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Lord_Grima

Echoes - Awakening Connections

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After beating Echoes, I found that a lot of things in Awakening make more sense now, or now I can see things in Awakening differently. I did not play Gaiden or know the story of it. If you didn't know, Archanea and Valentia eventually become the Halidom of Ylisse and the Continent of Valm. 

 

Most of it is seeing a lot of map locations from Awakening and realizing what was there in the past. One of them is the Duma Gate. In Awakening this is where you recruit Inigo, so seeing it here in Echoes and what it was originally was nice. Another "ah-ha" moment was knowing how the Mila Tree in Awakening got its namesake, in honor of the dragon Mila.

There were a lot of neat connections, so what were some of your favorites?

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The explanation of Grima's backstory and the history of Thabes was amazing. Also the added touch of playing "Forbidden Sanctuary" as Grima's map theme is just fricken beautiful.

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The tree wasnt named after Mila, the tree grew from her corpse. Celica at one point in the game makes the remark that great trees of unparalleled size grow from the dead bodies of divine dragons. So the Mila Tree is quite literally just Mila dying and reincarnating as a massive tree. 

Also aside from Sages Hamlet and the Dumas Gate there is also the Tower of Thabes which is located in the ruined city of Thabes next to the temple where Gharnef teleports you in your battle to retrieve Falchion in Shadow Dragon, also the risen are explained in the Tower and the ruins of time where you recruit Morgan is also in the ruined city of Thabes. Not only that but its believed that the Dragons Gate in Fire Emblem Rekka no Ken leads to the ruins of time where you recruit Morgan in Awakening. 

And if you want to get into crazy territory theres a theory that Robin is the Avatar from Rekka no Ken and after defeating Grima he ends up on the other side of the Dragons Gate in the field where Lyn finds him before somehow returning to Ylisse. 

Edited by RennacIsUnderrated

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To add to that, the bit about trees growing from dragon corpses was planned back in Awakening or Fates. So they definitely put some thought about it.

I'm not properly awake enough to remember any other connections, but I thought it was cool how the Hexlock Shield is apparently a "lite" version of the Binding Shield from Mystery of the Emblem or the Fire Emblem in Awakening.

It's extremely hard to see, but the jewels on the Hexlock Shield are meant to be of similar origin to the gemstones on the Fire Emblem.

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22 minutes ago, Thane said:

Rudolf's new design which hints at his connection to Walhart.

Speaking of which. Is it just me or is it odd we never learned the name of Alm's possible successor that changed the continent's name to Valm. Not that it would matter much since he wouldn't be playable but it would have been a nice little tidbit to know about.

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6 hours ago, VincentASM said:

To add to that, the bit about trees growing from dragon corpses was planned back in Awakening or Fates. So they definitely put some thought about it.

I'm not properly awake enough to remember any other connections, but I thought it was cool how the Hexlock Shield is apparently a "lite" version of the Binding Shield from Mystery of the Emblem or the Fire Emblem in Awakening.

It's extremely hard to see, but the jewels on the Hexlock Shield are meant to be of similar origin to the gemstones on the Fire Emblem.

You mean the Sage's Shield? That's the shield that is keeping Grima sealed away. It looks like a prototype Fire Emblem with only star orb in it.

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26 minutes ago, Thane said:

Rudolf's new design which hints at his connection to Walhart.

does it? the only similarity I see is that they're both Big and Red

it'd make sense but I don't really see it

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Just now, unique said:

does it? the only similarity I see is that they're both Big and Red

it'd make sense but I don't really see it

Big, red and long white hair. Naturally, this doesn't prove they're related or anything, but seeing as Walhart's goals are similar to Rudolf's, only more extreme, and he can be fought in the same place 2000 years later, I'd say the connection was very much intentional. 

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13 minutes ago, Thane said:

Big, red and long white hair. Naturally, this doesn't prove they're related or anything, but seeing as Walhart's goals are similar to Rudolf's, only more extreme, and he can be fought in the same place 2000 years later, I'd say the connection was very much intentional. 

...so that would actually make Walhart the Conqueror a direct descendant of Alm.

lolololololol Ghast is going to lose his shit. 

Edited by Shoblongoo

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24 minutes ago, RJWalker said:

You mean the Sage's Shield? That's the shield that is keeping Grima sealed away. It looks like a prototype Fire Emblem with only star orb in it.

Close, I do mean the shield that weakens magic. You can see the developers' notes in the limited edition artbook.

The Sage Shield does resemble a prototype Fire Emblem though.

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23 hours ago, RennacIsUnderrated said:

also the risen are explained in the Tower and the ruins of time where you recruit Morgan is also in the ruined city of Thabes.

SPECULATION:  Since Morgan appears in Thabes, do you think it's possible that Morgan was actually trying to go back further in time than any of the other children to stop Grima from even being created in the first? Though, this would probably conflict with Naga/Tiki's actions.

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4 minutes ago, PokéStarz said:

SPECULATION:  Since Morgan appears in Thabes, do you think it's possible that Morgan was actually trying to go back further in time than any of the other children to stop Grima from even being created in the first? Though, this would probably conflict with Naga/Tiki's actions.

Wow, I never even thought about this. Thats a really good point however it does state that Morgan isnt from Lucinas world and that theyre from a world where peace prospered. In other words Grima doesnt exist in Morgans world. So I think what its getting at is that Morgan is from the future of the world where Robin succesfully kills Grima aka the reality that the player sets in motion. But then that begs the question, why come back in time if Grima is dead? I personally love pairing Tiki and Robin together because then Morgan is a manakete and using the ruins of time/dragons gate makes a lot more sense.

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So just considering Grima's history, he would have been made in antiquity of Fire Emblem (so to speak) when Tabes was a flourishing civilisation and before the degradation set in (unrelated point I think humans were pretty primitive during this time so could Forneus actually be a dragon? You do fight a lot of normal feral dragons in the labyrinth). Then Forneus started going crazy from Grima's influence and they sealed them both with an OG Fire Emblem. Then Grima just sat there for a few centuries until Alm randomly wandered in, unsealed him and them promptly sealed him again using his Falchion. Then he remained sealed for another thousand years or so (really hitting the weights and eating his veggies in the meantime) until he broke free and Marth's descendant sealed him yet again. And then finally Validar and future Grima set him free only for him to be sealed (or ultimately destroyed) yet again.

Wow so Grima's life kind of sucks.

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I'm a bit annoyed that they de-epified Grima by making him the product of a mad scientist's work, just being artificially created with divine blood, instead of being directly of divine birth.

Wasn't there a backstory that he's the fusion of all earth dragons, or is that just a fan theory?

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1 minute ago, Night Zap said:

I'm a bit annoyed that they de-epified Grima by making him the product of a mad scientist's work, just being artificially created with divine blood, instead of being directly of divine birth.

Wasn't there a backstory that he's the fusion of all earth dragons, or is that just a fan theory?

i never really liked grima to begin with and i can't say this made me like him more, but I find the idea of one man's creation becoming something worshipped as a god a lot more interesting than simply another evil dragon

that was definitely just a fan theory, grima didn't really have a backstory if i'm remembering correctly. the idea probably came from the fact that grima is almost the exact same character as lopt. this gives him something that sets him apart much more.

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11 hours ago, unique said:

i never really liked grima to begin with and i can't say this made me like him more, but I find the idea of one man's creation becoming something worshipped as a god a lot more interesting than simply another evil dragon

that was definitely just a fan theory, grima didn't really have a backstory if i'm remembering correctly. the idea probably came from the fact that grima is almost the exact same character as lopt. this gives him something that sets him apart much more.

It was more to do with the Dragon's Table being located at the same place as all the sealed Earth Dragons.

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17 hours ago, unique said:

i never really liked grima to begin with and i can't say this made me like him more, but I find the idea of one man's creation becoming something worshipped as a god a lot more interesting than simply another evil dragon

that was definitely just a fan theory, grima didn't really have a backstory if i'm remembering correctly. the idea probably came from the fact that grima is almost the exact same character as lopt. this gives him something that sets him apart much more.

You have to think about it for a second. Humans are easily swayed by a higher power, whether it be another humans agreeable ideals, or a dragon that can promise power. I think the grimleal back then were a nomadic tribe traveling across plegia. Their travels across plegia eventually lead them to the dragon's table. With their lust and desires Grima saw this opportunity to take control. He easily swayed the nomadic grimleal and made them think they were destined to be lead by him. With him finally in control he blood bonded with the nomad's leader. Then, his plan quickly came into place...

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