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Mew-ie

Watersweep reinhardt? Phantom speed 3 seal

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So with the new release of sacred seals forge i saw the possiility to forge a "Phantom speed 3" which gives you +10 spd in comparison to another unit so does it make it pretty broken?

Imagine a brave weapon user (Reinhardt for example?) with watersweep 3, he have a pityfull speed of 15-21 but with a +spd IV (who will ever do that) so 21spd + Horse buffs (27spd) and the sacred seal utility (+10) he reaches a total of 37spd (or 34 for neutral spd)! 

(Of course a 40+10 reinhardt is even better)

Since watersweep requires only unit spd>1 he can safely poke a lot more of unit with DC or cancel green mages counter attack (like julia's low speed about 38 at her most with L&D3) 

Anyway it was a build i though of but i dont have the material for it nor want to build it 

Please tell me if any of you guys tried it, virtually it seems very strong so i would like to know the real results thx 

PS: -If reinhardt doesnt even oneshot an enemy at his first double strike there might a problem lol, basically i just suggested a useless build 

-We all know that reinhardt's damage potentiel will be reduced by alot because of magic deflect 

-This build idea example was set on reinhardt but of course you can use it on other units

Edited by Mew-ie
forgot to mention something

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I would assume if this build becomes popular, people would simply start running Phantom Spd 3 (or just shrug it off with Deflect Magic) on their Reinhardt counters.

Hell, Julia [=] (Fury 3, Phantom Spd 1) has 34 Spd.

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Well anyway it might be true but it would still be quite a monster to make you run a DEDICATED sacred seal against him which also mean a waste of potential seal place with like uhh distant defense or something like that 

Julia wont take any damage from reinharst anyway so i dont think it should be a worry xD the main issue is obviously rein + dancer team, usualy you expect rein to kill himself and dancer cant dance him but if he doesnt die he can change target after attacking with his absurd horse mage 5tiles hitbox 

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I'm not really sure it would be better to run than lancebreaker... Even with watersweep, my main counter against Julia would be the Xander that I use to buff Reinhardt. Same with any green... Especially since he still needs the cavalry buffs to run at his most efficient anyway. 

I haven't run any calculations, so I don't know what would be more effective... and it could be with the new seals that lower Reinhardt's effectiveness a bit, different builds may become necessary, but I'm not entirely sure watersweep would be the best one... especially since most people aim to have a +Atk -Spd Reinhardt and likely would've got rid of their other ones. Maybe worth considering for those only lucky enough to pull one Reinhardt who happens to have that IV though... 

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4 minutes ago, Cute Chao said:

I'm not really sure it would be better to run than lancebreaker... Even with watersweep, my main counter against Julia would be the Xander that I use to buff Reinhardt. Same with any green... Especially since he still needs the cavalry buffs to run at his most efficient anyway.

Obnoxious builds are better for defense teams than offense teams.

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Yeah obviously lancebreaker is wayyyy better on reinhardt and +atk IVs are also recommended but i never meant this build to be the best but a build idea to anyone wanting to try it out (for fun or to ruin other players arena run) 

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I am sorry but watersweep only works against mages or dragon stone usersand not distant counter melee units and without Moonbow or Lancebreaker Reinhardt fails to kill some prominent Lance units. It makes it safe for poking green mages but the dmg output would be very very pitifull without Moonbow. Hell alot of the reason why Reinhardt can one shot some Green units is because of Moonbow and quickened pulse seal, without it he would sit there like a duck and light Wings of mercy hell be spread all around

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Hm yeah i know about windsweep but i implicitly meant it because their mechanics is basically the same

skill choice will depend on your unit availability i will not give my only Alm to my reinhardt for obvious reasons hah

Edited by Mew-ie

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Here's an alternative scenario:

Reinhardt with Life and Death 3. He's a Player Phase unit, and many of his most dangerous counters simply disable his damage and return with death via Triangle Adept 3, if not just sending in a Cav to one-round him on enemy phase, so he really doesn't need to worry about the defense loss.

Neutral Speed Reinhardt (23) loses 5 speed from Dire Thunder (18)

LnD3 nullifys the speed loss (23).

Horse Cav buffs grant 6 speed (29). If only going regular old Hone Speed, then the boost is (27).

Phantom Speed 3 grants 10 effective speed (39) or (37)

That disables a large number of neutral speed targets, which might not mean much when most of the highest speed units usually further boost that speed, but it still disables anyone with a Brave weapon not names Elincia and everyone else. And the loss in attack is only two points total (1 attack from each hit of Dire Thunder).

 

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oh great! yeah that might be a good idea since rein doesnt really loses his offensive stats, i was too obsessed with death blow A skill and made it his "must have" skill and forgot the other

it can also gain by +2 stats with S support

and again reinhardt usualy 2shot his target anyway so this skill wont even be needed 

Replacing his moonbow by luna will maximize the damage potential in 2 turn if not dead the first without quickened pulse equiped 

 

Edited by Mew-ie

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He would still have really low speed.  You'd probably need L&D if you wanted to use it on arena defense to boost his speed up more.  Brave bow users would have an easier time with this build I think, given their high speed that's only really used to prevent doubles, though they usually have high res and in this case, you would want one with high def since they should never take damage from mages.  Though, BB users can usually one shot mages...

Edited by Lushen

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