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What exactly constitutes as a 'bad character' in Fire Emblem?


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When it comes to the writing and characterization of a character.  It's solely personal preference.  Everyone isn't going to like the same characters, of course, because we all enjoy different characters all for our own personal and different reasons.  Some people like certain tropes, some hate them, some love certain character quirks, some find them annoying.  It's overall based on preference.  For me, one-dimensional characters are boring unless they can somehow be written really well.  Otherwise, I like my characters to have flaws and even some psychological issues because I've studied, worked with, and am intrigued with that stuff.

As a unit, while it is also mostly personal preference, but stats and growths can also influence a person's view of a character.  Like others have said, Camilla is not super well received, but you can't deny the fact that as a fighter she's extremely capable.  But again, it's personal preference because some people may like characters that don't turn out to be really solid fighters.  Like Python since I feel like the minority that was blessed with a gnarly Python that wrecked shit while others say he misses everything he touches.

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There are two parts that make a bad character: gameplay and character.

A character may be awful stat wise, not being able to hit anything, being very fragile, etc, but they may have a very fleshed out backstory, personality, etc. If they fail at both, then that is a bad character.

Of course it comes down to opinions. One person may take joy in using a character who dies in one hit, but still love them due to their character, and vice versa for someone else.

Personally, I feel like the fans factor in to this as well. Very vocal and extreme fans often tarnish a character for me, unfortunately, and this causes me to look at the character's flaws more and be like...well you weren't as great as I remember you being...

This is why I find Ike and Cordelia to be bad characters.

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What makes a bad character? Characters who interfere with their OTP, according to certain people (like Geoffrey, Mia etc.). 

Anyway as for me, bad characters are characters who are carried by the plot let alone HAVE To be the ones who forward it and are formed around a lot of coincidences rather than their own character and decisions (see Ike). Also characters who are stalker abusive mothers that not just the characters in a game, but also actual real people let get away with it. Tharja and Camilla voted in the Top 10 FE Heroes poll as most popular female characters and IN the Top 5 by people. Characters like Nowi and Peri are also very problematic; and any characters who have disturbing realistic bad behaviours that aren't addressed by other characters or pointed out are NOT okay in my book. Do we as real people, just let stalkers, womanizers, abusive people etc. walk by? No. Then why the hell do people like Tharja and Camilla when they'd never let real people do that. Seriously; we're gonna keep getting characters like this if this isn't brought to attention to IntSys. 

Edited by Azzurohr
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What constitutes a bad character in anything? One that subjectively bore's people (and that goes for gameplay as well as narrative).

Edited by Jotari
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Strictly from a gameplay perspective: Base stats in accordance to join time is 95% of it.

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For example, Nyx in Fates.  Her main role is to be a damage dealer, what with her high Magic and Speed, but there are other characters who can perform her task just as well if not better.  Magic and Speed are literally her only noteworthy stats, with her Resistance being average at best and all of her other stats being complete garbage.  If anything, she makes a good mother for Forrest or Ophelia, who will have Magic and Speed equal to or better than hers on top of better supportive stats.

 

Nah. You're over-thinking it.

Nothing much wrong with Nyx's growth or stat spread. Growths have never really been that important anyway unless they're absurdly good or terrible. Anything in-between rarely matters.

Nyx's problem is base stats and that's pretty much it. If she had the speed to double at base and also a couple extra points of skill/magic, she'd probably be really good.

Growth momentum is more important than the actual growths. What I mean by that is that if a unit has good bases, then they are more likely to score kills on the basis on being good/useful in an efficient run. More kills = more EXP. More EXP = more levels and therefore more growth. If a unit with bad bases is taking 2 kills for every 4 kills a 'good' unit is getting, then the latter unit's growths are essentially doubled in the short term. Unless you happen to spoon feed kills to the former unit for the sake of it, which is just making your level of play worse.

I mean, if you take someone like Dorcas, he becomes substantially better with +2 base speed. But a +20% speed growth? Meh. You may think that's an exaggeration, but it isn't. Not in the context of FE7.

Edited by DLuna
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Obviously 'bad' character is pretty subjective, but anyway. For me, a bad character is a character I can't view as human (if they're meant to be human, of course!).

For example, it's pretty unbelievable that Setsuna in Fates would be SO clumsy and forgetful as to fall into every trap in existence, and to sit in them for literal days. It's also unbelievable that Arthur would be dogged by such excessively bad luck (or his son by excessively good luck). 

 

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For me, a bad character is someone who's not completely developed, even in some of the development is there. My biggest problem is if developers decide to focus on one particular trait and never develop anything else.

Since Camilla is already mentioned, I think one other example of this would be Peri. Her bloodlust is about the only thing that's developed in the game, with even the reasoning being something that most players probably wouldn't find. Not to mention that the bloodlust doesn't seem to have any realistic consequence (e.g. someone calls her out on it, Peri accidentally kills someone she isn't supposed to and actually feels remorse, she realizes she needs to get help but can't find it and simply resorts to what she knows). So she's only known by unrealistic bloodlust, which makes her a shallow character.

 

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To me, a bad character is where they are more trouble than they are worth on the field. Boah from Fire Emblem (and Shadow Dragon) is a good example because of his abysmal growths. Matthis wasn't much better, because of his growths being consistently terrible in every game he's been in, and his AI tending to kill Lena.

Dorcas was already mentioned because of his poor growths, and a character with poor or inappropriate growths, i.e. a magic user with strength can easily be a deal-breaker for me.

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I only consider a "bad character" from the gameplay aspect:

  • joining time
  • bases
  • growthrates

If these criteria aren't fufilled to my satisfaction, I simply will ignore this unit.
 

Even a bad written character or a character with evil intentions would be used by me in main game because only unit quality counts for me.
 

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The only characters I truly hate are the 99% of the joke and single attribute characters in FE (I like Anna, Arthur, and Farina that is really it...), people like Kellam, Gaius, Ilyana who exist to perpetuate a single unfunny joke. I didn't find it funny the first time what make you think I will like it the ten thousandth time. 

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8 hours ago, はたの 秦 こころ said:

I only consider a "bad character" from the gameplay aspect:

  • joining time
  • bases
  • growthrates

If these criteria aren't fufilled to my satisfaction, I simply will ignore this unit.
 

Even a bad written character or a character with evil intentions would be used by me in main game because only unit quality counts for me.

Tbh, this is ultimately my outlook on characters as a whole.  It's just hard for me to get attached to Fire Emblem characters as more than units.  Heck, half of the reasons I have for Sheena being my would-be Fire Emblem waifu have to do with her being a unit who is both armored AND wields Axes.

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Most people have already covered what makes a "bad" unit, so I don't think I really have anything to contribute there.

As far as story/characterization goes, I honestly tend to be pretty laid-back and forgiving... for the most part.

The first thing that comes to mind for something I would describe as an objectively bad quality of a character would be one who, for the majority of the audience of their home media work, fails to elicit the audience reaction they're clearly intended to evoke.
Along similar lines, it really bothers me when characters have serious flaws as people that aren't treated as such by the writing. Peri, Tharja, Azama, Jakob, Camilla, etc. are all good examples of this.

Essentially, I find a bad character to be one whose writers evidently didn't really have a very nuanced understanding of them even as they were writing them.

I don't know how much sense that makes, but that's the best way I can articulate it at the moment.

Edited by Topaz Light
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