what u DONT want to see in FE Switch

[Troublesome Knight]

On 3/14/2018 at 4:33 PM, Marty said:

- No children. I did not play FE4 so I don't know how well they work there, but they were garbage in awafates. In Awakening they are interesting characters for the most part, but I hate how their relationship with their parents is portrayed (seriously. If you show up in the present with similar ages then it makes no sense whatsoever to automatically treat each other by a father-son basis. it never felt natural to me except for main plot!Lucina, but it still shows up in her supports.) and I specially hate how monotone your army turns out because of them. In older games you are always gaining new allys with diverse origins, while awafates has the playable cast cut in half. And the worst part is how powerful they are when compared to their parents with basically forces you to use them and, in harder playthroughts, you barely grow attached to your units because you are rushing to create the perfect army to deal with that lunatic run.

8

That point about how the 1st Gen characters treat the 2nd Gen characters in supports is interesting and I think I sort of agree with it. It does seem a bit weird for them to be so comfortable treating each other like parent and child when they're so close in age. It sort of reminds me of Sailor Moon and how they handled the Child From the Future plotline. Whenever Chibiusa goes back into the past to visit Usagi they treat each other more like sisters than mother and daughter and that felt like it made more sense (and is also pretty hilarious to watch). Of course, I think part of that is because Usagi and Neo Queen Serenity act so differently that it's easy for Chibiusa to treat them like they're different people, but still. 

Edited March 16, 2018 by Troublesome Knight

[Altrosa]

On 3/7/2018 at 11:36 PM, kiaxxl said:

Replaying Echoes has inspired me; I DON'T want another Faye 2: Electric Boogaloo character. Cordelia were already kind of irritating at times  (some of her supports are good, some are "wahh chrom don't love me" and then Faye took it to a whole other level. We really don't need another character like that. If they have to do unrequited love then please, some subtlety. 

I still feel like the structure of supports and village chats screwed over any development Faye could've had since there is the subtlest hint that her crush on Alm turning into blind obsession was her coping with the war (Like, "I can do this because I do it for him, no matter how awful! It won't always be this horrible!") 

I think other Catria types better received since they have other facets to their characters. Faye didn't get that extra care put into her.

Faye's also a good example of why I find the supports of Echoes so frustratingly bad. Fates was so far on the opposite end that some Supports were super forced or unmemorable, but Echoes was so barebone it felt like a waste...

[Martin]

I don't want an army with an over abundance of pretty boys. I appreciate having an army of people who looks nice, but I REALLY want to have a horsed face ally with a cool, spiky mustache at one point or another or maybe a character that would resemble someone like Don Quixote. 

Having facial structures other than the standard perfect faced anime dude will make the overall world seem a little more realistic and would be a lot more appreciated by yours truly. 

 

Also, I would love it if they would remove the boob armor. 

[vanguard333]

20 hours ago, Martin said:

Also, I would love it if they would remove the boob armor. 

I can agree to that; one good blow to the middle of the armour and it would cave in; exactly why women wore the same armour as men historically (seriously; we have one or two written accounts of female knights that participated I tournaments, and Joan of Arc received a suit of plate armour to help ensure her survival, seeing as she was at the battlefield, even if she didn't actually fight, and that plate armour was the same as any plate armour that we see in that time period).

[Acacia Sgt]

Just to point out, but if the armor caves in, then it's not because of its shape; but rather because it was badly made, or the blow was one that would pierce through "practical-looking" armor as well, so again the shape has nothing to do with it.

Is the breast plate on females an object of sexualization that needs to be dialed back to an extent? Yes, of course. Is the design itself actually impractical? Not really.

[Shadow Mir]

On 3/8/2018 at 9:56 PM, Dreamyboi said:

Just looking at Riev's portrait tells me all I need to know but what about Valter? Was he another "I'm possessed/corrupted and that lazily excuses my lack of depth" situation or is he just disappointing like Berkut? 

Try both.

Another thing I'd rather not see is Thracia's system of having units within the same class having different promotions. It's ridiculous, and it does nothing but screw over units.

[Emperor Hardin]

5 minutes ago, Levant Mir Celestia said:

Try both.

Another thing I'd rather not see is Thracia's system of having units within the same class having different promotions. It's ridiculous, and it does nothing but screw over units.

How so?

If anything it helps people like Sun immensely.

[Von Ithipathachai]

39 minutes ago, Emperor Hardin said:

How so?

If anything it helps people like Sun immensely.

The problem is that there's just as much potential for units like Miranda to get screwed over by being forced into promotions they aren't suited for as there is potential for other units to benefit from it.  And IS doesn't always make the best decisions when it comes to unit balancing.

I figured that would be apparent, since you two spent an awful lot of time arguing about it in the Character-specific promotions thread.

Anyway, I still like the idea of character-specific promotion despite its drawbacks.  But I would still rather see branching promotions instead.

(EDIT: ...Then again, now that I think about it, Miranda is the only unit in Thracia 776's big cast who can be considered hurt by her promotion.  Lara may lose stats when she promotes to Dancer, but she sucks at fighting without help from Crusader Scrolls regardless, so she gains more utility than she loses.  And since she can still promote into a Rogue from a Dancer, I like to think of Lara promoting to Dancer being an odd precursor to Reclassing.

TL,DR, maybe character-specific promotions really aren't as bad as they look...)

Edited May 1, 2018 by Von Ithipathachai

[Shadow Mir]

21 minutes ago, Emperor Hardin said:

How so?

If anything it helps people like Sun immensely.

Remember Miranda? Because I sure as hell do not. Why? Because her being forced to promote into Mage Knight only screwed her over instead of helping her.

[Emperor Hardin]

26 minutes ago, Levant Mir Celestia said:

Remember Miranda? Because I sure as hell do not. Why? Because her being forced to promote into Mage Knight only screwed her over instead of helping her.

Miranda's issue was she came in late without elite and with low weapon ranks. A promotion to sage wouldn't have helped.

[Shadow Mir]

4 minutes ago, Emperor Hardin said:

Miranda's issue was she came in late without elite and with low weapon ranks. A promotion to sage wouldn't have helped.

True, but if a promotion to Sage wouldn't have helped, how in the seven hells does a promotion to an obviously inferior class help her? The answer to that is simple: it doesn't.

[Emperor Hardin]

1 minute ago, Levant Mir Celestia said:

True, but if a promotion to Sage wouldn't have helped, how in the seven hells does a promotion to an obviously inferior class help her? The answer to that is simple: it doesn't.

Promotion to Mage Knight at least make her unique.

What would've helped Miranda is some pursuit critical, higher weapon ranks and the elite skill.

[Shadow Mir]

9 minutes ago, Emperor Hardin said:

Promotion to Mage Knight at least make her unique.

What would've helped Miranda is some pursuit critical, higher weapon ranks and the elite skill.

Sorry, but "it makes her unique" is no excuse, far as I'm concerned. Being unique does NOT mean it makes her worth using.

[Emperor Hardin]

10 minutes ago, Levant Mir Celestia said:

Sorry, but "it makes her unique" is no excuse, far as I'm concerned. Being unique does NOT mean it makes her worth using.

My point is, you are trying to use Miranda as a way to say unique promotions don't work, when not only is Miranda a unique case, she is brought down by other factors.

Plenty of characters have benefitted from unique promotions. FE3 Merric, Lara, Narron, Sun, ETC. Essentially your argument isn't relevant.

Edited May 1, 2018 by Emperor Hardin

[vanguard333]

On ‎2018‎-‎05‎-‎01 at 12:07 PM, Acacia Sgt said:

Just to point out, but if the armor caves in, then it's not because of its shape; but rather because it was badly made, or the blow was one that would pierce through "practical-looking" armor as well, so again the shape has nothing to do with it.

Is the breast plate on females an object of sexualization that needs to be dialed back to an extent? Yes, of course. Is the design itself actually impractical? Not really.

Okay; I admit that cave in was a bit of an exaggeration. My point, however, still stands: actual armour is designed to let blows glance, and not take all of the force, while the breast plate on female characters has an obvious point of concavity that would take the entire force of a blow from an enemy weapon. Worst case scenario (like a blow from a lance from a charging knight on horseback); such a design could potentially cave in. So yes; it is impractical.

Path of Radiance and Radiant Dawn handled female chest armour design a bit better; at the very least, there were no points of concavity in the armour. 

Edited May 2, 2018 by vanguard333

[Slumber]

On 5/1/2018 at 11:07 AM, Acacia Sgt said:

Just to point out, but if the armor caves in, then it's not because of its shape; but rather because it was badly made, or the blow was one that would pierce through "practical-looking" armor as well, so again the shape has nothing to do with it.

Is the breast plate on females an object of sexualization that needs to be dialed back to an extent? Yes, of course. Is the design itself actually impractical? Not really.

Breast plates shaped like boobs is actually very impractical.

Have you ever played any sort of contact sport or baseball? If you've worn a cup, you'd know how it's shaped. It's not shaped to perfectly conform to your junk. It's shaped to protect while also giving space to move around, because they naturally shift and move around when you're active, and constraining them with something hard is very uncomfortable(Unless it's your kink or something).

The same sort of logic applies to boobplates in armor. It'd be better to have a larger, bowed chestplate than to try to protect each individual boob. The most extreme it could likely be and still be functional would be something like Casca's armor in Berserk. Camilla or even Effie would be absolute murder on some poor girl's girls.

Edited May 2, 2018 by Slumber

[Strullemia]

Children. You know they're forcing it in when they're using a hyperbolic time chamber to justify their existence. 

[Acacia Sgt]

2 hours ago, vanguard333 said:

Okay; I admit that cave in was a bit of an exaggeration. My point, however, still stands: actual armour is designed to let blows glance, and not take all of the force, while the breast plate on female characters has an obvious point of concavity that would take the entire force of a blow from an enemy weapon. Worst case scenario (like a blow from a lance from a charging knight on horseback); such a design could potentially cave in. So yes; it is impractical.

Path of Radiance and Radiant Dawn handled female chest armour design a bit better; at the very least, there were no points of concavity in the armour. 

2 hours ago, Slumber said:

Breast plates shaped like boobs is actually very impractical.

Have you ever played any sort of contact sport or baseball? If you've worn a cup, you'd know how it's shaped. It's not shaped to perfectly conform to your junk. It's shaped to protect while also giving space to move around, because they naturally shift and move around when you're active, and constraining them with something hard is very uncomfortable(Unless it's your kink or something).

The same sort of logic applies to boobplates in armor. It'd be better to have a larger, bowed chestplate than to try to protect each individual boob. The most extreme it could likely be and still be functional would be something like Casca's armor in Berserk. Camilla or even Effie would be absolute murder on some poor girl's girls.

Exactly.

Plate armor is by design meant to null or deflect striking blows. Which is why full plate made you practically invincible to sword strikes. Unless you were skilled and/or lucky to strike at the areas not protected by full plate, you were better off with piercing blows of enough force. Hence, lances, maces, sufficiently fast arrows, etc. Even a sword can work if you use it as a lance. That's also why the pole-axe was a versatile weapon. The axe blade was for unarmored opponents, while the small pike on the opposite side was for piercing blows at armored foes.

Realisticly, though, if you were fighting someone in full-plate, you were better off capturing them, not killing them. Since only the rich could afford full plate, so they're better to hold them at ransom than outright kill.

Now, onto the actual breast-plate, that's also what I meant about dialing back its sexualization. The concavity, as mentioned, is a real concern when it comes to dealing the concentrated blows needed to take down someone in armor. The thing is, though, armor by design is already meant to have the chest area reinforced further, precisely to protect the heart. If the armor ain't thick enough to witstand piercing blows, it ain't protecting you no matter the shape.

Realisticly, though, not every opponent you will face will have the strength or the quality of weapon to do that. Armor was practically a luxury. Full-plate was only mostly a thing of the rich and powerful. A peasant would be lucky to have even part of the set. Same for weapons. Best qualities were not for everyone. Depending on the lifestyle, that also factored if you could even have a battle-ready body to do the things like dealing a piercing blow strong enough to invalidate the protection of a full plate, if even having the weapon that could do it. This is also why armor fell in disuse with the rise of firearms. Firearms didn't outright made armor useless. On the contrary, "Bullet Proof" as a term comes precisely from armor made to withstand bullets. The real problem was that making "Munition Plate" was even more costly, while firearms became more sophisticated, cheaper, and accesible. Making the armor to match simply became too costly to keep up.

In the end, giving chest armor protusions akin to breasts isn't the problem. The problem is that it's done to the extent of concavity problems, and then the armor itself is not made thick enough. Form-fitting, if you will. It's a problem that dates back to medieval times themselves, people giving "feminized" armor to women in fictional portrayals to show they're, well, women. Even if it has to be breasts that are "barely there", you can have them in an armor design without having a big enough impact to the effectiveness of the armor. Since not every enemy will have the capability to overcome it.

But well, in the end, this is a video game. I know some people have different tolerance levels to how much a work of fiction is... well, fictional. As for me... I don't care, either way. Make them as fictional or realistic for all I care. I won't give a fuzz. Sometimes, though, and this is just my personal opinion, I do mind when a work of fiction is too real. What's the point of fiction, then, if I can't escape reality for it if even temporarily. Might as well remain in reality, and not pursue works of fiction, then...

[vanguard333]

Acacia Sgt I understand your point, and, to an extent, I agree. If I may point out just one thing:

20 hours ago, Acacia Sgt said:

Plate armor is by design meant to null or deflect striking blows. Which is why full plate made you practically invincible to sword strikes. Unless you were skilled and/or lucky to strike at the areas not protected by full plate, you were better off with piercing blows of enough force. Hence, lances, maces, sufficiently fast arrows, etc. Even a sword can work if you use it as a lance. That's also why the pole-axe was a versatile weapon. The axe blade was for unarmored opponents, while the small pike on the opposite side was for piercing blows at armored foes.

You're correct about full plate being invincible to sword strikes. However, a) you listed maces as an example of a piercing blow, when it's really a bludgeoning weapon meant for blunt force. b) "sufficiently fast arrows" whether arrows could or couldn't pierce plate armour is still debated to this day. I lean on the side of it couldn't; I have seen tests done with longbows and plate cuirasses, and all historical accounts of someone in plate armour being directly killed by an arrow strike were hit in the face when they had their visor up. c) "Even a sword can work if you use it as a lance" No; just no. Swords cannot go through plate armour. With a sword, one either has to aim for gaps, likely using half-swording, or grab the blade with both hands and use the sword as an improvised hammer using a technique called a Mordhau; a technique I hope one day appears in FE as a skill.

[Acacia Sgt]

23 minutes ago, vanguard333 said:

Acacia Sgt I understand your point, and, to an extent, I agree. If I may point out just one thing:

You're correct about full plate being invincible to sword strikes. However, a) you listed maces as an example of a piercing blow, when it's really a bludgeoning weapon meant for blunt force. b) "sufficiently fast arrows" whether arrows could or couldn't pierce plate armour is still debated to this day. I lean on the side of it couldn't; I have seen tests done with longbows and plate cuirasses, and all historical accounts of someone in plate armour being directly killed by an arrow strike were hit in the face when they had their visor up. c) "Even a sword can work if you use it as a lance" No; just no. Swords cannot go through plate armour. With a sword, one either has to aim for gaps, likely using half-swording, or grab the blade with both hands and use the sword as an improvised hammer using a technique called a Mordhau; a technique I hope one day appears in FE as a skill.

a) Ah yes, my mistake. Shouldn't have used "piercing" there. It's more accurate to say weapons to exert enough force on the armor.

b) I think people have tried that, with crossbows. Certainly not with a bow, though. Besides, as I mentioned, more often than not you wanted to capture someone in full-plate, not kill them. Again, shouldn't have added "piercing" there. Or at least, it's not meant to be literal. The force is what pierces the armor, not the weapon itself. If you really wanted/needed to kill someone in armor, you inflicted internal injuries on the body inside the armor, hence inflicting enough forceon the armor that the shockwave of the impact reaches the body inside, causing damage. FE follows this with the Hammer weapon, in fact. Effective against armored units since it inflicts enough force to bypass the armor and hurts the body inside.

c) That's the point. The use of bludgeoning weapons or inflicting enough force on the armor is not to actually pierce it. It never was. At least not always since you wanted the guy inside alive, more often than not. Instead, their purpose was to damage the body inside. After all, there's two ways to take down someone in armor. That is one. The other is to inflict non-lethal force that disorients and stumbles the opposite, so you can reach the areas that not even full plate covers, as you mentioned.

[Griffinlwgameplayer]

I kind of hope that Builds go down in importance and stats become more important again. Lets be real stats are not very important in Fates and Awakening because you can run around killing more risen and bandits or whatever to max those out

[Altrosa]

Boob armor to me, a boobed person, always looked like a really intense sports bra than like, proper armor. That's the only practical benefit I see to them. But, form fitted leather could do that far better, more cheaply, and add less weight to themselves with the tech and materials seemingly available to the average FE lady. Furthermore, every girl in Fates that'd likely need and use a good bra in combat curiously doesn't.

Edited May 3, 2018 by Altrosa

[Modamy]

7 hours ago, Griffinlwgameplayer said:

I kind of hope that Builds go down in importance and stats become more important again. Lets be real stats are not very important in Fates and Awakening because you can run around killing more risen and bandits or whatever to max those out

I kind of get what you mean, I personally dislike how important skills and what combination of skills a unit can get has become so important. Although I don't dislike skills, I would rather the challenge be in the map design and the mission objectives rather than stats or skills.

[Lief]

- Bronze weapons! I can deal with iron weapons being used when steel is available, but bronze weaponry should be wielded by ancient Sumerians rather than medieval knights. Also, they're way too weak.

- No child units, since IS would need to make extra chapters that are ONLY for recruiting a single character rather than ones that....you know...flesh out the world or reveal backstory. I'd like gaiden chapters to be like they were in FE7, where you got a merchant and extra story details.

- My Castle. Too many unnecessary features like baths and materials for forging.

- Skills like poison strike and grisly wound, unless there's a skill that negates these (and is not enemy exclusive....)

- Too much stuff hidden behind a dlc paywall (like support convos...)

- A bad story (obviously, though I'm more optimistic on this front as Echoes was decent)

[redlight]

Recruiting OP units and buying skills with My castle

Fan service cutscenes

Petting and close-up feature

Boob physics. We don't need for breasts to jiggle in gameplay. It looked so bad on small and rough models

Overpowered Jagen/Oifey that makes other units of similar class pale in comparison

Hyperbolic time chamber children

Being able make ships that don't make any sense

Marriable child

Little sisters who you can marry

Bad story

Shitty MC

Token yandere

OP prfs like Fujin Yumi that make allies of similar class irrelevant