General Weapon Refinery discussion/speculation/creation thread

[Othin]

4 hours ago, Fire Emblem Fan said:

This is extraordinarily fortunate for me because I already have Naesala as a 10+ unit, haha. That's an easy choice for me, definitely spending the resources for his refine.

Yeah, same. He was one of my earliest merge projects.

[Xenomata]

18 hours ago, XRay said:

You can lock teams to free up a little more Seals. Super and save tank teams can handle most Arena Assault defense teams, and since their team composition does not change, you can lock them and then reassign their Sacred Seals somewhere else.

That is... really not my playstyle at all. I'm generally performing my team-building in the moment, and in those moments I tend to prefer heavy PP with Save backup as needed. Hell my Astra AR-O team is literally the two Ninja Duo units and Duo Azura going full nuke on the enemy team. And in that regard, there's really not that many universally applicable PP units that I can have that many teams locked in...

In that regard I would have much preferred a PP Flora refine, but as it stands Naesala winds up being the one I'm most inclined to go after (which honestly there's no reason not to, he may as well have a Silver Weapon+ for all the good his base weapon does...)

Edited June 7, 2022 by Xenomata

[Xenomata]

And the newest batch of refines will be going tooooooo...

• Legenary Roy's Dragonbind, which had nothing but Dragon effectiveness and Distant Counter to its name until now. Legendary Remix unit.
• Fallen Mareeta's Shadow Sword, which carried the effect of Desperation if her HP was greater than 50%, as well as the slaying effect.
• Kjelle will be receiving the Heartbeat Lance, replacing her original Barrier Lance that gave her Res +7 when the enemy initiated combat.
• Panne's Taguel Fang, granting her Cavalry effectiveness and all stat +3 if she is either alone or only next to Dragon/Beast units, on top of the standard Beast Cav weapon effect of inflicting Atk/Def -4 and blocked follow-up when initiating combat. Grail unit.
• Mordecai's Sabertooth Fang, which gave him Def +3 and the ability to inflict all stat -4 on enemies near himself and his targeted ally when a Movement assist is used, on top of the original version of the Beast Infantry effect of boosting Special Damage by +10. 4* pool unit
• Bride Fjorm's Gjallarbru, which inflicted Isolation (prevents the use of Assist skills either by or on the afflicted unit) on any foes in cardinal directions of herself who had at least 3 less HP than Fjorm, as well as the Wrathful Staff effect. Seasonal unit

I'm not even gonna guess what the Heartbeat Lance is supposed to be referencing. Only one I really care about here is Panne, maybe Mareeta.

Looks like Keaton is now joining the skip gang...

Edited July 1, 2022 by Xenomata

[Florete]

Ugh, they were supposed to go back to doing two remixes this time, but it's just Roy. Are they really planning to give us just 6 (or 8 if they continue to make Feb a remix month) remixes per year?

Well, looking forward to Fjorm and Mordecai. I use Fjorm all the time in Astra and I have a +10 Mordecai that is mainly used for Pawns of Loki. Fjorm is probably getting a worthless combat refine, though. I feel like the best I can hope for with her is to make the Isolation condition a basic unit's HP > foe's HP instead of +3.

[Rinco]

Hoping Panne gets a good refine. Her stats are not that good, she really needs something amazing to make me build her

[Nym]

Please, please, please make Kjelle's refine good. Like it doesn't need to be as stupid as Bector's refine, but at least make it work! I would really like it if it's the first savior weapon, that would be cool!

[Naoshi]

[Ice Dragon]

One weapon to translate:

Heartbeat Lance is "鎧好きの堅槍" (yoroi-zuki no kensō), "Tough Lance of the Armor-Lover". It's worth noting that "賢" (ken) has an obsolete usage meaning "armor". The typical word for "armor" today is "鎧" (yoroi).

 

Legendary Roy: Dragonbind

Current effect is Distant Counter and effective damage against dragons.

Roy's remix is giving him Spurn on the B slot to replace his original Renewal, extends the range of his exclusive C skill, and adds additional bonus stats and percentage damage reduction based on the number of bonuses on nearby human-class allies.

There's not much to go off of for predictions since base Dragonbind is basically just a Distant Counter weapon. I can see him getting percentage damage reduction nullification (or reduction) in order to counter Dragon Wall. Null Follow-Up would also be nice to have since many of the bulky dragons have follow-up prevention.

I think he's pretty likely to get 7 HP recovery after combat to make up for losing Renewal.

Kjelle: Heartbeat Lance

Current default weapon is Barrier Lance.

Kjelle's default skills are split between two defensive skills (Barrier Lance and AR-D Def/Res) and one offensive skill (Bold Fighter), so I have no idea what they're going to do.

Fallen Mareeta: Shadow Sword

Current effect is Desperation if HP is 50% or higher. Permanent stat effect is the Slaying effect.

Mareeta would definitely like to have Null Follow-Up on her weapon to free up her B slot, but she already has Null Follow-Up on her B slot.

As far as player phase is concerned, she already has a high-HP Desperation and Null Follow-Up, so she doesn't really need any other defensive effects, like Dodge. Since her B slot is already taken, she ideally gets Tempo as a refine effect. Other than that, all she really needs is more Atk/Spd.

In the source game, Shadow Sword had the Brave effect and Nihil, which is basically exactly what Mareeta's base skill set gives her. However, it would be cool if they'd also give her a conditional Brave effect similar to that on Ascended Ishtar.

If they really want to give her an effect for enemy phase, I suppose they could give her Dodge, but it doesn't really seem all that necessary since Ascended Mareeta already fills that role.

Panne: Taguel Fang

Current effect is +3 to all stats if not adjacent to a human-class ally and effective damage against cavalry. Has the standard transform condition and standard beast cavalry effect. 

Panne has no identity right now as a unit since her only two weapon effects are a boost to all stats and a mostly-useless effective damage against cavalry. I don't know what they want to do with her, but hopefully, it at least gives a reason to actually use her over any of the other beast cavalry.

Currently, Panne has the lowest base Atk stat of all beast cavalry, tied with Selkie, and has only 1 point less than Ranulf. Both Selkie and Ranulf got sizable boosts to their damage output, so Panne hopefully gets the same.

Mordecai: Sabertooth Fang

Current effect is -4 to all stats as a Penalty to enemies within 2 spaces of self and target after using a movement Assist. Permanent stat effect is +3 Def. Has the standard transform condition and old beast infantry effect.

I'm definitely expecting his Penalties to be boosted up to -6 or -7. It's also rather likely that it'll get an additional effect added to it, like Guard if they want to be boring or Gravity or Deep Wounds if they want to be more interesting.

As a support unit, he doesn't really need any combat effects (though they'll definitely give him some Atk/Def anyways), but I'd love to see him get Jolly Jade Lance's "Assist Galeforce" effect to allow him to Smite twice in one turn.

Bride Fjorm: Gjallarbru

Current effect inflicts Isolation with Ploy range against opponents with at least 3 HP less than unit. Also has Wrathful Staff.

In a perfect world, the refine would reduce the HP comparison to at least 1 HP less than unit and increase the range to 3 rows and 3 columns. I can see them doing the former, but I can't really see them doing the latter. And even then, the former is still a toss-up.

I'm hoping they stick with her being primarily a support unit and give her one or more of the new effects that have been added more recently, like Warp Bubble, En Garde, or False Start. Putting both Even and Odd Recovery on her weapon would also be nice, though that's unlikely to happen.

 

8 hours ago, Xenomata said:

Looks like Keaton is now joining the skip gang...

It's pretty normal for there to be leftovers that don't get cleaned up for a couple months.

[XRay]

If they are going the super tank route, I hope Roy: Blazing Lion gets Dodge on his Weapon. If they want to go wild, adding Dodge status effect on top would be pretty hilarious. Pulse Smoke, healing, Null Follow-Up are also all nice effects.

I hope Kjelle gets Slaying, dual phase follow-up, and Special Fighter. Damage reduction would be nice too.

Fjorm: Bride of Rime inflicting Gravity would compliment Isolation really well, and expand the range to triple columns and rows would be great.

Beaststones in Awakening have higher Skl and Spd than Dragonstones, so if I had to take a stab at the effects, I am guessing Slaying to simulate the former, and Dodge and/or true damage based on Spd for the latter.

For Mareeta: Blade's Pawn, I second Tempo and Brave. Since she does not have any kind of damage reduction mitigation, double Lunas sound enough for damage output.

On 7/1/2022 at 10:09 AM, Ice Dragon said:

As a support unit, he doesn't really need any combat effects (though they'll definitely give him some Atk/Def anyways), but I'd love to see him get Jolly Jade Lance's "Assist Galeforce" effect to allow him to Smite twice in one turn.

I was thinking of innate Disarm Trap on himself (because they have better sense of smell to sniff things out), and grant Disarm Trap as a status effect to the person he is Assisting. But double Smites would be pretty bonkers and fun too.

— — — — — — —

And since we are talking about re-Refines in the other thread, here is my wishlist fixes:

Leo can have follow-up denial and damage reduction without any condition and have Gravity back in the base Weapon. I would throw in dual phase guaranteed follow-up, Special Fighter, and Firesweep for the Refine. He can dual phase and also kite on player phase.

For Takumi, I would eliminate all HP requirements, add Pass back on, and tack onTempest for even more mobility. I would upgrade the Refine so he can Warp to any space within 2 spaces of allies within 2 spaces. His combat is shit, so I would add either Slaying to the Refine.

Anna's base Weapon effect can Warp to any space within 2 spaces of any ally, and any ally can Warp to any space within 2 spaces of Anna. For her Refine, she deals true damage equal to total Flowers on her and allies within two spaces. Allies within two spaces of her deal true damage equal to number of her Flowers.

Alfonse's base Weapon Atk/Def boost should expand its optional condition to include Ideal, I would add and upgrade its original effect to all stat Wave and Null Panic with Tactics range, and tack on dual phase guaranteed follow-up. The Refine should add G Feud and green breaker.

Sharena should have Threaten all stats at Menace range and Null Bonuses/Penalties. For the Refine, I would upgrade it to Joint Drive all stats+5.

For Jaffar, I would add Fatal Smoke to base, and upgrade the Refine to full Watersweep and add Null Follow-Up.

For Innes, I would change its base to all stat +8 with Blow or Unity condition. The Refine will be upgraded to full Watersweep and add Null Follow-Up.

[Xenomata]

Edited July 5, 2022 by Xenomata

[Ice Dragon]

Refines are up:

Legendary Roy: Dragonbind

Base effect is unchanged:

• Effective damage against dragons
• Distant Counter

Refine effect is:

• If HP is 25% or higher:
  • +4 to all stats
  • +1 Special charge rate
  • the offensive half of Tempo

+4 to all stats is standard for Distant Counter weapons, but feels somewhat lackluster for Roy, who could really use as much Spd as he can get due to the fact that he's a good amount behind the current leaders. Human Virtue II makes up for it somewhat by giving him Sieglinde's refine effect, which lets him borrow the Bonuses from nearby allies, but much of that boost can be made up for with skills like Rein.

+1 Special charge rate and Tempo allows him to land Ruptured Sky on his first counterattack, which combos well with Human Virtue II's percentage damage reduction on the opponent's first attack. However, Roy lacks any means of blocking an opponent's guaranteed follow-up or breaking through an opponent's follow-up prevention, which is a problem for him when dealing with bulkier units that often have one or both effects. Ultimately, it might be best to forgo his new default Spurn in his B slot and switch to Null Follow-Up instead, relying instead on just Human Virtue II's percentage damage reduction on the opponent's first attack.

Without Null Follow-Up on his weapon or exclusive skill, Roy is somewhat disappointing. He ends up as a generalist ball of stats, which is underwhelming in the current meta where the best units do one useful thing and do it exceptionally well.

Kjelle: Heartbeat Lance

Base effect is:

• If HP is 25% or higher:
  • -5 Atk/Def to opponent
  • follow-up prevention

Refine effect is:

• If opponent initiates combat or opponent's HP is 75% or higher:
  • -5 Atk/Def to opponent
  • reduces opponent's Atk by an amount equal to [opponent's Atk at start of combat] × (10 + [number of stats unit has higher than opponent at start of combat] × 5)%
    • "number of stats" refers to the stat itself, not the value, so a maximum of 5 if all 5 of Kjelle's HP, Atk, Spd, Def, and Res are greater than the opponent's respective stat

I had to reread the effect several times just to confirm that it says what I thought it said.

Heartbeat Lance reduces the opponent's Atk (based on the value at the start of combat) by 10% plus an additional 5% for each stat that Kjelle has that is higher than the opponent's at the start of combat. This results in a maximum possible Atk reduction of 35% of its value at the start of combat, but realistically, it'll more likely be 20-25%.

However, even at 20% reduction, against an opponent with 60 visible Atk, it'll lower the opponent's Atk by a very substantial 12 points. Combined with the flat Atk reductions from her other effects, an opponent will realistically suffer a bare minimum of -22 Atk, which is massive.

You could run Fury 4 + Fury 3 on her to boost her visible stats as much as possible with Mediuth as support, but I don't think it's really necessary. Her stats are high enough that she'll already be winning 2 or 3 stats against most units that aren't armors.

Follow-up prevention is nice, too.

Fallen Mareeta: Shadow Sword

Base effect is changed:

• Slaying effect
• If HP is 25% or higher (previously 50%):
  • +5 Atk/Spd (new)
  • Desperation effect

Refine effect is:

• If opponent's HP is 75% or higher:
  • +5 Atk/Spd
  • the offensive half of Tempo
  • if unit's Spd is greater than opponent's Def at start of combat:
    • -8 Spd to opponent
  • if unit's Spd is not greater than opponent's Def at start of combat:
    • -8 Def to opponent

+10 Spd allows Mareeta to tie Karla (at least until Resplendent Karla is released later this month) for realistically the fastest unit in the game. At least, that's what it would have been if it weren't for the Spd-to-Def comparison that pushes Mareeta even higher. Essentially, fast units are unlikely to have high Def and will therefore be guaranteed to be out-sped by the additional -8 Spd, whereas units with high Def are unlikely to be fast and therefore don't care about losing Spd and will be hurt more by the -8 Def.

The only units that can potentially get around Mareeta's Spd-to-Def comparison are all of the infantry Dimitris and Spring Maria, who have high Spd and high Def, but not enough Def to trigger the Def reduction.

Other than that, Tempo is as expected and is welcomed.

Panne: Taguel Fang

Base effect is changed:

• Effective damage against cavalry
• If unit is not adjacent to a human-class ally:
  • +4 to all stats (previously +3)
  • if opponent is human-class (new):
    • +4 to all stats
    • Guard effect
• Standard transform condition and standard beast cavalry transform effect

Refine effect:

• If HP is 25% or higher:
  • +4 to all stats
  • if unit's Spd is greater than opponent's Spd:
    • guaranteed follow-up
  • If unit's Spd is at least 5 greater than opponent's Spd:
    • damage +7

+12 to all stats against human-class opponents is a lot, and Panne really needs it since her base stats are so awful. Both her Atk and Spd are worse than Kaden's, Ranulf's, and Selkie's, which is saying a lot since all of three of them have awful Atk and only decent Spd.

With the stat boost, she can actually compete with modern units. With a Spd Asset, maximum Dragonflowers, and only her weapon equipped Panne has the same Spd as Ascended Mareeta with the same setup. Before counting the +7 damage from the Spd comparison, Panne also beats Mareeta's Atk by 2 points on player phase (the cavalry transform effect is very nice and is probably why a lot of early beast cavalry had awful Atk stats), though Mareeta has a free Atk Ascended Asset that gives Mareeta a 2-point lead instead.

Guard and a guaranteed follow-up are also nice to have, as it makes up for the fact that she can't run Flow Guard. The Impact effect from her transform effect is also worth mentioning, even if it hasn't changed.

While it's most important to highlight the boost to her offensive performance, her defensive stats are not to be ignored, as +12 to all stats means she also gets +12 Def/Res. Combined with the cavalry transform effect, she has 47/49/42 defenses at +0 merge with maximum Dragonflowers and only her weapon equipped, which is nothing to sneeze at.

Mordecai: Sabertooth Fang

Base effect is changed:

• +3 Def
• After unit uses a movement Assist or ally uses a movement Assist on unit:
  • -5 to all stats on enemies within 2 spaces of unit and target ally or unit and targeting ally (previously -4)
• If opponent's HP is 75% or higher (new):
  • +5 Atk/Def
• Standard transform condition and new beast infantry transform effect (previously old effect)

Refine effect is:

• After unit uses a movement Assist or ally uses a movement Assist on unit:
  • +1 Special cooldown (Pulse Smoke) on enemies within 2 spaces of unit and target ally or unit and targeting ally
• If there is at least 1 ally within 3 spaces:
  • +5 Atk/Def

The changes to the weapon's base effect were all expected, though I would have liked -6 instead of -5. The refine effect adds Pulse Smoke to the debuff effects after using a movement Assist, which is nice, but isn't game-changing.

Not much else to say since he's a support unit. If you were using him before, he's better. If you weren't using him before, you probably still won't be using him.

Bride Fjorm: Gjallarbru

Base effect is changed:

• Wrathful Staff effect
• Inflicts Isolation with Ploy targeting against opponents with less HP than unit (previously at least 3 less HP)

Refine effect is:

• Allies within 2 spaces receive:
  • +4 Atk/Spd
  • nullifies Penalties in combat
• If there is at least 1 ally within 3 spaces:
  • +4 Atk/Spd

The Isolation application condition was improved to a 1-HP difference, which is all it really needed. Everything else is just icing on the cake.

Nullifying penalties as a Drive effect is pretty novel, though.

 

General thoughts

Dragonbind is quite a bit underwhelming, given that it's for a Legendary Hero. Not getting Null Follow-Up is disappointing.

Mordecai's is good, but doesn't really stand out. It's probably not going to convince anyone to use him if they aren't already using him.

The other four are all pretty amazing.

Kjelle lowers the opponent's Atk by a massive amount with a novel comparison condition, and it isn't that hard to get enough stacks to make a dent sizable enough to make a meaningful difference. I can see her actually being a pretty good Near Save tank.

Mareeta is just stupidly fast and stupidly strong and has all of the effects she needs to function without dying. No complaints. I'll probably actually build her now.

Panne went from being utter crap to actually being good. My only complaint is that she hasn't has a Forma released of her yet, which means I can't justify getting her to +10 and giving her Trait Fruits.

Fjorm got the boost she needed, and that's all that mattered.

Edited July 5, 2022 by Ice Dragon

[Florete]

More from Gjallarbru than I expected/predicted. It really didn't need anything so the extra effects are just fine for me.

[Xenomata]

• As with all other DC weapon refines, Roy's refine is pretty simple. Spectrum +4, accelerate special charge, and Tempo all in one. The DC and dragon effectiveness from the original remain intact, so Roy should hopefully have no problem maintaining a competitive edge when combined with Human Virtue II.
  ...still don't really understand why Roy is so freaking racist tho.
• Shadow Sword's base effect got the Forseti treatment (anyone wanna bet that Worldsea Wave gets it as well?), but the refine is actually pretty interesting imo. Not the further Atk/Spd and Tempo effects, the effect in which Mareeta actually is always inflicting a debuff that always makes a difference. Defensive foes who sack Spd will lose a lot of Def. Speedy foes who already have low Def lose a lot of Spd. I kinda like it.
  ...why do Fallen units always get the best refines?
• Heartbeat Lance looks pretty interesting. With the refine, Kjelle inflicts a total Atk/Def -10 on the enemy, the enemy can't follow-up, and they also get a further Atk penalty based on how many of Kjelle's stats are higher than their own. Realistically Kjelle can probably expect 3-4 of her stats to be higher at any given moment (there's no fixing that Spd), so that's 25%-30% of the foes Atk being chopped off. Pretty neat.
• What is with the racism in this batch...?
  Panne gets spectrum +12 if she is alone, healthy, and tearing the jugular out of a human and not a beast or dragon. Humans also get special charge -1. If her Spd is higher by at least 5 Panne gets a guaranteed follow-up and +7 true damage. Also cavalry effectiveness, can't forget that.
  Panne's base Spd is 34, 37 with an asset, so it wouldn't be unrealistic for her to be able to get the full benefits of her weapon against most foes. Kind of a shame though, her total stat bonus is lower than Selkies at maximum effect...
• Huh, a Pulse effect. That's nice, should make Smiting allies into a group safer. Might not work as well with enemies who have 1 turn cooldowns, 2 turn cooldowns with accelerated charge, or just already have their special charged, necessitating the ally have a Guard effect to ensure the enemy special can never trigger, but hey it's still a nice effect that helps improve Mordy's Smite game.
  Also Atk/Def +10 and the new Beast Inf. Tempo effect.
• Well at least the Isolation effect is easier to inflict.
  Not sure why Fjorm doesn't get exactly the same effect that she grants to her allies, nor why she doesn't need to be as close to get her own effect, but it should still be a good boon to have around if you already use Fjorm. Not like you have any other options, anyway...

And the lesson learned: Humans rock, screw the rules I have darkness, still don't get what Heartbeat Lance is supposed to mean for Kjelle, Humans suck, Mordecai smites you.

Edited July 5, 2022 by Xenomata

[XRay]

Roy: Blazing Lion is not bad, but it is not good either. A third Dodge on his Weapon would not be too broken, especially if we consider nukes these days who can nullify it.

Mareeta: Blade's Pawn got Tempo. As for the choosing stat debuff thing, I would have just went straight Spd/Def-8. Picking and choosing only one feels stingy. Like Roy: Blazing Lion above, does not feel too exciting.

Panne basically got Flow Guard. The Flow part is in the form of guaranteed follow-up, and the Guard part only works against Beorc. There is also true damage. It is decent for a free unit, but it is not amazing either.

Mordecai got Pulse Smoke.

Fjorm: Bride of Rime got penalty negation. You can use her with Save tanks, but Flayn and Elimine (or the Nifls) are so much better. I think they should have just doubled down on mobility penalties and give her Gravity instead.

I do not think there is anything game changing here. There is nothing bad, but there is nothing that warrants spending Dew for either.

46 minutes ago, Ice Dragon said:

• • reduces opponent's Atk by an amount equal to [opponent's Atk at start of combat] × (10 + [number of stats unit has higher than opponent at start of combat] × 5)%
    • "number of stats" refers to the stat itself, not the value, so a maximum of 5 if all 5 of Kjelle's HP, Atk, Spd, Def, and Res are greater than the opponent's respective stat

I am kind of confused on how to calculate it. If Kjelle has 5 stats that are all higher, that means the foe has their Atk reduced by 35%? Against nukes, she will most likely just have 3 stats higher, so Atk reduction is 25%? A nuke with 80 Atk will have it reduced to 60 Atk, which is pretty massive. If I did calculate it right, I think Kjelle might actually be worth using and Refining. If the opponent has shit Atk, then you do not need damage reduction.

Edited July 5, 2022 by XRay

[Xenomata]

49 minutes ago, XRay said:

Mareeta: Blade's Pawn got Tempo. As for the choosing stat debuff thing, I would have just went straight Spd/Def-8. Picking and choosing only one feels stingy. Like Roy: Blazing Lion above, does not feel too exciting.

Way I see it, limiting it to one stat means Mareeta is allowed to have it be at -8 instead of having to contend with a slightly lower debuff for the sake of having both stat debuffs.

It's not even like there's enough units in the game who pack such high Spd and Def that Mareeta can't deal good damage to them and still outspeed them, or even really any effects that Mareeta would want both Spd and Def lowered at the same time (not that I can think of anyway)

[Humanoid]

Hmm, probably not worth giving my Roy and Mareeta - both unmerged and with mediocre natures - any dew. And I'm committed to building Naesala as my blue beast unit (someday if/when I play properly again) so there's no incentive, so that rules out Panny and Mordy. Don't have Kjelle so Fjorm gets it by default, as faulty as that logic of someone needing to be refined is.

Edited July 5, 2022 by Humanoid

[Ice Dragon]

Updated my original post with analysis and other comments.

 

1 hour ago, Xenomata said:

Kind of a shame though, her total stat bonus is lower than Selkies at maximum effect...

Given that Selkie has trouble activating a full half of her stat bonus against bulky opponents where she really wants the extra Atk, giving Panne fewer points of stats in exchange for having a much easier time activating all of them is a good trade. Especially since Panne gets an additional +7 damage that ignores Def to hit slow, bulky units with.

 

1 hour ago, XRay said:

Mareeta: Blade's Pawn got Tempo. As for the choosing stat debuff thing, I would have just went straight Spd/Def-8. Picking and choosing only one feels stingy. Like Roy: Blazing Lion above, does not feel too exciting.

Fallen Mareeta already has the highest practical Spd stat in the game for the next 5 days (after which Resplendent Karla will beat her by 2 points). She doesn't need -8 Spd against slow, bulky units, and the only fast units where the -8 Def would actually make a difference are named Dimitri or Maria. Getting only one stat gives them a reasonable excuse to make the magnitude of that stat as big as it is.

 

1 hour ago, XRay said:

Panne basically got Flow Guard. The Flow part is in the form of guaranteed follow-up, and the Guard part only works against Beorc. There is also true damage. It is decent for a free unit, but it is not amazing either.

With her stat boosts, her stats are literally comparable with Ascended Mareeta's.

 

1 hour ago, XRay said:

I am kind of confused on how to calculate it. If Kjelle has 5 stats that are all higher, that means the foe has their Atk reduced by 35%? Against nukes, she will most likely just have 3 stats higher, so Atk reduction is 25%? A nuke with 80 Atk will have it reduced to 60 Atk, which is pretty massive.

Yes, all 5 stats is 35%.

The Atk reduction applies to the opponent's visible Atk, which means most nukes will only have a visible Atk stat around 70 tops (counting a +6 Bonus). This is also only in combat, so it won't protect against AoE Special skills, and she'll probably still die to them since her Res isn't particularly great.

[XRay]

1 hour ago, Xenomata said:

Way I see it, limiting it to one stat means Mareeta is allowed to have it be at -8 instead of having to contend with a slightly lower debuff for the sake of having both stat debuffs.

It's not even like there's enough units in the game who pack such high Spd and Def that Mareeta can't deal good damage to them and still outspeed them, or even really any effects that Mareeta would want both Spd and Def lowered at the same time (not that I can think of anyway)

41 minutes ago, Ice Dragon said:

Fallen Mareeta already has the highest practical Spd stat in the game for the next 5 days (after which Resplendent Karla will beat her by 2 points). She doesn't need -8 Spd against slow, bulky units, and the only fast units where the -8 Def would actually make a difference are named Dimitri or Maria. Getting only one stat gives them a reasonable excuse to make the magnitude of that stat as big as it is.

Inflicting Spd/Def-8 is not really all that much considering super tanks and Save tanks often have 50%+ damage reduction, and in Aether Raids, super tanks in general and some Save tanks can reach really high Spd.

51 minutes ago, Ice Dragon said:

With her stat boosts, her stats are literally comparable with Ascended Mareeta's.

And she is not Mareeta: Astra Awakened. Panne has Flow Guard. Mareeta: Astra Awakened got the Flow part, and also got access to two extra stacks of damage reduction that works against everyone, which is better than Guard in my opinion if you have to pick one or the other.

1 hour ago, Ice Dragon said:

The Atk reduction applies to the opponent's visible Atk, which means most nukes will only have a visible Atk stat around 70 tops (counting a +6 Bonus). This is also only in combat, so it won't protect against AoE Special skills, and she'll probably still die to them since her Res isn't particularly great.

Aw. I guess applying to only visible buffs is still better than nothing. Feels a lot tamer then.

[Ice Dragon]

2 minutes ago, XRay said:

And she is not Mareeta: Astra Awakened. Panne has Flow Guard. Mareeta: Astra Awakened got the Flow part, and also got access to two extra stacks of damage reduction that works against everyone, which is better than Guard in my opinion if you have to pick one or the other.

Defensively, Panne has 104 single-hit physical bulk at +10 merge with maximum Dragonflowers, which is enough to deal with pretty much anything short of an instant Ruptured Sky from a unit with Tempo or Time's Pulse.

Offensively, Panne matches Mareeta on player phase and has access to Trace for more mobility and additional offensive stats.

That's good for unit in general and insanely good for a free unit.

 

Oh, and Panne has weapon triangle advantage and effective damage against Sigurd, which lets her just flat-out one-shot Sigurd. In case you need someone else to delete Sigurd with.

 

2 minutes ago, XRay said:

Aw. I guess applying to only visible buffs is still better than nothing. Feels a lot tamer then.

You're looking at only losing about 5 points of Atk in penalties by not affecting in-combat Atk boosts. Not the end of the world when you're already hitting the opponent for a combined penalty of 22+ Atk just from the weapon alone.

That's all of the opponent's in-combat Atk bonuses for a modern unit (6 Atk from weapon, 9 Atk from Ideal, 6 Atk from Solo) nullified with the weapon alone, allowing for Kjelle's passive skills to nullify the opponent's weapon Mt (6-8 Def from Stance or Close Def, 4 Def from Save, 7 Def from Form).

Fighting against Kjelle is basically just your base Atk with no skills equipped (including weapon skill) against Kjelle's base Def with no skills equipped. Which is a losing battle unless you have something fancy up your sleeve like effective damage or a charged Special.

[Xenomata]

Hope you fans of Three Houses are ready, because this Weapon Refinery update has the first Three Houses unit to be receiving a refine.

• Wanderer Blade will be given to Rutger: Lone Swordsman (Original weapon is a Slaying Sword+, with the Slaying effect)
• Wolfskin Fang, belonging to Keaton: Lupine Collector (weapon inflicts Spd -5 and enables the Brave effect on both phases. Also has the original transformed Infantry Beast effect of +10 special damage)
• Worldsea Wave, belonging to Laegjarn: Burning Sun (Grants Spd+3 and enables a Desperation effect when Laeg's HP is above 50%_
• Divine Breath, which is coming alongside the remix of Naga: Dragon Divinity (Grants Atk+3, effective against Dragon foes, and boosts all of her stats by [number of units within 2 spaces that are either Dragons or have any kind of "Effective against Dragons" effect] x 3, with a maximum boost of +9)
• Freikugel, under the (reluctant?) ownership of Hilda: Idle Maiden (Grants Spd+3, if Hilda is within 2 spaces of an ally with Def higher than her own, grants those allies Atk/Spd +4, but if no nearby allies have more Def than her then Hilda gets Atk/Spd +6)
• Luna Arc, getting remixed alongside Alm: Saint-King (Grants Spd+3. If unit initiates combat, deals damage equal to 25% of foes Def (ignores reductions to Def from special skills like Lunar Flash)
• Lion King Fang, belonging to Caineghis: Gallia's Lion King (Grant Atk+3, if foe initiates combat, grants all stats +4 during combat. Also gains the Transformed Armor Beast effect of Distant Counter)

Personally keeping an eye on... uh... all of them I guess. Every unit save Rutger is either someone I have personal interest in or is just generally someone to keep an eye on.

Edited August 3, 2022 by Xenomata

[Othin]

Rutger, Laegjarn, Keaton, and Caineghis are all as expected, but I wasn't expecting Hilda for the last one. Guess all the pre-CYL3 banners are on the table now.

They'll probably do Dimitri/Edelgard/Claude as one batch, but I'm surprised they didn't start 3H with them or the Byleths.

[Diovani Bressan]

I guess they didn't want to do Yarne now or else we would have too many beasts at the same time? (I see no problem on that). And no Edelgard as well, because we may get all hourse leaders at the same time. So makes sense going for Hilda, since she is the next in line after those 2.

September should be CYL 4 refinements, even though I still think it's too soon. Plus Haar, and then Julia and/or Sothis. (depends if both get the remix or not)

After that, should be... Summer Lyn, Lethe, Fallen  Tiki or Corrin, and Yarne? (Seasonal Units are skipped in CYL refinery month). October doesn't have any remix scheduled, so no legendary/mythic. And for Grail unit: Fallen Delthea.

[Othin]

5 minutes ago, Diovani Bressan said:

I guess they didn't want to do Yarne now or else we would have too many beasts at the same time? (I see no problem on that). And no Edelgard as well, because we may get all hourse leaders at the same time. So makes sense going for Hilda, since she is the next in line after those 2.

September should be CYL 4 refinements, even though I still think it's too soon. Plus Haar, and then Julia and/or Sothis. (depends if both get the remix or not)

After that, should be... Summer Lyn, Lethe, Fallen  Tiki or Corrin, and Yarne? (Seasonal Units are skipped in CYL refinery month). October doesn't have any remix scheduled, so no legendary/mythic. And for Grail unit: Fallen Delthea.

I hope they finally break from the CYL September tradition. Last year was silly enough.

Yarne was the one I had in mind, but also they don't always do perfect color balance anyway.

[Xenomata]

I actually wonder if they're going to delay the House Leader refines for a bit because the Brave alts of the house leaders (plus Lysithea) are already theoretically penciled in for a refine, ergo they'd be the subject of a refinery update twice in close proximity?

...which just begs to remind that oh god the Brave House Leaders are theoretically getting a refine.

[Othin]

Counting 4* and 5* main pool units together, there's 29 main pool units left in Book 3, followed by another 12 from the first two months of Book 4. If we keep getting 3 of them every month, it'd take at least 14 months of regular refines to get all the units from before CYL4 voting took place.

If we continue to get CYL refines every September, we'll have CYL5 refines before that. That's absurd.