Jump to content
Sign in to follow this  
Lushen

Lushen's Cavalry Discussion

Recommended Posts

I've seen quite a few cavalry guides around here in the past which have inspired me to make my own.  I have a separate cavalry account where I'm trying to get at least 1 of every 5* horse in the game.  So far, I have Eldigan, Prinscilla, Xander, Olwen, and 3 Reinhardts.  I also have some level 40 4* cavalry units that I don't think are worth the upgrade.  I've used other cavalry units like Leo on my other accounts, so I know how they work as well.

Cavalry Base
I would argue you need two kinds of units to make an effective cavalry team - or any team for that matter.  One for physical attacks and one for magical attacks.  These two types should be opposing colors but they can be the same if the rest of your team is different.  Having more than 2 of a single color is a very bad idea.  The two golden gooses for a cavalry team are Reinhardt/Olwen and Eldigan.  With these two, you can actually 'duo' most of the game and a few grand hero battles.  In the latest one (Navarre), I used robin to bait a dagger unit (he didn't even do any damage that wasn't healed the next turn, just survived a hit) and Priscilla to heal him after so he could survive a second hit.  Besides that, Eldigan and Reinhardt "duo'd" the entire map without needing any heals.  If you have Olwen/Reinhardt and Eldigan both, you should definitely be making a cavalry team!

Below is the full 'guide'.  It's really more of a discussion.  After that, is an estimated 'guide' that is essentially cliffnotes of my discussion.  If you don't want to read a lot, just look at the cliffnotes and if you disagree with something read the justification in the full discussion.

I'm also not going too in depth when it comes to skill inheritance, because quite frankly, if you're that into the game, you already know what you're doing.  Just focus on goad/hone/fortify/ward slot C skills if you don't know what you're doing. 

Have any other team compositions I didn't mention?  I'd love to hear about them.

Full

 

+ Eldigan
Eldigan is a hard-hitting tank that can move three spaces.  If that sounds OP, it's because he is.  In addition to being a tank for Reinhardt, a slayer of green units, and a good combatant against reds, he also has the advantage of boosting your arena rating.  With fury, he has a BST of 182 which is crazy high.  I actually haven't inherited any skills on him yet because I just don't see the point.  Vantage would be great since he is below 75% hp quite often and hits hard enough to kill some attackers.  For slot C, I would recommend goad or hone cavalry to boost a Reinhardt's/Olwen attack/speed.  Though, Olwen benefits more from the speed buff than Reinhardt does.  Note his physical defense is considerably higher than his resistance, but both are good when you factor in his high HP.  Finally, feel free to buy lunge, but I don't recommend using it.  You're just going to slingshot the enemy in front of your support/glass cannon unit.

+ Reinhardt
Reinhardt is a great magical attacker due to his Dire Thunder tome which allows him to attack twice despite having one of the lowest speeds in the game.  Unfortunately, his low BST means you need to + him or give him fury to use him in arena effectively.  This isn't too bad, however, since he's available as a 4* unit.

Don't rule his speed out completely...It can be salvaged on a cavalry team. My +sp Reinhardt has 21 speed.  With fury (he can't survive more than one encounter so the -6hp means nothing) it would be 24.  With Hone cavalry, it goes up to 30.  With Goad cavalry, it goes up to 34 which allows him to start doubling.  What are the odds that all of these are active at any given time?  Pretty low, I think but keeping his speed around 28-30 can be very helpful.  Basically, you want him to be able to survive some nocolor attackers and mages which means only letting them attack once.  28-30 speed should keep him safe if one sneaks up on you. 

The best slot A would be death blow because most of his damage is going to come on your turn, but I'm using fury to boost his BST for arena.  Slot C could stay goad cavalry, or you can mix it up with another cavalry buff (more on this later).  For Slot B, Quick Riposte, a breaker, seal, or wings of mercy would all be great. 

+ Olwen
Olwen is an extremely viable alternative for Reinhardt.  She also suffers from the same low BST so if you want her for arena be prepared to start +ing her or give her fury.  And she's 5* only so good luck!

If you're planning to use Dire Thunder, I still think you should get a Reinhardt and inherit goad cavalry on your third or fourth unit.  I would not put it on her or Eldigan because both these units benefit from the extra speed considerably.  This also applies to hone cavalry, this isn't the right unit for it because she needs it.  With both hone and goad cavalry, in addition to fury...her speed is going to jump to 42.  She will attack almost any natural unit in the game 4 times.  Who won't she attack 4 times?  Reds, who she will kill anyways.  Other than reds, only Anna, naturally.  Against another support-based team, be careful though.  She also has decent attack so those four hits will destroy everything, even lots of greens.  Oh and a +sp nature would put her at 44 speed w/ dire thunder...yeah...

The other option is accept her speed will allow her to double without Dire Thunder, so change out her tome.  Blarwolf isn't a bad idea, but Blarraven would also be a great option.  Personally, I'm waiting for a blue version of Excalibur to get those pesky Pegasus Knights.  I prefer the first option, for now.

- Red/Green Physical Alternatives
Eldigan is by far the best unit out there for this kind of thing.  This might change when Default!Xander is released, but we'll see.  For now, two units can be substituted for him, but it won't be as effective.  What you're going for here is a tank that can kill with buffs.  Additionally without Eldigan you're sacrificing a lot of BST points.  I wouldn't recommend low speed units either because they won't hit hard or defend well when they're being doubled.  This just leaves Eliwood and Cain, sadly (gunter is bad post-skill-inheritance, don't use him as a key unit).  All the other green/red horse units have low speed.  Which one to use just depends on whether your team wants more physical resistance (Cain) or more magical resistance (Eliwood). 

- Blue Magical Alternatives
The only real alternative for Reinhardt/Olwen is Ursla, which you should have if you were here for the GHB.  However, if you're considering this then you don't have Reinhardt/Olwen so you don't have access to Dire Thunder.  In this case, you need to go for option #2 I've laid out in the Olwen section (not using Dire Thunder).  Her speed is high enough to where she should double with buffs.  However, without a Reinhardt your team will suffer a bit because you won't have goad cavalry on anyone.  This is ok, hone cavalry should be enough for now, but not great.

Ursla's stats are actually better than Olwen's slightly, but I don't think all the SP/time/feathers is worth farming for.  And you'd have to sacrifice a good 5* so I don't recommend replacing Olwen with Ursla if you have an Olwen/Reinhardt. 

Regardless, train Ursla to at least 4* lvl 40.  She could be useful in a GHB in the future (horse-killing horse)

- Blue Physical Alternatives and Green/Red Magical Alternatives
Yes, there are a lot of great blue physical cavalry units.  Unfortunately, I can't recommend using them with Reinhardt/Olwen.  If you're going to use a blue physical try to get a red/green magical unit (Leo and Cecilia are the only alternatives), you're going to suffer because there's no red/green version of dire thunder and neither units hit very hard on their own...This means folks like Abel, while very useful in a noncavalry team, just aren't going to be that good for an all cavalry team right now.

If you have to use a blue physical and blue magical for your two key members, you're going to have trouble getting a well-rounded team when the arena season's bonus heroes change.

However!  They can make great third/fourth units as long as you have a Reinhard/Olwen and an Eldigan/Eliwood/Cain

+ Healer
Ok, hear me out.  Healers are not totally useless.  In a team like this, they are ridiculously effective.  Eldigan will eventually start to run out of HP (I've had matches where he's tanked 5+ hits) and you'll want to keep his HP high in case a blue sneaks in.  The golden goose here is Priscilla.  We all thought she'd be another useless healer when she came out...but we were so wrong. 

- Priscilla
I would argue Priscilla is just as useful as Eldigan and Reinhardt/Olwen, if not more.  Why?  Because I've turned her into a freaking Gunter that can heal.  Before skill inheritance, people would throw Gunter into their team and hide him behind other units because he's not very good (but hone cavalry).  He was essentially a support unit that could go attack blues as a last resort.  Priscilla is an actual full-blown support unit.  Why #2?  Because cavalry units can outrun any unit that has just attacked them (besides other cavalry units which people don't use often).  This means you can run away and heal undisturbed before going back into battle.  Why #3?  She hits hard!  You wouldn't believe how much I've used her to finish off a stubborn knight with low resistance.  Why #4?  She can tank quite a few hits from mages with 32 resistance.  Everyone else on my team can't tank mages at all, so she's really my only option.  And she'll weaken them quite a bit.  And finally, why #5?  She has Rehabilitate.  With so many of my units using Fury (can't put it on her though...Otherwise I would for the BST), going down to exactly one hp is quite common.  Rehabilitate will completely restore their health, its crazy useful. 

- Other Horse Healers
Any other horse healer can do just about everything I've described above.  Priscilla is just the easiest because she already has Rehabilitate and a decent staff (you don't need -10 health when she does over 10x2 damage sometimes).  And most units have similar stats so they should be basically the same units.  But those small changes in resistance and health could prevent them from being a mage tank. Unfortunately, the 3 horse healers sit at the very bottom of the BST board for nocolor units...And since you won't pull nocolors often with a cavalry account...you probably won't get enough to + her much at all...Guess that's what you get for being a healer and a horse user. 

- Infantry Healers
I mean its not totally useless, but you're definitely going to want one on a horse for the mobility.  Otherwise, you could have wings of mercy to help out with the mobility issue but they won't be able to run away if they're under attack and your units are healthy.

+ Dancer
There are no dancer cavalry units (obviously).  However, that shouldn't dissuade you from using one.  Azura would be preferable because Olivia isn't going to add much to Eldigan and Ninian won't add much to Reinhardt/Olwen.  Dancers are a lot more effective with cavalry units because of their mobility will allow them to get across the map under the right circumstances with a dance.  I recommend setting up your dancer as a supportive/debuff unit and centering your team in her general vicinity. 

- Ninian
So...Ninian adds an alternate, alternate team composition.  It's a little strange, but because she is a blue magical attacker (and pretty good at it), she can actually replace Olwen/Reinhardt.  However, she won't benefit from any cavalry buffs so putting her as one of your key units may not work out for you.  I would keep her as support, but feel free to experiment with her.  Additionally, her mobility is just a pain when compared to all your horse units.

-Olivia/Azura
As mentioned, unless you're using an alternate team comp with a blue physical and red/green magical, Azura is preferred.  If you are, go with Olivia

 

Note, I know there are four sections (+).  That doesn't mean use one of each.  In fact, I would definitely not use a healer and a dancer at the same time.  Your third unit will probably be a physical attacker and your fourth can either be another physical attacker or a dancer/healer.

Cliff Notes/Summary

 

The absolute best build for a team composition right now is:


Red Physical
Blue Magical
Horse Healers, Dancer, Backup Physical Cavalry
The best dancer for these teams is Azura because she is a physical blue unit which I don't recommend in anything but the alternate team composition.  Backup physical cavalry are probably going to end up being blue physical because that's where all the good cavalry units are and this team comp doesn't have a blue physical attacker.

Rich Man's Team Composition
Eldigan
Reinhardt/Olwen
Horse Healers, Dancers, Backup Physical Cavalry
This build comes from the availability of physical and magical cavalry units (read full discussion for justification).  This may change in the future, but right now this is the best team comp from any standpoint I look at.  You could use a backup magical...  But Leo and Cecilia are the only options here (you don't need Ursla and Reinhardt/Olwen) and I don't find them incredibly useful right now unless you're using Ursla or have taken Olwen's Dire Thunder off (viable strategy).  I was using Olwen and Reinhardt before, and it wasn't too terrible, but I prefer using a backup physical (Sp!Xander, in my case).

Poor Man's Team Composition:
Eldigan/Cain/Eliwood
Reinhardt/Olwen/Ursla
Horse Healers, Dancers, Backup Physical Cavalry
Yea..the biggest problem with this is you kind of need Reinhardt/Olwen but you can make things work with Ursla which everyone should have.  Eliwood is available as a 3* so anyone should be able to get this team comp.

Alternate Team Composition:
Blue Physical
Leo or Cecilia
Horse Healers, Dancers, Backup Physical Cavalry
This isn't as good as the Rich Man's in most cases, but about the only alternative.  There are plenty of good blue physical cavalry units (I won't list them all out) but they aren't key units in the above two compositions.  In this composition, you can use them as a key member but you sill need a magical attacker of a different color.  Leo and Cecilia are ok...but neither hit hard enough and they don't have access to dire thunder.

And I feel like I shouldn't have to say it, but try to put in as many slot C buff cavalry skills in as you can.  In my experience, Hone/Goad are the most useful since buffing speed helps defense and offense.  Additionally, if you use both hone and goad you can get their speeds up to ridiculous numbers which is just OP.  But, having some ward/fortify units behind Eldigan can help out a lot as well.  If you don't know which effects stack with which, look it up before inheritance!

 

Notice, I'm only trying to help you pick your first two units.  That's because your fourth unit will change depending on the season's bonus heroes and your third unit may change to compensate that.  Only two units are going to stay stagnate no matter what (unless another hero comes out that outclasses them).  Try to train as many third/fourth units as you can so your team can be really flexible depending on the arena season.

 

 

 

Edited by Lushen

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
22 minutes ago, Lushen said:

I'm also not going too in depth when it comes to skill inheritance, because quite frankly, if you're that into the game, you already know what you're doing.  Just focus on goad/hone/fortify/ward slot C skills if you don't know what you're doing. 

I feel like this should be placed in a more visible spot. I just barely saved myself from writing up a post extolling Gronnblade(+) Cecilia.

Edited by LordFrigid

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
22 minutes ago, LordFrigid said:

I feel like this should be placed in a more visible spot. I just barely saved myself from writing up a post extolling Gronnblade(+) Cecilia.

Agreed and done.  I just know that if I had included skill inheritance more, it would be like 3-5x longer and 90% of it wouldn't apply to most people.  I think guides should cover the generalities and leave the specifics to guides about that certain character. 

I've never gotten Gronnblade(+) on Cecilia so I can't comment on it personally, but I've always been interested.  It would just mean spending 20k feathers on someone whose not a cavalry unit (and one who is, 40k feathers total for just her weapon skill) which I'm not prepared to do because I'd rather upgrade another Reinhardt ATM.  I certainty plan on it in the future.  Otherwise, I'm kind of hoping for more green cavalry units to come in the future.

I discussed skill inheritance briefly here and there but was avoiding big changes to units because that complicates things and is really only for really advanced players. 

Edited by Lushen

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Tbh just Gronnblade is worth playing with, and will stomp most foes. I did a couple Gunter/Ursula/Jagen/Cecilia pilot runs in the arena a couple weeks back, and it was pretty fun (granted they're all 4*, for what that's worth). If you're not running Gunter, it could provide some additional color coverage and little more reach. Alternatively, I'd imagine that with Fortify Cavalry, her standard Gronnraven + Triangle Adept would actually make her pretty tanky vs Colorless & Blue, which would provide EP options.

But enough about that...I can definitely appreciate general cavalry guidelines, and from the minimal/no inheritance standpoint, it looks pretty solid to me, nice work! It's really a pity there aren't more inheritance cav guides floating around (I've only really seen one or two, but then I might just be blind)...it might be helpful to maybe link some stuff at the end of the post in a "when you're ready, look at these" way, idk.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Thing is, the OP mentions a lot of rare 5 star units that many of us don't have. I don't have any of the mentioned characters, the cavs I have are Frederick, Stahl, Abel, Bunny Xander, and Jagen. So it's not entirely that helpful, I'm afraid. But you seem to have put a lot of effort into it, so I commend you for that.

Edited by Anacybele

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
3 minutes ago, Anacybele said:

Thing is, the OP mentions a lot of rare 5 star units that many of us don't have. I don't have any of the mentioned characters, the cavs I have are Frederick, Stahl, Abel, Bunny Xander, and Jagen. So it's not entirely that helpful, I'm afraid. But you seem to have put a lot of effort into it, so I commend you for that.

Yea, I totally get that.  It crossed my mind a lot while I was writing it.  That's why it's handled a bit better in the cliff notes.  There is a alternate team comp listed that, for you, would look like:
Bunny!Xander
Cecilia (free)
etc.

Or if you have Ursla, which I feel like you should unless this is a new account, you can do the poor man's team comp:
Cain/Eliwood (not hard to get)
Ursla
etc.

Also, are you the one that has and loves a 5* Fredrick?  If so, he would be great in either as a green unit.  I can't recommend 5*ing him from a competitive standpoint as a key member but as a nonkey member he is great since he's a green unit.

I would also throw Bunny!Xander in for the poor man's team comp, he's really good.

The issue with the units you listed is all but two are blue physical units.  The two are green physical units.  Unless you have Ursla, or can get a Cecilia (in which case definitely look at LordFrigid's post), you're screwed.  It's never a good idea to make a team out of all magical or all physical units.  I don't think cavalry teams are for everyone, especially right now.  You kind of do need those units.  Cecilia is the only F2P option if you don't have Ursla.  Which leads back into LordFrigid's post, I should defenitly add more to Cecilia. I also don't think Pegasus Knight teams are viable without a Spring Camilla and armored teams are never viable.  When I say viable, I don't mean whether it can be done or not but whether it's going to be able to handle every situation.

In retrospect I should have written the main discussion to accommodate F2P members (I'm F2P but rerolled on the major cavalry focus).  All the information is there, but its essentially listed as:
1.  You need these unis
2.  If you don't have that unit, you can use these instead
3.  Repeat 2

When I'm less tired, I'll certainty go a little more in depth on her.  Perhaps make a f2p discussion.  I won't be doing a skill inheritance discussion, because I think a whale needs to do that.  I simply will never have enough 5*s to skill inherit like crazy.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
4 minutes ago, Lushen said:

Yea, I totally get that.  It crossed my mind a lot while I was writing it.  That's why it's handled a bit better in the cliff notes.  There is a alternate team comp listed that, for you, would look like:
Bunny!Xander
Cecilia (free)
etc.

Or if you have Ursla, which I feel like you should unless this is a new account, you can do the poor man's team comp:
Cain/Eliwood (not hard to get)
Ursla
etc.

Also, are you the one that has and loves a 5* Fredrick?  If so, he would be great in either as a green unit.  I can't recommend 5*ing him from a competitive standpoint as a key member but as a nonkey member he is great since he's a green unit.

I would also throw Bunny!Xander in for the poor man's team comp, he's really good.

The issue with the units you listed is all but two are blue physical units.  The two are green physical units.  Unless you have Ursla, or can get a Cecilia (in which case definitely look at LordFrigid's post), you're screwed.  It's never a good idea to make a team out of all magical or all physical units.  I don't think cavalry teams are for everyone, especially right now.  You kind of do need those units.  Cecilia is the only F2P option if you don't have Ursla.  Which leads back into LordFrigid's post, I should defenitly add more to Cecilia. I also don't think Pegasus Knight teams are viable without a Spring Camilla and armored teams are never viable.  When I say viable, I don't mean whether it can be done or not but whether it's going to be able to handle every situation.

In retrospect I should have written the main discussion to accommodate F2P members (I'm F2P but rerolled on the major cavalry focus).  All the information is there, but its essentially listed as:
1.  You need these unis
2.  If you don't have that unit, you can use these instead
3.  Repeat 2

When I'm less tired, I'll certainty go a little more in depth on her.  Perhaps make a f2p discussion.  I won't be doing a skill inheritance discussion, because I think a whale needs to do that.  I simply will never have enough 5*s to skill inherit like crazy.

I said I don't have Eliwood or Ursula since I said I have no one mentioned in your post. Don't have Cain. Don't have Cecilia either and I don't bother with those 2 star characters unless it's someone I like.

Yes, I'm the one with a 5 star Frederick since he's one of my favorite characters. I personally think he's pretty great and would definitely recommend 5 starring him.

Bunny Xander doesn't have enough fire power for my liking. I'd rather have someone who can hit harder.

Edited by Anacybele

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
12 minutes ago, Anacybele said:

I said I don't have Eliwood or Ursula. Don't have Cain. Don't have Cecilia either and I don't bother with those 2 star characters unless it's someone I like.

Yes, I'm the one with a 5 star Frederick since he's one of my favorite characters. I personally think he's pretty great and would definitely recommend 5 starring him.

Bunny Xander doesn't have enough fire power for my liking. I'd rather have someone who can hit harder.

Fury 3 is amazing on Xander.  Turns him into a mini blue version of Eldigan.  And with the proper buffs, he can double almost anything and have high enough attack to kill most things.  I guess what I'm saying is he's more useful in a cavalry team than on a normal one.  However, plenty of other blue units can do what he does which is why I never refer to him as a key unit. 

I would say hold off on a cavalry team for now, then.  To put it simply, you can't really make a team out of all physical units so if you don't wish to train Cecilia up it's not going to be pleasant.  Even Leo wouldn't really help you.  I had him on my last account and I was having trouble making a cavalry team.  The team I have now just destroys everything without much effort.  If you're really interested in a cavalry team (Fredrick would love it), keep your eyes pealed for magic focus cavalry units in the future :p, it will catapult you into the meta. 

EDIT:  Also I hope I didn't insult Fredick's usefulness.  Anyone can be a good 5* including him.  He just doesn't replace Eldigan because his low speed means he can't go full-on-tank-mode.  <edit2> Though, actually speed buffs should help him tank quite well, he just wouldn't be doubling people without serious help.  <edit 3> actually nevermind he could, you'd just have to teach him fury 3...Only issue is you'd have to use Leo because the blue units behind him won't be able to help him kill green units if he needs backup.  Or have a slot 3 that can help out.

EDIT 4:  I might actually rewrite this after I get some feedback and put it in a pdf...Reading your replies really helps me gather new ideas and make new compositions.

Edited by Lushen

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Thanks for this! I've always thought a full cavalry team will be useful. I very much agree with your analysis. Personally, I use Eldigan(Oh God he is monstrous with Sol and Renewal), Reinhardt(Super love this guy), Frederick (inherited Hone Cavalry from Gunter), and Eliwood. Eldigan and Reinhardt pretty much do the killing while Freddy and Eliwood do the tanking and buffing. Gotta admit, as much as I love Eliwood, his stats are kind of underwhelming (but maybe it's because he is a 4☆ so I dont have access to Durandal). So in the future, I plan to replace him with someone like Xander or Camus (I heard Camus has godly skills). 

Also, I don't really use a healer since, in my opinion, full cavalry is specialized in rushing the opponent and kind of baiting as well. But yes, I think healers will do you good... but is more desirable in long battles. 

Spoiler

I just really like the mechanics of trotting 3 tiles and rushing the opponent. Freedom!

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.

Sign in to follow this  

  • Recently Browsing   0 members

    No registered users viewing this page.

×
×
  • Create New...