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Raising Level Caps - Yay or Nay?


Arthur97
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Okay, I can see why raising the cap would not be too popular since more grinding and all that, but seeing as I have all but three units maxed out, I would not be opposed to it to add some more challenge in the mix. Alternatively, they could just make 99 maps, but that could be a bit too much.

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I don't really have a problem with raising the level caps, in fact when it comes to Fates I think the cap should have been at 99 to start with instead of requiring Eternal Seals. This would have simplified things a lot if the cap was just 99 to start with. If they raise the level cap that high though it might be worth considering making the game in question longer than 25-30 chapters or so, also in such a game I would say give at least notable bosses noteworthy stats, as I felt that Hans and Iago when you fought them had pitifully low stats for when you finally fight them. Especially considering they were Garon's most loyal subjects and of considerable rank.

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Haven't played this, but speaking from Hyrule Warriors, no!

Level cap increases are in practice either superfluous levels or necessary levels to complete challenges. Given FEW is supposed to be strategic, the idea of being able to clear say Pegasus heavy battles with a mage simply by leveling more isn't good.

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Personally, I hope it doesn't happen, but I suspect it quite possibly will. There's an issue with raised level cap in that one of two things is likely to happen: Either new content requires very high levels, in which case you either need to be really good or grind a ton to keep up; or content doesn't require very high levels, in which case it becomes somewhat too easy for players who have grinded their levels very high.

 

Fortunately, levels in FEW don't actually make too huge of a difference, with a few exceptions. Picking, say, Rowan as an example. We can use his level 1 to 99 stat increases (accounting for promotion gains as well of course) to estimate what kind of stats he might have at, say, level 200, and thus work out things like how this improves his survivability, damage output and so on.

Spoiler

 

Rowans stats

His Bases for reference are 60 HP, 7 Str, 5 Mag, 8 Skl, 8 Spd, 8 Luk, 6 Def, 6 Res

Now using that we find he gains a total of 540 HP, 54 Str, 44 Mag, 68 Skl, 71 Spd, 68 Luk, 60 Def and 58 Res between levels 1 to 99. Assuming those growths stay roughly constant that gives him level 200 stats of about:

1253 HP, 136 Str, 109 Mag, 170 Skl, 177 Spd, 170 Luk, 149 Def, 143 Res.

 

So what does that mean? Offensively, assuming no Luna, he goes from 320 power (240 mt weapon + 80 Str) to 375 power - a 17% increase. Not actually all that much for 100 level ups. But with Luna, going from 120 Luk (with Luk+20) to 190 Luk means an increase in damage from 42.8% extra damage to 90.5% extra damage, which is a 133.3% multiplier on his damage. Factor that in and he actually deals about 56% more damage at level 200. Not completely ridiculous, but a big jump up for sure.

Defensively, there's a much bigger improvement. As a proportion of his max HP, he takes around 1/3rd as much damage at level 99. This is due to having 80% more HP and ~71% more in each defensive stat. If you throw in Aegis/Pavise, there's a slightly bigger proportional improvement as well, though not drastically so. So damage ranks would be massively easier.

As a final note, said level 200 character would also stay in Awakening much longer and get significantly more recovery/warrior/awakening drops due to their higher speed and luck.

 

 

Putting all that together... overall the effect of a massive increase in the level cap is going to be somewhere around a ~50% damage dealt increase, and a massive boost to durability. It's obviously a pretty big deal, but not completely ridiculous like you might first think. I doubt there will be any content that can't be cleared by well built level 99 characters even if there is a level cap raise.

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47 minutes ago, SavageVolug said:

I don't really have a problem with raising the level caps, in fact when it comes to Fates I think the cap should have been at 99 to start with instead of requiring Eternal Seals. This would have simplified things a lot if the cap was just 99 to start with. If they raise the level cap that high though it might be worth considering making the game in question longer than 25-30 chapters or so, also in such a game I would say give at least notable bosses noteworthy stats, as I felt that Hans and Iago when you fought them had pitifully low stats for when you finally fight them. Especially considering they were Garon's most loyal subjects and of considerable rank.

I only thought that was the case in Revelation, and more so for Hans, who happens to be worse across the board stat wise than the generic Berserkers (shout out to his 9 speed and him starting out with a Tomahawk, which makes you easier to double, equipped!).

Anyways, I don't see the point of having a 99 level cap in Fates since there's nothing that'd warrant that much grinding to take on. It's about as ridiculous as the 200 (or 255, depending on the game) level caps in the Tales and Star Ocean games - you'll have completed the main game loooooong before you even get close to it, except those games tend to have postgame stuff that would warrant such high levels.

As for this game, I can't help but think that they'll do it.

Edited by Levant Mir Celestia
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I normally would oppose this, but with how quick levelling up is in FE Warriors maybe it wouldn't be so bad.

I steamrolled the free update map because I was already near max level with most characters, so I'd like some actual challenge going forward.

Alternatively, every map is just in the 95-99 range, which I guess could work, but removes any sense of progression.

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Going off of Hyrule Warriors... No, no, and NO!

As I am somewhat of a completionist, having a higher level cap means intensive grinding for me. There is also the issue of having content that I am not sure what level my guys are supposed to be, so I head in being underleveled or overleveled. I never got around to finishing all of Hyrule Warrior's Adventure Maps because of this.

Now, I do not own Fire Emblem Warriors yet, but I much rather have difficulty added in through strategy instead of simply adding more numbers for progression.

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43 minutes ago, Sire said:

Going off of Hyrule Warriors... No, no, and NO!

As I am somewhat of a completionist, having a higher level cap means intensive grinding for me. There is also the issue of having content that I am not sure what level my guys are supposed to be, so I head in being underleveled or overleveled. I never got around to finishing all of Hyrule Warrior's Adventure Maps because of this.

Now, I do not own Fire Emblem Warriors yet, but I much rather have difficulty added in through strategy instead of simply adding more numbers for progression.

Don't worry, leveling is much easier in FEW. I have all but three maxed out...even characters I don't use much. 

As for the strategy...this is still a warriors game.

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19 hours ago, Anomalocaris said:

I normally would oppose this, but with how quick levelling up is in FE Warriors maybe it wouldn't be so bad.

I steamrolled the free update map because I was already near max level with most characters, so I'd like some actual challenge going forward.

Alternatively, every map is just in the 95-99 range, which I guess could work, but removes any sense of progression.

I agree, I feel like the new history maps would feel really trivial if all we have is capped levels to work off of and lets not give enemies higher caps, it feels like they are cheating us with crap like that.

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I'm pretty sure I've played FEW considerably less than my time with Hyrule Warriors where I don't remember getting any characters anywhere close to 99, not even Link. While it's true I only have one unit at level 99 in FEW, my lowest level character is 45 since I keep hitting the money cap and using it on the guys I don't often play as. If I had to guess the average level of my characters, it's about 65. And I'm still not done with all the objectives I want to clear.

Sort of unrelated, but these Warriors games need more things you can do with money than just training grounds and chump change amounts for your upgrades. Make it so we can buy materials. Running out of materials is mostly a concern for the first few chapters and for post game, so I don't think KT needs to worry about players cutting out too much of the gameplay from an already overlong experience

Anyway, I think the game would benefit greater from harder challenges, even if you can only get them through DLC maps. The toughest challenge is probably the Anna recruitment mission? I don't remember encountering anything else in the game where enemies reached past level 60. The level cap surprised me with how low it is, but it helps reinforce that feeling that I could reasonably finish everything in the game with some effort. Even increasing the level cap to a conservative 150 would break that feeling for me.

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I don't really see the need for bringing the level cap in general any higher than Lvl 99 considering that if you want any extra damage, there are bonus attributes that can make anything that has a weakness to a particular attribute look like a normal enemy.  Even the damage reduction on other enemies isn't that big of a deal when using a weapon who's max power is at 240 as the drop to what I think is 185-195 as a penalty isn't a huge deal (unique weapons with True Power unlocked don't suffer the power drop but still do less damage to enemies who aren't weak to any added bonus attributes).  Like others who responded, there are consequences that come with the added benefit of having an increased level cap...such as enemies who are higher leveled and are often times way too strong even when the gap in difficulty says otherwise.  I wouldn't say the game having '99 chapters at the least' is particularly wanted as the traditional FE games in the main series have at least 25 chapters (including endgame) with some actually being quite agonizing to finish without losses due to bonus exp. being limited on receiving to only after the chapter is completed the while Warriors only had at most 21 chapters and had an easy way to 'cheat' the difficulty via Training Grounds as you could get gold by selling weapons so you could over-level your units before the endgame even struck.

3 hours ago, Glennstavos said:

I'm pretty sure I've played FEW considerably less than my time with Hyrule Warriors where I don't remember getting any characters anywhere close to 99, not even Link. While it's true I only have one unit at level 99 in FEW, my lowest level character is 45 since I keep hitting the money cap and using it on the guys I don't often play as. If I had to guess the average level of my characters, it's about 65. And I'm still not done with all the objectives I want to clear.

Sort of unrelated, but these Warriors games need more things you can do with money than just training grounds and chump change amounts for your upgrades. Make it so we can buy materials. Running out of materials is mostly a concern for the first few chapters and for post game, so I don't think KT needs to worry about players cutting out too much of the gameplay from an already overlong experience

Anyway, I think the game would benefit greater from harder challenges, even if you can only get them through DLC maps. The toughest challenge is probably the Anna recruitment mission? I don't remember encountering anything else in the game where enemies reached past level 60. The level cap surprised me with how low it is, but it helps reinforce that feeling that I could reasonably finish everything in the game with some effort. Even increasing the level cap to a conservative 150 would break that feeling for me.

Anna's mission is at default, a Lvl 80 however all the enemies are at least Lvl 90 with the named enemies being at Lvl 93 at the beginning.  This means that even with Lvl 99 promoted units, the mission is no cakewalk, especially if your doing Invisible Ties, The Dark Pontifex, Noble Lady of Caelin or Together to the End.  The former only has two mounted units (one who hates magic and has two weaknesses one to Plateslayer and the other to Mountslayer and the other hates bows and anything with Wingslayer), one healer and two strong units who aren't really walled on either the physical or magic side (the twins are also you're other viable units).  Robin faces stiff competition as one of the beginning enemies is a Lvl 93 Validar and a number of enemies pack high Resistance.  The second gives you three units outside of the twins (I think Leo and Robin are added as they are replacing two of the 'would be characters' so there might be five units outside the twins) and your choices are much more strict as Tiki's usage isn't as good and your main powerhouse is Marth and some enemies shrug off Tomes rather quickly.  Noble Lady of Caelin gives you Lyn, Chrom, Marth and Robin and I believe Caeda as well including the twins.  While this gives you a balanced branch (Marth/Lyn for mob killing and Chrom for bossing), you only have one healer not including the twins (if Caeda is added) and said healer is your only mounted unit who can reach objectives that are in danger but can die quickly to bows or to anything with Wingslayer.  The last one isn't recommended as your only ally I believe is Celica.  The Path Is Yours is the best since outside of the twins you have five mounted units (Hinoka, Xander, Camilla, Leo and Elise) and the two elder Nohrians are also tanks who hit hard but are hard to control.  You have three healers (Hinoka, Sakura and Elise) and three ridiculously powerful hitters (Ryoma, Corrin and Takumi).  Of course Dragonslayer spells death for Corrin and Mountslayer will eliminate three of your units (Xander, Leo and Elise) while Wingslayer kills two of them (Hinoka and Camilla).

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1 hour ago, Emblem Blade said:

I don't really see the need for bringing the level cap in general any higher than Lvl 99 considering that if you want any extra damage, there are bonus attributes that can make anything that has a weakness to a particular attribute look like a normal enemy.  Even the damage reduction on other enemies isn't that big of a deal when using a weapon who's max power is at 240 as the drop to what I think is 185-195 as a penalty isn't a huge deal (unique weapons with True Power unlocked don't suffer the power drop but still do less damage to enemies who aren't weak to any added bonus attributes).  Like others who responded, there are consequences that come with the added benefit of having an increased level cap...such as enemies who are higher leveled and are often times way too strong even when the gap in difficulty says otherwise.  I wouldn't say the game having '99 chapters at the least' is particularly wanted as the traditional FE games in the main series have at least 25 chapters (including endgame) with some actually being quite agonizing to finish without losses due to bonus exp. being limited on receiving to only after the chapter is completed the while Warriors only had at most 21 chapters and had an easy way to 'cheat' the difficulty via Training Grounds as you could get gold by selling weapons so you could over-level your units before the endgame even struck.

Anna's mission is at default, a Lvl 80 however all the enemies are at least Lvl 90 with the named enemies being at Lvl 93 at the beginning.  This means that even with Lvl 99 promoted units, the mission is no cakewalk, especially if your doing Invisible Ties, The Dark Pontifex, Noble Lady of Caelin or Together to the End.  The former only has two mounted units (one who hates magic and has two weaknesses one to Plateslayer and the other to Mountslayer and the other hates bows and anything with Wingslayer), one healer and two strong units who aren't really walled on either the physical or magic side (the twins are also you're other viable units).  Robin faces stiff competition as one of the beginning enemies is a Lvl 93 Validar and a number of enemies pack high Resistance.  The second gives you three units outside of the twins (I think Leo and Robin are added as they are replacing two of the 'would be characters' so there might be five units outside the twins) and your choices are much more strict as Tiki's usage isn't as good and your main powerhouse is Marth and some enemies shrug off Tomes rather quickly.  Noble Lady of Caelin gives you Lyn, Chrom, Marth and Robin and I believe Caeda as well including the twins.  While this gives you a balanced branch (Marth/Lyn for mob killing and Chrom for bossing), you only have one healer not including the twins (if Caeda is added) and said healer is your only mounted unit who can reach objectives that are in danger but can die quickly to bows or to anything with Wingslayer.  The last one isn't recommended as your only ally I believe is Celica.  The Path Is Yours is the best since outside of the twins you have five mounted units (Hinoka, Xander, Camilla, Leo and Elise) and the two elder Nohrians are also tanks who hit hard but are hard to control.  You have three healers (Hinoka, Sakura and Elise) and three ridiculously powerful hitters (Ryoma, Corrin and Takumi).  Of course Dragonslayer spells death for Corrin and Mountslayer will eliminate three of your units (Xander, Leo and Elise) while Wingslayer kills two of them (Hinoka and Camilla).

I didn't think Frederick was weak to plateslayer, and even if he was, enemies don't really use special attributes outside of bows and enemy heroes (Chrom, Marth, Rowan, etc.).

Also, I don't think Lyn is even available on her own map, neither is Ceada since she's an NPC. Celica is ironically the only unit you can't use in Together to the End if memory serves.

Also, in The Path is yours, you can only use a Corrin, the twins, and Anna. To me it is the hardest for this fact alone. Also, not sure why you're so gungho for mounted units.

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I'd rather the level caps not rise, considering we're going to be getting a bunch of new characters soon, which would make the overall process tedious even if Paragon exists. 

Granted the majority of characters are actually all fun to use as opposed to HW where you had to cherry pick who was fun and alot of movesets in that game were controversial for the hardcore warriors fans in their effectiveness.

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I would like my units to start feeling super powerful, So I wouldnt mind raising the level cap, As long as it doesnt reach 255 like Hyrule warriors did. perhaps just 200.

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On one hand yes, cause I feel like new HM maps would become too easy if kept at 99 max. However, coming from HW where the Twilight map and Majora's Mask map pretty much forced you to grind up your characters to the new max in order to stand any chance which was absurd. Especially the Twilight map, which I wasn't even able to beat until the level 255 cap.

Even if levels are gained faster in FEW, I still would not like the tedium involved with grinding characters past 99, especially considering we are getting 9 new characters which will all more than likely start at level 1.

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The biggest problem with the TP and MM maps were, in my opinion, not so much the necessity of the level cap but the absurd amount of damage enemies dealt, being able to spoil your S-rank with one attack.

FE warriors doesn't have as big a problem with that due to Dual Guard and the rather high damage threshold for getting an A-rank. As long as the enemies don't become insanely durable too, I think raising the level cap will be fine.

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Plus these games dont really have any giant bosses to worry about except for the final one, but even he doesnt show up on every single map, So raising the level cap wont be that much harder compared to hyrule warriors.

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1 hour ago, Azz said:

On one hand yes, cause I feel like new HM maps would become too easy if kept at 99 max. However, coming from HW where the Twilight map and Majora's Mask map pretty much forced you to grind up your characters to the new max in order to stand any chance which was absurd. Especially the Twilight map, which I wasn't even able to beat until the level 255 cap.

Even if levels are gained faster in FEW, I still would not like the tedium involved with grinding characters past 99, especially considering we are getting 9 new characters which will all more than likely start at level 1.

Personally, I'd say the real problem with both those maps was as Anomalcaris said - you took an insane amount of damage even from grunts. I'd say one of the worst missions by far was a giant bosses mission where the reward is for Ruto, who has to deal with Gohma, the goddamn Imprisoned, and a Ghirahim betrayal on top of that. Mercifully, Hyrule Warriors Legends nerfed those maps.

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4 hours ago, Azz said:

On one hand yes, cause I feel like new HM maps would become too easy if kept at 99 max. However, coming from HW where the Twilight map and Majora's Mask map pretty much forced you to grind up your characters to the new max in order to stand any chance which was absurd. Especially the Twilight map, which I wasn't even able to beat until the level 255 cap.

Even if levels are gained faster in FEW, I still would not like the tedium involved with grinding characters past 99, especially considering we are getting 9 new characters which will all more than likely start at level 1.

FE:W removes most of the 'harshness' on gaining levels if only due to how simple the Training Grounds work.  Once Invisible Ties is unlocked, the Lvl 20 Timed Assault can be abused to get units to at least Lvl 70 if one has the patience.  Combine that with selling any weapons not needed results in the leveling issue being not so much of a problem.  The Lvl 61-63 Timed Assault after the map is completed allows one to get units to max their levels out since you'll most likely have gained access to Silver Weapons if not Braves which often net good amounts of gold over a few runs if they have a full 6 slots and most of them are already full although there are some 'hurdles' in the path.  Increasing the level cap would be better if the Training Grounds had more of a restriction to avoid being easy picking, maybe if it were accessible after every playable character in the main story at least was unlocked or you could only use it to level up a set number of units after each mission.  FE:W is one of the easier 'Warrior' games that was released so some mechanics would need to be tweaked to avoid making the game more of a challenge while making it less challenging.  Yes, grinding is a pain (and always shall be in the FE universe for those who really dislike doing so) but if there was some sort of reason in-game to require players to do so that could help.  Such as some maps post-game can only be accessed once every character that one has are at least at a certain level would mean that even the less-used characters would have to be used.

19 hours ago, Arthur97 said:

I didn't think Frederick was weak to plateslayer, and even if he was, enemies don't really use special attributes outside of bows and enemy heroes (Chrom, Marth, Rowan, etc.).

Also, I don't think Lyn is even available on her own map, neither is Ceada since she's an NPC. Celica is ironically the only unit you can't use in Together to the End if memory serves.

Also, in The Path is yours, you can only use a Corrin, the twins, and Anna. To me it is the hardest for this fact alone. Also, not sure why you're so gungho for mounted units.

Some classes have dual bonus weaknesses.  Mounted units are anything but flyers.  Frederick is on a mount and is also treated as an Armored unit, giving him two bonus weaknesses to Plateslayer and Mountslayer (on top of his general weakness to Tomes thanks to his crappy Resistance).  Camilla has a dual weakness, one to Bows/Wingslayer (as she's a flyer) and another to Dragonslayer (thanks to her flying mount).

That's what I find odd when I look at the usable units on Anna's missions.  Unlike every other mission that has a restriction to a certain game's characters, those missions twist the actual use of who can be used.  Closest example is when a mission says 'Fates Heroes' but only allows the use of Corrin out of them all whereas in Invisible Ties, it says 'Awakening Heroes' and allows the use of what can be said the entire cast.  I'm rather unusual for mounts in this case as while I really don't like using anything mounted (Freddy and Xander are hard to control as they hit fast but move too much, Camilla hits too slow, Leo and Elise alongside Camilla don't really gain much on their Awakening Gauge, and the aerial trio are like Camilla but trade being 'slow' for being a bit too fast and the aerial Knights main use is their C6 command), they are of use on Anna's missions where the maps tend to be very huge.  Given the possibility of enemy Rally Commanders, Sages/Sorcerers who spam long-distance lightning which is a pain to avoid (your ally units take a crap ton of damage on higher difficulties so healing everyone is hard) or create Shadows, enemy units trying to regroup (which on large maps is a hassle to prevent), or simply trying reach the objective without losing too much time, anything non-mounted (both ground and air mounts) will struggle to prevent most of those conditions.  At least anything that could be considered 'mounted' by ground or air terms can reach the enemy unit in question and if paired up properly, complete that objective by defeating the enemy.  This is the issue when you lack such units due to restrictions.

3 hours ago, Thany said:

Plus these games dont really have any giant bosses to worry about except for the final one, but even he doesnt show up on every single map, So raising the level cap wont be that much harder compared to hyrule warriors.

Said final boss isn't really hard compared to everything else being thrown at you.  In the Main Story where you fought it for real, you had two Sages bombarding your entire team with long-range magic and that easily takes a heavy toll within a minute on top of Shadow enemies who soak up a lot of damage before going down.  The dragon isn't even a pain by that point.  On the two History Maps that feature it, everything prior to the final boss is harder than the final opponent itself for the most part.  Increasing the level cap past Lvl 99 would, again but for a different reason than I listed above, be nicer if the game tossed out enemies who are harder to defeat who were at least Lvl 90 (I'm talking about general enemies not those who have names) however the only Lvl 90+ enemies are those on Anna's missions so outside of repeating those missions (unless any upcoming updates have maps where the enemy levels are higher than Lvl 80), increasing the level cap would make the game easier than it is (and FE:W is overall easier than most other FE games even when playing the same difficulty and mode as you would on other FE games and is perhaps the easiest 'Warrior' game).  The other issue is that for anything non-History Mode, your ally units (those you can't control or command) are at set levels and those levels never change even on higher difficulties.  The increase in max level caps would result in stronger enemies who could create a 'Game Over' faster than anyone would want, especially problematic on missions where an Ally Commander or Ally Fort Commander (Base) suffers from a heavy disadvantage to most of the enemy forces and is lower leveled than the enemies in general.

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1 hour ago, Emblem Blade said:

Some classes have dual bonus weaknesses.  Mounted units are anything but flyers.  Frederick is on a mount and is also treated as an Armored unit, giving him two bonus weaknesses to Plateslayer and Mountslayer (on top of his general weakness to Tomes thanks to his crappy Resistance).  Camilla has a dual weakness, one to Bows/Wingslayer (as she's a flyer) and another to Dragonslayer (thanks to her flying mount).

That's what I find odd when I look at the usable units on Anna's missions.  Unlike every other mission that has a restriction to a certain game's characters, those missions twist the actual use of who can be used.  Closest example is when a mission says 'Fates Heroes' but only allows the use of Corrin out of them all whereas in Invisible Ties, it says 'Awakening Heroes' and allows the use of what can be said the entire cast.  I'm rather unusual for mounts in this case as while I really don't like using anything mounted (Freddy and Xander are hard to control as they hit fast but move too much, Camilla hits too slow, Leo and Elise alongside Camilla don't really gain much on their Awakening Gauge, and the aerial trio are like Camilla but trade being 'slow' for being a bit too fast and the aerial Knights main use is their C6 command), they are of use on Anna's missions where the maps tend to be very huge.  Given the possibility of enemy Rally Commanders, Sages/Sorcerers who spam long-distance lightning which is a pain to avoid (your ally units take a crap ton of damage on higher difficulties so healing everyone is hard) or create Shadows, enemy units trying to regroup (which on large maps is a hassle to prevent), or simply trying reach the objective without losing too much time, anything non-mounted (both ground and air mounts) will struggle to prevent most of those conditions.  At least anything that could be considered 'mounted' by ground or air terms can reach the enemy unit in question and if paired up properly, complete that objective by defeating the enemy.  This is the issue when you lack such units due to restrictions.

Still seems hard to prove since I don't think I've ever fought an enemy with either plate or mount slaying weapons.

I don't think any Fates Heroes mission restrict like that, only the Anna mission which is technically a different restriction. All the Anna missions' restrictions are named after the illustrations which means they can do whatever they like.

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46 minutes ago, Arthur97 said:

Still seems hard to prove since I don't think I've ever fought an enemy with either plate or mount slaying weapons.

I don't think any Fates Heroes mission restrict like that, only the Anna mission which is technically a different restriction. All the Anna missions' restrictions are named after the illustrations which means they can do whatever they like.

Try using weapons that have either Plateslayer or Mountslayer and using said weapons against an enemy Frederick.

Anna's Missions...

Invisible Ties: No Restrictions; Awakening Heroes + Rowan/Lianna.

The Path Is Yours: No Restrictions; Corrin, Rowan/Lianna, Anna

The Dark Pontifex: No Restrictions; Marth, Caeda, Rowan/Lianna, Robin, Leo, Anna

Noble Lady of Caelin: No Restrictions; Rowan/Lianna, Chrom, Robin, Anna

Together to the End: No Restrictions; Within the heart (whatever that means)...everyone bar Celica.

The Path Is Yours is barely harder than Noble Lady of Caelin which adds in one extra character to use, meanwhile Together to the End only restricts Celica as unusable.  Anna says that her rules don't follow normal regulations.

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4 minutes ago, Emblem Blade said:

Try using weapons that have either Plateslayer or Mountslayer and using said weapons against an enemy Frederick.

Anna's Missions...

Invisible Ties: No Restrictions; Awakening Heroes + Rowan/Lianna.

The Path Is Yours: No Restrictions; Corrin, Rowan/Lianna, Anna

The Dark Pontifex: No Restrictions; Marth, Caeda, Rowan/Lianna, Robin, Leo, Anna

Noble Lady of Caelin: No Restrictions; Rowan/Lianna, Chrom, Robin, Anna

Together to the End: No Restrictions; Within the heart (whatever that means)...everyone bar Celica.

The Path Is Yours is barely harder than Noble Lady of Caelin which adds in one extra character to use, meanwhile Together to the End only restricts Celica as unusable.  Anna says that her rules don't follow normal regulations.

I guess that would do it, but it still doesn't really affect you playing as Frederick.

Part of my problem with the Fates map is who you're given. The twins are...okay. Anna is...okay, and I'd rather not use a Corrin so I'm without many options. With the other one, I had access to Chrom, Robin, and Marth. 

Edited by Arthur97
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1 hour ago, Arthur97 said:

I guess that would do it, but it still doesn't really affect you playing as Frederick.

Part of my problem with the Fates map is who you're given. The twins are...okay. Anna is...okay, and I'd rather not use a Corrin so I'm without many options. With the other one, I had access to Chrom, Robin, and Marth. 

Corrin's specialty is taking on enemies 1-v-1 as they lack a lot of attacks that effectively hit mobs but most of their C finishers hit hard and they have at most 3 C finishers that proc the Stun Gauge against anything that isn't a Lance-user (or anything that can't be stunned regularly).  Their C5 shatters the enemy's guard on the final hit and if it hits anything that isn't guarding, does great damage against anything in the hitbox without sending anyone flying.  The normal attack chain is their only reliable distance attack but it sends anyone hit flying backwards a bit on the final blow so that's pretty ugly.  I'm also guessing that Anna is only playable after her mission is completed as otherwise she's a NPC ally (like how we have an NPC Ally Chrom in Invisible Ties).  So we're stuck with a Lvl 80-90 NPC Anna who might just get herself killed as we lack the ability to give her commands (her AI in Awakening as an NPC Other unit was ok given the conditions but in Fates her recruitment chapter was pretty annoying early on with so many enemies and she could only take two hits at most before going down.)

So far the only thing that an extended Level cap would help for given the current status of FE:W is for Anna's mission as every other mission in History Mode can be completed with units who aren't even Lvl 80.  It's entirely possible to clear Together to the End (including the Distortions) with promoted units below Lvl 70 despite your damage not being as high as desired (compared to being Lvl 99).  Even then, having an extended level cap just for five missions (which only one is needed to be done) to get one particular character isn't enough.  There has to be more of a logical conclusion for increasing an already perfectly fine level cap than just to have 'stronger' units.  A higher level cap would be nice, as I've said before, if there was an in-game reason to train every character available.  If the game had more than just a few chapters where certain characters (outside of the story-important beginners) are forced to be used that would add some incentive to use those who aren't easy to use.  Your earlier post about character max stats is kind of...unusual.  Complaining about how some characters have higher stats than others isn't uncommon as FE doesn't really follow who has what.  Ryoma has the second highest Strength stat in-game so far at 105, only slightly higher than Takumi's 102 and being below Camilla's 106.  Lyn's Strength isn't even higher than these three, even Chrom and Frederick who have their Strength at 100 are higher.  Lyn's stats follow the traditional Swordmaster, decently high Strength with very high Skill/Speed with decent HP/Luck with everything else being average or trash (oddly she has one more point in Defense to Ryoma's one more point in Resistance).

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