you cut it.

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6 hours ago, omegaxis1 said:

Simple: Green hair. Not kidding when I say that. Naga, Tiki, Mila, Duma, they all have green hair.

No green hair for Doma and Mila in the original Gaiden. That's retroactive information in light of the remake, which ignores major cues from the original that they were likely earth dragons (if they were even dragons at all). They've shown repeatedly that they're willing to change old canon, as Emperor Hardin has pointed out above re: sealing Mila into Falchion (and just Falchion in general).

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6 minutes ago, Salamud said:

Going from Xane's shapeshifting, Gotoh building Starlight along with being Mr. Magic, and Tiki being able to use non-Divine Stones the Divine Dragons apparently had at least some ability to manipulate other elements.

Most tomes are built via sealing elements into books, also Starlight is light in origin. Xane being able to  switch forms is related to his unique mastery of shapeshifting his Manakete form, not a Divine Dragon power. Basically its related to Xane's talent rather then a talent unique to any specific Dragon tribes.

Bantu can use stones outside of his tribe too, as can Medeus.

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1 hour ago, Emperor Hardin said:

Mila always was shown to have a humanoid appearance via her statues.

Lost at the cost of the lives of virtually ALL Divine Dragons. Actually Earth Dragons are associated with Earth very much, they burrow through the ground and Medeus's death speech in book 2 invokes the Earth again. Earth and Shadow are associated together in many old myths.

Point is Duma being a Divine Dragon is a stretch no matter how you cut it.

Well of COURSE its humanoid, since we see that she can take human form. But those statues didn't really have her hair color, so you can't actually base that on anything. And you actually CAN'T say that Duma and Mila being Divine Dragons a stretch, because its canon from this point forward. Also, if anything, them being Divine Dragons makes far more sense than them being known to be actual gods, given how this is still the same verse as Archanea, which Naga is the closest thing to a god, and she's a Divine Dragon, not a true god. 

It was never said that all the Divine Dragons died in that war at all. If anything, the dragons simply went into hiding or lived among humans, since living with the humans was their idea. 

Okay, and your point? Earth and shadow might be interconnected through that, but then you can really invoke the same concept to Divine Dragons. Fire creates light, wind is tended to be associated with light as well. Life and light go hand in hand.

1 hour ago, Party Moth said:

No green hair for Doma and Mila in the original Gaiden. That's retroactive information in light of the remake, which ignores major cues from the original that they were likely earth dragons (if they were even dragons at all). They've shown repeatedly that they're willing to change old canon, as Emperor Hardin has pointed out above re: sealing Mila into Falchion (and just Falchion in general).

Original gaiden didn't really give a full form of the beings themselves. Duma was a slime monster, and Mila was at best a statue. Not real legit evidence there you've got. And no, there was NO mention they were dragons. Just called them gods and that was it. Dragons is only being mentioned now, which makes sense. However, they can't be Earth Dragons because of the fact that all Earth Dragons went insane from degradation of the mind, and Medeus is confirmed to be the sole Manakete from the Earth Dragon Tribe. Loptyr was an Earth Dragon, but he began to possess via blood pact. 

4 minutes ago, Emperor Hardin said:

Most tomes are built via sealing elements into books, also Starlight is light in origin. Xane being able to  switch forms is related to his unique mastery of shapeshifting his Manakete form, not a Divine Dragon power.

Unfortunately, that's incorrect. The manakete form is giving a human form and dragon form, and Xane then threw away his Dragonstone. His transformation abilities are his and only his. The fact he can perform these unique aspects just strengthens the argument that Divine Dragons are not as limited to a light element as you say. 

As for Gotoh, can't really say much for him, cause he never fought his own powers, but rather just used his knowledge to create magic tomes, the famous one being Aura I believe and Starlight. 

6 minutes ago, Emperor Hardin said:

Bantu can use stones outside of his tribe too, as can Medeus.

I wouldn't use that as an argument. That's nothing more than a game mechanic, not a true aspect of the manakete species themselves, as its stated that they can only take the dragon form from the dragonstone they seal their powers in, because that is their powers held in. 

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8 minutes ago, omegaxis1 said:

Well of COURSE its humanoid, since we see that she can take human form. But those statues didn't really have her hair color, so you can't actually base that on anything. And you actually CAN'T say that Duma and Mila being Divine Dragons a stretch, because its canon from this point forward. Also, if anything, them being Divine Dragons makes far more sense than them being known to be actual gods, given how this is still the same verse as Archanea, which Naga is the closest thing to a god, and she's a Divine Dragon, not a true god. 

It was never said that all the Divine Dragons died in that war at all. If anything, the dragons simply went into hiding or lived among humans, since living with the humans was their idea. 

Okay, and your point? Earth and shadow might be interconnected through that, but then you can really invoke the same concept to Divine Dragons. Fire creates light, wind is tended to be associated with light as well. Life and light go hand in hand.

Original gaiden didn't really give a full form of the beings themselves. Duma was a slime monster, and Mila was at best a statue. Not real legit evidence there you've got. And no, there was NO mention they were dragons. Just called them gods and that was it. Dragons is only being mentioned now, which makes sense. However, they can't be Earth Dragons because of the fact that all Earth Dragons went insane from degradation of the mind, and Medeus is confirmed to be the sole Manakete from the Earth Dragon Tribe. Loptyr was an Earth Dragon, but he began to possess via blood pact. 

Unfortunately, that's incorrect. The manakete form is giving a human form and dragon form, and Xane then threw away his Dragonstone. His transformation abilities are his and only his. The fact he can perform these unique aspects just strengthens the argument that Divine Dragons are not as limited to a light element as you say. 

As for Gotoh, can't really say much for him, cause he never fought his own powers, but rather just used his knowledge to create magic tomes, the famous one being Aura I believe and Starlight. 

I wouldn't use that as an argument. That's nothing more than a game mechanic, not a true aspect of the manakete species themselves, as its stated that they can only take the dragon form from the dragonstone they seal their powers in, because that is their powers held in. 

Kaga never denied the existence of gods, he also mentioned non dragon spirits exist in the world. And it is a stretch as Duma and Mila's powers are distinct from a Divine dragons. As mentioned, Duma's powers relate to Earth and Shadow, the aspects of Earth Dragons.

Xane directly the vast majority of Divine Dragons died fighting the degenerated Earth Dragons during Mystery of the Emblem and its remake. He even says its pretty just him, Gotoh, and Tiki, with only the last one able to transform. So yes it was said.

Yet they can be Divine Dragons despite all of them dying but  Xane, Gotoh, Tiki, and Naga's reincarnation? Basically having them be surviving Earth Dragons is no more of a stretch then surviving Divine Dragons as both tribes are virtually extinct.

No, the Manakete IS the humanoid form, which all dragons can take. Xane being able to alter his humanoid form is entirely related to his personal skill, Gotoh or Tiki cannot alter how they appear like Xane. So no, if anything you saying that power relates to the Divine Dragons is incorrect.

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5 minutes ago, Emperor Hardin said:

Kaga never denied the existence of gods, he also mentioned non dragon spirits exist in the world. And it is a stretch as Duma and Mila's powers are distinct from a Divine dragons.

Xane directly pretty much all Divine Dragons died fighting the degenerated Earth Dragons during Mystery of the Emblem and its remake. So yes it was said.

Yet they can be Divine Dragons despite all of them dying but  Xane, Gotoh, Tiki, and Naga's reincarnation? Basically having them be surviving Earth Dragons is no more of a stretch then surviving Divine Dragons as both tribes are virtually extinct.

No, the Manakete IS the humanoid form, which all dragons can take. Xane being able to alter his humanoid form is entirely related to his personal skill, Gotoh or Tiki cannot alter how they appear like Xane. So no.

We have a real god in the Tellius series, but it just doesn't fit into the lore within the Archanea series where Naga doesn't really fit with Mila and Duma, but now it makes sense. Again, not really. When we have theories and evidence of mention of the contrary, it no longer seems like Mila and Naga are totally unrelated. Also, given how Earth Dragons were stated to view humans as insects and held them in contempt, while Divine Dragons had sympathy towards them, particularly Naga, its unlikely for Mila and Duma to be Earth Dragons. Okay, maybe Duma, but not Mila. 

Actually, Xane DIDN'T confirm anything about that. He explained the war of the Earth Dragons and Divine Dragons, and said it was a brutal and long war, along those lines, but he never said that the Divine Dragons all died. 

Of course, not saying that Divine Dragons couldn't have been killed afterwards, cause in the end, they DID become Manaketes and thus was physically vulnerable to being killed and oppressed by humans. Tiki was constantly sleeping and is now worshipped as an oracle, Gotoh founded the city of magic, while Bantu and Xane just travels around, with Bantu searching for other Manaketes. What became of them is unknown, but Bantu is hinted to still be alive, but Gotoh and Xane, not sure. Maybe they died when Grima rose to power 1000 years prior to Awakening. 

But Duma and Mila being exiled Divine Dragons doesn't seem like a stretch. If anything, it shows a unique aspect where even a Divine Dragon can be misguided and at times in the wrong, thus adding a bit moral gray. 

Yes, the Manakete is the human form. But that doesn't mean they have the ability to change that human form any time they want. Xane being able to shift his human form to mimic others that no other Manakete able to do that just means its a unique trait to Xane himself. But that doesn't disprove that Divine Dragons don't possess their own unique skills and techniques. Naga doesn't show to be able to revive the dead, but Mila can, despite Naga being the most powerful Divine Dragon. 

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8 minutes ago, omegaxis1 said:

We have a real god in the Tellius series, but it just doesn't fit into the lore within the Archanea series where Naga doesn't really fit with Mila and Duma, but now it makes sense. Again, not really. When we have theories and evidence of mention of the contrary, it no longer seems like Mila and Naga are totally unrelated. Also, given how Earth Dragons were stated to view humans as insects and held them in contempt, while Divine Dragons had sympathy towards them, particularly Naga, its unlikely for Mila and Duma to be Earth Dragons. Okay, maybe Duma, but not Mila. 

Actually, Xane DIDN'T confirm anything about that. He explained the war of the Earth Dragons and Divine Dragons, and said it was a brutal and long war, along those lines, but he never said that the Divine Dragons all died. 

Of course, not saying that Divine Dragons couldn't have been killed afterwards, cause in the end, they DID become Manaketes and thus was physically vulnerable to being killed and oppressed by humans. Tiki was constantly sleeping and is now worshipped as an oracle, Gotoh founded the city of magic, while Bantu and Xane just travels around, with Bantu searching for other Manaketes. What became of them is unknown, but Bantu is hinted to still be alive, but Gotoh and Xane, not sure. Maybe they died when Grima rose to power 1000 years prior to Awakening. 

But Duma and Mila being exiled Divine Dragons doesn't seem like a stretch. If anything, it shows a unique aspect where even a Divine Dragon can be misguided and at times in the wrong, thus adding a bit moral gray. 

Yes, the Manakete is the human form. But that doesn't mean they have the ability to change that human form any time they want. Xane being able to shift his human form to mimic others that no other Manakete able to do that just means its a unique trait to Xane himself. But that doesn't disprove that Divine Dragons don't possess their own unique skills and techniques. Naga doesn't show to be able to revive the dead, but Mila can, despite Naga being the most powerful Divine Dragon. 

Kaga has confirmed Gods and spirits can exist in the setting in his talk on tomes and staves. Most Dragons held Humans in contempt and refused to become Manaketes as Xane explained.

When the Divine Dragons fought the Earth Dragons they over-exhausted their dragonstones, and so practically became extinct.
Aside from Narga, only Gato, me and the just born Chiki survived.

Xane's words direct from Mystery, they died during the war.

It is a stretch. Also Duma and Mila are ultimately both non villainous characters, so it doesn't add grey. Instead it shows Divine Dragons are the only dragons that will get focus now.

As mentioned, Xane can do that because of his personal experience and skill, not because he's a Divine Dragon. Again, there's no proof Divine Dragons can control other elements outside of using Tomes and other sealed magic.

Mila being a Divine Dragon is unique to the remake, once agin.

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47 minutes ago, omegaxis1 said:

Original gaiden didn't really give a full form of the beings themselves. Duma was a slime monster, and Mila was at best a statue. Not real legit evidence there you've got. And no, there was NO mention they were dragons. Just called them gods and that was it. Dragons is only being mentioned now, which makes sense. However, they can't be Earth Dragons because of the fact that all Earth Dragons went insane from degradation of the mind, and Medeus is confirmed to be the sole Manakete from the Earth Dragon Tribe. Loptyr was an Earth Dragon, but he began to possess via blood pact.

My point is that them being dragons at all is sketchy at best, with the only indicators from the old canon being association with the earth element. If you want to play the "Earth Dragons all went insane/died in the war" card, then the Divine Dragons follow this too, as mentioned by Xane (quoted by Emperor Hardin above). Doma wasn't just a slime monster, he's referred to as an earth spirit. Mila wasn't just a statue, she's referred to as an earth goddess. Also, Loptyr is a great example of old canon sneaking in exceptions to the stated Archanean canon, as Loptyr neither took manakete form nor went insane and was sealed away, a fact Naga was aware of yet unmentioned by the remaining dragons in Archanea.

25 minutes ago, omegaxis1 said:

But Duma and Mila being exiled Divine Dragons doesn't seem like a stretch. If anything, it shows a unique aspect where even a Divine Dragon can be misguided and at times in the wrong, thus adding a bit moral gray.

I would argue that Earth Dragons who are not only passive of humanity but actively attempting to guide it would be a far, far more unique aspect of grey morality.

 

Despite all this, Mila's manakete form doesn't even match prior Divine Dragons anyway (if anything, her tail is more like an FE3 wyvern's than any Divine Dragon we've seen in the series). This whole direction is a mess overall, though I can at least appreciate the developers' attempts to better streamline Valentia and Ylisse into the Archanean/Jugdrali lore.

Edited by Party Moth
grammar and spelling correction
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10 minutes ago, Party Moth said:

My point is that them being dragons at all is sketchy at best, with the only indicators from the old canon being association with the earth element. If you want to play the "Earth Dragons all went insane/died in the war" card, then the Divine Dragons follow this too, as mentioned by Xane (quoted by Emperor Hardin above). Doma wasn't just a slime monster, he's referred to as an earth spirit. Mila wasn't just a statue, she's referred to as an earth goddess. Also, Loptyr is a great example of old canon sneaking in exceptions to the stated Archanean canon, as Loptyr neither took manakete form nor went insane and was sealed away, a fact Naga was aware of yet unmentioned by the remaining dragons in Archanea.

I would argue that Earth Dragons who are not only passive of humanity but actively attempting to guide it would be a far, far more unique aspect of grey morality.

Duma's map sprite in Gaiden is blatantly a dragon.

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1 hour ago, Salamud said:

Duma's map sprite in Gaiden is blatantly a dragon.

A dragon with a shell and a single eye that shoots lasers, basically while resembling a dragon, it didn't resemble a Divine Dragon.

Edited by Emperor Hardin
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39 minutes ago, Salamud said:

Duma's map sprite in Gaiden is blatantly a dragon.

While I agree that he looks like a dragon, the semblance in the battle sprite can be difficult to make out to the point where people deny it. I will concede that point, however.

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On 4/6/2017 at 0:19 PM, VincentASM said:

Personally I think this was all planned somewhat. Even Tellius has some subtle hints with the Branded. I mean, if you think about it, the Branded are really just pumped up versions of the humans with transfused dragon blood. Which makes sense if Tellius is near the start of the timeline.

Little off topic but this makes me wonder if the drug Izuka created was actually speeding up the laguz generation.

But maybe not because it affections humans too. Just a possible thought though.

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It's really funny how far people go just to refuse that Mila and Duma being Divine Dragons is a blatant retcon. :p
Or at least, it would be.

Oh yeah, took a look at LPs of Gaiden. Pretty cool. Kind of want to slap Celica in the face though.
I also feel that changing what Mila did, or didin't and giving a role to Naga... debase, devalue what Ruru and Duma actually did. Like, as if we need her. Same as making them dragons.
Admitvely, Awakening already did that, but you know what I think of what Awakening did.

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