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General Weapon Refinery discussion/speculation/creation thread

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36 minutes ago, Othin said:

Non-seasonal/legendary units released on Kaze's banner or earlier who do not yet have a refine:

Hm... If they continue with 4 refines per month and don't skip the staff units or jump to book 3, there's a chance we can get him in October.

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26 minutes ago, Flying Shogi said:

Hm... If they continue with 4 refines per month and don't skip the staff units or jump to book 3, there's a chance we can get him in October.

Given that we just got Lewyn, I'm assuming we'll get more units from later than Kaze in the meantime, but I'd also expect him to show up before some of the units preceding him. 3 are dancers and 9 have DC weapons, and who knows how long those will take.

If they start doing Book 2 demotes at a rate of one per month, it should take about 6 months from whenever they start, but who knows when that start will be. That said, now that Nowi and Arden are covered, we now have some sort of prf on every non-staff/dance unit from Book 1, so it could be about time to shake things up one way or another.

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11 hours ago, Othin said:

Given that we just got Lewyn, I'm assuming we'll get more units from later than Kaze in the meantime, but I'd also expect him to show up before some of the units preceding him. 3 are dancers and 9 have DC weapons, and who knows how long those will take.

If they start doing Book 2 demotes at a rate of one per month, it should take about 6 months from whenever they start, but who knows when that start will be. That said, now that Nowi and Arden are covered, we now have some sort of prf on every non-staff/dance unit from Book 1, so it could be about time to shake things up one way or another.

or you know they could actually start doing 12 refines per  update... Just an Idea to catch up and then go back to 4 per update. We should have hit Book 2 End now with refines, but we are nowhere near it lol

Edited by Hilda

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7 hours ago, Hilda said:

or you know they could actually start doing 12 refines per  update... Just an Idea to catch up and then go back to 4 per update. We should have hit Book 2 End now with refines, but we are nowhere near it lol

I'd love an increase in refine speed, but they've shown no interest in doing that.

IS seems to prefer taking it slow and drawing things out, so they don't burn through their content too fast. There's no timeline for what they "should" hit when.

Edited by Othin

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25 minutes ago, Fabulously Olivier said:

Who do we think is next? I'm predicting Hector, Maribelle, Sothe, and Joshua.

Sounds plausible enough, and I'd be happy with that list.

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3 hours ago, Fabulously Olivier said:

Who do we think is next? I'm predicting Hector, Maribelle, Sothe, and Joshua.

why you no love Azama or Wrys ._.?

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3 hours ago, Hilda said:

why you no love Azama or Wrys ._.?

Because all of the staves that have so far gotten refines were for 5-star exclusive characters, and Maribelle is next in line.

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1 hour ago, Ice Dragon said:

Because all of the staves that have so far gotten refines were for 5-star exclusive characters, and Maribelle is next in line.

i know that, but it would be nice if they started to refine 3-4 Star healers too ._.

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5 hours ago, Hilda said:

i know that, but it would be nice if they started to refine 3-4 Star healers too ._.

I highly doubt they'll give 4* and lower staves that kind of attention for a long while. Maybe the ones that used to be 5* summonable like Sakura and Lucius, but they're the only ones I'm willing to put any amount of money on.

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34 minutes ago, Xenomata said:

I highly doubt they'll give 4* and lower staves that kind of attention for a long while. Maybe the ones that used to be 5* summonable like Sakura and Lucius, but they're the only ones I'm willing to put any amount of money on.

I don't see a reason to assume that. They've given plenty of cool toys to common units of other weapon types, why would staffs be an exception?

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2 minutes ago, Othin said:

I don't see a reason to assume that. They've given plenty of cool toys to common units of other weapon types, why would staffs be an exception?

Just an assumption, but the staves they gave Elise, Mist, and Genny all have a statup, either Wrathful or Dazzling, and the main effect of their respective staves on top of the refine. I know they're not fair to compare, but even the most recent Kia Staff only has Wrathful and that penalty nullification buff, and that's on a Book 5 unit. I fully expect them to want to tone down on the goodies for the lower rarity staves, which may take a bit of planning before they are willing to roll them out.

Plus Tiki was the only Gen1 Dragonstone unit to have a refine for a long while, being a 5* exclusive (and Adult Tiki also existing and getting a pass), and it wasn't until the latter half of 2020 that any of the other Gen1 dragonstones got a refine. Knowing Intsys, they have no reason not to repeat history.

Note that I said they wouldn't get that kind of attention for a long while. I'm not saying it's impossible, but they only just started rolling out refines to staves. We might expect to see refines for 5* exclusive dancers next (Azura and Ninian), maybe even DC weapons or Legendary weapons a little later on, but I don't think we should expect refines for all the low-rarity staves immediately. It'd be nice sure, I +10ed Wrys and Lucius so my investment in them is higher than other staves, but I'd also really like them to get around to refining certain weapons a bit faster to...

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2 hours ago, Xenomata said:

Just an assumption, but the staves they gave Elise, Mist, and Genny all have a statup, either Wrathful or Dazzling, and the main effect of their respective staves on top of the refine. I know they're not fair to compare, but even the most recent Kia Staff only has Wrathful and that penalty nullification buff, and that's on a Book 5 unit. I fully expect them to want to tone down on the goodies for the lower rarity staves, which may take a bit of planning before they are willing to roll them out.

Plus Tiki was the only Gen1 Dragonstone unit to have a refine for a long while, being a 5* exclusive (and Adult Tiki also existing and getting a pass), and it wasn't until the latter half of 2020 that any of the other Gen1 dragonstones got a refine. Knowing Intsys, they have no reason not to repeat history.

Note that I said they wouldn't get that kind of attention for a long while. I'm not saying it's impossible, but they only just started rolling out refines to staves. We might expect to see refines for 5* exclusive dancers next (Azura and Ninian), maybe even DC weapons or Legendary weapons a little later on, but I don't think we should expect refines for all the low-rarity staves immediately. It'd be nice sure, I +10ed Wrys and Lucius so my investment in them is higher than other staves, but I'd also really like them to get around to refining certain weapons a bit faster to...

Would be nice if they released refines at a faster rate than they release actual new units. Like how many units have refines now out of the total that are in the game? A fifth? A sixth? I don't think it's as high as a quarter. How long will we need to wait for book five refines? Probably another five years, which by then the number of units in the game will have doubled what they are now (assuming the game runs another five years). They could go up to releasing five or six refines at once IMO (as like a standard, I know we've gotten five or six refines on some rare occasions where units share a weapon like Cyas and Alvis, course that's still the standard number of refines, it just affects more units). It's not like they're particularly resource heavy to create. It's just artificial scarcity that's keeping them so low.

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9 hours ago, Xenomata said:

Maybe the ones that used to be 5* summonable like Sakura and Lucius, but they're the only ones I'm willing to put any amount of money on.

I totally forgot that Sakura was a 4-5* unit before.

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6 hours ago, Jotari said:

Would be nice if they released refines at a faster rate than they release actual new units. Like how many units have refines now out of the total that are in the game? A fifth? A sixth? I don't think it's as high as a quarter. How long will we need to wait for book five refines? Probably another five years, which by then the number of units in the game will have doubled what they are now (assuming the game runs another five years). They could go up to releasing five or six refines at once IMO (as like a standard, I know we've gotten five or six refines on some rare occasions where units share a weapon like Cyas and Alvis, course that's still the standard number of refines, it just affects more units). It's not like they're particularly resource heavy to create. It's just artificial scarcity that's keeping them so low.

On the bright side, book 1 had the largest amount of non-prf weapon wielders by far, as well as (I think) the largest number of units by far. With us nearing the end of book 1, future books should go somewhat faster. There's also the distinct possibility that some weapons will be deemed good enough to not refine.

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2 minutes ago, Fabulously Olivier said:

On the bright side, book 1 had the largest amount of non-prf weapon wielders by far, as well as (I think) the largest number of units by far. With us nearing the end of book 1, future books should go somewhat faster. There's also the distinct possibility that some weapons will be deemed good enough to not refine.

Does that matter though? Like units with a prf like Lewyn and Sigurd still get refines. So basically all units (except seasonals?) are in the que. And while you're right Book 1 had the most units (I assume, given they didn't start the game with just four units), the fact is that they release more new units per month than they do refines. We get  standard four unit banner per month, plus a mythic at the end and four seasonals every second month plus two tempest trials units and a grand hero battle. So about ten a month give or take for some months not being seasonals, and only four refines. So they release new units at about twice the rates of refines. And I don't think power creep will ever guarantee a weapon that will never not need to be refined. By the time Brave Edelgard or someone is waiting for their refine (five or six years from now) the new units getting released will be far more powerful.

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Reinhardt became part of a weapon update before Reinhardt. I wonder if he'll get a legendary or even win CYL before he will be part of one. The others are Joshua, Nina, and flying Nino.

Meisterschwert and Keaton's Wolfskin Fang for that matter are going to be interesting since they are Arden's Blade at base, but with 1 more Mt because prf Brave Mt inconsistencies even with types taking into consideration. Anyway, Keaton at least has the infantry beast Wo Dao effect and infantry-exclusive or available skills whereas Meisterschwert is just a prf Brave Sword that works on both phases. Later similar weapons ended up with another effect like Meisterbogen has a weird only in human's hands follow-up denial effect, Ragnell-Alondite has Distant Counter, and Arden's Blade has a if Arden's HP is >= 50%, then he gets Atk+4, Def+6, and inflicts Guard on his foe in combat. Not sure what will happen with Meisterschwert. A simple effect would be Lull Atk/Def or Lull Spd/Def and a 2 or 3 spaces wide in-combat buff could reference his high authority in Thracia 776. Otherwise, Null C-Disrupt would be neat as would in the future, Vantage be for Wolfskin Fang and perhaps even one that is immune to Hardy Bearing which I find interesting we have not had a weapon or prf skill with that effect yet. They could do something weird with adaptive damage or him dealing damage based on his foe's resistance to reference him being skilled with magic and swords.

Joshua is also going to be interesting since he was until Halloween Xane who doesn't really benefit much from any other stat boost to have a flat +5 to a stat from his weapon. It's probably going to carry over as time has shown us with weapons that had the X+3, but who knows. Downgrading it when refined would be kind of dickish, but replaced or even upgraded could work since it's technically a second effect as Audhulma is a prf Killing Edge with Res+5 as its effects.

Then there's Nina and flying Nino. Nina is Nina, one of many, many units who should be at least 4* summon in some way. She doesn't have a it's named / belongs to her now in Fates like other characters, right? Not sure what they would do with her other than play on her default Spd/Res Link and give her the other half or go with Mordecai's debuff effect. Or they could do something wacky and give her a permanent damage reduction negation effect and double down on dealing damage by her dealing damage equal to her own or her foe's defense, resistance, or whatever.

Flying Nino is the first unit with the deal up to 7 damage with higher speed or another state to be part of an update, right? The only other two I remember off the top of my head are Karla and Naesala.

I figured Hector would have been part of this weapon update. What is even holding them back? They could just slap the increased HP threshold for its QR2 to that of refined Maltet and call it a day. Maybe add the negates his own follow-up attacks if they want to be nice.

Edited by Kaden

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7 minutes ago, Kaden said:

 

Ignore this. Had a butter fingers moment on mobile.

Edited by Kaden

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So they're not doing any more healers yet, that's unfortunate. Joshua is the only Book 1 unit here, and he wraps up the Book 1 grail units. Meanwhile we get two units from mid-Book 2, and one from late Book 2.

The other missing 5* units between the start of Book 2 and CYL2, aside from DC weapons, are Ishtar, Karla, Maribelle, and Sumia, plus Lene and Olivia for dancers. That's not many.

Edited by Othin

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On the one hand, this is a decent batch of characters. Nina needs anything to make her salvageable and Joshua was long-coming and I'm glad at least one version of Reinhardt gets a weapon refine after I've been whining about it.

No 3-4 star healers getting refines here makes me ;/ though.

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1 hour ago, GuiltyLove said:

@Flying Shogi Nino is getting a refine! What do you want for her? I just want a flier to get NFU.

If unit initiates combat, grants atk/spd +5 and if unit's HP>=25% of max, makes a guaranteed follow-up atk before enemy can counter attack. 

Not exactly NFU but it counters wary fighter esque units like B!Lysithea. Could allow Nino to become a powerful sweeper.

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1 hour ago, GuiltyLove said:

@Flying Shogi Nino is getting a refine! What do you want for her? I just want a flier to get NFU.

I just want something that's not wonky like Effie's refine. I don't want to expect anything to avoid disappointment.

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