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Super Smash Bros. Ultimate News and Discussion: A Simple and Clean Finish

Now that Ultimate has been out for a while, who is your favorite newcomer?  

71 members have voted

  1. 1. Who is your favorite base game (and Piranha Plant) newcomer?

  2. 2. Who is your favorite new Echo Fighter?

  3. 3. Who is your favorite Fighters Pass 1 character?



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41 minutes ago, Glennstavos said:

I feel like I say this about every character, but Steve seems too safe offstage.

Literally 90% of Smash Ultimates cast. This is something that's generally annoying about the game.

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On 10/3/2020 at 11:59 AM, Florete said:

>No female Byleth amiibo.

Just another reason why always getting male default sucks.

Totally agree with you, they went with the generic male one, not for nothing smash fans says that all of them are Marth. Now I wish they didn't add Byleth, I was looking forward her amiibo...

 

On 10/3/2020 at 1:10 PM, Florete said:

The point is that if Byleth was female default we'd be getting a female Byleth amiibo. As it is we lack amiibos for female Robin, Villager, Pokemon Trainer, and Byleth. The only male alt we lack an amiibo for is Wii Fit Trainer, who no one really cares about, because Inkling Boy does have an amiibo (just not a Smash one) and Corrin just got lucky.

I'm willing to bet a female Byleth amiibo would outsell male as well.

Getting these female amiibos wouldn't fix all my problems with all these characters always being male default but it would certainly soften the blow.

Ups I also agree with this comment really. Even if male Byleth fans are super loud, female Byleth always has more fans (more fanart, more likes, higher bplaces on polls, and so) so yeah she'll would definitely outsell him, now they won't have my purchase not a couple of friends IRL and other people I've seen.

They really just don't want our money, even if they had complications if manufacturing because of the pandemic, at least they should have it for the future, and for the others bayou mentioned there wasn't any pandemic so there is no excuse, female figurines are always a save sales, so I don't understand them except for them being misogynist as they tend do...

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Man, it just occurred to me that that first shot of Travis kicking the box is a reference to the first cutscene of the first game where he kicks down the door. "It's game time"

1 hour ago, lightcosmo said:

Literally 90% of Smash Ultimates cast. This is something that's generally annoying about the game.

I have so much to say on that matter but I'm in no mood for essays this time. Just that edgeguarding and offstage play is really what makes Smash unique compared to other fighters, and I wish the game's design was more concerned with those interactions than what happens onstage. A lot of the finer details with recoveries: like what special moves get refreshed after being hit, which characters benefit from good offstage game, and how ledge options are handled tends to feel sloppy when comparing between characters. And Mr. Roblox over here can just build a physical barrier in front of the ledge? I'm the guy that's always asking for edgeguarding to be easier, but even I feel like that's too far.

But we'll see I guess.

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4 hours ago, Florete said:

>No female Byleth amiibo.

Just another reason why always getting male default sucks.

It's a good thing, Male Byleth deserves to have the limelight for a change especially when the female variant unfairly overshadowed him within the community.

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1 minute ago, Seazas said:

Male Byleth deserves to have the limelight for a change

Did you see any of the trailers for Three Houses? Male Byleth has always had the limelight.

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43 minutes ago, charmedx3 said:

Ups I also agree with this comment really. Even if male Byleth fans are super loud, female Byleth always has more fans (more fanart, more likes, higher bplaces on polls, and so) so yeah she'll would definitely outsell him, now they won't have my purchase not a couple of friends IRL and other people I've seen.

They really just don't want our money, even if they had complications if manufacturing because of the pandemic, at least they should have it for the future, and for the others bayou mentioned there wasn't any pandemic so there is no excuse, female figurines are always a save sales, so I don't understand them except for them being misogynist as they tend do...

Are you seriously trying to imply that they're misogynists because they used a variation of a blank state avatar you don't care for? That's petty as fuck.

1 minute ago, Florete said:

Did you see any of the trailers for Three Houses? Male Byleth has always had the limelight.

Outdated promotional material for Three Houses means nothing. Same shit happened with Corrin. They were "even" with the male "always having the limelight" until Male Corrin got completely fucked out of it for the female version due to the community preferring her. Male Byleth having the amiibo means nothing for Female Byleth since she has the most community attention with Intsys actively focusing on her more and more too.

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1 minute ago, Seazas said:

Outdated promotional material for Three Houses means nothing. Same shit happened with Corrin. They were "even" with the male "always having the limelight" until Male Corrin got completely fucked out of it for the female version due to the community preferring her. Male Byleth having the amiibo means nothing for Female Byleth since she has the most community attention with Intsys actively focusing on her more and more too.

What a load of bullshit.

The only prioritization female Corrin got is being the default in Warriors, but even there they fucked up since male Corrin got the spotlight in History mode and was the one in the illustration (female Corrin is not in any of the illustrations in Warriors base game).

Need I say anything about these recent cipher artworks?

Spoiler

item_B22_01.png

Cipher-Finale.png

Need I mention all three Fire Emblem avatars in Smash being male default?

"Outdated promotional material" what a shitty argument, this is about Nintendo and IS treating their male avatars as primary and female as secondary and their promotional material is at the forefront of it all. Even saying the female has more community attention is dubious at best, they get more fanart but when people talk about the characters in general they're almost always referring to the male version, you always see people referring to Robin or Corrin or Byleth as "he" but rarely as "she." And I see nothing of this supposed IS giving female Byleth more attention lately aside from her summer alt in Heroes, but I guarantee you a male Byleth alt isn't far behind.

These and other posts I've seen from you really make me think you're a misogynist.

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3 hours ago, Glennstavos said:

Edit: Also I'm concerned people will complain about "the lack of Minecraft music" while completely missing/ignoring Sakurai's explanation. They didn't just ask for what already exists. They had to make almost all of the music we'll see in Smash, and those remixes take serious effort. Compare instead to the Dragon Quest music where they didn't seem allowed to remix anything despite the small selection.

How many music tracks does the entire Minecraft series have including Minecraft: Storymode, Minecraft Earth, and Minecraft Dungeons? I don't think I recall since Minecraft has alot of music track collection since it was an indie game and I only have the PS Vita version for Minecraft as well.

3 hours ago, Florete said:

The point is that if Byleth was female default we'd be getting a female Byleth amiibo. As it is we lack amiibos for female Robin, Villager, Pokemon Trainer, and Byleth. The only male alt we lack an amiibo for is Wii Fit Trainer, who no one really cares about, because Inkling Boy does have an amiibo (just not a Smash one) and Corrin just got lucky.

I'm willing to bet a female Byleth amiibo would outsell male as well.

Getting these female amiibos wouldn't fix all my problems with all these characters always being male default but it would certainly soften the blow.

No, my point was Nintendo does care of their employees' safety due to COVID-19 going around in the entire world like Sakurai said in Min Min's and Steve's Presentation and a lot of video game companies have to require their employees to work remotely at their homes as well. I'm presumably pretty sure the designers who worked on the amiibos possibly have to take care of their kids and other family members due to the Pandemic going on in the world and might have to risk the scheduling time on the amiibo creation for the designing point for the default designs only for the time being.

Edited by King Marth 64

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28 minutes ago, Florete said:

What a load of bullshit.

The only prioritization female Corrin got is being the default in Warriors, but even there they fucked up since male Corrin got the spotlight in History mode and was the one in the illustration (female Corrin is not in any of the illustrations in Warriors base game).

Need I say anything about these recent cipher artworks?

  Reveal hidden contents

item_B22_01.png

Cipher-Finale.png

Need I mention all three Fire Emblem avatars in Smash being male default?

"Outdated promotional material" what a shitty argument, this is about Nintendo and IS treating their male avatars as primary and female as secondary and their promotional material is at the forefront of it all. Even saying the female has more community attention is dubious at best, they get more fanart but when people talk about the characters in general they're almost always referring to the male version, you always see people referring to Robin or Corrin or Byleth as "he" but rarely as "she." And I see nothing of this supposed IS giving female Byleth more attention lately aside from her summer alt in Heroes, but I guarantee you a male Byleth alt isn't far behind.

These and other posts I've seen from you really make me think you're a misogynist.

Oh please, I'm not a misogynist just because I'm arguing in defense of Male Byleth and find his design better. Cut it out with those dumb assumptions.

Female Corrin has more action than Male Corrin by the community and literally got prioritized in the main mode than the filler side mode that is History Mode. While Female Corrin is shining in the main narrative and the cutscenes. Also, RARELY AS SHE!? Female Byleth is literally more popular than Male Byleth proven by the constant polls, discussions and fan content of Byleth as a whole. Male Byleth pales in comparison to the amount his female variant had. And you can hinge on "not far behind" yet Female Byleth quickly had priority from Intsys over the male and will remain that way.

Being "male default" means nothing either with Smash highlighting both genders of Male and Female on the render art piece with the fighter pass. They are treated equally in Smash with Male Byleth being 10x less popular and cared about than the female version. 

Edited by Seazas

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4 hours ago, Seazas said:

Female Corrin has more action than Male Corrin by the community and literally got prioritized in the main mode than the filler side mode that is History Mode. While Female Corrin is shining in the main narrative and the cutscenes.

Male Robin is prioritized in both the main story and history mode. Female Corrin is only prioritized in main story and has no illustrations presence. This is a bare minimum example of giving a female avatar some priority.

4 hours ago, Seazas said:

Also, RARELY AS SHE!?

Read around these forums, Reddit, etc. When people discuss the characters, it's almost always as "he."

4 hours ago, Seazas said:

Female Byleth is literally more popular than Male Byleth proven by the constant polls, discussions and fan content of Byleth as a whole. Male Byleth pales in comparison to the amount his female variant had.

Fan content is not my concern in all this. Official content is.

4 hours ago, Seazas said:

And you can hinge on "not far behind" yet Female Byleth quickly had priority from Intsys over the male and will remain that way.

Show me examples.

4 hours ago, Seazas said:

Being "male default" means nothing either with Smash highlighting both genders of Male and Female on the render art piece with the fighter pass. They are treated equally in Smash with Male Byleth being 10x less popular and cared about than the female version. 

>Male amiibo only.

>Male in the mural.

>Male on the roster and, as a result, will be the icon when showing high scores and looking at other data.

But female is shown behind male in the ads for the fighter pass so totally equal, yeah, sure.

You're really just telling me that you're mad that people like female Byleth more than male and that it's okay for her to be snubbed in official content as a result.

Edited by Florete

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Just a quick question; which would you rather have?

A. House of the Dead-themed Spirit Event

B. Dead Rising-themed Spirit Event

C. Plants vs. Zombies-themed Spirit Event

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Male Byleth > Female Byleth
Female Corrin > Male Corrin

With Travis being deconfirmed with that costume, that narrows down predictions a bit. I'm kinda surprised, honestly. I thought Travis was one of the more likely characters.

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7 hours ago, Florete said:

Male Robin is prioritized in both the main story and history mode. Female Corrin is only prioritized in main story and has no illustrations presence. This is a bare minimum example of giving a female avatar some priority.

Read around these forums, Reddit, etc. When people discuss the characters, it's almost always as "he."

Fan content is not my concern in all this. Official content is.

Show me examples.

>Male amiibo only.

>Male in the mural.

>Male on the roster and, as a result, will be the icon when showing high scores and looking at other data.

But female is shown behind male in the ads for the fighter pass so totally equal, yeah, sure.

You're really just telling me that you're mad that people like female Byleth more than male and that it's okay for her to be snubbed in official content as a result.

It's still prioritization, Female Corrin gets to be in fully animated cutscenes with her brandishing her weapon and interacting with legacy FE characters. Male Corrin doesn't get that.

And you can find many people referring to Byleth as a "she", Corrin too.

Female Byleth completely snuffs the male in popularity, community content and Heroes. Male deserved the shine especially when it does nothing for Female Byleth's overall popularity. 

>Female Byleth has more official Cipher based art than Male Byleth along with other pieces of art that the male variant does not have.

>Consistently outranking Male in popularity

>Utilized more in official FE content and has the priority in alts and content that the male does not.

>Has the most options in the actual TH's game too

Smash is actually the outlier as the recent trend favors Female completely after Three Houses released.

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4 hours ago, Seazas said:

It's still prioritization, Female Corrin gets to be in fully animated cutscenes with her brandishing her weapon and interacting with legacy FE characters. Male Corrin doesn't get that.

A spin-off not made by IS gave one female avatar a little prioritization while at the same time giving a male avatar more prioritization.

Not helping your case.

Male Corrin actually can interact with these legacy characters via supports, btw.

4 hours ago, Seazas said:

And you can find many people referring to Byleth as a "she", Corrin too.

This is a blatant lie. The only people I ever see people defaulting to refer to these characters as "she" are yuri fans and maybe the occasional Smash commentator when a player is using the female variant. On these forums, Reddit, GameFAQs, etc. for every 1 person who uses "she" there are 10 more who use "he."

4 hours ago, Seazas said:

Female Byleth completely snuffs the male in popularity, community content and Heroes. Male deserved the shine especially when it does nothing for Female Byleth's overall popularity. 

>Consistently outranking Male in popularity

I said this is not about fan content, it's about official content. And who was distributed for free in Heroes to all buyers of Three Houses?

4 hours ago, Seazas said:

>Female Byleth has more official Cipher based art than Male Byleth along with other pieces of art that the male variant does not have.

Since you didn't bother to prove this, I decided to check.

https://fireemblem.fandom.com/wiki/Byleth/Gallery

They have an equal number as far as I can tell, but male Byleth is the one who gets art with the three house leaders.

4 hours ago, Seazas said:

>Utilized more in official FE content and has the priority in alts and content that the male does not.

Citation needed. I've already shown my hand, you just keep saying things without proof.

4 hours ago, Seazas said:

>Has the most options in the actual TH's game too

This is only because the game has more male than female characters. It's not any kind of prioritization of female Byleth.

4 hours ago, Seazas said:

Smash is actually the outlier as the recent trend favors Female completely after Three Houses released.

No female Byleth to be seen.

I don't know how short-sighted, privileged, spoiled, or whatever word you need to be to somehow believe any female avatar in the series has gotten better treatment from IS than the male, but whatever is in your head is not what is happening in reality. Marketing has always always always pushed the male avatar but it's like if the male avatar doesn't get absolutely everything you seem to feel like he's being ignored outright for the female avatar. This is child's play and I've shown examples while you've proven nothing, the one thing you were actually able to say as any sort of defense was what happens in Warriors, something I brought up in the first place (have you even played Warriors?).

If you just prefer male Byleth, fine. Nothing wrong with that. But when you say that it's a good thing only male and not female Byleth is getting an amiibo, that's unjustified and being a dick. When you say female Byleth gets more from official sources, that's a lie.

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8 hours ago, Seazas said:

>Has the most options in the actual TH's game too

Curious, but what does this mean? 

I too think they should have had Female Byleth as the main, but I dont mind all that much. It's a minor nitpick to me anyways. 

I realise that the female variants exist, but they are just that, leaving Lucina as the only actual FE female rep. And even then, she's just a variant too.

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7 hours ago, Florete said:

A spin-off not made by IS gave one female avatar a little prioritization while at the same time giving a male avatar more prioritization.

Not helping your case.

Male Corrin actually can interact with these legacy characters via supports, btw.

This is a blatant lie. The only people I ever see people defaulting to refer to these characters as "she" are yuri fans and maybe the occasional Smash commentator when a player is using the female variant. On these forums, Reddit, GameFAQs, etc. for every 1 person who uses "she" there are 10 more who use "he."

I said this is not about fan content, it's about official content. And who was distributed for free in Heroes to all buyers of Three Houses?

Since you didn't bother to prove this, I decided to check.

https://fireemblem.fandom.com/wiki/Byleth/Gallery

They have an equal number as far as I can tell, but male Byleth is the one who gets art with the three house leaders.

Citation needed. I've already shown my hand, you just keep saying things without proof.

This is only because the game has more male than female characters. It's not any kind of prioritization of female Byleth.

No female Byleth to be seen.

I don't know how short-sighted, privileged, spoiled, or whatever word you need to be to somehow believe any female avatar in the series has gotten better treatment from IS than the male, but whatever is in your head is not what is happening in reality. Marketing has always always always pushed the male avatar but it's like if the male avatar doesn't get absolutely everything you seem to feel like he's being ignored outright for the female avatar. This is child's play and I've shown examples while you've proven nothing, the one thing you were actually able to say as any sort of defense was what happens in Warriors, something I brought up in the first place (have you even played Warriors?).

If you just prefer male Byleth, fine. Nothing wrong with that. But when you say that it's a good thing only male and not female Byleth is getting an amiibo, that's unjustified and being a dick. When you say female Byleth gets more from official sources, that's a lie.

So can Female Corrin so no, Male Corrin still has less than Female Corrin.

Let me spell it out for you clearly since you don't get it.

Female Byleth has:

-A bigger support pool in Three Houses

-An entire free character that Male Byleth does not get in Three Houses

-More official art if you bothered to look at her gallery

-More Cipher cards

-Superior popularity with the male one completely overshadowed by the fandom

-More priority in Heroes, an official Fire Emblem title

Male Byleth has:

-Showing up in marketing without much new content FOR him, just him existing there while other aspects of the game are highlighted more (Three Houses lords or the Abyss)

-Less in support pool, no free recruited character, less official art, less in general community and lesser priority in Heroes.

-Smash Bros using his render more.

Male Byleth shining more than Female Byleth in new content is 100% an outlier. Usually it's equal or Female Byleth has more. That's a fact.

I find it a good thing that Male Byleth got the shine, especially if Nintendo HAD to make just one variant. That's nothing but an assumption from your end to claim I'm happy Female Byleth never got an amiibo period.

Edited by Seazas

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2 hours ago, Seazas said:

Female Byleth has:

-A bigger support pool in Three Houses

-An entire free character that Male Byleth does not get in Three Houses

These are such small, insignificant things the fact that you're banking on them is pathetic.

2 hours ago, Seazas said:

-More official art if you bothered to look at her gallery

-More Cipher cards

Prove this. I don't know a whole lot about cipher but from what I looked up, this is not true, or if it is, it is to a miniscule degree. Even if she got 1 more card than him, he got cards with the three house leaders while she didn't, which puts him in more of a "main" position.

2 hours ago, Seazas said:

-Superior popularity with the male one completely overshadowed by the fandom

For the third time, not the damn point. IS does not control popularity, and if they did, male Byleth would be more popular.

2 hours ago, Seazas said:

-More priority in Heroes, an official Fire Emblem title

An ever-expanding title, this statement could be false in a week. TH marketing and Smash aren't going to change.

2 hours ago, Seazas said:

-Showing up in marketing without much new content FOR him, just him existing there while other aspects of the game are highlighted more (Three Houses lords or the Abyss)

-Smash Bros using his render more.

These are the problem. When you see "Byleth" from Nintendo, you see male Byleth.

What "content" exists for female Byleth? She doesn't have a figurine. She doesn't have marketing presence. She's just the second choice. Can you prove anything you're claiming?

2 hours ago, Seazas said:

Male Byleth shining more than Female Byleth in new content is 100% an outlier. Usually it's equal or Female Byleth has more. That's a fact.

This is 100% a lie and I have literally proven it in these posts. If you can't prove anything you're saying, stop posting.

2 hours ago, Seazas said:

That's nothing but an assumption from your end to claim I'm happy Female Byleth never got an amiibo period.

This was your response when I posted disappointment at female Byleth not getting an amiibo:

23 hours ago, Seazas said:

It's a good thing

 

2 hours ago, Seazas said:

So can Female Corrin so no, Male Corrin still has less than Female Corrin.

You latching onto this one aspect, ignoring the other issues I've been mentioning, says a lot about what little ground you actually have in the argument.

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1 hour ago, Florete said:

These are such small, insignificant things the fact that you're banking on them is pathetic.

Prove this. I don't know a whole lot about cipher but from what I looked up, this is not true, or if it is, it is to a miniscule degree. Even if she got 1 more card than him, he got cards with the three house leaders while she didn't, which puts him in more of a "main" position.

For the third time, not the damn point. IS does not control popularity, and if they did, male Byleth would be more popular.

An ever-expanding title, this statement could be false in a week. TH marketing and Smash aren't going to change.

These are the problem. When you see "Byleth" from Nintendo, you see male Byleth.

What "content" exists for female Byleth? She doesn't have a figurine. She doesn't have marketing presence. She's just the second choice. Can you prove anything you're claiming?

This is 100% a lie and I have literally proven it in these posts. If you can't prove anything you're saying, stop posting.

This was your response when I posted disappointment at female Byleth not getting an amiibo:

 

You latching onto this one aspect, ignoring the other issues I've been mentioning, says a lot about what little ground you actually have in the argument.

You say that what I have is insignificant as you hinge on miniscule "marketing" that never advertised Byleth as a character. It was always about Edelgard or the actual game. RHEA and the students had more focus on the teaser trailers than Byleth. Hell, you're randomly bringing up Male Byleth being with the lords in a piece of Cipher art as if that means shit. Female Byleth gets more in the actual Three Houses game with superior amount of supports and an entire character handed to her for free. The fact that you deflected and claimed "iT'S INSIGNIFICANT" says a lot about your little ground if you're denying what's given to her in the actual game she debuted in.

If something as insignificant as standing with the lords mean a thing. Then Female Byleth having standalone official art with her and Dimitri, her and Sothis and Female Byleth having an entire duo unit with Rhea: a major character is way more significant than Male Byleth standing there with the 3 major lords' overhead him in the background.

Nope, never being false since Female Byleth was prioritized first for alts. That's undeniable and Male Byleth is slugging behind her.

No, I can post if I want to. Male Byleth shining more is an outlier, outdated promotion that didn't even fucking focus on Byleth and Smash Bros means nothing since Smash Bros only utilized a default render and prioritized lesser versions before such as Male Corrin. Otherwise Male and Female Byleth had equal presence in the trailer and are both shown together often.

I said it's a good thing in response to your claim that "male default" sucks when the male version shining over the female version is a rarity. Only Robin actually deviated from the trend.

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Bomberman as a Brawler is...interesting. Feels wrong to play him without using bombs, though. Like, they made such an inspired moveset for Steve & Alex that incorporates mining and crafting, but they couldn't come up with a bomb-centric moveset for Bomberman? Yes, he's already an Assist Trophy, but for all we know an AT is going to get promoted to playable within this FP just as a Spirit was. However, the fact Bomberman is now both a Mii Costume and an AT dampens his chances. I wonder if his Spirit Battle will update to use the Mii Costume and song?

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2 minutes ago, Seazas said:

Female Byleth gets more in the actual Three Houses game with superior amount of supports and an entire character handed to her for free.

I'm sorry there aren't more waifus in Three Houses for you to marry.

You are ridiculous. I'm done here.

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17 minutes ago, Florete said:

I'm sorry there aren't more waifus in Three Houses for you to marry.

You are ridiculous. I'm done here.

That's a terrible counterargument. I don't want a "waifu to marry" but it's a fact that Female Byleth has more at the moment with an entire character given to you just for picking a female version.

More popularity, more support options, more official artwork and more priority. Male Byleth being prioritized is an outlier and always was ever since Three Houses dropped which led to him being vastly overshadowed. You brought up Warriors being a spinoff as a counterargument yet Smash Bros is more of a non canon spinoff with the most outdated viewpoints. Like how it prioritized Male Corrin, lmao.

Edited by Seazas

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2 minutes ago, Seazas said:

That's a terrible counterargument.

It's literally what you're saying. They both have C-A with everyone so your argument hinges on male Byleth having fewer S-ranks.

4 minutes ago, Seazas said:

Male Byleth being prioritized is an outlier and always was ever since Three Houses dropped

Statements I have outright disproven in multiple ways but you don't pay attention.

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2 minutes ago, Lord_Brand said:

Bomberman as a Brawler is...interesting. Feels wrong to play him without using bombs, though. Like, they made such an inspired moveset for Steve & Alex that incorporates mining and crafting, but they couldn't come up with a bomb-centric moveset for Bomberman? Yes, he's already an Assist Trophy, but for all we know an AT is going to get promoted to playable within this FP just as a Spirit was. However, the fact Bomberman is now both a Mii Costume and an AT dampens his chances. I wonder if his Spirit Battle will update to use the Mii Costume and song?

Yeah I was surprised at him not being a gunner too. One of Brawler's moves is the 'Exploding' Side Kick (if you've never seen it, it's just Falcon Punch without the falcon motif), but that doesn't cut it. Meanwhile Gunner has a lot of exploding moves along with one that is very literally a bomb drop. I guess the developers felt self conscious about their choice when they recommended playing a match with only the X-Bomb item to get something akin to a bomberman experience.

I'm sure they can think of a good moveset for bomberman. It's just trying to partner up with Konami that's the real issue. Konami has been virtually out of gaming news since a little over a year ago where they released a contra game nobody likes and something about a castlevania mobile game. Between that and the complete lack of any announced titles, something's up with those guys, and it's not the pandemic.

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