Can the RNG of FE6 be considered a bug or a design flaw?

[Harvey]

Right now on my second playthrough of FE6, the hit rates are atrocious in this game. But I wonder if this is a bug or an actual design flaw in this game...idk, what do you think?

 

[Zapp Branniglenn]

Which hit rates are you referring to? It's really a very similar system to 7 and 8. This is the first game to debut True Hit, but that's no bug. 

[Harvey]

38 minutes ago, Gustavos said:

Which hit rates are you referring to? It's really a very similar system to 7 and 8. This is the first game to debut True Hit, but that's no bug. 

I'm talking about hit rates in all of the weapons. 

I don't know, to me, its more of a bug than it is of a design flaw since the hit rates are bonkers....an enemy dodging 70% of steel sword?

The RNG is what makes Fire Emblem special so I can't really say that its a design flaw in this..atleast to me.

 

[Punished Dayni]

......

RNG being RNG, combined with enemies having luck and the hit rates on weapons being a bit imbalanced (more than a bit for axes).

I'd consider the weapon hit rates to be poorly balanced, but that's about it.

[The Geek]

Well, in FE6 it isn't the RNG that's the problem so much as the fact that most weapons have terrible hit rates, making the player more susceptible to getting RNG screwed in combat.  This isn't as much of a problem in other games that use single RNs as in those games weapons actually have decent hit rates.

[Magical Glace]

The RNG in FE6 is not bugged, if it says it can happen, it can happen.  

IT'S RANDOM.  

11 minutes ago, The Geek said:

Well, in FE6 it isn't the RNG that's the problem so much as the fact that most weapons have terrible hit rates, making the player more susceptible to getting RNG screwed in combat.  This isn't as much of a problem in other games that use single RNs as in those games weapons actually have decent hit rates.

FE6 uses two RN's, not one, for hitting an enemy.

Edited May 14, 2017 by Glaceon Mage

[Refa]

The only bugged thing about the RNG is that it goes from 0-100 instead of 0-99.

[Harvey]

2 hours ago, Glaceon Mage said:

The RNG in FE6 is not bugged, if it says it can happen, it can happen.  

IT'S RANDOM.  

FE6 uses two RN's, not one, for hitting an enemy.

Yeah I get that its random...but playing it right now, the rng tends to not do in my favour even if the hit rate indicates that I have a chance of doing. 

There are many times that I just get frustrated that the hit rate keeps lying to me all the time. I get that the RNG is the whole point of Fire Emblem but this one is a bit exaggerating it.

Edited May 14, 2017 by Harvey

[Magical Glace]

Just now, Harvey said:

Yeah I get that its random...but playing it right now, the rng tends to not do in my favour even if the hit rate indicates that I have a chance of doing. 

There are many times that I just get frustrated that the hit rate keeps lying to me all the time. I get that the RNG is the whole point of Fire Emblem but this one is a bit exaggerating it.

That doesn't make it a bug, it just means you're unlucky.  If it's not 0% or 100%, then a hit/miss is not a guarantee. 

If the displayed hit is above 50, the true hit is higher than the displayed hit, if it's below 50, true hit is lower than displayed hit.  SF has a chart of it all.

[Harvey]

4 minutes ago, Glaceon Mage said:

That doesn't make it a bug, it just means you're unlucky.  If it's not 0% or 100%, then a hit/miss is not a guarantee. 

If the displayed hit is above 50, the true hit is higher than the displayed hit, if it's below 50, true hit is lower than displayed hit.  SF has a chart of it all.

Where did I even mention that its a bug?

Also, you can't simply deny that this game has a lot of hit rate issues particularly the axes. I swear, there are times that I have a good chance to hit the enemy and yet it just ends up not doing in my favour. How can 90% of bolting be a miss?

 

 

[Magical Glace]

2 minutes ago, Harvey said:

Where did I even mention that its a bug?

The title of the thread?

Spoiler

2 minutes ago, Harvey said:

Also, you can't simply deny that this game has a lot of hit rate issues particularly the axes.

I'm not denying Axe hit rates are low.

2 minutes ago, Harvey said:

I swear, there are times that I have a good chance to hit the enemy and yet it just ends up not doing in my favour. How can 90% of bolting be a miss?

It's random.  That's how.  It's not a bug or a flaw in the game, you're just unlucky.

Edited May 14, 2017 by Glaceon Mage

[Rezzy]

It's more just low hit rates across the boards than anything that could be considered a bug.  As a result Swords are higher valued than in most games, and Axes lower.

[Harvey]

Just now, Glaceon Mage said:

The title of the thread?

I asked what YOU think about it? A bug or a DESIGN flaw?

34 minutes ago, Glaceon Mage said:

I'm not denying Axe hit rates are low.

And yet you keep saying that I am unlucky if an obvious hit rate seems to be a miss.

34 minutes ago, Glaceon Mage said:

It's random.  That's how.  It's not a bug or a flaw in the game, you're just unlucky.

Maybe so but lying like that seems to insult the player more than the unit if you ask me.

 

[Magical Glace]

34 minutes ago, Harvey said:

I asked what YOU think about it? A bug or a DESIGN flaw?

And yet you keep saying that I am unlucky if an obvious hit rate seems to be a miss.

Maybe so but lying like that seems to insult the player more than the unit if you ask me.

If a 90% displayed/98.10% true misses (to use your example with the Bolting), it's just bad luck.  It is NOT impossible for that to miss, so if you hit that 1.9%, well, too bad for you I guess.  But it's not the game's fault.

I never denied that axes have low hit rates, please point out where I did.  Only said that complaining that a high hit rate misses is basically blaming the game for something nobody has any control over.

Random means random.  That's literally all I'm saying.  

Edited May 14, 2017 by Glaceon Mage

[Lord Tullus]

Guys, FE 6 RNG is like this:  2 25% chances, or 3 25% chances.  Which will hit more often? two chances or three?  Obviously the 3 chances.  There are more times that a low hit rate can hit.   Probability isn't always in favor of the player.   If you increase that 3 to 4, 6, or even 10, the probability of a hit landing will be much higher, even when random.  If it was fixed, 25% would hit 1/4 of the time.  But since it's random, it may hit 1/4 of the time.  With FE 6's low hit rates and high avoid rates, the accuracy is much more screwy, and leads to poor outcomes, regardless of the 2 RN system.   It feels like the RNG of the older games, but it isn't.

[ChibiToastExplosion]

The game's not bugged, it just hates you as much as you hate it.

Stop playing if the only outcome is to make 1,000 topics complaining about it - especially on things that have been proven 1,000 times.

AKA 6 uses the same RNG as 7.

[Harvey]

36 minutes ago, ChibiToastExplosion said:

The game's not bugged, it just hates you as much as you hate it.

Stop playing if the only outcome is to make 1,000 topics complaining about it - especially on things that have been proven 1,000 times.

AKA 6 uses the same RNG as 7.

I'm not criticising the game or even bashing the game here. I'm asking YOU guys what YOU think about the RNG in this game, that's it. So in this case, its not a bug to you, then fine so be it. To me, it seems like a bit of a design flaw because its giving false hope to the player like that to begin with that's it.

If I was really bashing about the game, then I'd done so in the title of the thread in the first place.

Actually, I'm really liking it playing it again to be honest here. Yeah my first playthrough is frustrating but even though its still frustrating, I'm liking it better than I did before whether you believe it or not.

 

[shadowofchaos]

11 minutes ago, Harvey said:

If I was really bashing about the game, then I'd done so in the title of the thread in the first place.

The title of your thread implies bad things already about the RNG despite it being exactly the same as FE7 and FE8.

The hit rates of the weapons themselves are the flaw. Especially Axes. It's the same system as FE7 or FE8, but they were able to tweak weapon parameters to have higher hit rates in the later iterations because they learned from their mistakes.

[X-Naut]

2 hours ago, Refa said:

The only bugged thing about the RNG is that it goes from 0-100 instead of 0-99.

This is the only aspect that can be considered buggy. Otherwise, I don't consider the RNG to be either; it's not responsible for your constant bad luck, it's the things that it works off of (weapon hit rates, the hit/avoid formulas, and terrain bonuses) that cause problems. Even then, I can't really call them a design flaw as much as I can call it poorly tested, or possibly even designed for an audience that appreciates unreliability.

[Integrity]

i don't see two sides to the question, 2rn was absolutely a design flaw

[-Cynthia-]

While people do find the low hit rates to be an annoyance, they did serve the purpose of giving swords (and bows as a range option) a niche that they lack in 7/8/9/10. Those games are pretty much dominated by axes, particularly hand axes, because they lack any noticeable downside. 

[Harvey]

1 hour ago, shadowofchaos said:

The title of your thread implies bad things already about the RNG despite it being exactly the same as FE7 and FE8.

The reason why its so is because people complain a whole lot of the RNG in this game whether its a good or a bad thing, I didn't mean it like that as I was just curious about how it ended up being such a main problem for the game.

 

[Jedi]

30 minutes ago, Harvey said:

The reason why its so is because people complain a whole lot of the RNG in this game whether its a good or a bad thing, I didn't mean it like that as I was just curious about how it ended up being such a main problem for the game.

Because people like to whine, and thats about it.

[Dr. Tarrasque]

...

This is so stupid.

It's the same RNG as in FE7, the difference is enemies have better stats relative to FE7, enemies have points in their LUCK stat and HIT rate numbers are lower on many weapons.

People complain about it because unpleasant outcomes are more prevalent in this game due to aforementioned factors. People will always look to blame and insist that there's more to their misfortune than what's already been said and established. Simply put: FE6's numbers are not as much in favor of the player as they are in FE7 and FE8. Simple as that.

[ChibiToastExplosion]

2 hours ago, Jedi said:

Because people like to whine, and thats about it.

Truer words have never been spoken. This thread was made by their king.