Lord Cow-Cow Posted November 17, 2008 Share Posted November 17, 2008 Well I think the polls speak for themselves. Also I must now log off so someone (some people?) must continue the. Argument? Well anyway good bye. all hail lord cow-cow! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bunny: spider bitten Posted November 17, 2008 Share Posted November 17, 2008 (edited) Why the hell would you ever want to remove Paragon from her? After she's about 10 levels ahead of the rest of your units, what is the point in having it? If you don't remove it, she'll hit 20/20 and then using her will take away from the rest of your characters. And even at the same level as the rest of your cast, other skills are appealing. Edited November 17, 2008 by bunny Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Reikken Posted November 17, 2008 Share Posted November 17, 2008 After she's about 10 levels ahead of the rest of your units, what is the point in having it? Higher level > lower level, even if it's temporary. If you don't remove it, she'll hit 20/20 and then using her will take away from the rest of your characters. ...what the hell? How much exp Astrid gains has absolutely nothing at all to do with anyone else. Actually, if Astrid's not gaining any exp anyway, you can afford to let others take any free kills that Astrid would otherwise have taken. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr. Tarrasque Posted November 17, 2008 Share Posted November 17, 2008 After she's about 10 levels ahead of the rest of your units, what is the point in having it?If you don't remove it, she'll hit 20/20 and then using her will take away from the rest of your characters. And even at the same level as the rest of your cast, other skills are appealing. EXP rankings don't exist in this game. Who cares if some1's capped and sapping EXP from other units when your team's already capable of destroying? If it really bothers you to have some1 capped not getting any EXP, THEN JUST USE HIM/HER TO WEAKEN ENEMIES OR DON'T HAVE HIM/HER KILL ANYTHING AT ALL. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bunny: spider bitten Posted November 17, 2008 Share Posted November 17, 2008 Higher level > lower level, even if it's temporary. After ten levels, she'll gain less EXP than the rest of your units anyway. Less than that if your units have better levels than the enemy characters. It has little point after 10 levels, it's worthless at 20/20, and if she manages to be around 12 levels ahead of the pack, removing it gives you a negligible loss anyway. Eventually, there's no point in having it. You don't have to remove it, but there's a point where there is no loss in doing so. Actually, if Astrid's not gaining any exp anyway, you can afford to let others take any free kills that Astrid would otherwise have taken. If you are using her after she hits 20/20, she's taking kills and gaining zero XP for them. Which does take from other characters. Just because it doesn't make them any worse doesn't mean they can't be any better. And what you're saying is she becomes dead weight for a chapter or two, and rather than being a slightly lower level for 4-6 chapters and being slightly above average with waning stats, you'd rather her have zero worth for a chapter or two. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YokaiKnight Posted November 17, 2008 Share Posted November 17, 2008 Guess what? Five Paladins actually give you diversity, plus a lot of flexibility.You know that's not what he meant. Come on.You really don't want to argue how ineffective she is early on without BEXP, though. And that's either way. ;)And why should they? Can we talk about how Ike is pretty weak if he only uses Iron Swords? Or Zihark doesn't do as much damage without Adept? The only reason you'd take away these conditions is for a challenge or just to weaken the characters. That doesn't have much bearing on their real effectiveness. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bunny: spider bitten Posted November 17, 2008 Share Posted November 17, 2008 Why should they? Well, I don't know. What I do know is that it was his idea to do so in the first place. He said she only needs a level or two of BEXP to get off the ground - Which isn't all that true. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Reikken Posted November 17, 2008 Share Posted November 17, 2008 (edited) After ten levels, she'll gain less EXP than the rest of your units anyway. Less than that if your units have better levels than the enemy characters. It has little point after 10 levels, it's worthless at 20/20, and if she manages to be around 12 levels ahead of the pack, removing it gives you a negligible loss anyway.Eventually, there's no point in having it. You don't have to remove it, but there's a point where there is no loss in doing so. and that point is at max level If you are using her after she hits 20/20, she's taking kills and gaining zero XP for them. Which does take from other characters. Just because it doesn't make them any worse doesn't mean they can't be any better.And what you're saying is she becomes dead weight for a chapter or two, and rather than being a slightly lower level for 4-6 chapters and being slightly above average with waning stats, you'd rather her have zero worth for a chapter or two. She takes less exp from others if you leave it on than if you remove it. And no, I did not say anything about being dead weight, and that makes no sense at all. Edited November 17, 2008 by Reikken Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kiba Posted November 17, 2008 Share Posted November 17, 2008 I like her a lot more now that she is higher lvl, pretty good stats Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Reikken Posted November 17, 2008 Share Posted November 17, 2008 (edited) Not really. Per attack she does well below average, and per round she's about average. Considering she's doing some 2 more damage than Zihark at the same level, and he's got Adept and a crit boost to put him just above her damage wise, she's beating maybe 10 characters in damage per round, and more than half of them don't double consistently. Where are you getting this? What I'm seeing is well above average speed and above average atk. After promotion, she's faster and more damaging than Ike, until he gets Ragnell. I think that constitutes above average offense. Edited November 17, 2008 by Reikken Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bunny: spider bitten Posted November 17, 2008 Share Posted November 17, 2008 (edited) And no, I did not say anything about being dead weight, and that makes no sense at all. A character with supposed above average strength and above average speed isn't leaving a unit alive after attacking. So when you say Actually, if Astrid's not gaining any exp anyway, you can afford to let others take any free kills that Astrid would otherwise have taken. You're basically giving all of her attacks to another unit. Sure you can use her, but it's incredibly diminished use. What I'm seeing is well above average speed and above average atk. Above average for what game? 24 characters have better strength/magic and another 3 share the stat. Also, considering Ike has better weapon levels and a STR lead, the two are doing the about the same amount of damage until Ike gets Ragnell. ;) That's not even counting the number of characters with skills that boost damage, crit boosts, and supports. She has the best weapon type, but even then she's competing with the likes of Zihark in terms of damage. She also doubles, but the bulk of units do. Average. I've already given that? Above average? Not really. For what it's worth, you may be confusing averages with total value. I mean, even Knoll isn't awful in FE8 because it's easy. But he's well below average. Edited November 17, 2008 by bunny Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Reikken Posted November 17, 2008 Share Posted November 17, 2008 (edited) She has the best weapon type, but even then she's competing with the likes of Zihark in terms of damage. She also doubles, but the bulk of units do. Competing with Zihark in damage? No. 20/15 Astrid, Silver Axe = 36.1 atk, 27.0 spd 20/10 Zihark, Silver Sword, A Brom = 33.5 atk, 27.2 spd And that's being generous to Zihark. The level difference would be bigger than that. A character with supposed above average strength and above average speed isn't leaving a unit alive after attacking.So when you say You're basically giving all of her attacks to another unit. Sure you can use her, but it's incredibly diminished use. "free kills". Kills that anyone can get, and it doesn't matter who. For example... Say there are 2 enemy units in range that can be finished off in one round by several characters, and you have like 5 characters in range to attack them. Someone is going to be doing nothing that turn regardless, so it may as well be Astrid. Whoever is taking the kills in that situation is not being any more useful than anyone else. It's an advantage for her that you can let it be her every time without her losing anything. Others benefit at no cost to her. Also, considering Ike has better weapon levels and a STR lead, the two are doing the about the same amount of damage until Ike gets Ragnell. ;) If by "about the same" you mean that Ike does a point or two less, then yes. Edited November 17, 2008 by Reikken Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Swords Master Panda Posted December 19, 2009 Share Posted December 19, 2009 Astrid is one of the best paladins I have used other than Oscar. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ercdouken Posted December 19, 2009 Share Posted December 19, 2009 "HEY GUYZ, I JUST REVIVED A YEAR OLD TOPIC!" Anyhow, I use Astrid most of the time in this game. She is indeed awesome. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Anouleth Posted December 19, 2009 Share Posted December 19, 2009 Astrid is pretty cool. Paragon really helps her, otherwise I think she'd be unusable. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fireman Posted December 19, 2009 Share Posted December 19, 2009 Just closed this topic for the 1-year necropost and all that. Feel free to start a new topic if you must satisfy your burning desire to talk about using Astrid. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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