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[FE5] Project Exile - Thracia 776 Script and Menu Translation - FULLY COMPLETE AND RELEASED!

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On 6/6/2019 at 7:39 AM, Gocciole said:

I'm sure you have had a ton of input from different people but I'd say the average person who's interested in playing an obscure SNES SRPG from the late 90s would vastly prefer a "simple translation" as you put it,to a localization that takes a ton of creative liberties in order to make the game more accessible and more in tune with modern video games.

Source this.

On 6/6/2019 at 7:39 AM, Gocciole said:

Overall I think there's just a big disconnect in what this project wants to do and what a lot of players wanted it to be.

And this.

You are one person, not a group.  If you consist of multiple entities, do let me know, because it means that some dimension or other has lost their villain, and I will need to let Starfleet know.

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Well, I just recruited Xavier. It only took the help and emotional support of two friends, a warp staff, two fortify charges, Lara's life, two hours of mine, the deaths of three of Xavier's adjuntants, copious abuse of the emulator's rewind feature, and a small brain hemorrhage. Oh, and I now despise all people named Charles with a passion. My apologies if anybody in the team's called that.

I think the time has come to give you my thoughts on the patch. It might get a bit long, so please bear with me.

So, Project Exile! Thus far, I really like the patch. The dialogue's quality is inmense. I read the old LP of Thracia at the LP archive years ago, and although I can't remember it too well, from what I can recall, the difference is like night and day. The liberties taken to give the text some much needed favor are much appreciated. The bossmen now have a semblance of a personality! It's not just Paulus anymore! All they need now is to not have the Largoface.

The biggest improvements, to me, are the villager dialogue and Raydric. I'd say some of the villagers even surpass some official FE villagers! Far too often in FE do villagers just go "hello heroes of the videogaym take this item, thanks for being the heroes of the videogaym I hope this item you've taken serves you well, cheers!". You made an effort to prevent that, and for that I thank you. As for Raydric, the new translation gives him this child-like, smug, slimy personality that fit the whole Eyvel situation like a glove. By the time I left Manster, I hated the man with a passion, and wanted nothing more than to bring him down, even though I knew what was going to happen. Another highlight for me is Kempf. I love how sarcastic he is in the new translation. It helps differentiate him from the very similar Lentzenheimer from TearRing Saga, who was like a completely unhinged, more plot-relevant Kempf. Thanks to Project Exile, they now feel like different characters, as opposed to Lentzenheimer and Lentzenheimer 0.5. Now they're Lentzenheimer and "it's a big word adults usually learn after they're able to read".

I have to say, though, Veld's... still not good. He still feels like a generic bossman when he's randomly having a chat with Manfroy, Julius and Ishtar in the middle of map 4, he still feels like a generic bossman when Eyvel's petrified even though it's HIM that petrifies her (heck, I'd argue he stands out even less now, since Raydric was improved so much), and taking a quick look at his endgame dialogue, he once again feels like nothing more than a generic bossman when Manfroy gives him an earful right before Veld is the final boss of the game. Even when he's the one giving an earful to Raydric, he STILL feels kinda like a generic bossman! A bit less than every other time he appears, but still. How does he do it?

I understand that Veld may be beyond saving (and that it may be intentional, given the overall small-scale, personal feeling of Leif's tale), but seeing how much you improved Raydric and everybody else, Veld's a bit of a letdown. Not that I can think of any way to make him better, mind, but I don't know. Guess I expected a bit more, after seeing that "pitfighters, meet Eyvel. Eyvel, pitfighters. Let it never be said that I'm a poor host" line among the OP screenshots.

Now, don't get me wrong, I still love the story and the dialogue very much. Veld's just a small stain in the face of a great story.

About the name changes, I'm fine with them for the most part. Lot of them I'm neutral about, some I like (Seram never made any sense, Schroff fits the guy way better I feel, Bhuj is actually a thing). There are a couple that I admit I'm not too crazy about, like Conote > Connaught. I get that it's an actual thing, but it required moving the place in the world map, and that's pushing the limit a bit, the way I see it. I also don't like Pan too much, although that's more of a personal issue ("Pan" in Spanish means bread. I'm from Spain. See where I'm going? Also, I can't help but think of Peter Pan). Still, these are but pet peeves in the face of all the awesome changes - not the least of which was an actually readable menu, the long-lasting problem that kept me from trying Thracia out for all these years until now.

Lastly, I wish to address the hints. Y'know, the things that sparked pages upon pages of discussion? Personally, I don't mind them. Keep in mind, I went in semi-blind: I knew the more infamous things, like Xavier or Ilios's recruitments, from all my years of being a FE fan, but I never knew any maps by memory or anything like that.

Let me tell you, none of the subtle hints that were added prevented Dagdar's tragic death at the hands of Tahra's Asshole Sorcerer Reinforcement Squad. I wish they did. I also wish I could've reset his death, but Asbel had gotten a move level up and Hicks had solo'ed half the map and Paulus, so I just couldn't do anything but press on. Rest in peace, man. I'll make sure to save the person that changed you for the better, at least.

The scroll growths are a bit of a stretch, I'll admit, an actual localization wouldn't have shown them so bluntly, but it's handy to not have to go to google for them. And I haven't gotten there yet, but I don't think the 24x hint would impact anything that badly. The escaping hint is good. The fact that such an absurd mistranslation as the original's "ah, just make him escape, everyone will follow suit! Totally!" slipped by everybody in charge is marvelous, in a way. Then again, Murder Hollace and In America. What do I know, right. You guys should've kept In America, it was, like, half of Kempf's personality.

One hint in particular that I want to elaborate on is

Spoiler

Xavier's adjutants and their respective hostages being given unique names with matching first letters.

Because this one actively improved my experience. See, I was playing with two of my friends watching (and laughing, a lot of the time). They're fellow FE fans, although not since too long ago (I may or may not've gradually set up their introduction to the series over the years), and they wanted to see for themselves just how ridiculous recruiting Xavier is. When one of them figured this out, we put it to the test, and he turned out to be right, it was absolutely magical. Not to mention, I had a name to scream in anguish when the damned bastards moved in ways I didn't want them to. Why, yes, it was Charles that killed Lara. She dodged him, and then he got a movement star. Prick... Maybe it's not exaaaaaaactly what Kaga intended, but when Kaga intended the destruction of the human race, I think we can safely ignore him to an extent. Still love you, man, you made Berwick Saga and I cannot thank you enough for it, but it had to be said.

So, in conclusion, amazing patch. I finally got to check out this awesome game for myself, and the patch's excellent quality only improved my experience. My highest regards to the whole team, and I hope that you keep up the good work!

 

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I'm really glad to hear you and you friends had such a good experience! Don't worry, we hate Charles too. He has formerly-Eichmann's portrait, so he's definitely a jerk.

 

    On 6/7/2019 at 2:36 PM, Ertrick36 said:

    (Big, encouraging post. Thank you!)

[Click and drag to move]

Oh no, I do know we've been getting a super good reception. What I meant when I said that FE fans don't want these sorts of projects anymore, I meant projects like Shaya's, acting like quick bandaids for a dry, general idea of what the game was about.

But then with the FE12, FE14, FE4, TRS and BWS translations really amping the value, the community kinda righfully expects bigger and better stuff, these days.

Edited by Miacis

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1 hour ago, Saint Rubenio said:

Well, I just recruited Xavier. It only took the help and emotional support of two friends, a warp staff, two fortify charges, Lara's life, two hours of mine, the deaths of three of Xavier's adjuntants, copious abuse of the emulator's rewind feature, and a small brain hemorrhage.

Ah, once I figure out how to get the deployment add-on to work (it just freezes the game as is), I'll be attempt The Xavier as well. 

And why would you need Warp for the job? I've got over 20 uses of Sleep Edge ready for to put to the task (took a little savestating to get them, somehow Linoan kept missing with the Sleep Staff). Despite Sleep making it impossible for you to Talk to people, NPCs can apparently still do so.

I think the Sleep Edge strat is:

  1. Give the Sleep Edge to someone who can't ORKO (and hope they don't crit) the Armors
  2. Bait and Sleep Edge a couple of them without being stuck surrounded by them,
  3. Step your Sleeper back a one or two spaces.
  4. Their awake comrades move forward and attack, you counter them with Sleep again.
  5. Repeat with more steps back until they're all snoozing and the Friege armors are dead/captured.
  6. Then allow the civvies their time to without fear of injury persuade their respective languid Leonster lovelies.
  7. Have Leif tell Xavier his peons didn't meet the Grim Hammer and were just nicked with tranquilizers.

Chapter 18 looks like it's easy beyond a little chest & thief rushing (armed with more delicious Killing Edges- can I say Chapter 15 was divine taken slowly when I was down to four Iron Swords at most beforehand?), the only real challenge it looks like is Xavier and the Member Card (which is useless if you don't have funds, you probably don't). Xavier is even positioned perfectly in the middle of this map, he is its axis, its navel, it's Mt. Meru. 

 

And as I pointed out in the Discord, there is a use of the phrase "get lucky" in Radiant Dawn, in reference to the notes of 8x:

Excerpted from the Brom-Heather recruitment convo:

Brom: Aw, heck, I hope I ain’t shoutin’ at a deaf girl… CAN YOU HEAR ME?!
Heather: …Knock it off, already. What do you want, you old hick?
Brom: …Oh, sorry ’bout that. They call me Brom, by the way… How ’bout you?
Heather: …Excuse me? Are you trying to get lucky or something? Give it up, you smelly pig farmer. There’s no way I’m having anything to do with you.
Brom: No, no! It’s nothin’ like that at all! I got myself a darlin’ wife and a whole passel of kids, and I love ’em ta death.

Brom's followup line indicates he knows exactly what Heather means. *Starts playing an FE remix of that Pharell(?) song with the same name*

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9 hours ago, Interdimensional Observer said:

sleep strat

Ahah... y-yeah... about that...

I didn't have any sleep swords, so I had to clumsily maneuver around the northwestern corner of the map to get them to move to places where the NPCs could reach them. A favor they did me about 10% of the time. Fucking Charles... and it wasn't just him, I had to rescue an unarmed Hicks and warp in an armed Misha once so Nicholas would stop blocking the hallway.

Ah, but it was still lots of fun. Mainly because I had my pals there to laugh it off with. Jesus Christ, though, that was ridiculous. Didn't even get the member card, those annoying Leonster lancers captured a couple of the NPCs.

Besides, I got Green Douglas. No regrets. That man is going to go to the endgame, no questions asked.

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12 hours ago, Interdimensional Observer said:

And why would you need Warp for the job? I've got over 20 uses of Sleep Edge ready for to put to the task (took a little savestating to get them, somehow Linoan kept missing with the Sleep Staff). Despite Sleep making it impossible for you to Talk to people, NPCs can apparently still do so.

 I think the Sleep Edge strat is:

  1. Give the Sleep Edge to someone who can't ORKO (and hope they don't crit) the Armors
  2. Bait and Sleep Edge a couple of them without being stuck surrounded by them,
  3. Step your Sleeper back a one or two spaces.
  4. Their awake comrades move forward and attack, you counter them with Sleep again.
  5. Repeat with more steps back until they're all snoozing and the Friege armors are dead/captured.
  6. Then allow the civvies their time to without fear of injury persuade their respective languid Leonster lovelies.
  7. Have Leif tell Xavier his peons didn't meet the Grim Hammer and were just nicked with tranquilizers.

It's amazing to think that the strat requires a (maybe) unintended bug.

Kaga dammit. 😛

Also, Bolting can be used to take out the Freige armours before they come out, but that's only useful if you have the boltings to spare.

12 hours ago, Interdimensional Observer said:

Excerpted from the Brom-Heather recruitment convo:

Brom: Aw, heck, I hope I ain’t shoutin’ at a deaf girl… CAN YOU HEAR ME?!
Heather: …Knock it off, already. What do you want, you old hick?
Brom: …Oh, sorry ’bout that. They call me Brom, by the way… How ’bout you?
Heather: …Excuse me? Are you trying to get lucky or something? Give it up, you smelly pig farmer. There’s no way I’m having anything to do with you.
Brom: No, no! It’s nothin’ like that at all! I got myself a darlin’ wife and a whole passel of kids, and I love ’em ta death.

 Brom's followup line indicates he knows exactly what Heather means. *Starts playing an FE remix of that Pharell(?) song with the same name*

Daft Punk and Pharell.

(Also, Brom can recruit her? That'll be helpful if I need to in that chapter.

2 hours ago, Saint Rubenio said:

Besides, I got Green Douglas. No regrets. That man is going to go to the endgame, no questions asked.

At least you have an indoor lance user now.

Who starts on E Rank.

FFFFFFFFUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUU-

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5 hours ago, Saint Rubenio said:

Besides, I got Green Douglas. No regrets. That man is going to go to the endgame, no questions asked.

He looks like he has good growths at least. 40 Str, 45 Mag, 55 Skl, 50 Spd, 70 Lck. Stacking Scrolls on him should get him to 115 Spd growth. Looks like he'd be a good candidate for Wrath if you still have it, since he has 0 Pursuit Critical Coefficient.

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1 minute ago, Interdimensional Observer said:

He looks like he has good growths at least. 40 Str, 45 Mag, 55 Skl, 50 Spd, 70 Lck. Stacking Scrolls on him should get him to 115 Spd growth. Looks like he'd be a good candidate for Wrath if you still have it, since he has 0 Pursuit Critical Coefficient.

Actually, he comes with Wrath, alongside Accost and the unique to him Pavise. His skillset is just all sorts of great. I even gave him Paragon to compensate for his high level and iffy availability. Kill me if you want. I can't do much to fight off the power of bias.

3 hours ago, Dayni said:

At least you have an indoor lance user now.

Who starts on E Rank.

FFFFFFFFUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUU-

He has A axes, and all my other axe users are dead (except for Halvan and Ralph, but Ralph's only got C and Halvan, well...). I don't think he's going to be using lances too much.

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Just now, Saint Rubenio said:

Actually, he comes with Wrath, alongside Accost and the unique to him Pavise. His skillset is just all sorts of great. I even gave him Paragon to compensate for his high level and iffy availability. Kill me if you want. I can't do much to fight off the power of bias.

I forgot that somehow. If they just polished up his Spd a little, lowered the recruitment pains, and decided to curtail the excessive enemy Hammers or gave him and Dalsin the option to strip down just as mounties can dismount, then he'd be considered a really good unit I think.

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50 minutes ago, Interdimensional Observer said:

I forgot that somehow. If they just polished up his Spd a little, lowered the recruitment pains, and decided to curtail the excessive enemy Hammers or gave him and Dalsin the option to strip down just as mounties can dismount, then he'd be considered a really good unit I think.

I thought he already was considered good. I'm pretty sure the general consensus is that, while he does have some flaws, he's the best bow user in the game for as long as he exists, and one of the best Generals in the series. Heck, even if you can't stand the amount of hammers, he works as filler, as you can't really go wrong with a unit that brings a leadership star to the table. He also has the Leif Support™ and swords to help him alleviate the hammer problem somewhat.

Edited by Saint Rubenio

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Thanks so much for this wonderful patch that will let many really experience Thracia for the first time including myself. I played through the game with the old patch but now will get the story, character and all that. 

Fan translations are the most generous and greatest contributions one can make and a simple thank you isn't enough. Just know that it will bring joy to countless people, hours of fun that would otherwise never be experienced.

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19 hours ago, Miacis said:

Oh no, I do know we've been getting a super good reception. What I meant when I said that FE fans don't want these sorts of projects anymore, I meant projects like Shaya's, acting like quick bandaids for a dry, general idea of what the game was about.

Oh, okay, good.  I had a sneaking suspicion that you were referring to that patch instead, but given some of the recent debating, I wasn't too sure.

Yeah, people evidently do expect more from hacks and projects than what Shaya's patch did.  With how every other Japan-only FE game has a translation patch now, I suppose it's to be expected.

20 hours ago, Saint Rubenio said:

I have to say, though, Veld's... still not good. He still feels like a generic bossman when he's randomly having a chat with Manfroy, Julius and Ishtar in the middle of map 4, he still feels like a generic bossman when Eyvel's petrified even though it's HIM that petrifies her (heck, I'd argue he stands out even less now, since Raydric was improved so much), and taking a quick look at his endgame dialogue, he once again feels like nothing more than a generic bossman when Manfroy gives him an earful right before Veld is the final boss of the game. Even when he's the one giving an earful to Raydric, he STILL feels kinda like a generic bossman! A bit less than every other time he appears, but still. How does he do it?

It's a bit difficult due to his situation.  He's sorta a less powerful Manfroy whose only personal slight against you was turning Eyvel to stone (which was more a response to Raydric's failure to contain the imprisoned forces than anything), and that slight was able to be rectified.  Anything else he has done was mere behind-the-scenes manipulation - and subtle manipulation, at that.

Spoiler

And in regards to his manipulation of Travant, it was still Travant himself that killed Quan and Ethlyn; Veld just gave him an easier way to do that.  He never really seems to just do things himself.

Raydric, meanwhile, manages to be his own sort of thing despite just being mostly a power-hungry dictator.  He has a more interesting and overt involvement with the politics in the Thracian peninsula and personally slights you in a number of ways.  I mean, the entire Manster arc is build-up for you to hate that Ray-dick so that when you come back around to his house, knocking him down would feel so much more satisfying even in spite of the fact that he's just not as difficult to fight as the terrors that are Kempf's dastardly rival and angery violent dad.

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Why on Earth would you deliberately change and alter dialogue like you have? Why would you remove and add things at will?

I guess I'll continue to not play Thracia until it's remade or until I learn Japanese. What a letdown.

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1 hour ago, De Geso said:

Why on Earth would you deliberately change and alter dialogue like you have? Why would you remove and add things at will?

I guess I'll continue to not play Thracia until it's remade or until I learn Japanese. What a letdown.

Ah yes, keep the dialogue that is misleading and lies to the player.

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2 hours ago, De Geso said:

Why on Earth would you deliberately change and alter dialogue like you have? Why would you remove and add things at will?

I guess I'll continue to not play Thracia until it's remade or until I learn Japanese. What a letdown.

Any Japanese-English translation worth its salt takes creative liberties, else you get stiff dialogue at best and gobbledygook like "Murder Hollace" or "All your base are belong to us" at worst. Take it from someone trying to teach himself Japanese, Japanese and English are fundamentally different languages - their alphabets work differently, their sentence structures are different, Japanese pronunciation rules are more rigid, the list goes on. Whether you realise it or not, you're effectively complaining that this patch isn't Google Translated.

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2 hours ago, De Geso said:

Why on Earth would you deliberately change and alter dialogue like you have? Why would you remove and add things at will?

I guess I'll continue to not play Thracia until it's remade or until I learn Japanese. What a letdown.

You do know if/when they remake it, it will get the Echoes treatment and have completely revamped dialogue, possibly additional characters added, as well as bonus maps added right?

There is no such thing as a 1:1 translation. Not one that's good because things don't translate 1:1 between languages. Particularly in a game like this where they flat out screwed up one of the lines of dialogue and tell you that everyone else auto-retreats with Leif. 

Time to get over that idea. Its never going to happen. Even if/when Project Naga finishes Tharcia they will have altered dialogue as well. 

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2 hours ago, ThroningErmine8 said:

Any Japanese-English translation worth its salt takes creative liberties, else you get stiff dialogue at best and gobbledygook like "Murder Hollace" or "All your base are belong to us" at worst. Take it from someone trying to teach himself Japanese, Japanese and English are fundamentally different languages - their alphabets work differently, their sentence structures are different, Japanese pronunciation rules are more rigid, the list goes on. Whether you realise it or not, you're effectively complaining that this patch isn't Google Translated.

そうね。デゲソさんはたぶん決して日本語を勉強しませんと思います。その人は決して嬉しくないだよ。

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26 minutes ago, Kysafen said:

そうね。デゲソさんはたぶん決して日本語を勉強しませんと思います。その人は決して嬉しくないだよ。

No, he probably won't. And ありがとう for the unexpected reading opportunity. Still very much a beginner, but just learning the kana and some basic phrases means I've probably already probably learnt more than De Geso ever will.

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11 hours ago, De Geso said:

Why on Earth would you deliberately change and alter dialogue like you have? Why would you remove and add things at will?

I guess I'll continue to not play Thracia until it's remade or until I learn Japanese. What a letdown.

Hello. All the translated Japanese media worth its salt and that you're likely to have enjoyed happens to have followed a similar process. You just didn't know because nobody left you a nice honest pile of translation notes until we did.

Moreover, let me posit that it's doubtful you'd have enjoyed these media nearly as much if it weren't for those changes.

What you do now with that newfound knowledge is up to you.

Edited by Miacis

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22 hours ago, Syndixel said:

Ah yes, keep the dialogue that is misleading and lies to the player.

Ah yes, you are better than the original writers and authorial intent doesn't matter.

21 hours ago, ThroningErmine8 said:

Any Japanese-English translation worth its salt takes creative liberties, else you get stiff dialogue at best and gobbledygook like "Murder Hollace" or "All your base are belong to us" at worst. Take it from someone trying to teach himself Japanese, Japanese and English are fundamentally different languages - their alphabets work differently, their sentence structures are different, Japanese pronunciation rules are more rigid, the list goes on. Whether you realise it or not, you're effectively complaining that this patch isn't Google Translated.

Creative liberties are different from outright removal of dialogue because the translator didn't like it, or adding in Phoenix Wright-tier changes because honorifics are confusing. I'm not expecting a perfect and rigid 1:1 translation, but I am expecting things not to be added and removed at the translator's will because he thinks himself a better writer than the Japanese who wrote it. Yes, I know Japanese is very different language with different roots than English, and it's fine to consider that when translating - but "I live down the street from this business so that means everyone in the world would be confused by Safy's name" is a silly change to make.

12 hours ago, Miacis said:

Hello. All the translated Japanese media worth its salt and that you're likely to have enjoyed happens to have followed a similar process. You just didn't know because nobody left you a nice honest pile of translation notes until we did.

Moreover, let me posit that it's doubtful you'd have enjoyed these media nearly as much if it weren't for those changes.

What you do now with that newfound knowledge is up to you.

You are wrong about what I have and have not enjoyed, but that is okay. This is a common argument I hear when I speak about bad localization changes, that in the past the things I have enjoyed went through a similar process...but they haven't considered that I (and I can't speak for others who share my view) go through some efforts to ensure the accuracy and veracity of the translated works I indulge in. For a simple example, Dragonball's localization is wildly different from the original in a number of ways, principally the decision to write Son Goku as an altruistic hero rather than his actual character. The dub is, thus, worse, as is the official manga translation and some subs (though it depends on the group). When I was a child and didn't know any better, yes, I did like Dragonball for what it was (or what I thought it was), but as I grew older and came to understand that the story was altered, I distanced myself from it. The original intent is, of course, much better than the localized versions.

I'm not advocating for a 1:1 translation, as I said, but removal and alteration of things because the translator "felt like it" is poor practice and frankly embarrassing to read about. I thank the translation team for their transparency, but I can't help but admonish them for doing the same things for which Treehouse was lambasted years ago.

Also: the comments about my never learning Japanese are falsehoods, but if that makes you feel better you are welcome to continue believing such things.

Edited by De Geso

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You acting like things were changed arbitrarily in the patch only shows you didn't fuckin' read shit about what was changed. Everything that had a change had a reason - and everything that was changed was exceptionally mild at best.

 

You're pissing and moaning that generic bandit bosses say more than "UGHH I AM KILL" when they die. I understand respecting authorial intent, but small embellishments on dialogue like that is not disrespecting that.

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1 hour ago, De Geso said:

Yes, I know Japanese is very different language with different roots than English, and it's fine to consider that when translating - but "I live down the street from this business so that means everyone in the world would be confused by Safy's name" is a silly change to make.

i really don't know why you're latching onto this because サフィ maps to literally nothing of note in English (beside Notable Moroccan Port Town, Safi), so by that metric the name you're already using, Safy, is a creative liberty, since there's no reason to not use Safi, and neither of them are symbolic of anything or mean anything at all

 

EDIT: hey, actually, i was slightly wrong - Safi is an arabic given name in its masculine form, with the feminine form Safiya, which is what the translators used, nice

Edited by Integrity

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12 minutes ago, Integrity said:

i really don't know why you're latching onto this because サフィ maps to literally nothing of note in English (beside Notable Moroccan Port Town, Safi), so by that metric the name you're already using, Safy, is a creative liberty, since there's no reason to not use Safi, and neither of them are symbolic of anything or mean anything at all

 

EDIT: hey, actually, i was slightly wrong - Safi is an arabic given name in its masculine form, with the feminine form Safiya, which is what the translators used, nice

"Latching" is a strong word, I just mentioned it. But you're right, there's no reason not to use Safi. Why Safiya, then? Because the translation team liked it better?

18 minutes ago, CappnRob said:

You acting like things were changed arbitrarily in the patch only shows you didn't fuckin' read shit about what was changed. Everything that had a change had a reason - and everything that was changed was exceptionally mild at best.

 

You're pissing and moaning that generic bandit bosses say more than "UGHH I AM KILL" when they die. I understand respecting authorial intent, but small embellishments on dialogue like that is not disrespecting that.

"Westerners don't understand Shintoism so I made the dialogue about free will instead because Westerners like free will."

"I thought this guy's dialogue was plain, but what I wrote is better because I said it is better."

"Honorifics are scary, so instead I came up with nicknames."

The only change that is arguable is the last one because some Westerners really are so dim as to misunderstand terms of endearment and nicknames are an easy way to circumvent that. I also never said that the changes were arbitrary - my disliking them is mostly because of the intent of the translator's intent rather than the apparent lack of one.

Your definition of "mild changes" and mine may not be the same - if you like this "localization," then more power to you. I was personally greatly looking forward to it but it's a letdown that such changes were made. As I said, I suppose I will have to continue studying Japanese and do so more intently. I unfortunately have the habit of using romanized Japanese rather than the proper characters because I am surrounded by spoken Japanese at work and I have to speak it occasionally, but it is a hurdle I will need to overcome.

But anyway, this isn't my blog. My point is, I am not a fan of localization changes to any degree unless they are absolutely necessary - if you're translating a book about courtly nobility in Japan, it's important to signify in the text (ideally in a seamless manner) that something someone just said was rude if that statement wouldn't come across as rude in English. However, it isn't necessary to change the dialogue so that the spoken words themselves are more obviously rude - Japanese is a language of subtlety, after all, and to make such a change is to use your own interpretation rather than the author's choice of words.

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11 minutes ago, De Geso said:

"Latching" is a strong word, I just mentioned it. But you're right, there's no reason not to use Safi. Why Safiya, then? Because the translation team liked it better?

because it's literally the feminine form of safi, which is what her name transliterates to. this is not a difficult concept.

 

EDIT:

11 minutes ago, De Geso said:

The only change that is arguable is the last one because some Westerners really are so dim as to misunderstand terms of endearment and nicknames are an easy way to circumvent that.

i'm trying to stay in my lane and not be the admin sitting in the thread and flinging shit around but holy shit, do you really think that the reason people localize away honorifics is because we're too stupid to understand them? lmao

Edited by Integrity

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9 minutes ago, Integrity said:

because it's literally the feminine form of safi, which is what her name transliterates to. this is not a difficult concept.

 

EDIT:

i'm trying to stay in my lane and not be the admin sitting in the thread and flinging shit around but holy shit, do you really think that the reason people localize away honorifics is because we're too stupid to understand them? lmao

I don't recall Safi being an Arab. I get that the translator found out that Safiya was actually a feminine Arabic name after making the change he already had made, and that's great and dandy, but Safy/Safi is not an Arab so her name being masculine in Arabic means nothing in the context of Thracia 776, which is not set anywhere that Arabic is anyone's first language. There are other examples (though none spring to mind as I write this) of names being masculine in one tongue and feminine in the next.

And no, you misunderstood me - I was saying that instead of using terms of endearment (the better alternative), nicknames are appropriate rather than keeping honorifics around. Of course, the original point of that was to show that not all of the changes were made for the sake of embellishment, both good and bad ones. Please pay attention to the context of what people are saying and think critically rather than taking things at their face value.

Edited by De Geso

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