What constitutes "good" or "bad" voice acting?

[Dragoncat]

Noticed in this topic: https://serenesforest.net/forums/index.php?/topic/84446-i-have-to-say-im-not-longer-so-pessimistic-about-three-houses/

People were having a little side discussion and saying Xenoblade 1 has bad voice acting. What? I think it's fantastic. The smooth British accents (especially Dunban and Alvis) and the fact that Reyn sounded like he was trying not to shit his pants in fear while running from the arachnos in Tephra Cave, examples can go on and on, those voice actors nailed those performances imo. I had to make a topic about voice acting in general because obviously if I said that in there it would derail the thread.

Now obviously sometimes the voice acting is just BAD, like if a character sounds monotone or too cheesy or not realistic or something, but that's probably quite rare when you think about it. Game devs want to hire skilled voice actors if they know what they're doing and not making like, a crappy Barbie game for preschool girls or something.

Yeah. Discuss.

[Rapier]

I don't know how to determine it objectively and universally because I lack a more technical notion on voice acting, but I can notice when the voice acting is good or bad, so here we go.

For me, a voice actor/actress needs to be able to convey the character's emotions to the listener/watcher. If you sound too hammy and cheesy or if you sound like you're reading a text, it's bad voice acting, because you're not conveying the character's emotions properly. For examples on which both happen, take Resident Evil 1. Some of the VAs there actually try to sound worried, desperate, happy etc., conveying the character's emotions, but it's done in such a hammy and cheesy way that it feels forced (take all of Barry's scenes), while others sound like they're reading a text sheet (Rebecca is the worst offender imo).

There's also a matter of the voice actor's own voice matching with their character. On real life, people's appearances and personality do not match their voices, obviously, but for narrative purposes it is important that they do so for fictional characters, to follow certain stereotypes. That's why they choose higher pitched female voices for specific types of anime/game characters (see Trails of Cold Steel's Alisa), or baritones for specific types of anime/game characters (usually the stoic ones, see Frederick).

ask Elieson nicely and he might interview Kyle Herbert again, maybe

[omegaxis1]

Yeah, no idea why anyone would think that the voice acting in Xenoblade 1 is bad. I found it great. 

However, I will explain what I feel is bad voice acting.

When you perform voice acting, you need to really be in touch with the character. Just because you aren't a thespian where you actually act in a movie or such and be seen, you are still being that character. You have to actually understand the role you are playing. When you understand the character, and when the events of the story take place, the scenes where you talk, you need to capture the emotions behind the character at that moment.

This is why at some of the moments in Xenoblade 2, the voice acting was cringey, while some others were great.

For example:

Spoiler

When Vandham died and Rex went, "FOR VADHAM!" I found that cringey. It did not convey the emotions of a boy distraught over losing whom he views as a father-figure. 

However, when Rex was talking to Pyra and Mythra's spirits while fighting Jin, I felt the voice acting was doing great. The talk was really heartfelt. But then he went with "JOIN ME!" and it was cringey again. When saying that, you need to really shout it out. The voice actor felt like he was trying to still hold his voice back, but that just makes it harder to appreciate, because it takes you out of the moment. 

2

Another example of good voice acting is several moments I found in Code Geass, the most particular was in Season 2 in the dub:

Spoiler

When Shirley was dying and Lelouch found her body, my god, absolutely LOVED that moment where Lelouch truly sounded so distraught. I could FEEL the despair behind his voice. It was especially heartwrenching when Lelouch tried to use his Geass and ordered Shirley not to die, despite how it was all in vain. Johnny Yong Bosch did SUCH A TERRIFIC job that I could feel my eyes tearing up at that moment. It was a truly painful and beautiful scene.

 

So my overall statement to how to get good voice acting is ultimately to capture the emotions of the character, to really let it flow and truly feel real.

[Dragoncat]

30 minutes ago, Rapier said:

I don't know how to determine it objectively and universally because I lack a more technical notion on voice acting, but I can notice when the voice acting is good or bad, so here we go.

For me, a voice actor/actress needs to be able to convey the character's emotions to the listener/watcher. If you sound too hammy and cheesy or if you sound like you're reading a text, it's bad voice acting, because you're not conveying the character's emotions properly. For examples on which both happen, take Resident Evil 1. Some of the VAs there actually try to sound worried, desperate, happy etc., conveying the character's emotions, but it's done in such a hammy and cheesy way that it feels forced (take all of Barry's scenes), while others sound like they're reading a text sheet (Rebecca is the worst offender imo).

There's also a matter of the voice actor's own voice matching with their character. On real life, people's appearances and personality do not match their voices, obviously, but for narrative purposes it is important that they do so for fictional characters, to follow certain stereotypes. That's why they choose higher pitched female voices for specific types of anime/game characters (see Trails of Cold Steel's Alisa), or baritones for specific types of anime/game characters (usually the stoic ones, see Frederick).

ask Elieson nicely and he might interview Kyle Herbert again, maybe

This is a good explanation. 

I just don't understand why those people were saying that about Xenoblade. It's like, what? The emotions were conveyed perfectly and nobody sounded like they were just reading.

I never thought about the voices matching the character thing. But it might have some effect irl. Like many buff guys irl have deep voices. I think. Yet Elmo is voiced by a big black man.. Wut.

[Etrurian emperor]

There's a fine line between good or bad. Sometimes a line is just so bad that it suddenly because really good. Things like ''DONT FURGET ME!'' and most of the things Reyn says might fall into that category. 

I think the most important thing that makes voice acting bad is if it misses the intention of the scene. A guy playing a villain might cackle as if he's in a Saturday morning cartoon but that might just end up working really well if the villain in question is supposed to be crazy. Rex has a lot of lines that fall flat because the actor doesn't succeed in depicting the emotion Rex is supposed to feel at the moment. ''For Vandam!'' is a good example, as are his rather lackluster screams. Yet when the guy voices Rex when he's being cheery or cocky he tends to nail it. 

[omegaxis1]

10 minutes ago, Etrurian emperor said:

There's a fine line between good or bad. Sometimes a line is just so bad that it suddenly because really good. Things like ''DONT FURGET ME!'' and most of the things Reyn says might fall into that category. 

1

"BUT MARRRSSS~"

[Ertrick36]

Yeah, speaking technically, it pretty much is if the actor "overacts" or just barely acts.  Also, they need to sound consistent, in both the sound/tone/pitch of the voice and the way they talk.  Part of that comes from how the development team (specifically the script writers, directors, and those who program the lines in) handles lines, but the burden is still on the actor to deliver them well.

Actually, I'm reminded of this notorious scene as an example of how the actor himself didn't necessarily do anything wrong (besides grossly misinterpreting tone), but the rest of the voice team was off:

Here, Quinton Flynn (Raiden's actor) conveyed the emotion he was going for - that is, overly happy and proud - well enough, but that line clearly doesn't call for that emotion.  Something like a mildly annoyed/relieved/smart ass tone would've been better, but the director didn't convey that or didn't know it needed to be conveyed that way.  As a result of this dysfunction, we get this beauty.

[Affinity]

Good voice acting: What is this ominous light that threatens to engulf us?

Bad voice acting: I'm nervous, what if I hit her?

[DisobeyedCargo]

Just now, Dragoncat said:

Noticed in this topic: https://serenesforest.net/forums/index.php?/topic/84446-i-have-to-say-im-not-longer-so-pessimistic-about-three-houses/

People were having a little side discussion and saying Xenoblade 1 has bad voice acting. What? I think it's fantastic. The smooth British accents (especially Dunban and Alvis) and the fact that Reyn sounded like he was trying not to shit his pants in fear while running from the arachnos in Tephra Cave, examples can go on and on, those voice actors nailed those performances imo. I had to make a topic about voice acting in general because obviously if I said that in there it would derail the thread.

Now obviously sometimes the voice acting is just BAD, like if a character sounds monotone or too cheesy or not realistic or something, but that's probably quite rare when you think about it. Game devs want to hire skilled voice actors if they know what they're doing and not making like, a crappy Barbie game for preschool girls or something.

Yeah. Discuss.

Yeah I have no idea why someone would think XC1's voice acting would be bad, it was great.

 

I think the main thing for voice acting is you need to be able to convey the emotion of the current moment well, which xenoblades cast does quite well

[Stroud]

I think Xenoblade did a good job at least Xenoblade Chronicle 2 was cool. Who does not like the welsh cat.
In my opinion a good voice actor will not let you think that its a voice actor who speaks and can immerse with the characters.
And I think to act for voices from film, cartoons, games etc. from another country is a difficult job. I saw chinese anime (Evil or Live, Fox Spirit matchmaker) were I was just thinking that I rather would have the chinese voice actors. Because it just did not feel right, even if the voice actors were not bad.
 

Edited August 3, 2018 by Stroud

[Tryhard]

It's somewhat jarring to hear the voice acting in XC2 from what I've heard. What's with the super anime girls with Scottish or Welsh accents.

That said, the quality of the voice acting was fine enough in XC1. The choice of British voice actors was an uncommon one but it was fine.

Edited August 3, 2018 by Edgelord

[Armagon]

As many have said, the difference between good and bad voice acting is the ability to convey the emotions of the characters. More importantly though, bad voice acting is when the voices just do not fit the characters well (or at all, that's when it's really bad). An example of this is in the Hyperdimension Neptunia games, where the English voice actors are just too quiet and fail to capture the wacky personalities of the characters and dialogue. Another example is Japanese Dunban. Xenoblade's Japanese dub is what you would expect but Japanese Dunban sounds like he's 12.

An example of good voice acting is, as some people have mentioned in this thread, is Xenoblade Chronicles. Many fans can recall the famous "I'LL KILL YOUUUUUU" line from Shulk, which is one of my favorite lines in gaming. Xenoblade 2 has great voice acting as well (even if Rex's VA stumbles a few times but credit where credit is due, he manages to do good screams near the end of the game).

Hell, another example of good voice acting is literally anything that comes out Albedo's mouth in the Xenosaga trilogy. Whoever his voice actor is manages to perfectly capture the character of an immortal madman.

While it's fairly common, i think a lot of scenes benefit from the voice actors adding little touches to the lines they say. You know, a chuckle or a sigh or something that's not in the dialogue box. It makes the characters come to life a lot more. Games like Xenoblade, Trails of Cold Steel, Kid Icarus: Uprising and FE Echoes are good examples of this.

26 minutes ago, Edgelord said:

It's somewhat jarring to hear the voice acting in XC2 from what I've heard. What's with the super anime girls with Scottish accents.

And this brings up a point i want to to talk about and it regards my thing about the voice acting fitting the characters. Whenever accents are involved, it gets blurry, especially if it's one that people aren't really used to hearing, like Welsh. I've seen some people say that Nia's voice doesn't fit her but i think it's just because they are so not used to hearing a Welsh person (because what other game besides Xenoblade 2 has a Welsh actress that actually uses her accent) and i can perfectly understand why some people are caught off guard. 

It's fine to not like accents but in general, whenever you hear an accent in a video game (or anything), it's important to not outright rule it as bad voice acting, because chances are that you're just not used to hearing that particular accent and once you do get used to it, you could be like "hey, this is actually pretty good".

(Note: this wasn't directed against you, i was just making a general statement as part of my views on voice acting.)

Edited August 3, 2018 by Armagon

[DisobeyedCargo]

4 minutes ago, Armagon said:

Many fans can recall the famous "I'LL KILL YOUUUUUU" line from Shulk, which is one of my favorite lines in gaming.

OMG yes THIS! That was very well done and I still get chills whenever I replay that scene 

[Dragoncat]

@DisobeyedCargo @Armagon Yes that whole scene! I felt his anguish and rage. Another good one is "Talk all you want, but those words will be your last!" Nobody better piss off Monado Boy about his girl or harm a hair on her head unless they want a laser blade shoved where the sun don't shine, that's for sure.

Dunban sounds like he's 12 in the Japanese dub? That's kind of funny lol.

Also, you guys...

Spoiler

I can't figure out if the faced mechon voices are made more mechanical for their mecha selves or not. Any insight?

 

Edited August 3, 2018 by Dragoncat

[DisobeyedCargo]

3 minutes ago, Dragoncat said:

@DisobeyedCargo @Armagon Yes that whole scene! I felt his anguish and rage. Another good one is "Talk all you want, but those words will be your last!" Nobody better piss off Monado Boy about his girl or harm a hair on her head unless they want a laser blade shoved where the sun don't shine, that's for sure.

Dunban sounds like he's 12 in the Japanese dub? That's kind of funny lol.

Also, you guys...

  Hide contents

I can't figure out if the faced mechon voices are made more mechanical for their mecha selves or not. Any insight?

 

Spoiler

Just from what i here the faced Mechon voices do sound a tad different inside the face unit. Most likely from some sort of speaker system or something. Outside of the face units they are the same voice I think.

That was also another great scene, also had some good music but that’s off topic now 

 

XC1 spoilers inside spoiler tag

Edited August 3, 2018 by DisobeyedCargo

[Johann]

XB1's voice acting is some of the best I've seen. The writing of the dialogue was frequently well one as well. I think some people seem to conflate badly written dialogue with bad voice acting, you can only do so much with a shitty line. Good voice acting sounds like how real people sound. This is why Xenoblade and FE Echoes are highly lauded, the characters talk like real people do.

Compared to normal TV/movie/theater scripts, however, video games are harder to get right since the lines aren't always in sequence, and far too often are voice actors given little to no time to prepare for their roles or even study their lines. Ever see a scene in a game where the characters aren't quite talking with the right tone? Odds are they weren't given the context they needed (I can think of several random non-scene lines in Bravely Default where Bryce Papenbrook sounds as if he's guessing the context of the line). Dunno about Xenoblade, but I recall reading that for Echoes, the cast was given a lot of time with their scripts, and it shows.

Of course, none of this gets into stuff like dubbing, which is hard even for veteran voice actors due to being constricted by the animation.

[Dragoncat]

On the subject of accents...

Shulk: Ree-sursh

Sharla: Mers-in-rees

Just about everybody: Cahnt

Caught me off guard a bit for awhile but now I think the British accents kick butt. Dunban and Alvis have my favorite voices but yeah Shulk's VA really did awesome.

Although I was talking to someone I know irl and I've been showing her the game, and I told her how they pronounce can't (Reyn: Dunban you cahnt wield the Monado anymore!) And she said she thought cahnt is actually Scottish and I started picturing Reyn in a kilt lol. He's already got floppy shorts!

[SoulWeaver]

It's a terribly subjective question. For me, it often depends on whether the VA fits how the character sounded in my head, especially when it involves characters I already recognize as opposed to characters I only heard about - for example, I found Camilla's Warriors VA very jarring, at least at first, since I was very used to her Fates voice, which sounds a bit more serious than her Warriors voice. I'm more used to it now, but I still prefer her Fates voice over her Warriors one. Another example of a VA I didn't think did a good job was Zephiel in Heroes - I get he's supposed to sound kind of off, what with the whole kill-the-humans-let-dragons-rule thing, but really he just sounds sort of constipated to me and it ruins the effect. On the flip side, they picked perfectly for Narcian in Heroes - I heard his line 'My talents are legion, my ability unparalleled' and knew I was going to find myself liking Narcian a lot more than I had before. Valter was also done fairly well, and I appreciated that a lot.

Obviously, this isn't an across-the-board thing, and I've been pleasantly and unpleasantly surprised by VAs before(I always imagined Palla sounding much older, and Minerva less gruff, and the choice of VA really switched my perspective on the two of them up - I love Palla but can't stand Minerva's voice because it doesn't sound like I thought she would at all), but I thought I'd add my opinion in here.

[Interdimensional Observer]

No mentions of Chaos Wars and its nepotism/VAing on the family cheap? Nor "Die monster! You don't belong in world!"? Or Baten Kaitos having been voice acted during a scuba trip?

I'm not exactly the biggest VA fan, in FE I actually turned them off in Fates (and KI:U, EOU2, and I wish I could in BOTW), although I'm fine with most games having it. This said, I will say two little things:

1. No technical recording issues please. Besides Eternal Wings being an egregious case of this, Aimee Matchlock and Edea Lee in Bravely Second both seem to have a lisp issue, despite Edea not having one in Bravely Default. This is despite Bravely Second being much more recent than EW.
2. Make sure you're hiring people who speak the language as their native tongue. Ryfia in the poorly VA'ed Arc Rise Fantasia did not sound like one at all, besides her voice lacking emotion and seeming like somebody was reading off a script. 

A third thing I'd like, but I know can't be avoided, is for VAs to not repeat themselves in multiple games. Call it an immersion breaker and baggage-bringer when I recognize somebody's voice is the same as another's from a totally different game. It hurt Einheria of BD that she shared a VA with Legretta of ToA, since I don't really like Legretta (and it just so happens the two also share similar, not sympathy-earning, situations).

 

I seen people say RD's limited voice acting was bad, and Rolf and Mist were, but I actually liked Sephiran's voice a bit. And I for some reason love the leagues-deep voice of Skrimir, I'd actually like to see in Heroes.

[Dragoncat]

20 minutes ago, Interdimensional Observer said:

Or Baten Kaitos having been voice acted during a scuba trip?

I played a bit of that. I remember being stuck in the fishing village because I couldn't get past the waterfalls. I've heard people say its voice acting is terrible but at the time I played it I didn't notice it being bad or good, just there. Now that I think more on it though, the old lady telling the story about the whale? Kinda cringey. Too cheesy "old person" sounding. Real elderly people don't drag their syllables out like that so I have no idea where that came from.

[Slumber]

For me, it's if it feels natural. 

Most anime/JRPG voices don't sound like voices that belong to real people. They sound like real people doing a voice, and no matter how loud they yell, the range of emotions just typically isn't there for a lot of these voices. They always just sound like somebody doing a voice at different volume levels. Which works well for comedy, but not so much for anything trying to be at all serious. 

It's why Echoes' voice acting felt like such a step up from previous FE games. It generally felt natural. Fates and Awakening felt very unnatural, and those sounded like everyone was doing their best anime voices. 

Though there is sometimes just bad voice acting. Tellius is more of an example of that. It didn't feel like people doing voices like Awakening and Fates, but it also was clearly a bunch of people who weren't really actors, and just didn't know how to read lines convincingly. 

[Rapier]

Also, bad voice acting doesn't always come because of the voice actor, but because the voice direction was bad and they worked with whatever they could. There are also times that the VA for the game is usually good but not for that role/game. Games with this that come to mind are Fates, Marvel vs Capcom Infinite (miraculously, Zero and Sigma sound good) and....... uh, I probably forgot about another.

[NinjaMonkey]

3 hours ago, Affinity said:

Bad voice acting: I'm nervous, what if I hit her?

More like So-bad-it's-good voice acting.

47 minutes ago, Slumber said:

Though there is sometimes just bad voice acting. Tellius is more of an example of that. It didn't feel like people doing voices like Awakening and Fates, but it also was clearly a bunch of people who weren't really actors, and just didn't know how to read lines convincingly. 

I'm probably alone on this, but I prefer non-VA's over professional VA's. Ace Attorney is another example of this: Up until Dual Destinies, they had Capcom employees voice the characters "Objection!", "Hold It!" and "Take That!" lines, and I honestly prefer them over the so-called "professionals" (especially Edgeworth's, as his new voice acting is terrible).

[Slumber]

35 minutes ago, NinjaMonkey said:

More like So-bad-it's-good voice acting.

I'm probably alone on this, but I prefer non-VA's over professional VA's. Ace Attorney is another example of this: Up until Dual Destinies, they had Capcom employees voice the characters "Objection!", "Hold It!" and "Take That!" lines, and I honestly prefer them over the so-called "professionals" (especially Edgeworth's, as his new voice acting is terrible).

There are some times where just picking people out of the office to do voices works out well(Deadly Premonition comes to mind. The voice acting has a lot of charm and it's pretty solid as a whole). But there are also times where it doesn't. Tellius is more of a case where it doesn't, and the voice acting is stiff. 

Edited August 4, 2018 by Slumber

[Johann]

2 hours ago, Interdimensional Observer said:

"Die monster! You don't belong in world!"

I thought about posting or at least mentioning it, but then I figured there are plenty of examples of far worse, and at least that one is kinda charmingly silly. Incidentally, I played Path of Radiance right after finishing Tales of Symphonia, and the contrast was absurd going from ToS's veteran cast to... whatever Mist's VA was.

2 hours ago, Interdimensional Observer said:

I'm not exactly the biggest VA fan, in FE I actually turned them off in Fates (and KI:U, EOU2, and I wish I could in BOTW)

Kid Icarus's voice acting was phenomenal, they got some serious talent for that and it shows. Everyone gives a strong read and it's timed extremely well. I do think it helped that the script was revised by comedy writers and that there wasn't much/any dubbing for them to do.

BOTW's was mostly disappointing, but you can switch languages at least. I switched to French myself.