Choose Your Legends: Round 2 - Jan 21 - 28! Who will YOU vote for? [FEB 1: RESULTS ARE IN]

[omegaxis1]

1 minute ago, bottlegnomes said:

Alm, Celica, and Faye are the only consistent complaints I've heard, but those even are, in Alm's and Celica's cases, appended by but they're just so likable as people. There's always going to be complainers and that's how a lot of them seemed to me. They criticize Alm for being flawless and then turn around and talk about how awful Celica is for making mistakes. I personally can see the complaints about Alm's perfection, but he is just such a likable character that I don't particularly care. Celica I'm not in agreement with at all. Sure, we can criticize Celica's bad decisions since Jedah falls into every cliche about villains, but Celica doesn't have the benefit of seeing everything as a story and the people as characters who fit certain tropes. In her situation, most people wouldn't be willing to make the sacrifice she was and that should be admirable since she's in the metaphorical rock and hard place: She and all her friends probably die or she alone definitely dies. Sure it wasn't the right decision, but a ton of highly beloved fictional characters are know for their sacrifices which line up pretty much 1:1 with Celica's attitude.

I personally feel like the whole but Alm/Ike/whoever doesn't run into any issues is overblown in this community. Alm loses a leader of the resistance and has Clive constantly doubts him up to a certain point. He has to come to terms with killing his own father and he and Celica do butt heads, even if his decision ends up working out in the end. IIRC, he even worries about driving Celica away. It's a fairly traditional hero's journey with competent execution and a very likable cast.

I'm not saying any of FE's stories are Hamlet, but the complaints always seem to revolve around the same points and the critics always seem to be a vocal minority that just happen to not like a certain main character's look or personality and extrapolate that to the story being somehow worse than the others in the series. Anyway, back to the initial point, maybe not nothing but praise, but like 90% of everything I've heard is very positive toward SoV's characters.

See, here's the issue though. It isn't just that Alm was perfect, but the story was supposed to also be about Alm proving that blood doesn't mean anything, because he's a villager with no royal ties... at first. And at the end, we find out he is the Emperor's son, and rightful heir to the Rigelian throne. This ultimately destroys the entire setup of the lesson, because it just ends up showing that royalty is the right case. It wasn't some villager that became a great leader, it was a born royal who was always meant to be a leader. 

Also, Alm and Celica were supposed to represent Duma and Mila respectively. Alm was meant to be like Duma and seek strength, and Celica like Mila that sought love. But unlike the gods, Alm and Celica learn to utilize both. In fact, in Awakening DLC, when we recruit Alm, he explains that he's a guy that has a hard time showing compassion to enemies since he's trying to kill them. But Alm shows none of the qualities of Duma. He doesn't seek strength or an inability to show compassion, but rather just the opposite. 

And it isn't Celica making a mistake. It's Celica making an incredibly obvious mistake. Something that can be avoided using common sense. Jedah was clearly evil, and used ruthless methods, including even getting Alm trapped in a dragon cave where he fought many necrodargons. Celica still insists that this was the right thing to do. Celica trusting a man like that so easily is just Corrin-level of idiocy. She even lied to her friends and brother for crying out loud. She had no proof that anything that Jedah was saying was true. She never saw Mila until after she joined Jedah, and by the time she realized what a stupid mistake she made, it was too late. That's why Celica is harshly criticized. At least in Gaiden, it makes a bit more sense as to why she follows Jedah, in that she wants to save Alm. But here, she tries to justify that this would save Valentia. 

[Interdimensional Observer]

43 minutes ago, bottlegnomes said:

While I personally quite like Awakening's cast, I can see that, but why SoV? I've heard pretty much only positive things about them, and I personally like them quite a lot.

Bertram you think? I felt like RD gave him a decent enough backstory. There wasn't much that he could actually do as a rider and that was one of the thing I thought RD didn't completely drop the ball on.Bryce and Lanvega absolutely agreed. Lanvega didn't even get any art. Heck, we don't even know what class he was. It always came across as we talked about the old four riders but we only have three. Bryce could've been a little more like Brendan in FE7 where he's present and comes into play some, but for the most part just comes across as being pushed aside.

 

It happens to be a holdover from Fates. I heard the plot was garbage for a long time, so when I started playing I mashed Start through the story and never saw it, and I did the same with supports, and I turned off the voices and most of the time the animations, besides never visiting the Private Quarters or Hot Springs. I didn't want it to spread to SoV, but I didn't fight the instinct and I skipped the plot and characters there too. I think it is starting to infect me in non-FE too, I haven't bothered to pay attention to the plot of Breath of the Wild at all.

Awakening was before this happened. But with Awakening, I never bothered with the kids save Lucina until my very last run of it when I recruited only 2 of them (Project: Make Noire a Competent Ingame Hard Classic No Grind Bow User, was a failure). I would get characters to A Support, but other than Chrom I would never go to S (I might have gotten S but not recruited the kids once). I did monosex playthroughs where I saw the same-sex supports, but none of the opposite. I even cleared Future Past having never made anyone but Lucina (and an unrecruited Morgan) on the ladies only run. This itself may stem from a Rune Factory commitment issue of mine, where I just picked Mana to get over to the 2nd Gen of RF2, and never married in RF3 despite it being needed to advance the plot, and even in RF1, F, and ToD never married either. And since Fates, I've for some reason been wanting to forget Awakening's cast, even if I can't completely or mean them no malice.

The benefit of not engaging with the characters is I can stay aloof and unaffected in things like Camilla and Nowi debacles, nor do I get too enraptured in bile spewing towards Fates, since I have no right to do so. I also can't be burned by witnessing bad characters if I choose not to know anyone at all, even if this keeps me from knowing the good at the same time. I might even like certain characters more not knowing them than by knowing them. Would I superficially like Niles anymore if I actually read his dialogue, which I hear is laced with innuendo all the time? Tis' like me and alcohol, I don't drink, but appreciate the arts of brewing, winemaking, and distilling. Would I still have this if I actually tasted an artisanal microbrew or a fine cognac or a single malt whiskey steeped in peat and went "Bleck! This is horrible!"?

....But this isn't the place for this.

 

As for Bertram. The issue is his presence as a Four Rider- he doesn't have any until the chapter you fight him in. This is not good for a supposedly powerful foe who has a fancy title. Yen'fay had a similar issue in Awakening. He is supposed to be a very powerful foe, but we see nothing of him as a general until the chapter he gets killed in. Petrine and the Black Knight appear plentifully beforehand, the BK on the battlefield, and Petrine not, to show off their military competency. What would have helped Bertram is if we saw him more often.

Perhaps if he made a quick appearance in Blood Runs Red, the boss of that chapter could be his lackey who he talks to and commands to stay there while he looks for the escaped prisoners elsewhere, his sword unable to remain still in such a peaceful place. And another appearance in Battle Reunion, similar scenario to the former, perhaps the 15 turn limit would be explicable as Bertram trying to secretly flank Geoffrey's position and after 15 turns, he succeeds and kills Geoffrey (this would require making Geoffrey dying a defeat condition- but I don't think that would ever be at any risk of happening below Maniac difficulty). Ashnard would be using him to clean up Crimean knights in hiding, making Bertram into an actual Four Rider as in the Biblical sense- a horseman who foretells the coming of the Apocalypse and death and destruction. Bertram is less a human and more the Specter of Death itself in his relentless sweeping across the Crimean landscape, his sword cutting down the slightest resistance with the least resistance. 

[Lau]

Wait, has the split been confirmed?

Oh fuuuu--I hate things like this, I get too nervous.

[Rezzy]

Wasn't the voting supposed to begin today?  I tried looking for the poll, but nothing's coming up.

[Lushen]

6 hours ago, Lau said:

Wait, has the split been confirmed?

Oh fuuuu--I hate things like this, I get too nervous.

You can play with URLs to figure out who is going to be in this round.  RD Ike is gone but both Marths persist.  So all alternate versions of previous winners are gone but they're still split which hurts Marth (yay for me)

@Rezzy4 1/2 hours

Edited January 21, 2018 by Lushen

[Lau]

18 minutes ago, Lushen said:

You can play with URLs to figure out who is going to be in this round.  RD Ike is gone but both Marths persist.  So all alternate versions of previous winners are gone but they're still split which hurts Marth (yay for me)

@Rezzy4 1/2 hours

You just said that to a massive Marth fan, how dare you! I'm joking, you do as you please friend.

Ugh, this is definitely going to hurt Marth, again. I'd've thought that IS would have learnt from this from last time?

Ah well, SD Marth is the superior Marth as a character, plus he scored higher than his NMotE last time, so time to dump the votes on him. We can do it, Marth. My nerves depend on it.

[bottlegnomes]

55 minutes ago, omegaxis1 said:

See, here's the issue though. It isn't just that Alm was perfect, but the story was supposed to also be about Alm proving that blood doesn't mean anything, because he's a villager with no royal ties... at first. And at the end, we find out he is the Emperor's son, and rightful heir to the Rigelian throne. This ultimately destroys the entire setup of the lesson, because it just ends up showing that royalty is the right case. It wasn't some villager that became a great leader, it was a born royal who was always meant to be a leader. 

Also, Alm and Celica were supposed to represent Duma and Mila respectively. Alm was meant to be like Duma and seek strength, and Celica like Mila that sought love. But unlike the gods, Alm and Celica learn to utilize both. In fact, in Awakening DLC, when we recruit Alm, he explains that he's a guy that has a hard time showing compassion to enemies since he's trying to kill them. But Alm shows none of the qualities of Duma. He doesn't seek strength or an inability to show compassion, but rather just the opposite. 

And it isn't Celica making a mistake. It's Celica making an incredibly obvious mistake. Something that can be avoided using common sense. Jedah was clearly evil, and used ruthless methods, including even getting Alm trapped in a dragon cave where he fought many necrodargons. Celica still insists that this was the right thing to do. Celica trusting a man like that so easily is just Corrin-level of idiocy. She even lied to her friends and brother for crying out loud. She had no proof that anything that Jedah was saying was true. She never saw Mila until after she joined Jedah, and by the time she realized what a stupid mistake she made, it was too late. That's why Celica is harshly criticized. At least in Gaiden, it makes a bit more sense as to why she follows Jedah, in that she wants to save Alm. But here, she tries to justify that this would save Valentia. 

I always took the point about Alm's blood to be that it doesn't matter regardless. Alm spent his entire life believing he was a commoner and did everything with that mindset. Berkut on the other hand, spent all his time believing he was destined for great things. Berkut ends up amounting to squat and believing he's been bested by something he despises, even if that isn't actually the case. When it comes to light that Alm is a royal, nothing about him changes because birth doesn't matter; he's still Alm. I'd argue that Alm being truly a commoner would've driven a different moral--that commoners aren't lesser than royals--rather than that birth is unimportant to who the person is.

Alm is also more aggressive. I do agree that they could've done better with this, but like I said, none of FE's plots are perfect, but he isn't the complete dove that people paint him as. He decides to take up arms in the resistance even when, as mentioned by Python in the DLC, the resistance are basically the ones causing trouble; commoners don't care who rules them as long as they're not getting abused, and Desaix, while no saint, didn't seem to be portrayed as as bad as the previous king. He also decides to invade Rigel, yes with reasoning, but IIRC he doesn't even make an effort to extend a peace offering. People keep bringing up the Awakening DLC, but from everything I've seen and heard Alm was actually portrayed as compassionate if more brash than Celica in Gaiden. It honestly seems more like Awakening was inaccurate to Alm rather than Echoes was.

Celica, on the other hand, borders on pacifism. She was raised by priests and only resorts to violence when there's absolutely no other way, such as with Grieth. Celica also likes to assume the best in people, such as trusting Conrad when he's the masked knight, so it makes sense that she would try to give Jedah a chance. IIRC, Celica doesn't know about Alm getting trapped in Echoes so that wouldn't come into play. Her going with Jedah was to meet Mila in hopes of being able to do something, not that it was guaranteed to save Valentia. Again, she was raised by priests who were eternally faithful to Mila and she doesn't see any other way to even try to save Valentia. Alm's a pragmatist who goes with the way that's in his control. They do to some extent learn from each other, but also have their believes reinforced to some extent so they know they weren't completely wrong. Mila does, at the end of the day, help them overcome the bad guys and they have to work together to finish things off, but they do finish things off. For Alm, this means realizing that Celica's faith in Mila wasn't completely misguided and that he can't rely on only his own strength while Celica realizes that she does sometimes need to be the driving force and that the gods aren't perfect. I'd argue that Alm and Celica aren't meant to be 1:1 to Mila and Duma, but rather that we shouldn't be so steadfast in our own ideals, that sometimes compromise is necessary. Mila and Duma with pacifism and militarism and Alm and Celica with self-driven destiny and faith in others.

Like I said, Echoes isn't perfect, but it's hardly the absolutely shitshow that people make it out to be. I'd hardly say it's fates level bad, especially since Celica's choices aren't presented as the only right way to approach the situation and are at least more justified and in line with her ideals even if they aren't the best decisions in the world.

But anyway, we should probably stop derailing the thread. Might take this to the Echoes forum.

@Interdimensional Observer I get what you mean on both accounts. It does get easy to start jamming skip. As for Bertram, I can definitely agree that any presence would've been better for building him up. I feel like it would've have to be very specific since he is basically rabid. It might have to be something like another general letting him run wild because they themselves weren't able to handle the enemy and then Bertram annihilates them. Just something to show that he's scary to fight. In retrospect, it seems like he should've been a mobile boss in his chapter, maybe after a certain turn the soldiers around him can't keep him in check over his bloodlust, and have him, like you said, appear in a chapter or two to chase you down like the BK likes to do.

Edited January 21, 2018 by bottlegnomes

[Lushen]

6 hours ago, Lau said:

You just said that to a massive Marth fan, how dare you! I'm joking, you do as you please friend.

Ugh, this is definitely going to hurt Marth, again. I'd've thought that IS would have learnt from this from last time?

Ah well, SD Marth is the superior Marth as a character, plus he scored higher than his NMotE last time, so time to dump the votes on him. We can do it, Marth. My nerves depend on it.

Marth is also hurt because I believe smash will have less of an impact.  I think CYL was announced during Nintendo Direct last year and Smash Switch was still new.  So they had a huge impact.  This time, not so much.  Marth will mostly be carried by the JP but I don't think he will go very far.  Hector, Chrom, and Ephraim are possibilities to me.

[omegaxis1]

3 minutes ago, bottlegnomes said:

Like I said, Echoes isn't perfect, but it's hardly the absolutely shitshow that people make it out to be. I'd hardly say it's fates level bad, especially since Celica's choices aren't presented as the only right way to approach the situation and are at least more justified and in line with her ideals even if they aren't the best decisions in the world.

But anyway, we should probably stop derailing the thread. Might take this to the Echoes forum.

I never said that Echoes was bad. Like I said before, I loved SoV. They really nailed some of the stuff shown. Voice acting most definitely helped. My issue is that they didn't handle some of the things as well in trying to set up several situations. 

Yeah, I figured we should avoid derailing the thread any further than we already have.

[Rezzy]

4 minutes ago, Lushen said:

Marth is also hurt because I believe smash will have less of an impact.  I think CYL was announced during Nintendo Direct last year and Smash Switch was still new.  So they had a huge impact.  This time, not so much.  Marth will mostly be carried by the JP but I don't think he will go very far.  Hector, Chrom, and Ephraim are possibilities to me.

I think Smash is a prominent enough franchise that popularity from it won't wane all that much.  What might have an effect is Heroes itself, though.  Units like Reinhardt might get quite a bit of a boost, as seen from Voting Gauntlets where Dancers really out performed their CYL rankings.

Marth might be hurt because he's very overshadowed as a unit, and even though he's the face of the franchise, he has zero alt forms, unlike half the Fateswakening characters.

[Lau]

10 minutes ago, Lushen said:

Marth is also hurt because I believe smash will have less of an impact.  I think CYL was announced during Nintendo Direct last year and Smash Switch was still new.  So they had a huge impact.  This time, not so much.  Marth will mostly be carried by the JP but I don't think he will go very far.  Hector, Chrom, and Ephraim are possibilities to me.

CYL was announced during an FE only direct, I believe, so I doubt a lot of Smash fans would have watched it. Smash Switch? Don't you mean Smash 4 Wii U? That came out in 2014, FEH was announced in 2017, not really 'new'. I wouldn't count Marth out just yet, because I'm sure Warriors will have an impact, in some shape or form.

[Alexmender]

1 minute ago, Lau said:

CYL was announced during an FE only direct, I believe, so I doubt a lot of Smash fans would have watched it. Smash Switch? Don't you mean Smash 4 Wii U? That came out in 2014, FEH was announced in 2017, not really 'new'. I wouldn't count Marth out just yet, because I'm sure Warriors will have an impact, in some shape or form.

You shouldn't underestimate the Smash community. There were a lot of guys expecting Smash for NS during the Labo announcement even when Nintendo claimed that it was something aimed at kids and "kids at heart" and considering some (most do it ironically but there's always the naive person who believes it's true) believe that characters like Roy came from Smash it's not completely far-fetched to think some watched the FE direct in hopes of getting Smash news.

[Lushen]

6 hours ago, Alexmender said:

You shouldn't underestimate the Smash community. There were a lot of guys expecting Smash for NS during the Labo announcement even when Nintendo claimed that it was something aimed at kids and "kids at heart" and considering some (most do it ironically but there's always the naive person who believes it's true) believe that characters like Roy came from Smash it's not completely far-fetched to think some watched the FE direct in hopes of getting Smash news.

Yea I get that they were a huge influence in the first CYL but Marth only beat Ephraim by 900 points.  Very minor advantage and if the smash community within the FEH community has shrunk at all there's not much hope for Marth in my eyes.

Edited January 21, 2018 by Lushen

[Fire Emblem Fan]

Has it been confirmed that the previous winners are excluded?

[Lightchao42]

5 minutes ago, Fire Emblem Fan said:

Has it been confirmed that the previous winners are excluded?

The portraits of the previous winners and alts (RD Ike and Masked Marth) appear to be absent from the site's server, so that probably means something.

Edited January 21, 2018 by Lightchao42

[Dragoncat]

Guys it's January 21 and the site still isn't up. It just takes me to the results of last time.

[bottlegnomes]

23 minutes ago, omegaxis1 said:

I never said that Echoes was bad. Like I said before, I loved SoV. They really nailed some of the stuff shown. Voice acting most definitely helped. My issue is that they didn't handle some of the things as well in trying to set up several situations. 

Yeah, I figured we should avoid derailing the thread any further than we already have.

Oh, I didn't mean to imply you did. My apologies. I was probably overly general in that last statement. I agree it's not perfect, but my initial point was that there are those who criticize it generally like the cast with a couple exceptions, and those who are really harsh on it, like the Corrin > Alm people you mentioned, tend to overblow the negative aspects. Then again, I'm sure people could get on me for doing the same thing with Fates, so to each their own. 

Back on topic, I really kind of want to see Reinhardt win, just to see what they do with his CYL form. Of the names getting thrown around this time, I'll be a little disappointed if that's really how things play out. I don't have nearly the distain for Camilla and Tharja that it seems a lot of people do, but I'm not exactly a fan of either. Hector I love, but for whatever reason a CYL of him doesn't seem at all appealing, and I've never been terribly fond of Ephraim. I'd much rather Marth get a CYL than either, but my votes are already committed.

[omegaxis1]

Just now, bottlegnomes said:

Back on topic, I really kind of want to see Reinhardt win, just to see what they do with his CYL form. Of the names getting thrown around this time, I'll be a little disappointed if that's really how things play out. I don't have nearly the distain for Camilla and Tharja that it seems a lot of people do, but I'm not exactly a fan of either. Hector I love, but for whatever reason a CYL of him doesn't seem at all appealing, and I've never been terribly fond of Ephraim. I'd much rather Marth get a CYL than either, but my votes are already committed.

To be honest, I can really imagine a lot of influence coming from playing the game itself. The votes might either come in for wanting a better version of an old unit, or a new version of a unit they like using. Reinhardt is so high up there in the tiers ever since he first released, he is a major popularity now.

This is also why I never deny the case of Hector possibly winning, since he's still one of the best units in the game. 

My hope is that Male Robin wins, since I really want him and his Levin Sword to be in and can be very competent in the meta. He only works as a current unit only because I got him to +10. Without that, he really isn't that great of a unit. Balanced units that are lacking in points have issues. 

[Interdimensional Observer]

7 minutes ago, bottlegnomes said:

Back on topic, I really kind of want to see Reinhardt win, just to see what they do with his CYL form.

He has a Master Sword: like a Brave but A rank instead of B, sllghtly heavier, less accurate, slightly weaker, and has some Crit; when fought in T776. And gives Olwen a Blessed Sword: personal weapon with anti-horse, the Brave effect, +10 Mag- which doubles as Res in 776-, the Miracle Skill, and has high power and critical.

Either of these on a horse could work. Or they could reference dismounting and make him a footie.

[Rezzy]

8 minutes ago, bottlegnomes said:

Oh, I didn't mean to imply you did. My apologies. I was probably overly general in that last statement. I agree it's not perfect, but my initial point was that there are those who criticize it generally like the cast with a couple exceptions, and those who are really harsh on it, like the Corrin > Alm people you mentioned, tend to overblow the negative aspects. Then again, I'm sure people could get on me for doing the same thing with Fates, so to each their own. 

Back on topic, I really kind of want to see Reinhardt win, just to see what they do with his CYL form. Of the names getting thrown around this time, I'll be a little disappointed if that's really how things play out. I don't have nearly the distain for Camilla and Tharja that it seems a lot of people do, but I'm not exactly a fan of either. Hector I love, but for whatever reason a CYL of him doesn't seem at all appealing, and I've never been terribly fond of Ephraim. I'd much rather Marth get a CYL than either, but my votes are already committed.

Polarizing units will still rank pretty high, since the people that like them really like them, and you don't downvote anybody, so disliking a unit is the same as being neutral towards them for the purposes of the poll.

3 minutes ago, omegaxis1 said:

To be honest, I can really imagine a lot of influence coming from playing the game itself. The votes might either come in for wanting a better version of an old unit, or a new version of a unit they like using. Reinhardt is so high up there in the tiers ever since he first released, he is a major popularity now.

This is also why I never deny the case of Hector possibly winning, since he's still one of the best units in the game. 

My hope is that Male Robin wins, since I really want him and his Levin Sword to be in and can be very competent in the meta. He only works as a current unit only because I got him to +10. Without that, he really isn't that great of a unit. Balanced units that are lacking in points have issues. 

I wouldn't mind Hector winning.  They could give him Wolf Beil that's effective against Armors and Cavalry.

[r_n]

11 minutes ago, Dragoncat said:

Guys it's January 21 and the site still isn't up. It just takes me to the results of last time.

the notifications stated it would go up at a specific time. For EST, I believe it's 10 PM, or in about 3 & a half hours

[King Marth 64]

Just a heads up, he checked the web data that he hasn't seen any signs of the Cipher characters, Yuzu, Shade, Emma, and Randal appeared in Round 2 files. But, I happy to see that Faye, Conrad, Berkut, Frenand, and Rinea from Echoes: Shadows of Valentia along with Slayde, Jedah, and even some of the other bosses are going to be added for Round 2. But, I think the Cipher characters are going to be cut out for Round 2 or they'll might add it later.

Spoiler

 

 

 

 

Edited January 21, 2018 by King Marth 64

[Arcanite]

Everyone make sure you tell all your friends and family members to vote for Nino!

[bottlegnomes]

5 minutes ago, omegaxis1 said:

To be honest, I can really imagine a lot of influence coming from playing the game itself. The votes might either come in for wanting a better version of an old unit, or a new version of a unit they like using. Reinhardt is so high up there in the tiers ever since he first released, he is a major popularity now.

This is also why I never deny the case of Hector possibly winning, since he's still one of the best units in the game. 

My hope is that Male Robin wins, since I really want him and his Levin Sword to be in and can be very competent in the meta. He only works as a current unit only because I got him to +10. Without that, he really isn't that great of a unit. Balanced units that are lacking in points have issues. 

Yeah, I'd be genuinely surprised if Hector didn't place top 5. Between being a very new-player-friendly lord in the first international FE, one of the most popular lords in the West, and an amazing unit since day 1, Hector's got just about everything going for him. I wouldn't be disappointed if he won, but for some reason he just doesn't appeal to me for a CYL character.

Your feelings on male Robin are essentially mine on Palla :P I love her, but having the even stats she does makes her rather unremarkable overall.

2 minutes ago, Interdimensional Observer said:

He has a Master Sword: like a Brave but A rank instead of B, sllghtly heavier, less accurate, slightly weaker, and has some Crit; when fought in T776. And gives Olwen a Blessed Sword: personal weapon with anti-horse, the Brave effect, +10 Mag- which doubles as Res in 776-, the Miracle Skill, and has high power and critical.

Either of these on a horse could work. Or they could reference dismounting and make him a footie.

I think I'd posted it somewhere in here but my guess is that it'd be something like they give him a 12-14 mt brave sword called the Blessed Sword that may or may not give +5 res, and either up his speed by 5 or up his def by 2 and res by 3 or something. That way they can claim he's better since he could deal with all those pesky greens that kill him and has a higher BST without actually making him a game-breaker all over again. He'd still be good, but a 46 attack (maxed at 55 with +atk and DB3) brave sword cav is a hell of a lot less scary than current Rein.

On a side note, I just skimmed his stats from Thracia and it's interesting to note that while bulky, he's actually got higher speed, 14, than defense, 12, and most of his physical bulk comes from his high HP, 48. A little different than Heroes to say the least.

1 minute ago, Rezzy said:

Polarizing units will still rank pretty high, since the people that like them really like them, and you don't downvote anybody, so disliking a unit is the same as being neutral towards them for the purposes of the poll.

I know. I just mean that if they win I won't be frothing at the mouth like a lot of people seem like they would be, but I'd be a bit disappointed since there are a lot of characters I like better.

[Tybrosion]

14 minutes ago, Arcanite said:

Everyone make sure you tell all your friends and family members to vote for Nino!

I would, but all I'd get from them are looks that scream "WTF are you talking about?".

I'd say I'll at least give her a vote, but I don't think even that'll happen. Assuming we get seven votes total, I'm probably just gonna give three to Leo, three to Cordelia, and the last one to Klein.