Twitch Plays Pokemon Mafia NOC(15p)(GAME OVER TOWN WINS)

[Jaybee]

2/9

I have more posts than hours left in this phase so I'm going to waste one now. To the guy giving out extra anarchy posts (I assume that's a thing), don't waste too many on me. But I appreciate the thought!

Rereading all of D2, here's some questions I still have (as of Refa's first post on D2). I will endeavour to answer as many of them as possible when I get home, I've missed 8 trains over the past 30 minutes. If people have time to respond to them, that would be great, but these are mostly to help my own thought process.

Random thought: because votes are anonymous, town must hard consolidate on someone every anarchy phase to prevent scum from mass voting somebody and getting away scot free.

To answer what was directed at me, I didn't vote Elemina in my role pm because that takes effort, and if we've learnt anything from my last few games, it's that I'm pretty lazy!

And don't worry, I'm a bit of a night owl. I'll cover more when I'm back. 

 

1. What effort has Athena put into scumhunting on the D2 wagon? How did he vote D1, and what did he say about people on the wagon (Via, kts, refa, me, ice sage, mack, rad) as d1 and d2 progressed?

2. What can actually be gleaned from Elemina's catch up? On skimming, I thought it was super surface level and it didn't make him look any more town. What else has he contributed? 

3. What do Ath/SB, Ath/Refa and Ath/Rad interactions look like? At this rate I might as well ask what everyone thinks of Ath. 

4. How do Ice Sage's reads change as he is questioned? 

5. Shinori why you gotta hurt my feelings like this man :( I thought you were for real with that 

Phase ends in exactly 4 hours.

[Baldrick]

JB, the only cure for laziness is spamposting. I will tunnel you tomorrow unless you use your full alottment of posts. Are those numbered q’s things you want people to answer, or things you’re going to cover?

SB, with RAD’s activity today, I would want a very good reason to not lynch him today. Shinori throwing away his allotted posts for no reason, and not giving people any chance to question him is pretty slack, and I would be OK with leaving it to the next phase.

[Jaybee]

3/9

It's things I'm going to cover but if people want to respond to that, I'm open.

[RADicate]

10 hours ago, Refa said:

3/6

^That's my role.  Should be obvious town, there's literally zero scum benefit to it existing.  I'm not going to confirm/deny any additional information about my role, so deal with it.

I asked Marth if investigation results were guaranteed to be accurate, and he said yes.  I then asked him if that precluded the existence of a tailor, and he said "this game isn't bastard and everything happens for a reason!" which basically confirms nothing.  EIther Shinori is lying, or there is a Tailor.  I don't get why Scum!Shinori tunnels me and lies about a guilty (I can see Shinori being ballsy enough to lie about a guilty, but all of the proceeding play makes me think that he genuinely believed he caught me), it'd just make him look bad tomorrow.  Even if I get lynched and he somehow doesn't die tonight, I wouldn't go after him.  Tailor on me is fucking obnoxious why would you even add this role in your game Marf.  The problem is who would tailor me...my gut guess would be SB/Baldrick/Eurykins, honestly, just because those are people who'd be fearful of me being cleared.  RAD is still a bad lynch.

JB/Ice Sage not having voted despite saying that they would is ??? but it could just be laziness on their part; I know I didn't vote immediately even after I said I would.

##Unvote

##Vote: Athena

Hi sorry i died, but i can confirm thats not refas role. I give out those extra posts tyvm. Lying scum.

[Refa]

5/6

5 minutes ago, Killthestory said:

think i'm on 4 rn

for shinori's sake not voting the outted guilty is stupid and usually a misplay. please eventually consolidate there.

your read and subsequent vote on evan was bad, and while some of your reads have been good, they haven't come from a good place. a weird thought process that can read as tmi to me for you to suddenly flip near eod to a read you didn't mention much was super weird when a lot of your reads were good! your content has been very unintrusive, and it's looked meloow and easy to skim past if i wasn't reading specifically for you. just doesn't feel like you from last game.

This is a town reaction, I feel like scum would be more likely to stay on the sidelines considering it was a reaction test (I even told the mods "now I know how Via felt in SF3" FFS) and they would know that.

I don't really get what you're saying, though.  I voted Evan because he was the scumread I felt most comfortable voting, even though I had more issues with Randa/SB.

10 minutes ago, Eurykins said:

Also, the latter part makes it sound like there's a trapdoor/hinge behind your role that you're not divulging purposely, even with you in the limelight under Shinori's guilty of you. Kind of doesn't make things seem any better IMO? 

> If I didn't spell it out clearly initially, I do not think your role clears or paints you in a more townie light as a result. It can be easily a role on either side, like things like Announcers or other public roles that HAVE rolled scum multiple times in the past. To me it's something "safe" to claim as part of your role, something that aids in fake claiming as your role when it's only part of an entire role slot. That, plus the willfulness to not say anything more makes me feel more sketch about your claim, and more willing to place the eggs of trust in the Shinori basket for now. 

I don't see Scum!nori pushing for a crazy ass gambit like this though, when you were already being suspected since D1. Literally makes no sense to shove himself into a 1v1 for no reason and jeopardize his status amongst the rest of the players. So I am more inclined to believe that he has a legitimate reason to claim what he has than not. 

ALSO, YOU STATE THAT I'M NEUTRAL WRT MY READ ON YOU? I've scum read you since D1, and I've stuck by it? Shinori's claim to your guilty only seals the deal for me, and your claim does nothing to change/rectify the view on your slot. 

As scum, I would never even mention anything else about my role that is obviously scummy, so you trying to be suspicious of me for it is pretty bad.

I already mentioned that it doesn't make sense for Scum!Shinori to guilty me...Like, that was never the angle I was going for.  Why are you saying that it is?

Your reaction to me getting guiltied is neutral, I should say, not your reaction to me in general.  It doesn't read as natural to me.  Not sure what to make of your reaction after Shinori revealed it was a reaction test.

14 minutes ago, Shinori said:

This is a weird sentence in Refa's post and I don't quite understand it.

Oh yeah by the way I have 6 posts.

Also I was gambiting, I don't have any guilty on Refa.  I wanted to see his reaction + get reactions from other people.  I really wanted SB's reaction but I think he went to bed and I don't want to leave this situation as is for too long because if people all voted Refa then left for the night to not come back for phase end this would end badly.

Otherwise I think Rad/KTS/Ice are the top suspects actually to look at at the moment.

  Reveal hidden contents

Via was initially scum reading Refa but waffled on it.

Via suspect of Ice.

Via suspect of Randa/Rad.

https://serenesforest.net/forums/index.php...ent&comment=5214773 Strong post by Via commenting on how we should look at Randa with how fast Evan wagon built up.

Via town reading SB/Baldrick (Not specifically stated but probably accurate, he refused to out where they actually would be placed at.)

Via apparently slightly gut town reading Refa. Outside of the one thing he has for the gut read though he waffled on how he actually felt Refa might be between demotivated town or lazy/demotivated scum.

Via doesn't think Refa is being lazy which is interesting considering his demotivated claim followed by him putting in a lot of effort when pressured by basically only me.

There's something I want to claim but I can't/shouldn't so I won't.  There is imformation in the thread though pertaining to it so maybe someone will find it later.

Bad KTS post defending ice while putting pressure on Evan.
https://serenesforest.net/forums/index.php...ent&comment=5214539

"i thought ice sage's content post was shaky and awkward but made in a way that was believeable for new town." - Quote from KTS
Is this a scum slip? As in KTS and Ice are buddies and Ice is TRYING to act like new town since he hasn't played NoC before? With others coaching him to act like newb town.

I think Rad > KTS > Ice at the moment.  Will keep up with thread though and move my vote around as need be as the phase gets closer to ending.

I meant that I didn't want town to lynch you tomorrow because it'd be two mislynches in a row.

Well, fuck me gently with a chainsaw.  Don't see this reaction test coming from Scum!You, so uh...at least it helped me out in that aspect despite stressing me the hell out.

Disagree with KTS, his reaction to your guilty read as natural to me.

11 minutes ago, Baldrick said:

JB, do you have a good reason why you're not voting where you said you would (I'm asking more to try and get into your head, your response to me re: evan gave me town vibes)

I honestly have no idea what to make of Ice. The only explanation, given his tone, is that he is ignorant of how anarchy voting works. He didn't respond to me either, which is irking me.

Refa, D1 you had a lot of reads based on initial impressions. They showed you hadn't properly read, to decide if they were sound or not. 

You had gutreads on me/SB for our randa votes, despite not having read Randa. You voted Shinori for his voting behaviour, but his thought process was fairly clear to me from reading his posts closely, and you rightly dropped him once he had reiterated. (At this point, I'm going to write you and Shinori off as thunderdoming because I have no idea why you revived that case, and his using up all his posts makes no sense at all.) Can you also explain why you would sheep JB?

The lack of votes from JB/Ice bothers me too.  I'm hoping there's scum there so I can say my role did something lol.

My reads weren't based off of initial impressions after I made my post scumreading SB/Shinori/Randa.  I'd sheep JB because I think that Mackc2 making cases on both of the highest wagons and then voting the one w/more votes without really explaining why he's scummier is bad.  Also his reasoning for not reading me despite me making like...three?  Not RVS posts is pretty bad.

CUT BY THIS SO I'LL REPLY TO THE OTHER POSTS LATER

1 minute ago, RADicate said:

Hi sorry i died, but i can confirm thats not refas role. I give out those extra posts tyvm. Lying scum.

I claimed the role that revealed the votes lol.

[RADicate]

:myb:

[RADicate]

I thought you were arrowing the 3/6, probably couldve figured that one out myself if i had thought a bit more about it

[RADicate]

2 hours ago, Jaybee said:

2/9

I have more posts than hours left in this phase so I'm going to waste one now. To the guy giving out extra anarchy posts (I assume that's a thing), don't waste too many on me. But I appreciate the thought!

Rereading all of D2, here's some questions I still have (as of Refa's first post on D2). I will endeavour to answer as many of them as possible when I get home, I've missed 8 trains over the past 30 minutes. If people have time to respond to them, that would be great, but these are mostly to help my own thought process.

Random thought: because votes are anonymous, town must hard consolidate on someone every anarchy phase to prevent scum from mass voting somebody and getting away scot free.

To answer what was directed at me, I didn't vote Elemina in my role pm because that takes effort, and if we've learnt anything from my last few games, it's that I'm pretty lazy!

And don't worry, I'm a bit of a night owl. I'll cover more when I'm back. 

 

1. What effort has Athena put into scumhunting on the D2 wagon? How did he vote D1, and what did he say about people on the wagon (Via, kts, refa, me, ice sage, mack, rad) as d1 and d2 progressed?

2. What can actually be gleaned from Elemina's catch up? On skimming, I thought it was super surface level and it didn't make him look any more town. What else has he contributed? 

3. What do Ath/SB, Ath/Refa and Ath/Rad interactions look like? At this rate I might as well ask what everyone thinks of Ath. 

4. How do Ice Sage's reads change as he is questioned? 

5. Shinori why you gotta hurt my feelings like this man :( I thought you were for real with that 

Phase ends in exactly 4 hours.

Ironically enough the logic was for me to give inactives more posts to get the into the game! 

[Jaybee]

4/9

hi rad why are you jokeposting where is wallpost.exe

[RADicate]

2 minutes ago, Jaybee said:

4/9

hi rad why are you jokeposting where is wallpost.exe

I kinda lost motivation writing wallpost exe and starting browsing discord. And at this point even though i do have the capacity to save myself my existence is in effect distorting the reads of the entire game

[RADicate]

Because of the BS with the d1 wagons

[RADicate]

I also thought i had 24 more hours and planned to write that wallpost this morning.

[Baldrick]

1 hour ago, Jaybee said:

1. What effort has Athena put into scumhunting on the D2 wagon? How did he vote D1, and what did he say about people on the wagon (Via, kts, refa, me, ice sage, mack, rad) as d1 and d2 progressed?

2. What can actually be gleaned from Elemina's catch up? On skimming, I thought it was super surface level and it didn't make him look any more town. What else has he contributed? 

3. What do Ath/SB, Ath/Refa and Ath/Rad interactions look like? At this rate I might as well ask what everyone thinks of Ath. 

4. How do Ice Sage's reads change as he is questioned? 

5. Shinori why you gotta hurt my feelings like this man :( I thought you were for real with that 

Phase ends in exactly 4 hours.

1. I think he's been fairly proactive on that front. He didn't push via/KTS, but I accept his explanation for that. For all the others except mack/elemina, he's been questioning to guide them into providing reads, trying to hold them accountable for their activity, or building a case on them.

2. He hasn't posted since that catch-up post. The reads he got badly need elaboration. He actually hasn't been on for 24 hours now, which is frustrating.

4. His most dynamic read is on RAD. D1 he thought Randa was being ganged up on (still hasn't elaborated on this), D2 he said he wanted to give RAD the benefit of the doubt, which has a slightly different implication, means he doesn't have to explain his D1. Elemina is sheeped from you (nobody sheeped me despite the fact that I was the first one to point out the numbers of evan V randa wagons at the time), and he's very waffly on Refa.

 

PEDIT: Refa, I did say your later D1 posts were better, so. What do you think the scum motive Mack had for not talking about your slot?

RAD, you've got one post to do something constructive before I turn in.

MULTI PEDIT: Good night.

[RADicate]

13 hours ago, Eurykins said:

2. RAD's vote on Evan, while understandable in a 1v1 situation in terms of end-of-the-day lynch candidates, still doesn't sit well with me. The post  also had a weird vibe that could easily emulate vote dropping and running, and doesn't really offer anything else new. Part of me expected more of a response post as to why we should vote Evan over their slot, as opposed to just dropping a vote and disappearing. 

At this point i had skimmed maybe half the thread and checked the most recently posted votals. Normally I wouldve made some level of arguement but....

[RADicate]

Anywho those of you SRing refa for the chainsaw (ftr im leaning town on him for his opening into the game amost a few other things) and basing your entire lives on d1 wagonomics please do reevaluate your lives post my flip. 

[SB.]

1 hour ago, Baldrick said:

SB, with RAD’s activity today, I would want a very good reason to not lynch him today. Shinori throwing away his allotted posts for no reason, and not giving people any chance to question him is pretty slack, and I would be OK with leaving it to the next phase.

I would uh... see a guilty result as a very compelling reason myself tbh but I can see you disbelieving it because Shinori's behaviour beforehand felt forced to me as well. 

@RADicate please fullclaim (what exactly do you do in detail?) and what are your reads? 

This thing is short the question needs to be asked. I have one more post that I can use which will be wallier but I wanna catch RAD while he's around.

[Jaybee]

5/9

Athena

Spoiler

Day 1

1. Dislikes Randa's first post, likes Shinori, KTS, Eury.

2. Null on SB & Bart, joke vote on Evan?

3. Generally sheeps Bart's reads.

4. Scumreads Refa, townread Baldrick, Via, KTS.

5. FOS Ice

6. First mention that he suspects the Evan wagon is a counterwagon. I believe this is also a Refa scumread.

7. I like his explanation of his moderate Ice scumread. Says he dislikes Evan now, thinks his catchup post was scummy. Does not think Randa/Ice Sage/Evan are all scum, yet has these 3 as his highest lynch priorities. Refa has been demoted to same level as Mack/Rapier (inactives).

8. "I prefer RAD over Evan, because I can't help but feel Evan's wagon is a scumfueled counterwagon to save RAD. Assuming this scenario, Ice Sage looks worse as well. If Evan is town, I'd say both RAD and Ice Sage are nearly confirmed scum."

9. This is his main post about the Evan wagon. Expects at least 2 scum on the Evan wagon. The other people on the wagon are Via, KTS (said he likes both), me, Ice, Refa, Mack, Rad. His reads are quite consistent now.

Day 2

1. Sheeps Shinori's Refa, Rad, Ice scumreads. Votes Rad, preference for Refa, then Ice next.

2. 2nd post.

i. Townread Shinori & Baldrick, minor scumread Conq, null on SB, null on Eury/Bart. Says that he still prefers voting in the Evan wagon.

ii. Super defensive towards SB. I sense a little bit of blame game being directed towards SB/me/Ice for not switching over to the Randa wagon.

3. 3rd post.Doubts his Ice read even more now (considering the newb argument),  dislikes Bart for making surface-level posts, now scumreads KTS (3rd lynch priority).

4. Elaboration on Ice case, townreads Conq.

I think this man is town. The logic is consistent throughout, I understand why the majority of his views develop. The only thing I dislike is 1.7 where his Refa case suddenly drops. Would not lynch.

Bartozio

Spoiler

I'm going to give this slot a bit more grace because he did mention both D1 and D2 that IRL was getting in the way.

D1: He's null on Ice, and that he's voting Randa.

D2.1: Thinks Refa/Shinori look more town for their interactions, likes Athena's pressure on Ice Sage, & Conq in general.

D2.2: Doesn't think there's a lot of scum on the Evan wagon, insists more on lynching people scummy for their play (ie Rad). Suggests Athena is bussing Rad.

D2.3: Readspost

Initially I thought Bart was looking bad, and I agree that he's not posted much (but as mentioned above, IRL issues). Most things are fine, except that his Athena/Ice Sage reads are ???. 2.1 he says he likes how Ath is pressuring Ice but has some issues with the way Ath is pushing the people on the Evan wagon (elaborated in 2.2). Then he turns around and puts Rad > Ath > Ice in his scumlist in 2.3? And his Randa scumread seems very disconnected from his Ath scumread. Dislike slot.

SB

Spoiler

2.1: Kind of shades Shinori, doesn't like Athena's treatment of the Evan wagon. Still scumreads Ice.

2.2: Suddenly backtracks on Ice (In between 2.1 and 2.2, Conq says he thinks Ice is more newbtown) This sudden change in mentality on Ice looks bad. Doesn't think Refa and Randa are scum together. 

2.3: Feels better about Refa. Thinks Bart is coasting. Still has issues with Shinori pushing Refa.

2.4:  Dislikes Eury. I'll look through this, Eury posts are too hard to read.

I need to see SB's D3 to get a better grip, but I have basically no strong impressions from his D2 posts.

Ice Sage

yo he only has 1 post this phase wtf?

Urgh. his reasoning is all sheeped and it's really a nothing post. The thing is like I still don't see the scum intent, I just see New, Poor Player.

 

and if rad wants to die that badly then yeah im all for it

[RADicate]

25 minutes ago, SB. said:

tsI would uh... see a guilty result as a very compelling reason myself tbh but I can see you disbelieving it because Shinori's behaviour beforehand felt forced to me as well. 

@RADicate please fullclaim (what exactly do you do in detail?) and what are your reads? 

This thing is short the question needs to be asked. I have one more post that I can use which will be wallier but I wanna catch RAD while he's around.

I feel tempted to leave part of my claim off because until this game I have never seen this role as town. But I am effectively Anarchy Infinite Poster, 15x Arnarchy post asigner....... and the kicker: anarchy day persuader. As for my reads uh Shinori Refa and Athena are probs town. Gut wants to call ice sage scum but newbie meta distorts reads. Not particularly the bartz slot. Those are probably my most prevalent thoughts. The persuade was what i was referencing when i said i may have had capacity to save myself ftr.

[RADicate]

31 minutes ago, SB. said:

I would uh... see a guilty result as a very compelling reason myself tbh but I can see you disbelieving it because Shinori's behaviour beforehand felt forced to me as well. 

@RADicate please fullclaim (what exactly do you do in detail?) and what are your reads? 

This thing is short the question needs to be asked. I have one more post that I can use which will be wallier but I wanna catch RAD while he's around.

Ftr im pretty sure I saw shiniori say they lied about the guilt. 

[RADicate]

2 minutes ago, RADicate said:

I feel tempted to leave part of my claim off because until this game I have never seen this role as town. But I am effectively Anarchy Infinite Poster, 15x Arnarchy post asigner....... and the kicker: anarchy day persuader. As for my reads uh Shinori Refa and Athena are probs town. Gut wants to call ice sage scum but newbie meta distorts reads. Not particularly the bartz slot. Those are probably my most prevalent thoughts. The persuade was what i was referencing when i said i may have had capacity to save myself ftr.

Not particularly fond of the bartz slot* 

edit cuz lol grammar

[RADicate]

@SB. (figured out tags)

[SB.]

ONLY HAVING ONE POST SUCKS

That isn't a scum roleclaim. I don't know who the fuck I would turbo with the wagons as they are though (although SB + RAD + RAD persuade [assuming it's instant? Please @RADicate confirm exactly how this works] + 1 other vote should be enough to force any lynch). Eury or Bart would be the only people I'd be confident in lynching? @Jaybee @Conqueror I think you're around, is this a terrible idea? If you think so I'll like... probably just keep my vote down to avoid a disaster lynch but I don't like where this is going now. 

18 mins.

[Jaybee]

6/9

I'm trying to figure out what SB is pushing with regards to Eury and I don't see it. Her posts look fine to me aside from the fact that she maybe wasted #4 lol. I don't see what SB is grasping at here.

I think what's particularly pinging me about SB is that I don't feel that he's actually doing anything while waiting for Rad to flip. This looks bad and lazy in the light of other players trying to actively scumhunt.

---

Agreed that Refa's role is NAI for me, but the overall play seems townie. I think his Randa support is wrong but not bad in bad faith. @Refa, if you are reading Rad much better now, then I take it to mean you think both D1 cases were on town? In that case, who's scummy (aside from Athena)?

---

ftr shinori is never scum after the way he switched votes end D1 and for that gambit.

[RADicate]

2 minutes ago, SB. said:

ONLY HAVING ONE POST SUCKS

That isn't a scum roleclaim. I don't know who the fuck I would turbo with the wagons as they are though (although SB + RAD + RAD persuade [assuming it's instant? Please @RADicate confirm exactly how this works] + 1 other vote should be enough to force any lynch). Eury or Bart would be the only people I'd be confident in lynching? @Jaybee @Conqueror I think you're around, is this a terrible idea? If you think so I'll like... probably just keep my vote down to avoid a disaster lynch but I don't like where this is going now. 

18 mins.

Confirmed that is how it works.

[Athena_57]

Post 5/6

1 hour ago, Refa said:

I voted Evan because he was the scumread I felt most comfortable voting, even though I had more issues with Randa/SB.

What does this even mean though. I'm reading this sentence and all I feel ????

Rest of the post reads fine actually, no real issues, besides you once again sheeping JB on Mack/Elimina, even though that's based on RAD being scup, which you disagree with iirc?

1 hour ago, RADicate said:

Ironically enough the logic was for me to give inactives more posts to get the into the game! 

Yo, wtf, then why did I get an extra post :/ You wound me.

 

@Jaybee-post

Good post, I like it. Your summary un me has two things I want to correct though.
1.2. - What? I didn't joke-vote Evan
1.3. - I didn't sheep Bart's reads, I agreed with them (I had already posted most of these in-thread before he did)
2.2.i - I didn't scumread Conq? I said I liked their first post.

 

5 minutes ago, SB. said:

ONLY HAVING ONE POST SUCKS

That isn't a scum roleclaim. I don't know who the fuck I would turbo with the wagons as they are though (although SB + RAD + RAD persuade [assuming it's instant? Please @RADicate confirm exactly how this works] + 1 other vote should be enough to force any lynch). Eury or Bart would be the only people I'd be confident in lynching? @Jaybee @Conqueror I think you're around, is this a terrible idea? If you think so I'll like... probably just keep my vote down to avoid a disaster lynch but I don't like where this is going now. 

18 mins.

I'm here as well and RAD is freaking me out with him posting reads despite giving up. I don't think I'm willing to swap though? My world doesn't make sense tbh with him town.

Someone got a good plan?

 

Stuff on Bart in final post. TL;DR of it is that I'm still scumreading him a fair bit, but my initial reaction was a bit overblown.