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How come Corrin and Azura can marry their siblings in Revelation?

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Kinda late to the party in that regard. Also, they can do that in BR and CQ as well. There's some dumb shit about why on BR's side, but it doesn't really make any of it better.

Edited by familyplayer

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Because likely at the last possible moment of development the devs decided that making the Hoshido siblings accessible to the waifu/husbando crowd and appealing to the incest fans at the same time was more important than the premise of the game. 

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Because incest is wincest.

In Corrin's case, they aren't related to any of their siblings by blood, so any implications of incest are (mostly) gone. This also allows the player to marry whoever they want without any binding restrictions.

In Azura's case, she isn't related to the Hoshido kids whatsoever, as she was originally from Nohr. However, she can marry Leo and Xander, which IS('nt) a case of incest, as they're all (not) half-siblings. I wouldn't say it's as bad as the stuff that happens in FE4, but it's still pretty bad. 

I also want to mention that Corrin and Azura are cousins and can marry each other. So yeah.

Edit: Thanks to those who corrected me. I've learned again that I still don't know as much as I think I do. :P

Edited by indigospace

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1 hour ago, indigospace said:

In Azura's case, she isn't related to the Hoshido kids whatsoever, as she was originally from Nohr. However, she can marry Leo and Xander, which IS a case of incest, as they're all half-siblings. I wouldn't say it's as bad as the stuff that happens in FE4, but it's still pretty bad.

Pretty sure Azura was born before Aerte was married to Garon, but still.

The way things are written, they wanted to appeal to incest audiences but didn't want to get called out for actually doing it so did the letter trick for Hoshido and acted like the whole situation with Nohr wasn't just the wrong side of awkward.

As for Azura, it's fine if you're their first cousin in some places so that's their out.

TL:DR: They put more thought into trying to get the incest appeal than they did for Valla.

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The developers probably thought that some fans would be annoyed if they couldn't marry the Hoshidan and the Nohrian siblings and that marriage with everyone should have been available like in Awakening.

That's probably why kids are also in the game as well even though they were not necessary.

1 hour ago, indigospace said:

In Azura's case, she isn't related to the Hoshido kids whatsoever, as she was originally from Nohr. However, she can marry Leo and Xander, which IS a case of incest, as they're all half-siblings. I wouldn't say it's as bad as the stuff that happens in FE4, but it's still pretty bad.

Actually like Corrin, she isn't related to the Nohrian siblings by blood as well but it's still pretty bad. Her father was the unnamed former King of Valla.

Edited by Thunderstar

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And then there's Shigure, and the fact you can marry your cousin's child.

Marrying your cousin is not a big deal where I come from, but marrying your cousin's child is all levels of wrong.

Edited by Chopper...

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to the answer the question more waifus and husbandos to choose from no other reason. 

I'm a bit torn on this whole prospect cause on one hand when it comes to romance options I always say the more the better however on the other hand doing so in this case completely undermines the themes of the game. I mean the core theme of fates is choosing which is more important to you blood or bond and having no blood relation to your supposed blood siblings just kind of just throws that idea out the window. and the way it's just sort of handwaved like that just makes it even worse. I mean it just comes off as otaku pandering like fates doesn't already have enough of that.

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4 hours ago, indigospace said:

In Azura's case, she isn't related to the Hoshido kids whatsoever, as she was originally from Nohr. However, she can marry Leo and Xander, which IS a case of incest, as they're all half-siblings. I wouldn't say it's as bad as the stuff that happens in FE4, but it's still pretty bad.

Bold: Nope. One, she doesn't exactly confirm her relation to Elise when the latter asks about it. Second, she was born before Arete married Garon - considering that she and her mother got the Replacement Scrappy treatment from Nohrians...

Edited by Shadow Mir

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Really? Fates is tame compared to the shit that goes on in the mess of a game that is genealogy. That being said, i honestly think IS should have gone with the original angle and have you be related to the hoshidans instead of creating some half assed excuse so you could pet their faces. They could have just had Arete and Mikoto be the daughters of anankos instead  of having him be the avatars father.

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3 hours ago, Sage of the Mist said:

Really? Fates is tame compared to the shit that goes on in the mess of a game that is genealogy. That being said, i honestly think IS should have gone with the original angle and have you be related to the hoshidans instead of creating some half assed excuse so you could pet their faces. They could have just had Arete and Mikoto be the daughters of anankos instead  of having him be the avatars father.

Well, the only actual case of siblings/half-siblings* boning in FE4 is Arvis and Dierdre, and that relationship definitely isn't really painted in a good light.

Outside of that, it's all cousins. Which is still gross, but you generally have to go out of your way for it. Game doesn't really push cousins on each other, gen 1, there's really only Chulain and Ayra, but we don't really know how many degrees these two are separated within the royal family, and you can end up with a gen 2 where nobody besides Leif, Altenna and Seliph are related. Whereas male Corrin and Azura is pushed pretty heavily, and they are also cousins. And the whole idea of Corrin/Azura boning any of the Nohrians is still pleeeeeeeeenty gross and weird, despite them not sharing blood.

Oh, I guess there is Sylvia and Claud, but that whole relationship isn't really clear.

*not counting Faval/Patty and Lana/Lester, who, being cousins from identical twins, technically makes them genetically half siblings rather than cousins, but I doubt anyone on the team thought about the actual genetics of these 4

Edited by Slumber

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Because of what indigo said.  Except Azura isn't the daughter of Garon, and Arete isn't the mother of any of the Nohrian siblings, so Azura is literally in the same boat and also is the cousin of Corrin (Arete and Mikoto are sisters).  So the one main playable character who you have literally zero premonitions about being related to you is in fact the only character who is actually related to you by blood. 

But even without blood relation, you still have a sibling-like bond with the royals in Fates (same with Azura), so it's still an awkward dynamic.  And there is even more potential cousin-on-cousin incest in the 2nd Generation depending on if the female royals give birth to female children and the player wants to pair them with the children of the male royals.  Only in the case of Midori x Asugi is incest shot down (only in the localization, as far as I know), and that's only because they're always cousins no matter how you pair their parents.

8 hours ago, indigospace said:

I wouldn't say it's as bad as the stuff that happens in FE4, but it's still pretty bad.

5 hours ago, Sage of the Mist said:

Really? Fates is tame compared to the shit that goes on in the mess of a game that is genealogy.

Given that the main conflict in Genealogy literally revolves around bringing two siblings together to give birth to what is essentially the anti-Christ of that world, and that said pairing deprives a certain character (whom you're supposed to greatly sympathize with) of his lover, it seems the game actually doesn't give incest a good name.  Granted, it's kind of hammy that the main conflict of the game is literally brought about by incest, and some potential second-gen pairings are between cousins, but it hardly encourages incest the way that Fates does.  Just simply from a gameplay standpoint, there's not much incentive to pair cousins in Genealogy (and you can only pair Seliph up with his half-sister through exploits), while there's plenty to gain from incesting it up or boning your siblings/nephews/nieces-in-law in Fates.

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11 hours ago, Thunderstar said:

The developers probably thought that some fans would be annoyed if they couldn't marry the Hoshidan and the Nohrian siblings and that marriage with everyone should have been available like in Awakening.

And considering how popular the royals are, I don’t think they were wrong to think that.

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3 hours ago, Water Mage said:

And considering how popular the royals are, I don’t think they were wrong to think that.

The devs probably were correct when they saw that a lot of fans would be annoyed they couldn't marry the siblings. Still, I think pride and respect in the product they were making should have been enough tell them that undermining the premise of the game just to please those fans is incredibly silly and more than a bit pathetic. 

For a game that already drew so much controversy with skinship they really shouldn't have added pseudo incest to the mix. They had a great premise going so they should just have faith in it rather than abandon it just for a quick bit of fanservice. 

Edited by Etrurian emperor

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I'd say the idea of making the Royals pair-able was probably because Robin in Awakening could marry anyone they wanted and probably wanted to allow players to do the same thing with Corrin.  It could also have to do with allowing players to marry characters of certain personalities and/or appearances, especially when they were the characters to get most of the show time during trailers, causing people to naturally like them the most when playing Fates for the first time upon its release.

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51 minutes ago, Etrurian emperor said:

The devs probably were correct when they saw that a lot of fans would be annoyed they couldn't marry the siblings. Still, I think pride and respect in the product they were making should have been enough tell them that undermining the premise of the game just to please those fans is incredibly silly and more than a bit pathetic. 

For a game that already drew so much controversy with skinship they really shouldn't have added pseudo incest to the mix. They had a great premise going so they should just have faith in it rather than abandon it just for a quick bit of fanservice. 

I mean, I agree with all of this, but I also have to say that's merely one of the reasons why the story was underwhelming.  Though if they really, truly stuck with the premise of "adoptive relatives vs. blood relatives", Revelation would never have come into existence, or if it did it'd incur great self sacrifice and/or heavy, brutal choices.  Because honestly, the fact that there exists a "better alternative" to either of the paths is at least 50% of why the conflict feels so contrived and underwhelming.

Still, I think keeping marriage with the siblings off the table would've improved all of them as characters.  Particularly Camilla; I think if she wasn't created with the notion that she'd be a potential suitor for the avatar, a lot of the problems I have with her would go away.  Of course they could still marry other characters... but there's an extent to which there's too much fanservice, and I think Fates went well past that.

10 hours ago, Slumber said:

*not counting Faval/Patty and Lana/Lester, who, being cousins from identical twins, technically makes them genetically half siblings rather than cousins, but I doubt anyone on the team thought about the actual genetics of these 4

Given that holy blood works like "if you put two minor bloods together, you get major blood" (instead of that trait behaving like a proper recessive gene or even an allele) and that there's the implication that incest makes children stronger, I don't think the team thought about genetics in general.  Which is kind of funny and ironic, considering that genetic inheritance is kind of the main premise of the game.

Then again, if it truly behaved like genetics, then it'd be almost entirely random, which is no fun for the eugenics optimization crowd.  Though there might've been that one guy who considered making the genetics RNG...

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12 hours ago, Slumber said:

*not counting Faval/Patty and Lana/Lester, who, being cousins from identical twins, technically makes them genetically half siblings rather than cousins, but I doubt anyone on the team thought about the actual genetics of these 4

The reason they can marry each other I would say is less because IS was fine with it, and more because Subs exist. Febail-Muirne isn't incest, nor Asaello-Lana, or Asaello-Muirne, or Deimne-Patty, Deimne-Daisy, or Lester-Daisy, and they weren't willing to put in the effort to code out Febail-Lana and Lester-Patty.

Subs, as you sort of allude to, can also explain Shannan-Larcei, since Shannan-Creidne is not incest. Although when I think about it, Shannan-Larcei feels wrong to me, because Shannan is old enough and has lived such an existence that he has probably seen Larcei in diapers and has had a hand in raising her.

Also regarding the second Gen- Altena's inability to be married to anyone. Why? I've heard the best explanation is feelings for Arion, which is incest by upbringing if not by genetics- the CQ siblings issue.

 

1 hour ago, Ertrick36 said:

Though there might've been that one guy who considered making the genetics RNG...

By which you mean the original plans for FE4 to randomly produce only one child per mother (sans Seliph, Altena, and Leif) with a random gender? (Dear Heim that sounds a little too scattershot!)

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On 17-7-2018 at 7:52 PM, Interdimensional Observer said:

Subs, as you sort of allude to, can also explain Shannan-Larcei, since Shannan-Creidne is not incest. Although when I think about it, Shannan-Larcei feels wrong to me, because Shannan is old enough and has lived such an existence that he has probably seen Larcei in diapers and has had a hand in raising her.

Yeah, mentally Shanan is probably pretty much her dad which just makes the pairing creepy. 

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Because reasons and it's technically legal we need TEH ShIpPiNG!!! Besides, there's far worse actual incestous stuff in this franchise than marrying your half-semi-kinda-sibling. Which is ironic because you get the whole "Companion" thing in Awakening if the children characters are cousins. I feel like that's why you don't see "Wife" or "Husband" in the character's menu anymore and just the characters you're the closest to because I wouldn't be bothered trying to make all of this stuff try to sound normal if I was the developers either~

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