New Legendary Hero: Lyn, Lady of the Wind

[Silverly]

10 minutes ago, silveraura25 said:

Did EA suffer financial problems with public backlash from Battlefront 2? Not a response to Ice Dragon's post, but I'm just curious

Star Wars: Battlefront 2 and Heroes are entirely different games with entirely different audiences, and the issues brought up with both games are completely different here. In other words, it’s comparing comparing apples to oranges concerning the outcries of both games.

[Cute Chao]

56 minutes ago, MisfitMiju said:

I guess it sorta annoyed me since neither Hinoka or Eirika had alts before and they got blasted even though with gleipnir and kinshi mounts being in the game it's more probable to put the characters who were "snubbed" in the heroes. Alts being on the legendary banner isn't a shock it's just why her out of everyone surely she isn't the only character associated to wind or the only protagonist with the potential to be an archer. I agree that if it were a regular the anger would've soared higher than it already was and I apologize for assuming based off serenes and calling it a double standard when I should've taken into account the fanbase at large especially the poor folks on reddit

Don't get me wrong, I agree the Lyn shouldn't get another alt this soon and when the game really isn't that old (then again, maybe it is for a gacha - some say they usually last five years). But I think it's wrong to compare Eirika and Hinoka's situation to Lyn's and to then accuse of double standards, which you seem to see now, too.  

It would have been nice to see Alm with a bow or someone else without four already. To me, four seemed like it should be the max alts for a while, mostly 'cos that's the size of a team. Unfortunately, all this means is that we can likely expect more Chroms and Lucinas in the future, too. 

[Alkaid]

33 minutes ago, silveraura25 said:

Did EA suffer financial problems with public backlash from Battlefront 2? Not a response to Ice Dragon's post, but I'm just curious

Yes, a notable amount from what I saw. The game's sales seemed to take a good hit from all the bad press. Enough that they backpedaled hard and revamped the lootboxes to try and damage control. That said, the game still performed pretty well, just not as well.  Too little too late, I'm still mad they ruined that game, I was looking forward to it.

I wouldn't really compare that nuclear backlash to this Lyn situation, though. My bet is this banner is going to do well even with some people annoyed over a 5th Lyn. Waifu whales are where the money's at anyway

Edited April 27, 2018 by Alkaid

[Ivy Wife Supremacy]

3 minutes ago, Alkaid said:

Yes, a notable amount from what I saw. The game's sales seemed to take a good hit from all the bad press. Enough that they backpedaled hard and revamped the lootboxes to try and damage control. That said, the game still performed pretty well, just not as well.  Too little too late, I'm still mad they ruined that game, I was looking forward to it.

I wouldn't really compare that nuclear backlash to this Lyn situation, though. My bet is this banner is going to do well even with some people annoyed over a 5th Lyn. Waifu whales are where the money's at anyway

Exactly case in point

[Ice Dragon]

1 minute ago, Cute Chao said:

some say they usually last five years

Since I see this number quoted a lot (probably because I've been using throwing that number around), I'll go ahead and cite Extra Credits as my source so that it doesn't just become some random hearsay number.

[Cute Chao]

1 minute ago, Ice Dragon said:

Since I see this number quoted a lot (probably because I've been using throwing that number around), I'll go ahead and cite Extra Credits as my source so that it doesn't just become some random hearsay number.

Ah, fair enough. 

To be honest, I've only recently got into them, so I wouldn't know. I played ToL, which lasted two years, and ToR which lasted... about a blink of an eye. Other than that, Valkyrie Connect seems to be slowly degrading. The Final Fantasys are still going strong, but they have a different style and a very strong source behind them (plus I don't know when they started... I'm hoping FE is a strong enough source to keep going for a fair while).

[Arthur97]

16 hours ago, Paris said:

Doesn't she already have one more alt than the others not counting Chrom and Lyn? 

Same as Chrom, one less than Lyn, but one of them is essentially Lucina with new art and lines.

16 hours ago, ChickenBits said:

Someone should press the orbs for ya, it works for me instead of the classic cult summoning circle ?. I'm not kidding, whenever I'm frustrated with summoning I just hand over my phone to my mother and then magic happens. A good chunk of my 5 stars are ones that she has pulled.

There's already Lucina emblem though since there's four of her. Damn, now I want another Camilla ? even though she'll get so much backlash ? cause the community is biased.

@kcirrot I'm amazing at noticing stuff. Thanks for letting me know.

Like I said above, one of them is kind of lame.

14 hours ago, Zangetsu said:

Dude, give it a rest

Hey, it's only fair that Lyn gets complained about after how much grief Lucina, Chrom, Xander, and Camilla got.

[Lewyn]

2 hours ago, Cute Chao said:

Lyn is on a legendary banner, which is expected to receive alts, so it doesn't really feel so much like she's 'stealing a spot'. Chrom, Reinhardt (more than Olwen for some reason, although she got some), Eirika and Hinoka all got salt. It's not really a double standard. If Lyn had been on a regular banner, she would have got just as much salt, if not more, than Hinoka.

This so much.  Honestly I'm peeved at the amount of hate Lyn is getting, it just reeks of complete bias.  Unlike Robin, Chrom, Eirika, Hinoka, Zelgius (though he gets a pass since BK is TT unit) are a million times worse.  They appeared on new hero banners, they actually took a spot from a what would be the debut of a new character.  What about Lyn.

1st Lyn is regular Lyn.  Was launch unit, in one of the launch banners also I believe.  Nothing wrong here.

2nd Lyn is bridal Lyn.  Seasonal

3rd Lyn is CYL.  This can't be held against her, she was voted in by us.  IS has nothing to do with it.

4th Lyn is Love Abounds Lyn.  Seasonal

 

So what has she done?  Seasonals are all alts anyways, in a rare case the first appearance of a new character may be there like Spring Xander however since the beginning these banners have been predominantly alternate versions of characters already in the game.  

Where was all this hate when we got our 6th Robin?  Or the 5th who was on a new hero banner?  Not to mention the time between 5th and 6th Robin was less than the time between LA Lyn and this upcoming legendary Lyn.  Nah, it's all good people even want a 7th with Levin sword.  What about the 4th Chrom being on a new hero banner?  While these got some hate, it is nothing compared to what Lyn is unfairly getting.  

It has nothing to do with it being the 5th Lyn or even general alt hate, it is cause an old character is getting this many alts.  I mean we can have 12 Camillas, 20 Tharja, 40 Lucina, and 100 Robin and it would be cool.  However god forbid that an older character gets more than one alt.  

I hope this banner outsells every one before it.  Cause it doing bad wouldn't stop alts or anything, it would just mean we would get even more alts for characters from the 3ds games and much less from earlier games which would be an even crappier situation than we have currently.  

 

[Ice Dragon]

2 minutes ago, Arthur97 said:

Hey, it's only fair that Lyn gets complained about after how much grief Lucina, Chrom, Xander, and Camilla got.

This is the sort of logic that perpetuates the cesspools of salt that all of these threads end up having.

 

1 minute ago, Lewyn said:

Where was all this hate when we got our 6th Robin?

Like it or not, enough people consider the two Robins (and Corrin, Morgan, and Kana) to be different characters to sufficiently dilute the salt into something not toxic to life.

[Lewyn]

2 minutes ago, Ice Dragon said:

This is the sort of logic that perpetuates the cesspools of salt that all of these threads end up having.

 

Like it or not, enough people consider the two Robins (and Corrin, Morgan, and Kana) to be different characters to sufficiently dilute the salt into something not toxic to life.

I guess if there was a male Lyn, creepy as that would be, things could be better.  Still don't understand it at all though.  The different genders, other than marriage options, are the same in every way.  They can't exist at the same time either they represent the same individual.  

[Ice Dragon]

1 minute ago, Lewyn said:

They can't exist at the same time either they represent the same individual.

The substitute children in FE4 can't exist at the same time as the standard children, but there is no way in hell those are the same characters.

Saying that they have different names means nothing. People can change their names (and dye their hair and change their clothes). Masked Marth and Lucina are the same individual despite having different names.

[Liliesgrace]

Sorry, not sorry. I’m ecstatic to have a great new representation of my third favorite female FE character.

And I’ll be excited as well for more Chroms, Robins, Azuras, Xanders, Morgans, and hopefully another Ninian and Caeda too.

My only top five male not in the game is Rath and with his connection to both Sue and Lyn I feel I can reasonably hope to see him sometime this year or next.

1 minute ago, Lewyn said:

I guess if there was a male Lyn, creepy as that would be, things could be better.  Still don't understand it at all though.  The different genders, other than marriage options, are the same in every way.  They can't exist at the same time either they represent the same individual.  

Except Deeprealms and Outrealms are a thing. 

[Lord-Zero]

20 minutes ago, Lewyn said:

So what has she done?  

It’s a combination of really bad timing (5 versions of herself in just a bit more than a year), IS constantly pushing her everywhere they can (she’s been featured in quite a few banners these last few months) and alt fatigue. People are getting fed up with her. Alt fatigue just gets worse with every banner that has one or more. 

This banner will probably make just as much or less than the New Year’s banner. 

Edited April 27, 2018 by Lord-Zero

[Cute Chao]

22 minutes ago, Lewyn said:

*Snip*

Sorry, I still hate this banner and hate that Lyn got a fifth version so soon into the game, especially two months after her second seasonal. Of course people are going to be unhappy - it's been building up more and more. I'm hoping the banner doesn't really sell well and that they start to change their strategy, but I'm probably asking for too much. 

Incidentally, I don't count the Robins as the same character, and the Grimas are an odd case, so they are sort of in a limbo zone (I do wish they had actually been called Grima in game, since they're not really Robin, but they were desperate to go with the fallen hero instead of pretty cool villain - and yeah, he's pretty cool in Heroes). 

And yes, it does have a lot to do with alts. It's nothing to do with an old character getting so many. Are you forgetting about all the hate and salt Hinoka got just a few days ago, when she was widely requested for an alt? It's been building more and more with every alt. Lucina would have got the exact same salt had she been the one to receive a fifth, or Chrom would, too. 

Even forgetting CYL, this is her third alt now. Camilla and Xander received hate with two alts (although Azura seemed to get away with it). This isn't an Old vs New thing. It is just an alt thing. 

I also want to add FE7 is my favourite game. Lyn used to be one of my more liked lords, but since CYL, she's been so overexposed that I've found it harder to like her. I think her inclusion in Warriors was what really set me off, though, but meh, that's in the past. I just don't want to see more of her and didn't want her to be the first representation of coloured bows like she was for horse bows. 

Edited April 27, 2018 by Cute Chao

[Lewyn]

6 minutes ago, Ice Dragon said:

The substitute children in FE4 can't exist at the same time as the standard children, but there is no way in hell those are the same characters.

Saying that they have different names means nothing. People can change their names (and dye their hair and change their clothes). Masked Marth and Lucina are the same individual despite having different names.

 M Robin and F Robin there is nothing different about them apart from gender.  Just like tall Robin is no different from short robin, or long haired male Robin, from short haired male Robin.  They are customizable in physical appearance and gender cause it is an avatar.  They are the same character.

1 minute ago, Lord-Zero said:

It’s a combination of really bad timing (5 versions of herself in just a bit more than a year), IS constantly pushing her everywhere they can and alt fatigue. People are getting fed up with her. Alt fatigue just gets worse with every banner that has one. 

This banner will probably make just as much or less than the New Year’s banner. 

Well they are pushing Robin everywhere too, I bet you we get a 7th before the year is up.

I think this banner will make a lot actually.  Golden week, people spend more money, and besides Lyn this legendary banner has a lot of great units.  

[MisfitMiju]

Just now, Lewyn said:

I guess if there was a male Lyn, creepy as that would be, things could be better.  Still don't understand it at all though.  The different genders, other than marriage options, are the same in every way.  They can't exist at the same time either they represent the same individual.  

Well think of it this way, even though from narrative perspective they are essentially the same they've always been portrayed slightly different in supports based on their gender, and during both CYL campaigns nobody raised an issue with either robin or corrin being featured in their respective gender poll because they both have different appeal in contrast to folks like Marth and Ike.There is nothing wrong with Lyn or any of the prior characters receiving alternate versions of themselves since the true issue would be IS not spacing out these units appropriately, causing many characters to face the ire of the general fanbase

[Lewyn]

5 minutes ago, Cute Chao said:

Sorry, I still hate this banner and hate that Lyn got a fifth version so soon into the game, especially two months after her second seasonal. Of course people are going to be unhappy - it's been building up more and more. I'm hoping the banner doesn't really sell well and that they start to change their strategy, but I'm probably asking for too much. 

Incidentally, I don't count the Robins as the same character, and the Grimas are an odd case, so they are sort of in a limbo zone (I do wish they had actually been called Grima in game, since they're not really Robin, but they were desperate to go with the fallen hero instead of pretty cool villain - and yeah, he's pretty cool in Heroes). 

And yes, it does have a lot to do with alts. It's nothing to do with an old character getting so many. Are you forgetting about all the hate and salt Hinoka got just a few days ago, when she was widely requested for an alt? It's been building more and more with every alt. Lucina would have got the exact same salt had she been the one to receive a fifth, or Chrom would, too. 

Even forgetting CYL, this is her third alt now. Camilla and Xander received hate with two alts (although Azura seemed to get away with it). This isn't an Old vs New thing. It is just an alt thing. 

I also want to add FE7 is my favourite game. Lyn used to be one of my more liked lords, but since CYL, she's been so overexposed that I've found it harder to like her. I think her inclusion in Warriors was what really set me off, though, but meh, that's in the past. I just don't want to see more of her and didn't want her to be the first representation of coloured bows like she was for horse bows. 

I'm not forgetting all the previous hate.  My statement is mostly based on the video stats that were posted earlier, with a massive spike in disapproval for this Lyn banner compared previous banners featuring an alt.  

Hey I wanted the first colorless breath to be something special too, like Mila or Duma or Naga.  It was incredibly lackluster that it was an alt instead.  That being said I would have much preferred the first color bow user to be a new character.  Or the legendary banner to feature Ced. 

Camilla alt got hate just cause she was on Hoshiden New Year, when she isn't Hoshido at all she is Nohr.  So it felt like they snubbed Ryoma or Hinoka.  

[Lord-Zero]

Just now, Lewyn said:

 M Robin and F Robin there is nothing different about them apart from gender.  Just like tall Robin is no different from short robin, or long haired male Robin, from short haired male Robin.  They are customizable in physical appearance and gender cause it is an avatar.  They are the same character.

Well they are pushing Robin everywhere too, I bet you we get a 7th before the year is up.

I think this banner will make a lot actually.  Golden week, people spend more money, and besides Lyn this legendary banner has a lot of great units.  

Whether you like it or not, the Robins just happen to be in a grey area and that’s mainly due to their “Avatar” status. Their Grima versions are basically just Grima in full control with no semblance of the host Robin’s personality which is why people are much more lenient on the Robins and Grimas. Although F!Grima got plenty of heat as well. F!Robin is often treated as a separate entity from M!Robin. In Lyn’s case, it’s just FE7 Lyn, no possession, different gender option or anything like that. Her recent overexposition is really hurting her. It’s just IS seeing how much they can shove her until people get sick of her. 

The timing was bad. Really, really bad. Alt fatigue grows stronger with every alt they release. 

[Titamon]

So happy Lyn got art that I actually like, can't wait to pull.

[Roflolxp54]

I'm fairly certain even Lyn fans are at least a bit annoyed by the timing of Legendary Lyn's debut; there's the Combat Boosts banner which has Brave Lyn as a Focus unit. Assuming the player didn't get baited by Brave Lyn, they'd have to decide between going for Legendary Lyn (sniping is hell on Legendary Heroes banners) or Brave Lyn.

[Ice Dragon]

2 minutes ago, Lewyn said:

M Robin and F Robin there is nothing different about them apart from gender.  Just like tall Robin is no different from short robin, or long haired male Robin, from short haired male Robin.  They are customizable in physical appearance and gender cause it is an avatar.  They are the same character.

The fact that they have different support options is enough of a tell that they should be considered different characters: Changing Robin's gender completely changes how they interact with others in a meaningful way, whereas changing Robin's appearance and voice does not.

This can be contrasted against Mark and Grima. Changing Mark's gender does not meaningfully affect the choices that the character can make or the relationships the character has. Mark could even be a talking ambulatory palm tree and probably still count as the same character.

Grima's character does not change based on the gender of its host (even to the point where male and female Grima have identical voice lines in Heroes).

 

This is, of course, before you get into the argument of how you determine a person's identity when they are possessed by a different entity (or alternatively have dissociative identity disorder).

So either you have 3 versions of male Robin and 3 versions of female Robin or you have 2 versions of male Robin, 2 versions of female Robin, and 2 versions of Grima, but not 6 versions of "Robin".

[TadpoleSuperHero]

HECK YES

Didn't care enough about most of the Legendary Heroes to pull on them (got lucky with Vanguard Ike so didn't have to try my luck, and I like my infantry Ephraim enough that I wasn't tempted to spend a million orbs trying to get his legendary version... didn't even try for Grima-Robin (male or female) because I'm just not a fan), but I love Lyn, and I really don't care if she has a million alts, or if her Legendary variant is very similar to her Brave one. And THAT ATTACK ANIMATION.

I know there are other characters that could be argued "need" alts, and I'm still waiting for Marth to have a giant blowout and get a million alts (please let him get like seven alts in a row, the boy needs recognition!), but as long as they keep making good alts of my favorite characters, I'll go for them. 

Though it might also be my overall attitude about Heroes, which can be summed up in a word: Patience.

If the game doesn't have who you want yet, don't worry. It probably will eventually. Until then, save your orbs, train up the favorites you have, and be prepared to freak the heck out when the character or alt you've been dying to see finally shows up :)

[Cute Chao]

3 minutes ago, TadpoleSuperHero said:

Though it might also be my overall attitude about Heroes, which can be summed up in a word: Patience.

This is my most loathed word these days. It's been shown time and time again that at the current rate, there will be a lot of characters that aren't in FE Heroes for a very long time, if ever. Adding more and more alts is making people who like less popular characters feel like there is no hope for their favourite to ever be added, even if we forget about alts of existing characters. 

I'm not saying don't enjoy the character, and heck, I hope you get her quickly, but this whole notion of 'everyone will get in' is ridiculous, especially when they're content to keep milking characters like Lyn for every penny - this one within a few months of the last one. 

Pretty much the only chance many characters have now is if they expand the pools or do a mass addition of some kind. 

Edited April 27, 2018 by Cute Chao

[TadpoleSuperHero]

1 minute ago, Cute Chao said:

This is my most loathed word these days. It's been shown time and time again that at the current rate, there will be a lot of characters that aren't in FE Heroes for a very long time, if ever. Adding more and more alts is making people who like less popular characters feel like there is no hope for their favourite to ever be added. 

I'm not saying don't enjoy the character, and heck, I hope you get her quickly, but this whole notion of 'everyone will get in' is ridiculous.

Pretty much the only chance many characters have now is if they expand the pools or do a mass addition of some kind. 

Maybe that's a fair attitude to have. I hope you're wrong, because it would be really sad if they slowed down the additions of actual new character to a drip feed. 

I may also just be way too agreeable and content in my personality. I have fun, I enjoy things, and I tend not to get angry over much. I do see some fair and reasonable arguments by the ones who are more negative towards Heroes, so I'm not saying that it's all sunshine and roses. But so far at least, my own patience has paid off, but I'll have to see what this year holds for Heroes. I've been pretty happy so far. 

[Cute Chao]

2 minutes ago, TadpoleSuperHero said:

Maybe that's a fair attitude to have. I hope you're wrong, because it would be really sad if they slowed down the additions of actual new character to a drip feed. 

I may also just be way too agreeable and content in my personality. I have fun, I enjoy things, and I tend not to get angry over much. I do see some fair and reasonable arguments by the ones who are more negative towards Heroes, so I'm not saying that it's all sunshine and roses. But so far at least, my own patience has paid off, but I'll have to see what this year holds for Heroes. I've been pretty happy so far. 

That's good :) I want to be happy with the game, too, and I will probably be a hypocrite because if they ever added Kent in, I would be all sunshine and daisies (well sort of). 

I'd still be salty at weighted female seasonal banners and all female banners, and I'll still wish the alts would stop, but I think it would be easier to see sunshine and roses once/if he ever gets into the game xD 

But yes, don't let the salt drag you down :) These forums are the only places people can vent with like minded people (and have their opinions challenged by others), so it's just a form of release.