We Need Serenes Forest Mafia Mafia 5 After All! - GAME OVER

[BBM]

@kirsche- this is dumb lol. there's a very clear difference between returning to an RVS-esque vote when you have no other suspicions vs when you do. and i asked questions even though i didn't expect them to go anywhere because it's still better than doing nothing. 

I thought your initial vote on me wasn't good because like Junko/Refa said it took stuff out of context. i didn't feel like voting you for it at the time because I thought you would change directions after people pointed this out. it annoys me that you're doubling down on this instead. but I feel like as scum you would just be pushing me rather than looking at multiple things and asking more people to engage with your case on me. i don't really get what you're asking shinori though

@shinori- my junko vote was somewhere between an RVS vote and a serious vote, mainly for reactions bc his RVS vote gave me a weird feeling. i pressed him a bit on it to see how he would respond, and he responded well.

zeus giving excuses is a bit frustrating but given that he's new i don't really feel strongly about this current vote, or any people actively posting in the thread being scum.

satsuma is giving me d1 new player lynchbait vibes. i don't really think athena is playing like he did last game at all; he's engaging directly with someone this game, whereas he felt a lot more detached in the last one. 1-game meta is not great but regardless i think this is town v town.

 

[Eurykins]

Just got home from opening shift whoo. Holy pages already.

Gonna start reading stuffs. Posting in a few.

[SatsumaFSoysoy]

This is kinda how I always play Day 1s. I'm not particularly good at actively generating discussion, but I don't see how that makes me lynchbait.

[eclipse]

Just now, SatsumaFSoysoy said:

This is kinda how I always play Day 1s. I'm not particularly good at actively generating discussion, but I don't see how that makes me lynchbait.

Because you're doing nothing to advance the game.

So, let's say that you're town.  How are you going to lynch mafia if all you do is make excuses and otherwise refuse to engage?

[eclipse]

5 minutes ago, BBM said:

satsuma is giving me d1 new player lynchbait vibes. i don't really think athena is playing like he did last game at all; he's engaging directly with someone this game, whereas he felt a lot more detached in the last one. 1-game meta is not great but regardless i think this is town v town.

I made the mistake of dismissing a soft tell in the last anonymous game.  Exact same tone, to boot.  I'm not doing it again.

[BBM]

actually, I feel (slightly) more strongly about this so ##Unvote, ##Vote: Bibbon

agree with athena that bibbon's first post was meh. missed that exchange when i skimmed the thread earlier. pushing weapons for saying everyone is townie when that would also be all of her content if weapons didn't exist is cruddy. i don't agree with kirsche's response bc again, weapons couldn't have generated content about himself, and the part about my posts being weird isn't actually content. it's not a stance of any kind and doesn't even have an explanation of why my posts are weird. i also believe bibbon has played on other sites, so I'm expecting a somewhat higher standard from her? i also didn't like the "i need to get used to this site's meta" comment bc I've played on new sites lots of times and that has never been my approach (yes yes different people are different)

@satsuma- you feel like lynchbait bc d1 lynches are frequently on new players who're not good at generating content right out of RVS.

@eclipse- i don't understand your "soft tell" logic. obviously people are going to be more aggressive when pushing their own scumreads vs answering other peoples questions. i'd be more suspicious of him if it was the other way around.

[SatsumaFSoysoy]

7 minutes ago, eclipse said:

Because you're doing nothing to advance the game.

So, let's say that you're town.  How are you going to lynch mafia if all you do is make excuses and otherwise refuse to engage?

As the game goes on and more at night happens, I tend to get more and more active, but on Day 1, when only meta is being applied, I tend to not put too much stock into the arguments.

[Shinori]

15 minutes ago, BBM said:

@kirsche- this is dumb lol. there's a very clear difference between returning to an RVS-esque vote when you have no other suspicions vs when you do. and i asked questions even though i didn't expect them to go anywhere because it's still better than doing nothing. 

I thought your initial vote on me wasn't good because like Junko/Refa said it took stuff out of context. i didn't feel like voting you for it at the time because I thought you would change directions after people pointed this out. it annoys me that you're doubling down on this instead. but I feel like as scum you would just be pushing me rather than looking at multiple things and asking more people to engage with your case on me. i don't really get what you're asking shinori though

@shinori- my junko vote was somewhere between an RVS vote and a serious vote, mainly for reactions bc his RVS vote gave me a weird feeling. i pressed him a bit on it to see how he would respond, and he responded well.

I also don't understand what Kirsche wants.  I also am not really worried about your interactions on Page 3 anymore, outside of the rein vote which is still kind of weird to me.

4 minutes ago, BBM said:

actually, I feel (slightly) more strongly about this so ##Unvote, ##Vote: Bibbon

agree with athena that bibbon's first post was meh. missed that exchange when i skimmed the thread earlier. pushing weapons for saying everyone is townie when that would also be all of her content if weapons didn't exist is cruddy. i don't agree with kirsche's response bc again, weapons couldn't have generated content about himself, and the part about my posts being weird isn't actually content. it's not a stance of any kind and doesn't even have an explanation of why my posts are weird. i also believe bibbon has played on other sites, so I'm expecting a somewhat higher standard from her? i also didn't like the "i need to get used to this site's meta" comment bc I've played on new sites lots of times and that has never been my approach (yes yes different people are different)

I can partially agree with the stuff stated her about bibbon; if anything I'd just like to see more from Bibbon though.  I don't think they need to get used to a meta at all to post what they feel like is bad or good in the current here and now.

@SatsumaFSoysoy Day 1 stuff can generate a lot of information: No one particularly cares that you would perform better as the game progresses, as everyone will.  However people would also like to lynch scum today.  How do you intend to find scum by not doing much on day 1?  Who in your opinion is scummy at the moment? Does anyone stand out as doing something you don't think town would or should do?  Is there anyone that is particularly trying to skew discussion away from scum hunting in your eyes?  In short: What is bad and why is it bad?

[eclipse]

3 minutes ago, SatsumaFSoysoy said:

As the game goes on and more at night happens, I tend to get more and more active, but on Day 1, when only meta is being applied, I tend to not put too much stock into the arguments.

I, on the other hand, will reread the entire game.

HOW people interact with one another is valuable data.  Associative reads drive me in late game.  So if you can't do it for your sake, then do it for the rest of the town's sake.

8 minutes ago, BBM said:

@eclipse- i don't understand your "soft tell" logic. obviously people are going to be more aggressive when pushing their own scumreads vs answering other peoples questions. i'd be more suspicious of him if it was the other way around.

Tone is a spectrum, with "cowering in a corner" on one end and "stark-raving accusations" on the other.  When someone's response in the same time frame goes too far on both ends of the spectrum, it's pretty suspicious.

[Eurykins]

Hydra slot spec seems like a garble of null lmao. I don't quite see the point in trying to role/slot spec based on 1 or 2 players sitting on the same slot. Just means we should expect more in terms of reliable activity/scumhunting (if they're town) from their slot IMO. That's all. And more opportunity for them to scumslip/mess up if they end up being scum-sided instead.

BBM's vote on Junko on Page 2 feels nitpicky in the sense of, "there was no joke with the vote, so getting weird vibes from it". I get that people usually post silly jokes or comments in RVS, but is it really necessary/required to be considered part of "the clique of RVS posting"? Is this worse than someone who doesn't participate at all in RVS? The Rein vote also seems to come out of the blue, and doesn't really say/imply that it was due to weapons that he even voted Rein until questioned about it afterwards? 

I have no idea why Walrein voted Athena. Maybe my brain is dead from work and a long day, but just didn't quite click in my head.

PEDIT: Oh, now I see (on Page 5). 

Refa's vote on Athena (sheeping Walrein's case without understanding it???) is confusing me. Really easy and borderline really bad gameplay at work? Or lazy? Idk which I feel like it's leaning more towards.

Bibbon's first post of "reads" feels thin at best to me. Few to none of the reads have an explanation to them as to WHY they're a town read or otherwise, which makes it hard for me to believe fully that it appears that people are just that clear-cut townreads for the slot currently. 

@Bibbon What makes them town? What posts/points did BBM make that are "weird" and what makes it hard to determine whether it's scummy or not? If there's something you didn't like from Weapon's slot, is there scum intent behind the bad vibes/posts or something else?

In the context of the vote/situation, Bartozio's vote on SoySoy is decent- would actually sheep the vote/case personally.

@Shinori What struck you as bad regarding Athena's vote post on Zeus? The vote itself, or the latter half of the post? (IDK if it was explained, missed it if you did.)

BBM's vote on Zeus is.... okay, but most of his points against Zeus can likewise be directed at other players who've done just as little with their slots (IE. Soysoy, Fable, Nightmare [who really hasn't actually posted anything at all], and Elieson).

@BBM If Zeus is guilty/voteworthy of the notions you held against him, what about the others that fall in the same category/general area of lack of content, lack of scumhunting, etc.? Is one worse than the others, and if so, by what means?

SatsumaFSoySoy's lack of actual contribution is bothering me- this can also be noted against the others mentioned before- Fable, Nightmare, and Elie [and technically me before this post, I guess??? 'Cause work/life shit sucks worse than Mafia does.], but the sheer amount of self-centered (and partially reactionary-esque) posting (lots of posts, for that matter) with the comment of : "This is kinda how I always play Day 1s" feels really bad to me. Like you're okay with the concept/tactic of coasting and not actually scumhunting or trying to find scumreads D1, and expecting to pick out information that everyone else has bothered hunting out via questions and their own scumhunting in the following day phases. 

Also, the notion of "...but on Day 1, when only meta is being applied, I tend to not put too much stock into the arguments" Is also something that bothers me. This comment seems to imply that META is the main reason behind the majority of cases D1, when there are already a good handful of cases based on people's REACTIONS to D1 content/post reactions themselves. NOT about someone's meta specifically. The bolded statement also comes as an extremely easy way to avoid partaking in conversations/scum hunting because you don't know someone's "meta" when, in reality, meta takes a backseat to actual in-game content when it comes to actually casing someone? It doesn't take knowing someone's explicit habits (scum or town-sided meta tells) to identify scum slips, or to find scum reads. Or to even tell us where your thoughts/reads lie in terms of what you're seeing and making of the interactions that are taking place in this thread. 

Tl;DR of my thoughts:

SoySoy is taking too much time posting things that don't offer us anything. No thoughts, no reads, no votes. It's distracting, and I know I have a bad time getting stuck on "Bad gameplay" vs. Scummy gameplay, but for all the posts that this slot has made... zero content? Test vote on Refa (what made you choose Refa of all people, also?) to test some voting thing? Give us something to actually chew on? 

Bibbon is in a similar boat, but feels like a lesser offender, if only due to the fact that Bibbon has made /one/ kinda empty post, while SoySoy has gone the entirety of a multitude of posts doing the same thing of doing nothing. More empty posts, increased load of bad vibes. 

BBM's Slot is in a weird spot for me, because most of his casing/votes I feel are broad enough to where multiple player slots are actually applicable to his case? (IE. his Zeus, and even partially the Bibbon's vote/case) I'm not sure if "nitpicky" is the right word for the vote choices, but what makes the people voted worse than the other applicable candidates? His actions don't necessarily spell out "scummy" to me, but the vagueness of his casing/approach feels odd to me. Can't quite put my finger on it fully though. 

Refa (for once in a Mafia game), Via, Eclipse, Bartozio, and Shinori are all OK in my books currently. 

Weapons, Kirsche, and BBM are floating in the null/unreadable bubble for me. The listed have been notoriously hard for me in the past (when I actually played Mafia semi-frequently) to even get a half-decent read on, and I'm not much better off currently based on in-game content atm. 

The rest of the players need to actually post things.

##Unvote

##Vote: SatsumaFSoySoy

I'll be around somewhat tonight, but I have a super painful stye currently in my right eye that's making things kinda irritable for me. Will try to sleep on it (not literally pls no) and hope it goes away before I take a needle to it myself. 

[eclipse]

14 minutes ago, Eurykins said:

(snip)

All those words, and only a slight mention of Walrein.

[Shinori]

4 minutes ago, eclipse said:

All those words, and only a slight mention of Walrein.

I also haven't mentioned Walrein that I can remember off the top of my head: How come you didn't bring this up WRT me but did so for Eury?  Or did you ask her something about Walrein?

Why Walrein in specific?  And why ask Eury specifically? I know he's been very active but I don't quite understand this post right now.

[eclipse]

2 minutes ago, Shinori said:

I also haven't mentioned Walrein that I can remember off the top of my head: How come you didn't bring this up WRT me but did so for Eury?  Or did you ask her something about Walrein?

Why Walrein in specific?  And why ask Eury specifically? I know he's been very active but I don't quite understand this post right now.

She managed to say something about just about everyone else.  Walrein's been far more active than I remember (which is a Good Thing, and part of the reason why I'm townreading him), so I thought it was a little odd that she left him out.

(it also implies that I read your posts)

[Shinori]

@Eurykins Athena's Zeus vote during 'RVS' complaining about RVS was actually in a state that a few things had happened and a few things that he could have commented on.  If he actually wanted out of RVS COMPLETELY at the time he could have taken a step forward and made a comment WRT what had happened, specifically I stated once, the interactions between BBM/Junko at the top of Page 3 were something that could have been commented on.  Instead he decided to say nothing about it and complain about RVS.

[Fable]

Someone tell me who to sheep. 

[Shinori]

2 minutes ago, eclipse said:

(it also implies that I read your posts)

Are you implying that you didn't?  Blasphemous!

[Iris]

Day 1.5 - Votals
athena_57 (3): Walrein, eclipse
Bartozio (3): Anime27Arts, WeaponsofMassConstruction, Shinori
Polydeuces + SatsumaFSoySoy (2): Bartozio, Eurykins
Zkirsche (2): Junk, Refa
BBM (1): Zkirsche
Bibbon(1): BBM
eclipse (1): Jaybee
Refa (1): SatsumaFSoySoy
Shinori (1): Elieson

Not Voting: athena_57, Bibbon, Eärendil, Fable, Magnificence Incarnate, Nightmare, vi-astra, zeus_112

You have ~44 hours left in the day.  With 22 alive, it takes 8 to lynch and 15 to hammer.

Eärendil, Nightmare, and Polydeuces have been prodded.

Edited April 11, 2018 by Iris

[Eurykins]

@eclipse It took a bit to remember who Walrein was in terms of players in this game tbh (but then I remembered "smirky face avi" and then Walrein popped up in my mind).

The initial vote confused me coming from this slot, but then read past and was OK with it. Otherwise, I haven't been bothered or pinged by his slot outside of that (and his posts have read as a lot of question probing and includes some reads/thoughts as well), so I guess you could say he's fine with me for now?

[Jaybee]

1 hour ago, SatsumaFSoysoy said:

As the game goes on and more at night happens, I tend to get more and more active, but on Day 1, when only meta is being applied, I tend to not put too much stock into the arguments.

I think a decent amount of discussion has already happened this day phase for you to say something more substantial.

Though I don't actually think Satsuma is scummy but rather he's town playing very very sub-optimally. 

 

##unvote

 

Haven't gotten into whatever is happening with kirsche but no need to at work. And eury wallpost ;/

 

##Vote: fable

what was that post yo

[Fable]

1 minute ago, Jaybee said:

##Vote: fable

what was that post yo

It was me asking who I should sheep (voting me doesn't answer the question ftr). 

[WeaponsofMassConstruction]

12 minutes ago, Fable said:

Someone tell me who to sheep. 

 

[Jaybee]

*no desire to smh

 

@Fable It does. You have no input on anybody, then you come in and ask who to sheep instead of contributing literally anything. Again, there's enough discussion on enough people to say something about someone.

[Fable]

Just now, Jaybee said:

*no desire to smh

 

@Fable It does. You have no input on anybody, then you come in and ask who to sheep instead of contributing literally anything. Again, there's enough discussion on enough people to say something about someone.

Yeah I read all of it and nothing stood out to me. 

If something did I wouldn't have asked who to sheep. 

[Percivalé]

fable is scummy cuz he came in earlier going "hey everyone stop rolespeccing it's not productive" when we were already past that and on top of that he doesn't have anything productive to contribute himself.

vore & content coming in a sec I'm still not home, apologies.

[Percivalé]

VOTE***

oh god autocorrect don't do that