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How would people feel if they just added a job-lot of characters from Tellius onwards at 3-4* rarity with fully reused assets from their source games? It'd cut out the most time-consuming part of creating new units. I say Tellius because I assume it's from this point where characters would have viable art and voices to reuse.

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Just checked my 5* and, not counting repeats, I have 24 males and 24 females. I have an exactly even split. I was actually expecting to have more males.

I usually don’t care for meta but it’s true that most top tier units are female. I just figured it was unintentional however I wouldn’t be shocked if it wasn’t.

3 hours ago, bbqbert said:

I have played the newer ones and there are not. I would say the closest thing we have in this area are in Heroes: summer Marx and summer Frederick--both I think were drawn by hentai yaoi artists? I don't know for sure and not particularly interested, but I know they are constant examples people use that fanservice in Heroes exists for females too. Warriors also blows off armor and has the men in shorts--women are in various types of underwear, including lingerie. So they kinda try...?

But as for straight-up actual characters in a legit Fire Emblem game, I think Odin would be the closest in his weird magic getup.

Wow, a yaoi artist that doesn’t know men have nipples? That’s kinda funny if so. XD

1 hour ago, Humanoid said:

How would people feel if they just added a job-lot of characters from Tellius onwards at 3-4* rarity with fully reused assets from their source games? It'd cut out the most time-consuming part of creating new units. I say Tellius because I assume it's from this point where characters would have viable art and voices to reuse.

I’d imagine it wouldn’t be well received. How would they even go about handling their special artwork or injured artwork when most probably only have one piece of official artwork? I don’t think characters like Boyd or Ilyana have any sort of voice acting to work with either.

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6 minutes ago, NegativeExponents- said:

I don’t think characters like Boyd or Ilyana have any sort of voice acting to work with either.

Huh, shows what I know - I assumed they'd have at least 3DS level voice assets given the relative power of the systems.

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20 minutes ago, Humanoid said:

Huh, shows what I know - I assumed they'd have at least 3DS level voice assets given the relative power of the systems.

Nope. Voice snippets were an awakening thing. As was battle cries and critical quotes. Tellius characters were totally silent in battle, though they did have voice acted cutscenes, but many have famously poor acting.

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lets use the gampress arena offence tier list:

tier 1*: 2 male, 4 female

tier 1: 9 male, 13 female

tier 2: 11 male, 26 female

tier 3: 29 male, 35 female

tier 4: 26 males, 17 females

tier 5: 17 males, 8 females

tier 6: 10 males, 5 females

total: 104 males, 108 females.

 

while it IS skewed toward females being higher tier, it isn't THAT horrible like females are 30% better than males?, in all honesty. most of my teams include at LEAST one guy: reinhardt, inigo, black knight, or camus.

 

as for fliers? most of the time you have pegasus knights, who untill fates were ALWAYS female, while wyvern lords were either a promo to pegesus kights and/or mostly enemy exclusive. if we want male fliers, there isn't really that many choices, while there were like 3 peg knights per game...

 

 

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44 minutes ago, TheBraveGallade said:

as for fliers? most of the time you have pegasus knights, who untill fates were ALWAYS female, while wyvern lords were either a promo to pegesus kights and/or mostly enemy exclusive. if we want male fliers, there isn't really that many choices, while there were like 3 peg knights per game...

 

 

Cormag is fairly popular. Not hugely, but enough. They just passed him over on this banner in favour of a secondary Eirika. You could say it was to have the connection to Lyon... but then I look at some previous banners with confusion (Crimean one, especially. Elinica, you think Geoffrey, Lucia and maybe Bastian. We got Nephenee and Oscar who have so little connection to her save country...).

Haar is one of the most popular units in his game. Still waiting for him, too (we got BK again instead, but I suppose they've suddenly decided they want their units to have links of some kind... because...).

Not forgetting that they deliberately added even more female units as fliers in the seasonals, when it could just have easily been male. There was no reason not to make Shigure a flying singer, for instance. He even has the lowest BST in the game already (I think?). But nope, Azura had to be the first because... female? It's not like a lot of people weren't going to pull for a flying singer, regardless of who.

3 hours ago, Humanoid said:

How would people feel if they just added a job-lot of characters from Tellius onwards at 3-4* rarity with fully reused assets from their source games? It'd cut out the most time-consuming part of creating new units. I say Tellius because I assume it's from this point where characters would have viable art and voices to reuse.

Really unhappy. This would be the laziest way of going about it and then they'll be like... but you got your units. Have Camilla #10.

And that was even if they had assets to reuse.

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@Cute Chao

I am a big waifu-lover, and I was still disappointed to not see Cormag on the SS banner. I know he's not the most popular character, but I still thought this would be his time. 

And on the subject of Haar, he's ridiculously popular among people who played RD, I'm surprised they passed up an opportunity to add him in. I'm hoping they're just saving him to try and sell a couple lesser units alongside him.

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1 minute ago, Cornguy said:

@Cute Chao

I am a big waifu-lover, and I was still disappointed to not see Cormag on the SS banner. I know he's not the most popular character, but I still thought this would be his time. 

And on the subject of Haar, he's ridiculously popular among people who played RD, I'm surprised they passed up an opportunity to add him in. I'm hoping they're just saving him to try and sell a couple lesser units alongside him.

I imagine he will be added alongside really popular female characters, since they don't seem to be very good at spacing these out imo, as the latest banner proves to me. But yeah, it was the biggest disappointment. I knew it was going to be three females when Myrrh and L'Aracheal came straight after one another but then to see Eirika was an even bigger gut punch than the banner suddenly ending without the fourth person on the Crimean banner >.<

Fingers crossed for a Cormag soon. He's my favourite SS character along with Seth. I'd love to see Glen, too, along with Selena.

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19 hours ago, Glennstavos said:

Echoes has just two playable female characters left. Sacred Stones has just five left. 

Darn.

It is at least a good thing that both Silque and Tatiana are clerics since it means they won't be introduced together in the same banner.

Got 44 females at 5* vs, 30 males.

Edited by Vince777
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3 hours ago, Vince777 said:

It is at least a good thing that both Silque and Tatiana are clerics since it means they won't be introduced together in the same banner.

Introducing Celica: Divine Princess, Delthea: Shadow Spirit, and Silque: Mila's Servant!

Be sure to obtain at least one of them to ensure that you'll be prepared for the Tempest Trial that will allow you to obtain Valbar: That Dude!

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20 hours ago, bbqbert said:

Looking at the current layout, it is INSANE how much priority/special skills/special stats/special attention is given to female units versus male units. I counted quickly, but to give you a general rundown:

S+: 4 female, 0 male

S: 18 female, 11 male

S-: 19 female, 11 male

A+: 30 female, 22 male

A: 20 female, 23 male

A-: 11 female, 22 male

B+: 3 female, 12 male

B: 3 female, 3 male

The actual Gamepedia tier list looks like this when you take movement type buffs into account (excluding every new unit starting from Gunnthra because they haven't been added to the movement type buff tier lists yet):

S+: 8 male, 13 female
S: 7 male, 16 female
S-: 20 male, 21 female
A+: 17 male, 20 female
A: 18 male, 15 female
A-: 17 male, 9 female
B+: 7 male, 2 female
B: 2 male, 3 female

Counts by movement type are as follows, spoilered for length:

Spoiler

Armor:
S+: 5 male, 3 female
S: 2 male, 1 female

Cavalry:
S+: 3 male, 2 female
S: 3 male, 2 female
S-: 10 male, 4 female
A+: 2 male, 2 female
A: 4 male, 1 female

Flying:
S+: 0 male, 8 female
S: 1 male, 5 female
S-: 2 male, 4 female
A+: 1 male, 1 female

Infantry (hell if I know if I counted right):
S: 1 male, 8 female
S-: 8 male, 13 female (dragons: 6 female)
A+: 14 male, 17 female
A: 14 male, 14 female
A-: 17 male, 9 female
B+: 7 male, 2 female
B: 2 male, 3 female

So a few things to notice from class distribution are that a few of the top tiers are slightly skewed by two things (both relating to classes that are traditionally predominantly female):

  1. Fliers are a predominantly female class due to the pegasus knight class being almost exclusively female (dragon knights are a roughly even split if you only count the starting classes' mounts in the old Akaneia games), and they rank highly due to access to movement type buffs and superior performance with Firesweep weapons.
  2. Every dragon in the game is ranked S and currently only contains female characters due to the playable characters in the main games also being almost exclusively female, though less so than pegasus knights.

Without fliers (including the male ones) or dragons, you end up with

S+: 8 male, 5 female
S: 6 male, 5 female
S-: 18 male, 17 female
A+: 16 male, 19 female
A: 18 male, 15 female
A-: 17 male, 9 female
B+: 7 male, 2 female
B: 2 male, 3 female

which is actually reasonably well balanced.

Vaguely amusing to me, the only particularly imbalanced tier, A-, would be 9 male and 7 female if every sword infantry in that tier were removed. This is also the only tier that is so heavily imbalanced towards a particular class with sword infantry being more than a third of the tier (38%, 10 out of 26).

If you really want to be fair and also remove axe infantry from the counts due to it being a predominantly male class in the main series, you get (omitting tiers that are unchanged)

S: 5 male, 5 female
S-: 17 male, 16 female
A+: 14 male, 19 female
A: 14 male, 14 female
A-: 15 male, 8 female

which is still well balanced.

Heck, let's also remove refreshers (all of the remaining ones are in S-):

S-: 15 male, 12 female

So my conclusion is not that female characters are made stronger than male characters, but that the female-dominated classes are busy clogging up the top of the tier list by being really good classes.

Edited by Ice Dragon
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12 hours ago, NekoKnight said:

They didn't need Eirikalter to sell that banner but they did.

Ah, (self-censored), you said Eirikalter and I started thinking about an Eirika where she's in Valter's gear and on a Wyvern and wielding his Lance and insane like he is and then started thinking about what her Tap Quotes would be if she was insane and then I had the idea that they'd make her do the usual insane character thing and break fourth wall and comment on the Ephraim+Eirika thing…goshdangit Neko, and some days I ask why we can't have nice things.

14 hours ago, Charmeleonbrah said:

I've had a couple drinks, so I'm in a more open mood than usual, and I'll just go out and say it: I'm in it just for the boobs.  I also would like nothing more than to have a sexy sister who isn't blood-related that smothers me in affection and lets me lay in her lap after a long day.

…eh, I play Conception 2, so I can't say much. I will admit I'm mostly on board with your last point there, but I'd drop the sister part because that just feels strange to think about.

14 hours ago, Charmeleonbrah said:

Lmao, nobody plays Fire Emblem for any of those...we play for the THIGHS.  Lyn's thighs are heaven-sent.  Celine wrote that there is nothing more aristocratic than shapely legs.

What about the upper arms? Those can be pretty sexy too if done tastefully.

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If they're going to have all female banners, the least they could do is make the TT unit male. It would even make financial sense, if (for example) Gerik was on a future banner, he'd be less of a draw than Marisa would if you swapped them around.

8 hours ago, Ice Dragon said:

So my conclusion is not that female characters are made stronger than male characters, but that the female-dominated classes are busy clogging up the top of the tier list by being really good classes.

But there's no good reason for female dominated classes to be that way.

Case in point, armoured units, who are also good with the type buffs and a male dominated class. The gender ratio is closer to even in Heroes because they made a lot of quota picks; Amelia could easily have been cavalry, and Gwendy and Sheema were included despite them ranking quite low.

Dragons are mostly female, but Heroes skewed it even further; Ninian but no Nils, M!Corrin is a sword unit, Deghinsea is at least as memeworthy as Oliver. Dracoknights are also mostly female despite three male dracoknight GHBs.

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8 hours ago, Ice Dragon said:
  1. Fliers are a predominantly female class due to the pegasus knight class being almost exclusively female (dragon knights are a roughly even split if you only count the starting classes' mounts in the old Akaneia games), and they rank highly due to access to movement type buffs and superior performance with Firesweep weapons.
  2. Every dragon in the game is ranked S and currently only contains female characters due to the playable characters in the main games also being almost exclusively female, though less so than pegasus knights.

While I do agree that if you take these classes out, it's less favoring female units--it still is favoring them to a certain degree, but not nearly as much. However, part of the point is that they chose classes and units and characters that are 1. female and 2. that are going to be the best and the brightest rather than giving that place to a worthy male. There aren't as many male fliers for sure in the whole series, but there are still quite a few they could have bothered making worthy--unlike Valter, Michalis and Subaki, who are sub par units (Valter and Michalis because of the GHB treatment, Subaki because he was an early release). So we do have male fliers; they were just given a short stick compared to their female counterparts. I'm not saying they're not useful--they're just LESS useful overall (especially in the current meta).

Dragons are just the same--there are plenty of male dragons they could choose to use but have decided against. M!Corrin is a perfect example--he is an infantry sword user rather than a dragon, and his female counterpart got one of the best classes in the game. There are more female dragons in the series, granted, but we don't have a single male dragon yet. Not to mention that dragons are one of the hottest units in the meta right now...

And please keep in mind as I say this: I love getting my favorite units. I'm thankful for them. However, I also play very competitively--I love the arena, I love the rewards you get in the arena because I get to invest in more characters I love. I love hanging in Tier 20 and getting the best rewards possible--and doing great in Arena Assault, too. But I also really love using units I love to do it, not just units I have to use because they're the best in the game. It's getting harder and harder to do, to be honest, when every banner releases spectacular female units like Myrrh and then a sub par male like Lyon off to the side.

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27 minutes ago, Baldrick said:

If they're going to have all female banners, the least they could do is make the TT unit male. It would even make financial sense, if (for example) Gerik was on a future banner, he'd be less of a draw than Marisa would if you swapped them around.

This is usually what they do, historically. Males fall in the TT and GHB category, which usually means they are given poor stat distribution and less unique/useful skills compared to their female counterparts on banners. It's not that there aren't male units in the game--it's just that, compared to the females, they're generally not that good.

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43 minutes ago, Baldrick said:

Case in point, armoured units, who are also good with the type buffs and a male dominated class. The gender ratio is closer to even in Heroes because they made a lot of quota picks; Amelia could easily have been cavalry, and Gwendy and Sheema were included despite them ranking quite low.

There are only 4 female armor knights, but 7 male armor knights.

Amelia is most iconically either infantry (her base trainee class) or armored (her most common promotion path).

 

45 minutes ago, Baldrick said:

Dragons are mostly female, but Heroes skewed it even further; Ninian but no Nils, M!Corrin is a sword unit, Deghinsea is at least as memeworthy as Oliver. Dracoknights are also mostly female despite three male dracoknight GHBs.

I will exclude Laguz because they seem to garner special treatment from the developers (there are none in the game) and players (players for some reason think they should be implemented differently from existing dragons) alike.

Excluding child-generation characters and enemy characters, I can think of a total of, what, 3 male dragons across the entire series that are canonically capable of using their dragon form? Bantu, Nils, and Corrin.

Enemies give a few more choices in Mediuth, Duma, Jahn, and Morva. And perhaps Grima and Anankos, though I haven't finished either of their games, so I have no idea if they count (I'm uncertain if they have a defined sex because as far as I am aware, Grima's body doesn't have a human form, and I know nothing of Anankos). And of those, only Jahn and Morva are not final-boss-class enemies (and Morva is very much undead).

Females have Tiki, Nagi, Fae, Ninian, Myrrh, Tiki, Nowi, and Corrin. Among NPCs, there's also Mila, Naga, and Idenn (from the epilogue).

 

31 minutes ago, bbqbert said:

However, part of the point is that they chose classes and units and characters that are 1. female and 2. that are going to be the best and the brightest rather than giving that place to a worthy male. There aren't as many male fliers for sure in the whole series, but there are still quite a few they could have bothered making worthy--unlike Valter, Michalis and Subaki, who are sub par units (Valter and Michalis because of the GHB treatment, Subaki because he was an early release). So we do have male fliers; they were just given a short stick compared to their female counterparts. I'm not saying they're not useful--they're just LESS useful overall (especially in the current meta).

Valter is ranked at tier S. Michalis and Subaki are S-. I fail to see how this is the short end of the stick. Hell, Narcian is A+.

 

33 minutes ago, bbqbert said:

M!Corrin is a perfect example--he is an infantry sword user rather than a dragon, and his female counterpart got one of the best classes in the game.

And yet, female Corrin was pretty much considered to be trash (albeit more salvageable than Odin or Jagen) until Steady Breath was released. Literally the only reason she is good at all is because she has access to refined Lightning Breath+ and Steady Breath.

 

47 minutes ago, bbqbert said:

And please keep in mind as I say this: I love getting my favorite units. I'm thankful for them. However, I also play very competitively--I love the arena, I love the rewards you get in the arena because I get to invest in more characters I love. I love hanging in Tier 20 and getting the best rewards possible--and doing great in Arena Assault, too. But I also really love using units I love to do it, not just units I have to use because they're the best in the game. It's getting harder and harder to do, to be honest, when every banner releases spectacular female units like Myrrh and then a sub par male like Lyon off to the side.

If there is one thing about the Gamepedia tier list that I cannot agree with more, it's the fact that the lowest occupied tier is labeled "B". Not "D". Not "E".

I think that speaks volumes about the viability of even the bottom-tier characters.

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37 minutes ago, Ice Dragon said:

Amelia is most iconically either infantry (her base trainee class) or armored (her most common promotion path).

to add on to this, amelia's quote before you pick her class remarks about her putting on armor that was too heavy for her to use, and I don't think the cavalier armor is as much of a step up as a knights armor is from amelia's initial class to warrant a reference to amelia not being able to use it. She also appears as a knight in her awakening spotpass, very likely could be a hint at a canon class option.

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41 minutes ago, Ice Dragon said:

Excluding child-generation characters and enemy characters, I can think of a total of, what, 3 male dragons across the entire series that are canonically capable of using their dragon form? Bantu, Nils, and Corrin.

Enemies give a few more choices in Mediuth, Duma, Jahn, and Morva. And perhaps Grima and Anankos, though I haven't finished either of their games, so I have no idea if they count (I'm uncertain if they have a defined sex because as far as I am aware, Grima's body doesn't have a human form, and I know nothing of Anankos). And of those, only Jahn and Morva are not final-boss-class enemies (and Morva is very much undead).

Females have Tiki, Nagi, Fae, Ninian, Myrrh, Tiki, Nowi, and Corrin. Among NPCs, there's also Mila, Naga, and Idenn (from the epilogue).

Valter is ranked at tier S. Michalis and Subaki are S-. I fail to see how this is the short end of the stick. Hell, Narcian is A+.

And yet, female Corrin was pretty much considered to be trash (albeit more salvageable than Odin or Jagen) until Steady Breath was released. Literally the only reason she is good at all is because she has access to refined Lightning Breath+ and Steady Breath.

If there is one thing about the Gamepedia tier list that I cannot agree with more, it's the fact that the lowest occupied tier is labeled "B". Not "D". Not "E".

I think that speaks volumes about the viability of even the bottom-tier characters.

By this list, then, of playable dragons: 7/8 female dragons are already in the game. 0/3 male dragons exist as dragons in the game. And as I mull this over, female Corrin is both a dragon and a flying mage--powerful and/or crazy unique classes. Tiki appears as two dragons and as an infantry axe wielder. Male Corrin appears twice--as a standard infantry unit both times. The argument again isn't necessarily that males aren't included--they're relegated to lower positions than the top tier female cast. And yes, weapon refinery has done wonders for the dragon class--a class that is 100% female at this time and therefore has made them outstanding and near untouchable in highly competitive play.

Also, I am referring to the skill inheritance/arena tier list on Gamepedia due to it representing the most competitive options for characters. Valter is A+, Michalis is A+, Narcian is A (wow I forgot he exists), and Subaki is A-.

Again, I do acknowledge that tier lists are not without error and should be used as very loose guidelines... but I think I've seen this trend for long enough now (at least on the tier list I follow) that it has rubbed me the wrong way.

Not to mention the teams I see in Tier 20 on a regular basis: almost exclusively female, with a random Reinhardt thrown in on occasion because magic is everything.

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6 minutes ago, bbqbert said:

0/3 male dragons exist as dragons in the game.

You say this, but then you go on to say this:

6 minutes ago, bbqbert said:

And as I mull this over, female Corrin is both a dragon and a flying mage--powerful and/or crazy unique classes. Tiki appears as two dragons and as an infantry axe wielder. Male Corrin appears twice--as a standard infantry unit both times.

This is non-sequitur. Summer Corrin, Summer Tiki, and both non-dragon versions of male Corrin have nothing to do with this discussion. You specifically call out that none of the male dragons appear as dragons, but then you call out how many times the female dragons appear as non-dragons, which have nothing to do with each other.

Reinhardt ruled the meta for months, and he still does to a good extent. There's no reason Corrin appearing as a flying tome user is any more important than Reinhardt being Reinhardt.

 

1 minute ago, bbqbert said:

Also, I am referring to the skill inheritance/arena tier list on Gamepedia due to it representing the most competitive options for characters. Valter is A+, Michalis is A+, Narcian is A (wow I forgot he exists), and Subaki is A-.

I'm referring to the movement-type specific rankings at the bottom of that page. The main tier list doesn't include things like Hone Fliers and Fortify Fliers into account, which is part of the reason why cavalry and fliers are so powerful. If you are really talking about units at the top of their game (and there's no reason not to), that's the list to use for anything that isn't infantry.

 

3 minutes ago, bbqbert said:

Again, I do acknowledge that tier lists are not without error and should be used as very loose guidelines... but I think I've seen this trend for long enough now (at least on the tier list I follow) that it has rubbed me the wrong way.

Gamepedia's tier list is, as best as I can tell from the notes they put up in their Reddit update post, about as objective as it gets. The only thing that is really up to debate is how to weight mobility against combat performance.

No, really. They aren't gospel, but they at least do their research and show their work.

 

15 minutes ago, bbqbert said:

Not to mention the teams I see in Tier 20 on a regular basis: almost exclusively female, with a random Reinhardt thrown in on occasion because magic is everything.

And all I see is Zelgius, Winter Robin, Winter Lissa, Winter Chrom, Hector, Amelia, and Halloween Jakob. Which, by the way, is five sevenths male.

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50 minutes ago, thecrimsonflash said:

to add on to this, amelia's quote before you pick her class remarks about her putting on armor that was too heavy for her to use, and I don't think the cavalier armor is as much of a step up as a knights armor is from amelia's initial class to warrant a reference to amelia not being able to use it. She also appears as a knight in her awakening spotpass, very likely could be a hint at a canon class option.

If she has a canon class, it's her central path, Great Knight, which is both armoured and cavalry. She went the opposite way to Frederick and Gunter.

That's not saying she shouldn't be armoured, but that she could be either, and is probably the latter for the same reason that Sheema and Gwendy got in.

1 hour ago, Ice Dragon said:

There are only 4 female armor knights, but 7 male armor knights.

Excluding child-generation characters and enemy characters, I can think of a total of, what, 3 male dragons across the entire series that are canonically capable of using their dragon form? Bantu, Nils, and Corrin.

Enemies give a few more choices in Mediuth, Duma, Jahn, and Morva. And perhaps Grima and Anankos, though I haven't finished either of their games, so I have no idea if they count (I'm uncertain if they have a defined sex because as far as I am aware, Grima's body doesn't have a human form, and I know nothing of Anankos). And of those, only Jahn and Morva are not final-boss-class enemies (and Morva is very much undead).

Females have Tiki, Nagi, Fae, Ninian, Myrrh, Tiki, Nowi, and Corrin. Among NPCs, there's also Mila, Naga, and Idenn (from the epilogue).

That's 4/6 for female armour knights (missing Meg and Kjelle) and 7/26 for male armour knights. (missing Roger, Dolph, Macellan, Lawrence, Horace, Hannibal, Dalshin, Xavier, Bors, Barth, Douglas, Oswin, Wallace, Gilliam, Gatrie, Brom, Tauroneo, Ignatius, Benny). I don't think you'd argue that Heroes is skewing the balance towards females, and rightly so.

On the other hand, dragons are, for playable characters, 0/3 male and 7/8 female. (Personally, I'd call it 0/6 and 7/9 because I see no problem implementing dragon laguz like manaketes, but the exact numbers aren't important). Clearly the balance is also skewed towards females as well.

Edited by Baldrick
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2 minutes ago, Baldrick said:

If she has a canon class, it's her central path, Great Knight, which is both armoured and cavalry.

One, this logic makes zero sense. Two, Ewan will explain to you why for me.

 

3 minutes ago, Baldrick said:

That's 4/5 for female armour knights (missing Meg) and 7/25 for male armour knights. (missing Roger, Dolph, Macellan, Lawrence, Horace, Hannibal, Dalshin, Xavier, Bors, Barth, Douglas, Oswin, Wallace, Gilliam, Gatrie, Brom, Tauroneo, Benny). I don't think you'd argue that Heroes is skewing the balance towards females, and rightly so.

I see no reason for Heroes to match the ratios of the main series games.

Why should it? To ensure that every may-as-well-be-nameless filler character from Akaneia has an equal shot of getting in? Why should that "7/25" give Hector the same weight (1 of 25) as Macellan (1 of 25)? What makes Dolph matter the same as Tauroneo or Lorenz? What makes Tauroneo or Lorenz matter the same as Hector or the Black Knight?

 

I'm also utterly appalled at the fact that you forgot Valbar, the man with the manliest of manly chins.

 

26 minutes ago, Baldrick said:

On the other hand, dragons are, at best, 0/3 male and 7/8 female. Clearly the balance is also skewed towards females as well.

I also don't see why we need to count Corrin twice. One version of Corrin was pretty much guaranteed to not be a dragon.

And really, that version was almost guaranteed to be the male one to match the other male lords with their legendary weapons. Honestly, I don't see how that decision to make male Corrin have his legendary weapon is any less preferential treatment for one sex than giving female Corrin a class that became broken half a year after she was implemented.

Actually, I feel like the fact that male Corrin has Yato is more problematic in terms of preferential treatment. Female Corrin got turned into a low-rarity fodder unit with a bad Atk stat and a generic weapon whereas male Corrin is high-rarity and has his legendary weapon, out-classed as it may be one year after the fact.

 

On a similar note, male Robin had one of the best skill sets at launch and was the meta counter, only falling out of grace when people started catching on to the one-round-kill meta. Female Robin has been bottom tier ever since she was implemented.

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1 hour ago, Ice Dragon said:

I see no reason for Heroes to match the ratios of the main series games.

Why should it? To ensure that every may-as-well-be-nameless filler character from Akaneia has an equal shot of getting in? Why should that "7/25" give Hector the same weight (1 of 25) as Macellan (1 of 25)? What makes Dolph matter the same as Tauroneo or Lorenz? What makes Tauroneo or Lorenz matter the same as Hector or the Black Knight?

I'm also utterly appalled at the fact that you forgot Valbar, the man with the manliest of manly chins.

I don't either, I said rightly so. I was reinforcing my point that the gender ratio of armour knights is less male-dominated in Heroes compared to the series as a whole. So there's no good reason why the gender ratio of dragons should be even more female-dominated in Heroes compared to the series as a whole.

Could've sworn he was in. Forgive me, noble sir Valbar.

 

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I also don't see why we need to count Corrin twice. One version of Corrin was pretty much guaranteed to not be a dragon.

And really, that version was almost guaranteed to be the male one to match the other male lords with their legendary weapons. Honestly, I don't see how that decision to make male Corrin have his legendary weapon is any less preferential treatment for one sex than giving female Corrin a class that became broken half a year after she was implemented.

Actually, I feel like the fact that male Corrin has Yato is more problematic in terms of preferential treatment. Female Corrin got turned into a low-rarity fodder unit with a bad Atk stat and a generic weapon whereas male Corrin is high-rarity and has his legendary weapon, out-classed as it may be one year after the fact.

The tier list puts Forrin at S and Morrin at A-. Low rarity isn't even intrinsically bad, it gives you more opportunity for merges. And more chance to actually pull the character in question if you're a casual.

Edited by Baldrick
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26 minutes ago, Baldrick said:

I don't either, I said rightly so. I was reinforcing my point that the gender ratio of armour knights is less male-dominated in Heroes compared to the series as a whole. So there's no good reason why the gender ratio of dragons should be even more female-dominated in Heroes compared to the series as a whole.

There's no satisfying reason for any of the problems the series (or strictly just Heroes) has, really. It really comes down to bad creative choices, with the adherence to archetypes/gender roles being just one major category. Because this is fiction, the writers and character designers can literally do anything imaginable, but instead go for cliches, cop-outs, and other poor creative choices (and hell, this is without even getting into things like race and LGBTQ representation). Characters like Camilla and Tharja are the result of bad creative choices, as are the idea that a given class should be entirely (or predominantly) one gender.

Balancing a game is extremely hard, and so I can't blame IS when people give them shit about certain things dominating the meta (incidentally, I would say the real threats in Arena are the underestimated units set up in unexpected ways). But I am disappointed when they make choices like having the majority of mages/healers females because it sends a message that reinforces gender expectations, while showing a lack of creativity.

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