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Super Smash Bros. Ultimate News and Discussion: A Simple and Clean Finish


Lightchao42
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Now that Ultimate has been out for a while, who is your favorite newcomer?  

74 members have voted

  1. 1. Who is your favorite base game (and Piranha Plant) newcomer?

  2. 2. Who is your favorite new Echo Fighter?

  3. 3. Who is your favorite Fighters Pass 1 character?



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1. Isaac

2. Alucard

3. Zero (but with the MMZ Zero alt costume)

 

 

Spoiler

Also, on an unrelated note I don't understand why people want Rex in Smash. XBC2 is a great game, but it's a great game in spite of its protagonist. Rex has an awful, stagnant personality and the worst outfit of any JRPG protagonist. Is he just riding Pyra's coat-tails? And if he is, would it not be more fulfilling to just add Pyra by herself and let her be a badass for a change?

 

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  • 2 weeks later...
29 minutes ago, Lord_Brand said:

It's been a few months since Sephiroth. We should be about due for another fighter reveal soon, yeah?

Actually, only a month and a half.

That said, a reveal in February and a release in March seems like a safe bet.

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Oh, right. Seph was December, not November. Doy!

Given what a fanboy magnet Shantae is, she would be an appropriate reveal in February. She's even wearing the right color! And if she released in March, it'd be just in time for my birthday, too...

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5 hours ago, vanguard333 said:

The next DLC fighter will be the protagonist of FE17, despite the game not even being announced yet when the fighter gets announced and the game still being in pre-production at that point. 

…Imagine the reactions if that happened! 

I don't know about adding the Fire Emblem 17 protagonist will show up in the next DLC as the next Fire Emblem game is unknown if it's in the middle of the development. I think Nintendo and Sakurai might have to hold off more Fire Emblem protagonists since the non-Fire Emblem side of the toxic fans in the Super Smash Bros. community had a heated debate on Byleth when he was announced and we did have a total of 8 Fire Emblem fighters in Ultimate as of right now. I think Sakurai might have to hold off for roster slot of the Fire Emblem 17 protagonist for the next installment after Ultimate or incase if Sakurai decided to make Fighter Pass Vol. 3 happen.

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8 hours ago, King Marth 64 said:

I don't know about adding the Fire Emblem 17 protagonist will show up in the next DLC as the next Fire Emblem game is unknown if it's in the middle of the development. I think Nintendo and Sakurai might have to hold off more Fire Emblem protagonists since the non-Fire Emblem side of the toxic fans in the Super Smash Bros. community had a heated debate on Byleth when he was announced and we did have a total of 8 Fire Emblem fighters in Ultimate as of right now. I think Sakurai might have to hold off for roster slot of the Fire Emblem 17 protagonist for the next installment after Ultimate or incase if Sakurai decided to make Fighter Pass Vol. 3 happen.

I wasn't making a serious prediction and I don't think it would actually happen either; I was just saying could you imagine the reactions if it did happen?

I thought that was clear by me ending my statement with, "Imagine the reactions if that happened!" Sorry for the confusion. 

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So I was playing with Aerith and it's funny, if you wanted to talk about a weapon that doesn't "fit" swordfighter's moveset...

When Aerith holds the staff, she's not holding it from one end, like a sword. She holds it from the middle, like a bowstaff. This results in pretty regular clipping through the body. Here's a taunt, here's a jab. You might be thinking "okay, those are just a few frames of animation, nobody'd notice in real time". How about her victory pose then? This shot is of the staff coming closest to exiting her body.

I'm really starting to see a case made for a fourth mii fighter, the mii mage. There are so many important supporting characters in video games that don't fall into one of the three categories, yet are known for magical aptitude or supernatural/psychic powers. The Mage would just wave their hands and feet for attacks and let the special effects do all the work, like Ness and Zelda do. Special effects whose aesthetics can be modified as part of the outfit to try and match the source material, similar to how the sword or gun on a mii changes with the outfit. Maybe one or two moves could incorporate a wizard's staff, for the benefit of any mii outfits referencing characters that normally hold such a thing. A Down aerial where they take a big book and slam it down on an opponent in front of them, that'd be good material for tome users. But I think the simplicity of vague gestures with the mii's limbs helps sell the moveset for a character who may not even normally fight like that. Just think: If Lloyd got in Smash, Colette would be a swordfighter. Because of the chakram special move, and no other reason, but she'd feel less like an outfit if she were fighting like a mage. 

Edited by Glennstavos
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1 hour ago, Glennstavos said:

So I was playing with Aerith and it's funny, if you wanted to talk about a weapon that doesn't "fit" swordfighter's moveset...

When Aerith holds the staff, she's not holding it from one end, like a sword. She holds it from the middle, like a bowstaff. This results in pretty regular clipping through the body. Here's a taunt, here's a jab. You might be thinking "okay, those are just a few frames of animation, nobody'd notice in real time". How about her victory pose then? This shot is of the staff coming closest to exiting her body.

I'm really starting to see a case made for a fourth mii fighter, the mii mage. There are so many important supporting characters in video games that don't fall into one of the three categories, yet are known for magical aptitude or supernatural/psychic powers. The Mage would just wave their hands and feet for attacks and let the special effects do all the work, like Ness and Zelda do. Special effects whose aesthetics can be modified as part of the outfit to try and match the source material, similar to how the sword or gun on a mii changes with the outfit. Maybe one or two moves could incorporate a wizard's staff, for the benefit of any mii outfits referencing characters that normally hold such a thing. A Down aerial where they take a big book and slam it down on an opponent in front of them, that'd be good material for tome users. But I think the simplicity of vague gestures with the mii's limbs helps sell the moveset for a character who may not even normally fight like that. Just think: If Lloyd got in Smash, Colette would be a swordfighter. Because of the chakram special move, and no other reason, but she'd feel less like an outfit if she were fighting like a mage. 

I'm pretty sure Sakurai did set the Aerith costume for the Mii Swordfighter since Mii Fighter Costume did have Viridi from Kid Icarus series and Veronica from Dragon Quest series did used Staves as well. I'm pretty sure the staves are the hard part for the costumes since they do used the same victory and taunt poses.

If Llyod got in Smash and Colette was used as a Mii Fighter Costume, I think Sakurai will might have her costume set for the Mii Brawler category since she doesn't use any staves nor any weapons that acts like to use for Sword.

Edited by King Marth 64
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I've suggested a Mii Spellcaster before, but I'd also suggest a Mii Spearfighter for long polearms, including staves. That would provide an easy template for characters like Kain, Aerith, Krystal, Caeda, etc. The Spearfighter's moveset would be a mix of thrusts, strikes, and projectile attacks.

And honestly, we could go even farther than that. I like to apply a rule of 8, based on the original number of default fighters in SSB64. So, I could propose up to five additional Mii Fighters, each meant to capture different weapon styles and archetypes.

  • Mii Bruiser - A heavier counterpart to the Brawler, who uses moves like rock throwing, wrestling, and tackles. This is the Fighter of choice for Donkey Kong, Mr. Sandman, Darmani, Goron Link, and Zangief.
  • Mii Smasher - Two-handed weapon users like Cloud, Black Knight, Magnus, Darknut, Iron Knuckle, Ganondorf, Darunia, Daruk, and Edelgard. Basically to Swordfighter what Bruiser is to Brawler.
  • Mii Spearfighter - Long polearm users like Kain, Aerith, Cid, Freya, Krystal, Azura, Mipha, and Dimitri.
  • Mii Spellcaster - Mages who use a rod or wand, suitable for Wizzrobe, Black Mage, White Mage, Arle Nadja, Ashley, Mage, Cleric, Dark Mage, etc.
  • Mii Ranger - Quick, agile, and uses light weaponry such as dual daggers, a bow, a boomerang, and a whip, making this good for fighters like the Belmonts, Shadow Man, Edge, Zidane, and Claude.

Of course, if we really want maximum customization flexibility, we could just lump them all into a single highly-customizable Mii Fighter category with different weapon options.

Spoiler
  • Fist
  • Heavy Fist
  • Arm Cannon
  • Blaster
  • Rifle
  • Sword
  • Sword & Shield
  • Dual Swords
  • Dual Daggers
  • Two-Handed
  • Spear
  • Wand
  • Staff
  • Whip

And then you can also include a bunch of different specials, many of which are generic variants of existing specials, and some of which are variants that aren't used by other fighters.

N Specials

Spoiler
  • Arc Bomb
  • Bow
    • Aura Bow
    • Dark Bow
    • Fire Bow
    • Ice Bow
    • Thunder Bow
  • Charge Shot
    • Aura Charge Shot
    • Dark Charge Shot
    • Fire Charge Shot
    • Ice Charge Shot
  • Cryokinesis
  • Fire Punch
    • Dark Punch
    • Ice Punch
    • Thunder Punch
  • Flamethrower
  • Homing Volley
  • Rapid Shot
  • Whirlwind
  • Wind-Up Punch

S Specials

Spoiler
  • Boomerang
  • Deflect
  • Fireball
  • Leaping Strike
  • Missile
  • Guided Missile
  • Rocket Dash
  • Warp Dash
  • Pyrokinesis

U Specials

Spoiler
  • Balloon Lift
  • Electrokinesis
  • Fire Dash
  • Jetpack
  • Rising Slash
  • Spin Attack
  • Spring Jump
  • Teleport
  • Uppercut

D Specials

Spoiler
  • Bomb
    • Ice Bomb
    • Thunder Bomb
    • Remote Bomb
  • Counter
  • Counter-Reflect
  • Absorb
  • Reflector
  • Thunder Bolt

 

Edited by Lord_Brand
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1 hour ago, King Marth 64 said:

If Llyod got in Smash and Colette was used as a Mii Fighter Costume, I think Sakurai will might have her costume set for the Mii Brawler category since she doesn't use any staves nor any weapons that acts like to use for Sword.

She uses chakrams to fight, and the chakram is one of swordfighter's special moves. As for her "sword", I'd anticipate just a really large chakram. It would look about as goofy as Aerith, which is my point about the three archetypes being too limited.

Brawler Colette would be random as heck. 

Edited by Glennstavos
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2 hours ago, Glennstavos said:

She uses chakrams to fight, and the chakram is one of swordfighter's special moves. As for her "sword", I'd anticipate just a really large chakram. It would look about as goofy as Aerith, which is my point about the three archetypes being too limited.

Brawler Colette would be random as heck. 

I don't know about using Colette's Chakrams would work as a Sword for the Mii Swordfighter. Her chakrams are completely rounded and not even tall enough to match the length as a sword while the other Mii Swordfighter weapons in each costumes are pretty straight in the line like the staves. I definitely think Sakurai could go for the other Tales characters instead unless if Sakurai could figures out a way to make the Colette Mii Fighter costume into for the Mii Swordfighter Set.

Edited by King Marth 64
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11 hours ago, Glennstavos said:

So I was playing with Aerith and it's funny, if you wanted to talk about a weapon that doesn't "fit" swordfighter's moveset...

When Aerith holds the staff, she's not holding it from one end, like a sword. She holds it from the middle, like a bowstaff. This results in pretty regular clipping through the body. Here's a taunt, here's a jab. You might be thinking "okay, those are just a few frames of animation, nobody'd notice in real time". How about her victory pose then? This shot is of the staff coming closest to exiting her body.

I'm really starting to see a case made for a fourth mii fighter, the mii mage. There are so many important supporting characters in video games that don't fall into one of the three categories, yet are known for magical aptitude or supernatural/psychic powers. The Mage would just wave their hands and feet for attacks and let the special effects do all the work, like Ness and Zelda do. Special effects whose aesthetics can be modified as part of the outfit to try and match the source material, similar to how the sword or gun on a mii changes with the outfit. Maybe one or two moves could incorporate a wizard's staff, for the benefit of any mii outfits referencing characters that normally hold such a thing. A Down aerial where they take a big book and slam it down on an opponent in front of them, that'd be good material for tome users. But I think the simplicity of vague gestures with the mii's limbs helps sell the moveset for a character who may not even normally fight like that. Just think: If Lloyd got in Smash, Colette would be a swordfighter. Because of the chakram special move, and no other reason, but she'd feel less like an outfit if she were fighting like a mage. 

Seems reasonable. Though Aerith's staff is pretty big I imagine it being a problem even with a Mii Mage, since most mage characters carry something a little smaller. Keeping it on her back and making her a brawler might actually have been the best decision with the current set up.

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On 2/1/2021 at 5:27 AM, Jotari said:

Seems reasonable. Though Aerith's staff is pretty big I imagine it being a problem even with a Mii Mage, since most mage characters carry something a little smaller. Keeping it on her back and making her a brawler might actually have been the best decision with the current set up.

Thus my suggestion that there be a Mii Spearfighter for long polearms like Aerith's staff. Or a Staff weapon category for a more customizable Mii Fighter in SSB6.

In the event Chrono Cross comes to Switch - perhaps as part of a Chrono Collection? - what if Serge got to join Smash along with Crono? The Element Grid would be highly compatible with Smash, as Serge's melee attacks could be grouped into Weak, Strong, and Fierce categories, which build up his Element level and allow him to cast more powerful spells. Dash & Slash, Luminaire, and Flying Arrow could be specials accessible either within the Grid itself or mapped to his S, D, and U Specials. The Elements and Techs on his grid are single use and become grayed out when he uses them, preventing him from using them again until he gets KO'd or uses his Final Smash, Chrono Cross. However, he can still use his Techs as Specials, they're just weaker than the Grid versions to balance the fact they're reusable.

Edited by Lord_Brand
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