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LunaLili

Apotheosis Questions

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hi, I'm almost finished with the awakening story line and i want to try and tackle Apotheosis but im not sure about a few things 

What units should I use? (besides Chrom) First gen vs. Second gen wise and how high should their supports be? I'm currently grinding my supports for both the 1st gen and 2nd gen and all my first and second gen units are married beside Laurent, Tiki, Flavia, Basillio and the special spotpass characters (like Priam and Emmeryn) 

What skills and classes are best? I have the dlc for both dread fighter and bride and limit breaker. I currently have Libra and Fredrick!Owain as Dread Fighters and Lissa as a bride and currently trying to get/grind limit breaker for everyone.

Who make the best rally bots, how many should i have and what rallies should they have?

 I want to do both the normal and sercet path so how much more difficult is the sercet path vs. normal path since Apotheosis is the same for all difficulties 

If you need my characters/levels/skills/classes and marriage supports let me know if it will help 

 

 

Edited by LunaLili
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U gonna want to have at least one rally bot. Dancer also a good idea. A vantage+vengeance+high crit build can be helpful. Forge your weapons for high might, add a bit of accuracy boost as well. Effective weapons can be surprisingly helpful.bring a fortify staff if u got one. Also dont forget those tikis tears.

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ok, should i use a spotpass/dlc character for a rallybot cause i dont really want to sacrifice one of my good units for it, my Olivia is a lv 30 dancer and she can handle herself pretty well attack wise but shes still a glass canon defense wise. Right now i think only Owain and Lon'qu has Vantage but i have vengeance on F!MU, Henry and Tharja who are all sorcerers, (you get vantage as a swordmaster right?) i have the golden gaffe dlc so forging weapons shouldn't be a problem (is there any preferable weapons like brave weapons, killing weapons etc.)

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I've always liked Brave. But for the vantage vengeance crit people they should have a weapon with as much crit as possible. All their damage comes off critting with a vengeance of low hp before the enemy can move. Vantage is gotten off myrmidon. As far as additional skills for vantage vengeance crit: anything that boosts crit. Wrath in particular is a good way to go.

oh yeah, and I'm availible for more immediate responses on the discord if u need more advice. Just send me a pm

Edited by Lunarisparadox

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ok then i can probably make Owain my vantage/vengeance crict bot since I believe he can reclass to sorcerer cause of Lissa (correct me if I'm wrong) and the and have him go though berserker before changing him back to dread fighter.

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You want to use your best Children Units because they are the best stat-wise. To fill the rest of your space, use your best adults. They should all be at S-Support, everyone should be paired with their spouse so they have the best possible bonuses they can get. I wouldn't recommend using Spotpass characters or Avatar-Sexuals unless they're Rallybots because they can't get Support bonuses.

Skills - Have as many Galeforce users as you can use because you want to be doing as much damage as possible per turn. Use non-Galeforce Units to soften units up and let your Galeforce Units finish them off and get another hit in. Also, EVERY UNIT should have Limit Breaker. Those extra stats are something you don't want to miss because your opponents all are going to be taking less damage than you would usually deal. Classes really depends on how you want to use each unit and will also depend on who's fathering which children.

Best Rallybots are Fliers (specifically Falcon Knights) because they cover more range and can heal (if they're a Falcon Knight). I used Gerome and I believe a Bride Spotpass Unit because I had an extra space open. Between them, I would recommend covering all of the Rally Skills. I would also recommend your Rallybots carry weapons that you anticipate will break during the battle so they can replace them.

I don't believe I've ever done the Secret Path so I can't verify how much harder it is.

If you want more advice on which skills to use, you can list out your Children Units and who their parents are so you can settle on their best skill choices~

 

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Ok so my childern are units are (and yeah a lot of them are pretty weird father wise cause i wanted to do weird pairings my first time) 

Robin!Lucina (Paladin) - Galeforce, Aether, Limit Breaker, Ignis and Aegis  (also has all stats +2) rally movement + spectrum, defender, dual strike, rightful king, solitary, charm and defender.) She's married to Ingio and has all her stats capped.

Chrom!Morgan (Grandmaster) - Galeforce, Lifetaker, Limit Breaker, Ignis and Rightful King (also all stats+2, veteran, slow burn, solidarity and rally spectum) he's married to Nah and also has all his stats capped.

Frederick!Owain (Dreadfighter) - Renewal, Agressor, Limit Breaker, Luna, and Vantage. (Also has Rally Luck, Astra, Miracle, Avoid +10, Swordfaire and Resistance +10) he's married to Severa and has all his stats capped. 

Valkie!Laurent (Sage) - Magic +2, Zeal, Slow Burn, Tomefare and Focus. (also has Lifetaker and Rally Magic) Not married but has A support w/all his supports and has his stats capped. (btw should i make him a sorcerer for anema or no?)

Gauis!Cynthia (Falcon Knight) - Speed +2, Galeforce, Lancefaire, Pavise and Renewal (also has rally speed, luck, defense, movement, counter and relief. She's married to Germone and has all her stats capped

Virion!Kjelle (General) - Defense +2, Hit Rate +20, Indoor Fighter, Luna and Pavise (also has Rally Defense) She's married to Brady and has all her stats capped but magic and resistance.

Stahl!Noire (Sniper) - Prescience, Aegis, Lifetaker, Hit Rate +20 and Bow Fair. She's married to Yarne and has all but magic and restiance capped. (might make a bride?)

Kellum!Brady (War Monk) - Galeforce Dual Guard, Healtouch, Miracle, Rewneal (also has Rally Luck) he's married to Kjelle and will primary be used as a healerbot also has all his stats capped but restiance. 

Ricken!Nah (Mankete) - Swordbreaker,  Wyrmsbane, Aegis and Limitbreaker (also has odd rythem, quick and slow burn, defender and magic +2) She's married to Morgan and has all her stats capped. (I heard that Mankete's aren't that great in Apotheosis, is that true? And if they are what would be a good class for her) 

Henry!Ingio (Hero) - Galeforce, Sol, Limit Breaker, Armshift and Aggressor. (also has patience, axebreaker, resistance +10 and Lifetaker.) He's married to Lucina and has all but magic and resistance capped stat wise.

Lon ' qu!Severa (Hero) - Galeforce, Sol, Limit Breaker, Armshift and Axebreaker (also has patience and lethality) and she's married to Owain and has all but magic and resistance capped.

Libra!Germone (Wvyen Lord) - All Stats +2, Tantivity, Renewal,  Swordbreaker and Deliver (also has strength +2 and Quick Burn) He's married to Cynthia and has Strength, Skill and Speed capped but is still a work in progress.

Gregor!Yarne (Warrior) - Patience, Astra, Odd Rhythm. Axebreaker and Sol. (Also has Beastbane and Even Rythem) - He's married to Noire and only has his skill capped. He's still a work in progress

Is it feasible to make dlc! alm and dlc! erika rally bots since i dont really wanna use my good units as rally bots and should all my stats be capped before doing Aphthosis? 

I'm guessing I should used my FMU since she's married to Chrom and Olivia as a dancer as long as she stays away from the frontlines.

Thanks you both for commenting, and sorry for the long response. 

 

Edited by LunaLili
another question

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First off... Counter and Lethality are completely useless in Apo, so don't use those. Second, Sol won't do you any good since you won't be healing off enough to make it worth it.

On 9/20/2018 at 3:38 PM, LunaLili said:

ok then i can probably make Owain my vantage/vengeance crict bot since I believe he can reclass to sorcerer cause of Lissa (correct me if I'm wrong) and the and have him go though berserker before changing him back to dread fighter.

Nope. Lissa doesn't have access to Dark Mage, and by extension Sorcerer. Owain would need Henry or Libra as his father for that.

On 9/20/2018 at 2:47 PM, Lunarisparadox said:

I've always liked Brave. But for the vantage vengeance crit people they should have a weapon with as much crit as possible. All their damage comes off critting with a vengeance of low hp before the enemy can move. Vantage is gotten off myrmidon. As far as additional skills for vantage vengeance crit: anything that boosts crit. Wrath in particular is a good way to go.

oh yeah, and I'm availible for more immediate responses on the discord if u need more advice. Just send me a pm

The problem is, Wrath is rather underwhelming, with only 20 crit to offer. Not to mention the gender lock. Second, enemies actually have luck stats, meaning your crit chances are most likely going to be too low to rely on.

Edited by Shadow Mir

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So whats are good skills to replace sol since it wont work good for Apotheosis?

Ok thanks for telling me that, then I'll just leave Owain as a Dread Fighter.

 

 

 

 

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So for the most part, no-holds-barred Apotheosis child unit setups can be organised into one of the following three categories:

Galegirls. Galegirls (girls with Galeforce, such as Cynthia, Severa, all good Lucinas, and Kjelle and Noire with Avatar, Gaius or Donnel parentage) want their skillset to read Limit Breaker, Galeforce, [weapon]faire, stable Proc (Luna or Vengeance), dualproc or filler. Do not run Vengeance with a second proc. Lucina is an exception and will usually carry Limit Breaker/Galeforce/Dual Strike+/Aether/Luna. (You don't want to stack more than 2 procs as your Lucina currently does, because diminishing returns start to kick in with a vengeance.)

Galeboys. Galeboys (boys with Galeforce - Owain, Inigo and Brady) want to carry Limit Breaker, Galeforce, Aggressor, [weapon]faire, stable Proc (Luna or Vengeance).

Hard supports. Any unit without Galeforce (for the most part, this is all Laurent, Yarne and Gerome, as well as most Nahs, and any Kjelle and Noire without Avatar, Gaius, or Donnel parentage) will almost always be a hard support unit and permanently in the "pocket" of a galegirl or galeboy. For the most part, these units will want to focus on dealing damage, so look for classes with the most Str and Mag. As to skillset, Limit Breaker, Aggressor, [Weapon]faire, and two filler skills (Strength/Mag/All Stats +2, Dark Mage Aura skills, Hit+20, Prescience) is the usual fare.

Some unit setups don't fit any of these three categories but work very well anyway (Lancebreaker sets, Vaike!Noire, Stahl!Nah, and Henry!Nah are some that stand out in my mind. Also the Vantage/Vengeance crew which you don't want to be using).

Not many of your units are really optimised in terms of parentage. Some are, but many are not. That's not an issue unless you want to do Apotheosis Secret Route challenge runs (without DLC or without Rally, for example). You do have a few standout units, though, and I'm going to call them out as the "core members" of your army that will be taking on the more challenging enemies.

Lucina is almost always exceptional. Avatar!Lucina isn't much better than Sumia!Lucina, but she is better. I'd be interested to know your Asset/Flaw. For the most part, +Spe/-Def is considered the best in Apotheosis, but you should be able to get by with just about anything that isn't stupid. Henry!Inigo is a pretty versatile physical unit with Hero, Warrior and Assassin, but struggles a bit as a caster due to lacking the Sage class, so I hope you're not carrying -Str on Lucina. Strongly consider picking Warrior on Inigo, it's a very powerful class.

Gaius!Cynthia is traditionally considered terrible because she's taking up a valuable dad (Gaius) who can be used to pass Pegasus Knight (and therefore Galeforce) to Kjelle or Noire (Nah sucks at leading). Since you already have her locked, though, she's a fantastic unit who will be pulling triple duty as a combat caster. Gaius!Cynthia is just about the fastest unit in your army and you're going to want to put her in Sage with the skillset Limit Breaker/Galeforce/Luna/Astra/(All Stats +2 if you have the DLC, Speed +2 if not). Reason for this - backed by Speed+2 (or All Stats+2), she edges past the highest speed benchmark in Apotheosis: 75 Speed. That lets her double attack the fastest and most threatening enemies in the game (Wave 2 Sniper Boss, the Wave 5 Sniper Boss Clone, and Wave 5 overall boss) potentially allowing her to bring them down in one round of combat. Libra!Gerome is a competent caster, so shift him to Sage.

Lon'qu!Severa is considered the best Severa there is. I'm not a fan personally, but there you go. Her best class is considered Wyvern Lord, but Fred!Owain isn't really able to pull off a particularly competent Berserker. Instead, you want to go Hero + Warrior; LQ!Sev in Hero doesn't need the extra speed from Berserker and prefers the accuracy of Warrior. You can just follow the Galegirl formula I outlined at the start of the post, but I'm inclined to say Lancebreaker here. The point of the Lancebreaker build is to knock certain lance enemies to 0 hit (including the Wave 5 overall boss, as well as the Soldiers in wave 4. Check to make sure your enemies don't have the Hawkeye skill before attacking them!), letting Severa attack them with impunity. Equip an Axe and the skills Limit Breaker/Galeforce/Vengeance/Lancebreaker/(Avoid+10, Speed+2 or All Stats +2). I've never used Lancebreaker no-holds before, so I'm not sure if you require Avoid+10. If not, then packing All Stats +2 lets you hit the abovementioned 75 Speed.

Those are you major "high notes".

For the most part, you want to be carrying 4-6 combat pairs (so the three I outlined above, plus Chrobin, probably plus Morgan, and maybe Noire as your Sniper). Bring Olivia, bring two Rally Bots (it's fine and even preferred to be using DLC or Spotpass characters like Alm and Eirika. There are ten Rally skills in the game, one for each of the seven stats, plus Mov, Heart and Spectrum. Dump Rally Str on Alm, Rally Heart/Res/Speed/Mov on Eirika, and distribute the rest of the skills however. Don't forget that you can transfer them to future saves via Logbook!). The rest of your units should be playing Staff Support - Fortify, Rescue, Recover, Physic, Catharsis.

Your basic strategy in Apotheosis is massive player phase offense. Engage the enemies on your turn, kill as many as possible, then use your Rescue Bots to drag your units out of combat range so that they're not attacked or swarmed. Repeat next turn until you win. Snipers are considered very strong on Apotheosis because their Longbows can't be counterattacked.

You need to watch out for important enemies, too. Wave 2 sniper boss is guaranteed to double with his Brave Bow and ORKOes every unit in the game, but can be ORKOed back by a powerful, fast magic user (Gaius!Cynthia), or surrounded, since he doesn't have Pass. Don't let him attack you. Wave 3 sorceror boss has 99 Luck Miracle and Nosferatu, so he's a pain to bring down, and Luna+ means he does a lot back to you. Dual Strikes or Snipers will make him regret his life choices. Wave 3 paladin does a ton of damage and has Aether + Ragnell. Tread carefully around him. Wave 4 boss is pretty fast, takes a lot of damage and does a lot back. Don't let him double your units and kill his staff support sages first. Speaking of which, those Sages are really dangerous due to Celica's Gale tomes and Luna+. Wave 5 boss... kill with Lancebreaker Severa. Watch out for the minibosses - you'll see two of the w4 boss, two of the w3 boss, and the w2 boss again.

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Been a while since I did an Apotheosis run, but IIRC...

- You want capped units with limit break
-You want rallybots
-You want rescue and physic on your staff bots
-You want forged brave weapons and high % Proc skills on your attackers
-You want as much galeforce as possible (breed your future children accordingly)
-You want sages and valkyries on staffbot duty; the former for their movement and the latter for their magic cap granting maximum range on physic and rescue
-You want your offensive magic units to be in the sorcerer class, due to dark magic giving you a forgable tome that double-hits with the brave weapon effectf. (Waste or Ruin--I don't remember what its called. Basically u want everything thats going to be playing an offensive role to high % proc and have extra hits to activate their procs) 

 ~breaker and ~faire skills are ideal for filling out skill sets

On 9/25/2018 at 11:28 PM, Landmaster said:

You want to use your best Children Units because they are the best stat-wise.

 

Yes.

 

On 10/3/2018 at 2:20 AM, soly said:

our basic strategy in Apotheosis is massive player phase offense. 

Yes
 

On 10/3/2018 at 2:20 AM, soly said:

use your Rescue Bots to drag your units out of combat range

Yes

On 9/20/2018 at 2:50 PM, LunaLili said:

Who make the best rally bots

Female Avatar with rally heart and rally spectrum, in addition to other rally skills (don't worry about giving her rally luck or skill. Rally speed is probably the most important one to grab, after spectrum and heart)

Female children of male avatar can do this too. But thats a waste of children--their higher stat caps and skill options make them the units you'd rather be fielding on offense (morgan in particular being the best unit in awakening, and having superior caps even to the rest of the future children if you make one of said children her parent).

You're not missing out on any frontline firepower by putting the avatar in a supporting bot role.    

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