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Let's Play Tactics Ogre: the Knights of Lodis


Parrhesia
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What are we doing here?  

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  1. 1. The bearer asks: "Bear which burden?"

  2. 2. The wanderer asks: "Walk which path?"

  3. 3. The builder asks: "Design which plan?"

  4. 4. The sage asks: "Swear which oath?"

  5. 5. The leader asks: "Share which vision?"



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Update 7
"I don't think it's good for you to be so caught up in yourself."

Spoiler

 

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Ouro 8

"Allos, you're better than this."

I've always known this was true, but it was different hearing it from the boss' mouth. I swallowed, and looked him in the eye. I wasn't going to lie to him, to pretend I wanted to be on this errand on a garbage island, but at least it was... somewhere. My first march under a Felis banner. I couldn't help but think of how proud my family would be - after all, as far as they knew, I was just another infantryman! Lost in the crowd!

"I know," I told him. And the boss smiled and handed me a bow and told me to pick on Alberich in the next training session.

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It changed my life.

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And in the aftermath, I embraced my new destiny. My new bow. My new hat. It felt like fate.

And then Alphonse came up to me in private and politely advised me to 'try again'.

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I am still contemplating his meaning on the road south - we're to head to Scabellum, to ensure our new spellcasters have spells to cast (Deneb tugged on Alphonse's sleeve until he acquiesced). It seems I'm not the only one to re-evaluate my path, as Sorrell has followed Alberich into pacifism. Deneb has ditched her hat.

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For now, I'll have to set my book down. Seems there's some commotion on the road.

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Blue faeries good, purple faeries bad.

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Glycinia is decked out in some decent midgame gear, but she's a faerie, and thus pathetic at fighting.

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Theirs are no exception, of course.

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This is also our introduction to gremlins! Gremlins are also hot garbage.

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Sadly there's not really a good frame to capture magekills. I'll settle on one eventually. In any case, the enemy is now level 7. That's a significant advantage, or would be if they were dross classes. Fortunately, TO's levelling curve is... very heavily weighted. You get one experience from hitting an opponent even one level beneath you, and you get huge jackpots for hitting higher-leveled guys.

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The map can be summarised by the fact that the faerie above got the Sniper emblem over the course of it.

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Glycinia is barely scratched by the non-griffons and doesn't even bother to fire back until like turn 7. I don't think mine even hit once.

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And I might be being harsh but I sort of hate Glycinia's face.

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Well, as funny as it is to kick her out...

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Wow, I.
I actually like her a lot more now lmao

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But yeah we'll sign her up. Hey, free glass pumpkin!

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She tells us her sister's called Lubina and, well, the scene ends here. Let's take a look at her gear! The Ice Chain, now on Alphonse, is just good armour. The Dragon Gem lets you handle dragons as if you were a tamer - again, don't ask me for specifics, but they'll fight better. The Glass Pumpkin is an accessory that makes you into a tank! But there's one issue.

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Note Ivanna's movement. Note, in fact, the decimal point there. Alphonse - also a knight - has 5.3. You know how most SRPGs like, just have movement as 'class base, plus a bit more if they have special boots or whatever'? Not KoL. Sure, every class still has a base movement value, but it's adjusted upwards by agility and, here's the kicker, down by equipment weight. And the glass pumpkin weighs about as much as most moons, kicking Ivanna's movement down from 4.7 to 4.0. Technically harmless for her (they're always rounded down), but it would chip an entire point off, say, one of the ninjas, or Alphonse. Single-handedly. Anyway, next time, the actual plot advances. Stay tuned.

KILL COUNTER
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Not a mandatory mission, but a story mission regardless. I'll say it counts.

 

 

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I don't know, I thought the Fairies were okay if for no other reason than that ability they learn that lets other people move again. I concede that's not quite as useful in TO as it would be in Fire Emblem, but it's something.

Spoiler

Plus that thing the two special ones can do.

 

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They might learn it eventually but they're a complete liability now. The thing under the spoiler will be showcased, but it's not much to get excited over, either.

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oh wow a fairy use her for me please i love her so much already she is cute and i love thank you parrhesia for you using her : ) you have no choice : )

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It's not that I trust Cybil. It's that I distrust everyone else more.  If she's going against the jerk that imprisoned Alphonse, that's enough to follow her.

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1 hour ago, epilepsyduck said:

I don't know, I thought the Fairies were okay if for no other reason than that ability they learn that lets other people move again. I concede that's not quite as useful in TO as it would be in Fire Emblem, but it's something.

Huh, they could do that? Never found out way back, hah.

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Glycina and Lubina are miles above every other fairies (they even have better growths), but that doesn't change the fact they are still fairies... They can have some uses, but they are far too frail...

 

 

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Update 8
"You infuriate me!!!"

Spoiler

 

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To Urodela.

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Almost... too quiet?

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No, not quite.

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Yeah, Urodela isn't fancy. We come down expecting trouble in the shape of a bunch of Rananculus goons - we find it.

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Like I seriously hope

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you weren't expecting nuance here,

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since there ain't none.

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PSYCHE.

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haha alright cybil.

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Sitri here is kind of a beast. He has a darkness support spell which has a chance to sleep people, and hell, that's preferable to if he starts hitting you with his insanely sick katana. The Matsukaze is The earlygame weapon.

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His support is pretty tough. Five ninjas! and a witch technically. Witches are offensive support casters. Does that sound like a fine enough niche to you? Witches are bad.

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They obligingly clunk into our defensive line.

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We kill this guy and heal up the battered Flauros-

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- oh, and for picking that guy's lootbag up, Allos gets the Embodiment of Desires emblem. This apparently makes him find better treasure.

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Sitri gets stuck in. I'd like to finish him now, but it's Defeat Leader, and I'd like the experience and gear, thank you very much.

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Cybil finally decides to help. Guest AI tends to be avoidant when it can't have an immediate effect, which for mages usually means 'spending the first couple of turns running away'.

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Allegedly there is a guy in this tile, but fuck if I can see. He's in the space behind Lechies' back.

Deneb drops a rock on him and he explodes.

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witches dot png

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oh god

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With the rains, the water level rises gradually. Doesn't really change this map at all, but it's a thing that happens that's important to keep track of.

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Rocks fall, Kilik dies.

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The witch follows suit. Here, I have compiled a list of her achievements for your perusal;

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And then one of the crossbowmen, for good measure.

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The survivor steals some consumable from the witch.

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Then I mysteriously decide I like the cut of her jib.

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This is why! I have no idea if she drops it or not, but, hell.

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Unfortunately it sort of means she can't be... healed.

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Sitri's done fighting. He'll just run away, chugging healing leaves, until Allos finally brings him down.

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yaaay

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Get. In.

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Unexpected friends pick a hell of a time to show up.

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Nice going, Ric.

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Here's the thing, though. Alphonse was never meant to be clued-in - he's just some squire in Ric's entourage.

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And, you know...

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Eventually we'll have to learn to stand on our own two feet.

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(Even if sometimes that means following someone else, if it's to honour a debt.)

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Alphonse isn't stepping back from this.

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Ric's dealing with it by not really dealing with it at all.

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Alphonse restates his case.

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Ric's ambitious, and his ambitions have always had a place for us. This mission was always just a stepping stone.

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It's not even the fact that there's Depth here - Alphonse is... well, he's got ambitions too. He wants to find his limits.

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Fucking everyone but us seems to these days.

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Ric's done being nice.

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He won't even let Alphonse start to explain before turning on Cybil directly.

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I think Filarhh is the big central God.

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Though He's usually just called God in this game.

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They both precede these lines with dramatic hair-flips.

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Girls, girls. You're both beautiful!

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If you're expecting some kind of choice here that I'm massaging over, there isn't.

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Alphonse needs this.

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You know I get Orson's deal is to be the stock stoic retainer archetype, but... you'd think he'd step in and stop Ric from severing with a hitherto loyal guy who just needs some space.

But no. They just walk off. And that, for tonight, is a wrap.

KILL COUNTER
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Absolute final chance for democracy.

 

 

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Update 9
"You outsiders think you can solve everything with your money and your logic!"

Spoiler

 

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Welcome to this tiny garbage shack.

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Cybil's saying words, sure, but is that really on the top of Alphonse's mind right now?

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yesss i managed to capture a lightningshot

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Well, he is fifteen, Cybil.

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Ogre Battle loves this shit. The original had some kind of moral gauge that I don't know at all, anyone who's played March of the Black Queen feel free to effort post about it.

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Ogre Battle 64 wasn't about what you did, it was about how you did it, and the person you were. Through somewhat clunky and opaque game mechanics, you could be venerated as a heroic liberator, just sort of go down in history as one of the rebels, or alternatively do so much war crime that as soon as the war is over the victors want nothing to do with you and banish you. Hell, if you fail spectacularly enough, there's even a special bad ending map where the heroes of the last game try to kill you!

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Tactics Ogre: LUCT has three paths - Law, Neutral and Chaos. Without going into spoilers (do not go into spoilers, chat, I'm LPing that game next) there is One Big Law/Chaos Choice and, on Chaos route, the chance to make a compromise later on to wind up in Neutral. Somewhat hamfistedly, there is a guy set up as your rival who exists solely to take the different decision to you.

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Knights of Lodis has one Big Choice, too, and a lot of minor variations around that (mostly about whether or not you recruit and use a certain character, which we will be because it makes for a better story).

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As these lines REALLY WANT TO HAMMER HOME TO THE PLAYER, JESUS CHRIST, we are coming up to the Big Choice now.

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Oh hey, some innocent exposit-

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OKAY, GAME. I GET IT.

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Sh U t UP

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Thank God.

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All for the shaggy dog story here that Braids Boatsman is fucking worthless to us.

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This is the best line in the history of video games.

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... Cybil was angry?

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He turns to leave, then stops for one last thing - a favourite of this game's, I'm noticing.

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haha okay dude off you go.

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Here it is. The Big Choice. Are we for or against mermaid torture?

Combining results for canon route and trusting Cybil (even when they contradict), it seems like we're for.

PATH A (13): Acacia, MK404, Epilepsy, Rothene, Fleet, Vaximillian, Eclipse, Reality, Omegaprism, Cross, Tamanoir, Dollie, Vaximillian
PATH B (9): Dayni, Cross, Integrity, Euklyd, Ranger, Dandra, MK404, Efina, Fleet!

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Path B is my preferred route, personally. I'll outline the implications of this route as we go. Largely, the two paths trace one another's steps, but the actual events on the given maps vary.

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In broad strokes, Alphonse is disillusioned by Cybil's methods in general, and sets his own path. Ivanna becomes his primary confidant, and they talk for a while - about Ivanna, sure, but also about Alphonse's feelings towards Rictor. He underlines his desire to honour his word to Cybil by doing what he can to get the spear, and sets off for the Temple of Sufrir. This sets us up to maybe even reunite with Rictor later along the way, when the heated words heal a bit, and in the short term, he sends Orson to watch over us.

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The choice isn't really about what we do. It's about how Alphonse feels, how strong his convictions are. Path A - the canon path - sets up an Alphonse subservient to Cybil's will, and one whose morality is more... mutable, in general.

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We're still going out to ruminate with Ivanna in the rain, though.

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In the short-term, it sets us up for a different route - the direct route.

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Ivanna seems a bit more distant in this conversation than in the Path B version - she doesn't speak as much about herself, and doesn't bring up Rictor.

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We're just kicked out onto the world map, to head straight west.

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So... anyone having buyer's remorse?

 

 

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I'm okay with mermaid torture as long as it doesn't become like Dwarf Fortress and the dev Fucks Us Up

Edit: mermaids bone were worth a bunch of money (6000!) but then there was a patch i think and it stopped working so all the genociding against the merpersons were worthless woops.

Edited by Dollie
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Well this is unsettling. Not sure how I feel about the 'big choice' being both hamfistedly obvious and, at the same time, quite difficult to see coming. I dunno, I feel like the choices given don't feel like the big one. Maybe it's because I can easily interperet that big conversation about choice as "the choice is coming much later" rather than "it's going to happen now in this cutscene. Get ready". But I think that's just a personal issue.

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1 hour ago, Dandragon said:

Well this is unsettling. Not sure how I feel about the 'big choice' being both hamfistedly obvious and, at the same time, quite difficult to see coming. I dunno, I feel like the choices given don't feel like the big one. Maybe it's because I can easily interperet that big conversation about choice as "the choice is coming much later" rather than "it's going to happen now in this cutscene. Get ready". But I think that's just a personal issue.

Yeah, that's more or less how I felt about it too. The fact we're not facing the mermaid directly doesn't makes it seems that important right now...

We get the strongest characters on route A, so I have no regrets. 

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1 hour ago, Dandragon said:

Well this is unsettling. Not sure how I feel about the 'big choice' being both hamfistedly obvious and, at the same time, quite difficult to see coming. I dunno, I feel like the choices given don't feel like the big one. Maybe it's because I can easily interperet that big conversation about choice as "the choice is coming much later" rather than "it's going to happen now in this cutscene. Get ready". But I think that's just a personal issue.

there's tons of words telling you that the decision is important instead of, for instance, making the decision about something important

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7 hours ago, Integrity said:

there's tons of words telling you that the decision is important instead of, for instance, making the decision about something important

I understand that but thats not what i mean. What im saying is that those words could be interpreted as warning you about a decision later down the line instead of the one in front you. Granted, thats just the perspective of someone who didn't make it as far, so...

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Update 10
To Florida

Spoiler

 

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So, you like war crimes, huh?

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Well, there's no dialogue here. Pans to Alphonse, pans down to these schmucks, pans back to Alphonse and now we can deploy.

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Dragons are a thing, as usual. They start out differentiated by colour (corresponding to element), then upgrade depending on alignment.

And on this map, they can only move two spaces apiece.

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Yeah, that's pretty much it.

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They fling themselves forward.

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It becomes quickly apparent that our guys struggle to hurt them and I really shouldn't've skimped on bringing my nerds to the party. On the bright side, I decided to gif the Hawkman hammer flourish. In a nice touch, they're all unique - though they aren't all interesting. Archers just spend like an extra frame on their shot, for instance.

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Spears work properly in TO and hit two squares.

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Aaand the fight's turned a bit dicey.

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Still, we'll pull back from the dragons, kill this guy, just play hit-and-run. That's the strengths of this lineup, just leaning on mobility and ranged att-

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...

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This is getting annoying.

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While looking through the dragons, I notice... this.

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Aaand they're through the line. That hawkman hit Alberich for 82, by the way.

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Alphonse is our one tank, so we try and have him hold the line. We finish another hawkman, almost kill the last.

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Alphonse holds the line against the two dragons, but he needs both heals next turn. Both faeries have Sniper by now. That hawkman, helpfully, submerges himself to cripple his own ability to fight back.

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Okay! There we go.

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Now we can just bully the dragons from afar, and continue to regret not bringing a nerd.

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Anyway, we just mop up as soon as their line breaks.

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Hey, look what they dropped!

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Anyway Alphonse is just kind of running about and then boom.

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Alphonse is a little suspicious and Shiven's hilariously a bit offended by it.

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Alphonse turning him away is a matter of pride - he sees it as Cybil lacking faith in him getting the job done.

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Saying yes is really boring, though.

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So we get Shiven as our reward! His stats are... noticeably a bit worse than Tanya's, but whatever. Since people have talked about some guys showing up worse than generics, and this happening, I assume that fortunes slightly affect growths, and 'Overconfidence' isn't exactly a great one to have. He does, however, come with a really good katana.

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Disappointingly, the Dragon Eyes don't actually seem to turn you into a dragon. Ah, well.

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Meanwhile? Training. It's become apparent we need more muscle, and so more muscle we shall have.

KILL COUNTER
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glad that's over with

 

 

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I can't get over the fact his surname is Verde. Verde... that's just green, plain and simple, hehehehe... then again...

Also, I think you need the full set of equipment for that to work. Description is misleading, yes.

Edited by Acacia Sgt
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Update 11
Interlude: Deneb, the ordinary human

Spoiler

 

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Now, witches are bad. I've told the thread this before. A witch can't really fight, usually misses her statuses, doesn't even really have good stats... et cetera.

But a witch...

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... and The Witch...

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Well, you know how the saying goes.

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The extremely common saying that real people say, all the time.

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THE witch has Temptation, a charming spell, as her bread-and-butter status.

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Deneb is also one of very few characters in the game who can't be reclassed - even guys like Ivanna and Shiven (and Orson) can be shunted around at will.

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Well, that was a fun easter egg, wasn't it? Now let's arbitrarily go to Scabellum to shop.

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And sure, I will sell the Glass Pumpkin to this very ordinary shop.

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Sure!

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And, hey, more unique dialogue in this very ordinary store. (We do not actually do this.)

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Well might you be asking why the Octopus, which is as far as the game guide tells me (and, hell, intuition sure does) is very strong and slow and dumb, is here shown very weak and slow but clever. I don't know why. I checked actual ordinary humans and they have the right stats, so it's probably not just a Deneb thing.

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Okay, okay, so here's the real story.

As you've probably worked out - either by following the series, or just kind of figuring out that Deneb is kind of a weird name - Deneb is a special character. In fact, she's kind of like Ogre Battle's Anna. She usually cameos in each given game, usually as a secret shop kind of person, portrayed as a pumpkin-loving witch flirt.

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In KoL she doesn't make a conventional appearance - she's an easter egg. Hire a female soldier (she may have to be chaotic and/or fire elemental, she may not - she definitely can't be lawful, though, since witches can't be), get her to the witch class and, boom, all this happens. She's an endgame-quality mage... when we get endgame quality spells, anyway. She can't actually use basic attack magic, which is a little annoying, but we'll cope. Charm is really good, and I don't even think any other unit in the game can inflict it.

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As another upshot, the store in Scabellum just becomes Deneb's personal store. As we saw earlier, she can sell glass pumpkins like the ones Glycinia came with - and we want to, as well. 2000 Goth is a shitton at this stage. There's also Another reason - I'm not sure if we'll see the payoff or not. Regular shops won't buy glass pumpkins, in any case.

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Also, unique gear! You might think that the sweets gear is a joke set.

It isn't.

We'll get back to it later. It's a bit pricey for now, and I've half a suspicion it might get moreso with time.

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As for what to do with Deneb, we've stuck her in the standard nerd outfit. She's slow, as all nerds are. She's dual-wielding the basic staff because for some reason the basic staff gives +10 intelligence so all of your nerds should be dual-wielding them. This does, admittedly, remove her punch utility so on second thoughts I'm actually going to remove them but whatever, the clerics and wizard have them in any case.

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Tactics Ogre is one of those games where the undead revive incessantly. Faith is your 'no, stop that' button.

Anyway, interlude over - time to get back to the Good Shi-

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oh for fuck's sake

 

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