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Hilda

Idea: Blacksmith Weapon upgrade!

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As everyone of you knows Sacred Coins arent in use at the moment. So i thought: "What if there was a Blacksmith-Shop to strengthen/create your own Weapon".
Of course such a System needs some restriction otherwise we would end up with very unbalanced units, so here goes my Idea!

In Order to upgrade your Weapon to the next level (as in inherit a skill to it) the following conditions have to be met:

1. The Units needs to have the weapon learned and equiped

2. You need a Unit you want to sacrifice to inherit a skill. The skill can be picked directly, but you can only pick the Skill rank up to 2. tier (silver circle) and not higher. Skills have a different point values. Your Weapon can only have a maximum of 4 point values inherited, so you can match and mix skills until the maximum amount of Point Values is reached.
Some Skills can not be inherited to some Weapons. Please note that normal skill-inheritance prohibitions apply here too, you cant inherit Lance Breaker to a Sword weapon. Or you cant inherit Shield Pulse 2 to a Tome because its restricted to Infantery Units.

3. You need Sacred Coins to pay the Blacksmith for the forging, 50 coins per craft/Skill inheritance

4. You need a large amount of Great Badges in the corresponding weapon to upgrade them! The Amount of Badges needes i SP Cost of the Skill in question divided by 2. For Example: Distant Counter needs 300 SP to be learned, so you need 150 Badges if you want to forge the skill into the Weapon.

5. Different Weapons have different Max point Values (see point 2)
The Following Max point Values apply:

Melee and Bows:
Currently Existing Legendary Weapons: Max point Value of 2, CYL Banner Legendary Weapons have a Max point Value of 0, they cant inherit any more skills
Silver Weapons: Max point Value 4
Slayer Weapons (effectiv against, without bows: Max point Value 4
Brave Weapons: Max point Value 2
Slaying Weapons (new cooldown -1 weapons): Max point value 2
Killer Weapons: Max point value 4
Wo dao Weapons: Max point value 3
Gem Weapons (Ruby, Saphire): Max point Value 4
Firesweep weapons: 2

Tomes:
Legendary tomes. 1
Litrblade: 1
Litrowl: 3
Litrraven: 4
Litrwolf: 4
Mt 13 normal tomes: 4

Breaths:
Fire Breath: 4
all other Breaths: 2

Staves and Daggers:
Assault: 4
All other Staves: 3
Poison Daggers: 3
Legendary Daggers: 3
Remaining Daggers: 4

 

Following Skills (only Tier 2 can be inherited, neither Tier 1 or Tier 3) can be forged (inherited) into a Weapon and their Point Value they use up on the Weapon Slot:

A Passives:
ATK+/SPD+/RES+/DEF+/HP+ 2(This includes skills like "Attack and Def+") : 1
"insert" Blow skills 2 (Death Blow 2 for exampled, includes also the new combined Blows): 2
Heavy Blade 2: 2
"insert" Boost 2(Earth Boost for example): 1
Close Counter: 2
Distant Counter: 2
Defiant "insert Stat" 2: 1
Distant Def 2: 2
Close Def 2: 2
Fortress Defense 2: 1
Fortress Res 2: 1
Fury 2: 3
Life and Death 2: 3
Steady Stance 2: 2

Following A-Passives cant be forged into a Weapon: Triangle Adept, Steady Breath, "insert" Shields (Iotes Shield for example)

 

B Passives:
"Insert" Breaker 2: 2
Brash Assault 2: 2
Dazzling Staff 2: 3 (Stave exclusiv)
Desperation 2: 3
Escape Route 2: 3 (Stave exclusiv)
Guard 2: 2
Live to Serve 2: 2
Obstruct 2: 1
Pass 2: 1
Poison Strikes 2: 2
Quick Riposte 2: 3
Renewal 2: 2
Seal "insert Stat": 1
Seal "insert double stats": 2
Shield Pulse 2: 2
Vantage 2: 3
Watersweep 2: 2
Windsweep 2: 2
Wings of Mercy 2: 3 (Stave Exclusive)
Wrath 2: 4
Wrathfull stff 2: 3 (Stave Exclusive)

Following B-Passives cant be forged into a Weapon: Wary Fighterl, Sacae's Blessing, Lunge, Knock Back, Hit and Run, Flier Formation, Drag Back, Cancel Affinity, Beorc's Blessing

 

C Passives:
"Insert" Ploy 2: 2
Breath of Life 2: 2
Drive Attack 1: 2
Drive Def 1: 2
Drive Spd 1: 2
Fortify "Insert Stat" 2: 2
Hone "Insert stat" 2: 2
Infantery pulse 2: 2
Savage Blow 2: 2
Spur "Insert stat" 2 (this includes the new double stat spur skills): 1
Threaten "Insert stat" 2: 1
 

The Following C-Passives cant be forged into a Weapon: Atk Smoke, Armor March, All Fortify Emblem and Hone Emblem skills, Goad Emblem and Spur Emblem skills, Guidance

As an example:
Silver Lance has a max value of 4, Therefor it would be possible to forge Desperation 2 (3) and Defiant Spd 2 (1) into the weapon and reach the max value of 4.
There are 2 forges, so you would need to pay 50 coins for each forge: Total 100 coins
Desperation 2 costs 100 SP: so 50 Great blue Badges needs (since its a Lance)
Defiant Spd 2 costs 80 SP: so 40 Great blue Badges needs (since its a Lance)
Total amount of Great blue Badges needed: 90
A Brave Weapon with a max value of 2 would not be able to put Desperation 2 (3) on it, because Desperation 2 (3) allready exeeds the max amoutn of point Values, but you could put Distant Counter (2) on the weapon if you wanted.

Thoughts?

 

 

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This seems just a tad ridiculous 

I mean, the whole point of having special weapons (Lyn's for example) is because no other person can have their type of set or do what they can do. Letting literally everyone have any type of combination of skills seems like the game could break in a single day XD

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This also basically screws over any existing legendary weapon that has an outclassed additional effect.

 

3 hours ago, Hilda said:

Fire Breath: 4

You mean Flametongue. Fire Breath is the Iron and Steel equivalent.

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Perhaps you could put aside special weapons and use the upgrade system on normal ones. Characters would need to have a certain number of stats to upgrade them and you cold also input certain properties at them.

For example:

Upgrade a Iron Sword for Lyn, the sword cold become more powerful and you could insert a item like a gem to make the atributtes of the weapon become even better or give her special properties.You could also create a system to randomize which atributes would increase.

Edited by DarkSoul

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1 hour ago, Arcanite said:

This seems just a tad ridiculous 

I mean, the whole point of having special weapons (Lyn's for example) is because no other person can have their type of set or do what they can do. Letting literally everyone have any type of combination of skills seems like the game could break in a single day XD

Thats not quite true since you can forge legendary weapons further too. Since Lyns Sol katti would have 2 Max value, she could forge Brash assault (it costs 2 points) and still run Wrath 3 on her Passive B Slot makeing her even further a beast, while other units can only run Desperation on Silver weapons, Wo Dao, Gem Weapons, Killer Weapon Slaying Weapons etc. + She still would have more might on her weapon

While Ryomas weapon would get a bit weaker a tad, his weapon still would have the highest might when considered with other weapons that run Distant Counter

Hector could Run Distant Counter on his Armads and free up his A-Slot for something different makeing him still superior, becuase you cant forge Quick Riposte (3) and Distant Counter (2) on any other weapon, it would exeed the max Limit of 4.

The current existing weak legendary Weapons like Like Seliphs Tyrfing are allready crap anyway, so it doesnt matter.

I just think this would open up alot of possibilitys for interesting builds on characters that would be usually underused, or open up crazy builds on allready strong characters.

Besides as said Inheritance rules still apply on weapons too, you cant give Stave users Death Blow 2 on their weapons for example. Or give Tome users Shield pulse 2 or Wrath 2 etc. If the unit cant inherit the Skill normaly from other units due to restriction, they also cant forge it into their weapon.

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Maybe instead of that system, just using coins to upgrade weapons to their "plus" version, like Brave Lance to Brave Lance+ without having to spend 20K feathers.

Also maybe be able to upgrade skills like Quick Riposte and LaD to third tier.

Edited by Rezzy

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Maybe tone it down a bit, like every normal weapon can get only 1 effect. Now this would be a bit arbitrary but it'll be better if some weapons like blade tomes, braves and slayers get only up to tier 1 skills while weaker ones like Silver, killers and wolf tomes get up to tier 2. Legendary weapons would get something like up to tier 3 in their in-built effect if it's available and maybe a second skill up to tier 1 to ensure they remain better than every common weapon.

Then again this idea would open a huge can of worms that would screw extremely hard with the game balance (that is quite a mess as it is, I'd dread finding a Reinhardt with DB3.5 because of this). I'm someone who agrees to include a forging option to the game, but instead of doing a 2nd SI just give 2 points of might to most weapons (maybe 3-4 to wolf tomes) and lessen some penalties to others like brave weapons have a -3 spd penalty instead of -5 and erase the -1 cooldown to blade tomes. 

 

 

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36 minutes ago, Hilda said:

open up crazy builds on allready strong characters.

See that's the thing, why would we need to do that? Give Reinhardt innate Deathblow 1 or something because why not?

Edited by Arcanite

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The two biggest problems are

  1. This is a game where +3 Atk on a weapon that is generally considered to be nearly worthless is enough for people to scream "power creep". Where characters that are designed specifically to be and have every right to be stronger than other units makes people scream "power creep".
  2. Every weak legendary weapon is being shat on. Proper balance is to raise the power of the weaker elements in the game to be on par with the stronger ones, not to widen the gap further. Any Silver Bow+ can be made to be stronger than Fujin Yumi because adding Pass 2 and Atk +2 onto a Silver Bow+ makes it identical to Fujin Yumi with a +1 Atk advantage (both have 2 customization points left). Which is dumb.

 

I don't think this game needs any means of making player characters that much stronger than they already are. What should be focused on are means to make characters strong in the existing system (like giving limited characters the ability to be merged to +10 without waiting 3 years for enough reruns) and reducing the gap between weaker units and stronger units (being able to double-nature weaker units would be pretty cool, if maybe a bit broken if you actually roll a good one).

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I want a forgery system too. Mostly to get the forgery music into the game, but also to upgrade generic weapons into their + versions.  I hate having to spend a down payment on a car in feathers just to give a Stahl's Ruby Sword + to Olivia. I'd rather give her a normal ruby sword, then spend a bunch of sacred coins upgrading that for her. And I think the average player would appreciate that system for the dozens of brave builds that make a greater variety of units viable. Blade tomes, poison daggers, Lightning Breath, I think there's enough possibilities here to make players want to collect these coins on a regular basis.

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1 hour ago, Rezzy said:

Maybe instead of that system, just using coins to upgrade weapons to their "plus" version, like Brave Lance to Brave Lance+ without having to spend 20K feathers.

Also maybe be able to upgrade skills like Quick Riposte and LaD to third tier.

This would be what I would want.  OPs ideas are a little bit too game breaking for me to support, but being able to use SCs for upgrading regular weapons and skills without having to promote units for SI would be great.

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2 hours ago, Rezzy said:

Maybe instead of that system, just using coins to upgrade weapons to their "plus" version, like Brave Lance to Brave Lance+ without having to spend 20K feathers.

Also maybe be able to upgrade skills like Quick Riposte and LaD to third tier.

I'm not really into the forge skills into weapons idea, but this also seems like a waste for sacred coins. Having an alternative with coins instead of 20k feathers for a 5* locked skill is a waste for a new currency/mechanic. 

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17 minutes ago, KongDude said:

I'm not really into the forge skills into weapons idea, but this also seems like a waste for sacred coins. Having an alternative with coins instead of 20k feathers for a 5* locked skill is a waste for a new currency/mechanic. 

It would be nice to get some way to get those skills weapons at a reduced cost by some method.  Using 20K to get a character to 5* seems okay, but using 20K for QR3 seems a bit excessive.  I honestly have no idea what the coins will end up being for.  It seems like they could come up for another use for the thousands of badges we have.

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Just now, Rezzy said:

It would be nice to get some way to get those skills weapons at a reduced cost by some method.  Using 20K to get a character to 5* seems okay, but using 20K for QR3 seems a bit excessive.  I honestly have no idea what the coins will end up being for.  It seems like they could come up for another use for the thousands of badges we have.

It's just that they've been keeping sacred coins use a secret for 2 months. It'd be anticlimactic if it did something that we can already do without it. I'd rather they introduce something completely new rather than a new way to do something we already can.

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Darn it. If only this idea was implemented six months ago when developers were releasing Reinhardt, I can make game breaking stuff!

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14 hours ago, Rezzy said:

Maybe instead of that system, just using coins to upgrade weapons to their "plus" version, like Brave Lance to Brave Lance+ without having to spend 20K feathers.

Also maybe be able to upgrade skills like Quick Riposte and LaD to third tier.

I don't know about this system. Feathers can let you do the same thing so why not just use those as the currency? Just give a "Upgrade Skill" tab and let people use say 10k feathers to upgrade a 3rd tier weapon to 4th tier (or level 2 ABC skill to level 3) and you won't need a separate currency. I think Sacred Coins would be better spent upgrading something that feathers can't do. For example, spending coins to turn Killer weapons into Slaying weapons or turning 2nd tier weapons into inheritable 3rd/4th tier weapons such as upgrading an Elwind tome into your choice of Gronn(Wolf/Raven/Owl/Blade etc)

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