Fate/Grand Order General

[QKumber]

12 hours ago, MagicCanonBalls said:

Yep, just started around March. I got all the Carp CEs and MLB ushi but still struggling with the last 1m hp usually. 

If you want some help I got a open spot on my friend list, you can just pick my Rider and keep her alive - on my comps she deals like 5 million on her np turns so I bet she can work with fewer carps but more protection aswell on 3million quest o/

314.369.629

[Shiki]

On 23.5.2019 at 2:22 AM, JSND Alter Dragon Boner said:

This raid rerun make me wonder what kind of stupid created Kintoki Rider.

The same people who made Miyu. Everything balances itself out in the end.

-----

I'm a bit over 120M now, still got all the riceballs. Probably will use my current supply for the next day since it drops Proofs (and Lamps I don't need but w/e), the rest of them will be burned on the last day (Gears + Hearts).

Also finished my 4th Grail Servant with Leonidas using the shop EXP. Good stuff, now I just need to bully Ibaraki for the Lores.

What's everybody doing with their daily AP? I found myself a new hell in Proofs and doing the Pirate Ship node robbed me my sanity once again. tbf I've got nothing else to do, I'm done with all the Interludes and Rank-Up Quests I could unlock so far.

[YotsuMaboroshi]

32 minutes ago, Magus of Memery said:

The same people who made Miyu. Everything balances itself out in the end.

Miyu's main design problem is that she follows Prillya lore too closely, to the detriment of her gameplay.

Consort Yu seems like more of a standard badly designed servant, since she's new to FGO.

[Shiki]

9 minutes ago, YotsuMaboroshi said:

Consort Yu seems like more of a standard badly designed servant, since she's new to FGO.

On the other hand Yu's biggest limitation is the buff removal on her NP. If you take that out of the picture she is at the very least workable with her decent skills and if they bundle it with a NP Interlude to mitigate her horrible Atk stat there's an elegant solution for her.

Miyu, however, makes me wonder: Where do you even start? 2 of her skills makes no sense for her role and even if you remove the massive HP cost from her NP it's just a worse version of Merlin's.

[Silverly]

Am I hearing people blaspheming my daughter? cracks knuckles

Honestly the event is... going slow. It honestly really sucks the currency CEs are gacha locked since I already have the banana while I couldn’t care less for Shuten Doji. I feel Bullying the Oni is the only mode where I can get fairly consistent victories with the occasional whiff thanks to Ibaraki having a stray buster crit out of nowhere (honestly is she a chimera in disguise?). The farthest I went in Slaying the Oni was around 1,500,000, while I know the aforementioned Bullying is better I at least want to clear the hardest one from beginning to end. Bleh, tbh I wasn’t really looking forward to this one. Onigashima please come soon. 

[Sire]

I finally got Ishtar! Woo! Now I can save up for King Hassan and Eresh, provided I don't get sidetracked by Merlin and Maid Artoria Alter.

Sire's Summoning Ishtar Attempts - Final Total: ~215 (~45 Tickets, ~ 481 Quartz)

...Downside is that I'm going to be in material and QP hell for a while. I already have no real QP as I'm spending it on upgrading my Waver whenever I have the chance. Oh well, I'm content at the moment. Ishtar is now in my Chaldea after trying to get her for a while. Hopefully King Hassan and Eresh will be easier to obtain.

* * * * *

As for the event, I tried doing the 2 BP 3 Million node. I guess I get why people run it (easier to 2-turn it with proper setups, and possibly obtain more materials), but for some reason I find running the 3BP 6 Million to be better for me. Doing less runs, despite taking longer, just feels better for some reason. Maybe this will change if I go into hardcore grinding mode.

[YotsuMaboroshi]

1 hour ago, Magus of Memery said:

On the other hand Yu's biggest limitation is the buff removal on her NP. If you take that out of the picture she is at the very least workable with her decent skills and if they bundle it with a NP Interlude to mitigate her horrible Atk stat there's an elegant solution for her.

Miyu, however, makes me wonder: Where do you even start? 2 of her skills makes no sense for her role and even if you remove the massive HP cost from her NP it's just a worse version of Merlin's.

Strictly from a design standpoint, there's no question which is worse.  Miyu's kit is more of a mess than Yu's, but I can at least see the reasoning for most of Miyu's skills (to a degree) based on what she accomplished in Prillya.  Yu looks like she was intentionally designed to be bad, which makes me feel more 'WTF were they thinking' than Miyu's kit does.

 

47 minutes ago, Silverly said:

Am I hearing people blaspheming my daughter? cracks knuckles

Assuming you're referring to Miyu, I like Miyu as a character and plan try for NP5 when she hits NA regardless.  But she's objectively not a well designed Servant in FGO.

[Silverly]

16 minutes ago, YotsuMaboroshi said:

Assuming you're referring to Miyu, I like Miyu as a character and plan try for NP5 when she hits NA regardless.  But she's objectively not a well designed Servant in FGO.

I know, I know. My comment was made in jest. I didn’t hear many people be critical of it when she was initially released though, at least concerning the Youtubers I follow who cover FGO. 

[MagicCanonBalls]

4 hours ago, QKumber said:

If you want some help I got a open spot on my friend list, you can just pick my Rider and keep her alive - on my comps she deals like 5 million on her np turns so I bet she can work with fewer carps but more protection aswell on 3million quest o/

314.369.629

Just sent my friend request. Thank you for the help. 

[QKumber]

2 minutes ago, MagicCanonBalls said:

Just sent my friend request. Thank you for the help. 

I assume you are Akania on fgo?

Btw I put my dmg CE on lancer! Scathach is prob easier to use then Quetz. Charge her np and make use of her stun on np, it makes a diff!

[MagicCanonBalls]

5 minutes ago, QKumber said:

I assume you are Akania on fgo?

Btw I put my dmg CE on lancer! Scathach is prob easier to use then Quetz. Charge her np and make use of her stun on np, it makes a diff!

Yep that's me. Also your setup is really amazing. I think I am gonna experiment around with some of your servant in diff strategy + team comp.

[QKumber]

3 minutes ago, MagicCanonBalls said:

Yep that's me. Also your setup is really amazing. I think I am gonna experiment around with some of your servant in diff strategy + team comp.

Glad to help! Just send a message here or pm me if you need me to change CEs or soemthing!

Now go bully the banana Oni Kappa

[YotsuMaboroshi]

20 minutes ago, Silverly said:

I know, I know. My comment was made in jest. I didn’t hear many people be critical of it when she was initially released though, at least concerning the Youtubers I follow who cover FGO. 

I think a lot of people were 'OMG Miyu!!!!' without really considering how she worked at the time, and what I know of Youtubers in general is that they tend to be hype first a lot of the time (not that I really follow any).  I remember there was criticism of the demerit on her NP on Reddit, and Rabbit's review of her on Gamefaqs was relatively critical.

[Water Mage]

3 hours ago, Magus of Memery said:

 

What's everybody doing with their daily AP? I found myself a new hell in Proofs and doing the Pirate Ship node robbed me my sanity once again. tbf I've got nothing else to do, I'm done with all the Interludes and Rank-Up Quests I could unlock so far.

As I recently needed 36 Proofs to fully ascend a Servant and only had 2 Proofs at first I understand your pain very well.

Speaking of stupid good/bad Servants, I wonder if Hans was a happy accident or was intentionally made to be really good Support. And for a game known for it fanservice, it ironic how most of it’s OP Servants of each rarity are male: Merlin, Waver, Rider Kintoki, Bedi, Hans, Georgios, Arash and so on.

Edited May 25, 2019 by Water Mage

[Alexmender]

4 hours ago, Magus of Memery said:

What's everybody doing with their daily AP? I found myself a new hell in Proofs and doing the Pirate Ship node robbed me my sanity once again. tbf I've got nothing else to do, I'm done with all the Interludes and Rank-Up Quests I could unlock so far.

Door farming. One never leaves QP hell (>.> Sanzang/Da Vinci/Tamalancer/MHXA/ton of good 4* servants and their need for hundreds of millions of QP keep haunting me). 

- - - - 

While Ridertoki is OP and can take the 6M banana by himself, Ishtar+Stheno+Liz+Support Merlin is more fun and they can clear the stage faster (2~9 turns depending on card RNG). I need to get rid of my bad habit of always considering ST>AoE even when said AoE is a literal nuke that crits extra hard.

[DehNutCase]

The moment I decide to level + skill Kintoki Rider Mr. Dio shows up.

-_-

(I mean, I'll take it, but I guess that means I won't be going for Rider Alter this summer.)

 

My summer stash is running pretty low, but hopefully I don't see anything worth pulling for the next few months.

[JSND Alter Dragon Boner]

7 hours ago, YotsuMaboroshi said:

Miyu's main design problem is that she follows Prillya lore too closely, to the detriment of her gameplay.

Consort Yu seems like more of a standard badly designed servant, since she's new to FGO.

 

Miyu is BY FAR the most gameplay oriented designed servant in 2019. Nothing is even close to how gameplay based she is. We;re talking a servant who'se primary niche is being designed SPECIFICALLY to fucks around with the game's core mechanic when they don't need to do it like that. You don't go THAT far in programming a character if you used Lore as a basis

Again, people only call her #LORE because shes bad, but objectively speaking she's a ridiculously gameplay focused servant - her problem is the same one as Arjuna, the gameplay design on her isn't one that benefits the player. The fact that she is a collab character is another problem

5 hours ago, YotsuMaboroshi said:

Strictly from a design standpoint, there's no question which is worse.  Miyu's kit is more of a mess than Yu's, but I can at least see the reasoning for most of Miyu's skills (to a degree) based on what she accomplished in Prillya.  Yu looks like she was intentionally designed to be bad, which makes me feel more 'WTF were they thinking' than Miyu's kit does.

 

Assuming you're referring to Miyu, I like Miyu as a character and plan try for NP5 when she hits NA regardless.  But she's objectively not a well designed Servant in FGO.

 

Yu's only true problem is her NP and her NP is actually a direct #Lore - she recreates the particles of her body when she broke it up, hence the self buffwipe

Edited May 25, 2019 by JSND Alter Dragon Boner

[YotsuMaboroshi]

34 minutes ago, JSND Alter Dragon Boner said:

 

Miyu is BY FAR the most gameplay oriented designed servant in 2019. Nothing is even close to how gameplay based she is. We;re talking a servant who'se primary niche is being designed SPECIFICALLY to fucks around with the game's core mechanic when they don't need to do it like that. You don't go THAT far in programming a character if you used Lore as a basis

Again, people only call her #LORE because shes bad, but objectively speaking she's a ridiculously gameplay focused servant - her problem is the same one as Arjuna, the gameplay design on her isn't one that benefits the player. The fact that she is a collab character is another problem

You're going to have to explain better how Miyu is a gameplay oriented design.  I'm not just going lolore because she's bad, I can see lore justification for almost her entire skillset. 

• Her NP has a demerit because it's her acting as a Grail, and acting as a Grail literally kills her.  If she grants too many wishes she will die. 
• Her Cheerful Mystic Code is an Arts and crit damage buff because Miyu is a technical fighter, compared with Illya's brute force approach, and technique is generally considered Arts. 
• Her Maiden's Willpower has a guts because she's gotten up and continued fighting stuff that should have literally killed her (Fragrarch, at the very least, though that was partly due to how Bellerophon works).  Not too sure about the debuff immunity though.
• Her Wish of the Child of God is how she supplied mana to Shirou during the Miyuverse grail war.  The second part lets her support her best friend Illya (though that's not really a major lore thing, and at least Miyu's works for more than Illya, unlike Kuro's).
• She has Unlimited Prana Supply for the same reason Illya does, the Kaleido sticks provide unlimited mana to their users.

Maybe there's something in there that I'm missing, but I don't see how her design is primarily gameplay oriented.

Edit:  The only gameplay synergy I see in her kit is that her Arts buff, NP, and maybe her third skill (if she uses it on her self) enable her to use her NP relatively quickly, but that seems rather weak for a servant you claim is a heavy gameplay design.

Edited May 25, 2019 by YotsuMaboroshi

[JSND Alter Dragon Boner]

24 minutes ago, YotsuMaboroshi said:

You're going to have to explain better how Miyu is a gameplay oriented design.  I'm not just going lolore because she's bad, I can see lore justification for almost her entire skillset. 

• Her NP has a demerit because it's her acting as a Grail, and acting as a Grail literally kills her.  If she grants too many wishes she will die. 
• Her Cheerful Mystic Code is an Arts and crit damage buff because Miyu is a technical fighter, compared with Illya's brute force approach, and technique is generally considered Arts. 
• Her Maiden's Willpower has a guts because she's gotten up and continued fighting stuff that should have literally killed her (Fragrarch, at the very least, though that was partly due to how Bellerophon works).  Not too sure about the debuff immunity though.
• Her Wish of the Child of God is how she supplied mana to Shirou during the Miyuverse grail war.
• She has Unlimited Prana Supply for the same reason Illya does, the Kaleido sticks provide unlimited mana to their users.

Maybe there's something in there that I'm missing, but I don't see how her design is primarily gameplay oriented.

 

Her 1st skill is a combo of "her most common card and crit" the #1 source of untimely unit death in the game. Her 2nd is a battery, something everyone hates facing. Guts is filler, but eh

But now were getting to be BIG one. The one that makes it so obvious where they are going with her

Miyu NP is programmed SPECIFICALLY so that instead of applying it to everyone, she apply it to herself which activates at the very end of the turn, after which it applies the effect. They DONT need to do it specifically this way, its like taking a huge effort for no fucking reason when you can just copy paste Merlin(we can agree Wish of Child of God is essentially Garden of Avalon right?). In fact theres only a fringes beneitf of doing it this way and thats from the fact that Miyu's NP effect won't be deleted if the enemy buffwipes the target, but NOT Miyu. Wiping Miyu would instead delete everything.

In mechanical terms, Miyu uses a skill simmilar to Innocent Monster for her entire Noble Phantasm - most servant who resembles Miyu, including Merlin's Heal and NP charge use a Charisma Type skill(Merlin's star boost actually uses Innocent Monster type proc because well its Innocent Monster after all).

The way this is presented in the game on opposing side is where you draw the line

 

When Merlin's Garden of Avalon is used as an enemy, it would offer the team HP regen, offer the team ONE ARROW OF NP CHARGE and finally BOOST HIS OWN CRITICAL RATE

Mitu;s Wish of the Child of God would activate at the end of the turns. At that time she applies ONE ARROW OF NP CHARGE, CRITICAL RATE BOOST, HP REGEN to EVERYONE for 3 Turn straight

 

 

And thats EXACTLY why Miyu is so lethal in theory.... as a boss especially in teamfight context. Which is as a reminder that is her ONLY appearance in Prisma Codes rerun. She is designed SPECIFICALLY as a teamfight boss, and a ridiculously bullshit one at that(had she wasn't a Caster she's on the level of Napoleon as far as bullshit boss goes). You can call this a quasi-LOLORE moment the same way that Arjuna is a lethal boss, but not that good of a unit.

With Miyu on field, you have a support adds that makes it so that, once she reach her NP, she turns 4 charge into 2 charge. 5 charge into 3 charge. 3 charge into 2(notably after 3 charges drop their NP, they'd be left with 1 charge and charges 2 that turn, allowing another NP every other turns). Miyu herself would have her NP up permanently unless stopped,, and this doesn't include the fact that she'd bump up everyone's crit rate in the process. With her skillset she had a decent critical rate, and she can magically makes team's NP gauge charge faster out of nowhere to boot.

 

Theres even already a CQ in recent times that had the set up that could have made Miyu's threat level apparent - the Alter Ego fest of Tokugawa Ooku event last month sets up everyone into 3 charge bar, with one bulky pivot in Kiyohime. Had Miyu is one of the enemy there, she'd put everyone on 2 charge gauge timer and it could have been a stupidly hellish fight.

As it is, Miyu is in a weird spot, she had all the makings that would have made a stupid bossfight, but not the means of doing so for being a CQ on a low level collab event with damage CE without the boss being scaled for such a thing(i cleared the Prisma CQ with Fionn) and being a collab servant she's not going to show up for much

Edited May 25, 2019 by JSND Alter Dragon Boner

[YotsuMaboroshi]

@JSND Alter Dragon Boner

I can see where you're coming from now, though I still think there plenty of lore design for Miyu's skillset working the way it does, as she was an established character before FGO.  For comparison, Yu (and a lot of FGO exclusives) is sort of a chicken/egg situation where they could have designed her first then figured out a lore justification, or written the lore then figured out how to match it to skills, and we don't really know which one (at least I think Yu's body reconstruction is unique to her, I'm not too familiar with True Ancestor lore).

I will point out that you mixed up Miyu's skills and her NP.  Wish of the Child of God is her third skill, with the targeted NP charge and a Buff Success up chance.  Maiden's Willpower is her second, with guts and debuff immunity.  Her NP is Wish Upon a Star, which is the mini-Garden of Avalon, and still has a lore justification for being a self buff instead of a party buff:  her ability to provide mana as a Grail requires her to be present.  Once Shirou's wish made her leave the Miyuverse Earth, she could no longer provide mana to him, which left him unable to use UBW.  So it matches her lore fairly well that you don't get the benefit from her NP when she leaves the field.

[JSND Alter Dragon Boner]

4 minutes ago, YotsuMaboroshi said:

@JSND Alter Dragon Boner

I can see where you're coming from now, though I still think there plenty of lore design for Miyu's skillset working the way it does, as she was an established character before FGO.  For comparison, Yu (and a lot of FGO exclusives) is sort of a chicken/egg situation where they could have designed her first then figured out a lore justification, or written the lore then figured out how to match it to skills, and we don't really know which one (at least I think Yu's body reconstruction is unique to her, I'm not too familiar with True Ancestor lore).

I will point out that you mixed up Miyu's skills and her NP.  Wish of the Child of God is her third skill, with the targeted NP charge and a Buff Success up chance.  Maiden's Willpower is her second, with guts and debuff immunity.  Her NP is Wish Upon a Star, which is the mini-Garden of Avalon, and still has a lore justification for being a self buff instead of a party buff:  her ability to provide mana as a Grail requires her to be present.  Once Shirou's wish made her leave the Miyuverse Earth, she could no longer provide mana to him, which left him unable to use UBW.  So it matches her lore fairly well that you don't get the benefit from her NP when she leaves the field.

Yeah, there are some servant where it is very obvious they designed based on gameplay first - its VERY easy to notice in older servants in fact, but Saber Lancelot is one of the most blatant(the way he's presented in Camelot doesn't help). Yu feels like the lore first - she have all sorts of "regeneration" cuz MUH VAMPIRE and then theres her NP with a filmsy justification added on her skillset

 

I don't think servant deisgn have to be 100-0 lore or gameplay per se, but the way i see it, when they made Miyu, they specifically made her in such a way to include her as a bonus bossfight in Prisma codes, and it coincidentally made SOME sense in how it works. Thats why, i consider her 2019's most gameplay designed servant(most other ones either had a more midline gameplay to lore while fulfilling a specific gimmicks, Theres Qin Shin Huang but hes stupid anyway). In the game's run, theres probably something like uhhh

Jalter who'se lore didn't explain her gameplay enough - her skillset is blatantly a rip off of Vanilla Saber a servant who have been copied so many times you'd lose count at one point

Saberlot whose profile on AO is literally DOTA1 Hero profile, and so many other old servant who have DOTA1 Hero profile in early days

who'se arguably more than Miyu in terms of lolgameplay

[Shiki]

After spending all my current rice supply on today's raid I'm now at over 320M damage. Today's release of a certain series describes this perfectly:

Spoiler

 

 

[YotsuMaboroshi]

A bit slow, but I'm now done with both the ladder and the shop.  Technically I still have pieces, monuments and the CE copies in the shop, but I have lots of pieces and monuments already, and 3 MLB copies of Shana-O, so I don't really think I need them.

Going to just mess around with various servants in the 3BP fight to keep contribute to the raids, farm a bit of QP from gourds, and hopefully get some Carp drops to get a third MLB.

[Water Mage]

The event’s end only 4 days away, so I wonder what’s next? It will be straight to Onigashima or there will be a week off with a Shinjuku banner like the JP banner?

[MrSmokestack]

I finished the ladder yesterday, but I’m still chipping away at the shop.

21 minutes ago, Water Mage said:

The event’s end only 4 days away, so I wonder what’s next? It will be straight to Onigashima or there will be a week off with a Shinjuku banner like the JP banner?

There was a 6 day gap between the Rashomon and Onigashiama reruns. Or maybe it will be like NA last year