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Book III Opens: December 2018 (Speculation + Discussion)

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On 3/24/2019 at 6:28 AM, Mercakete said:

Yeah, they go back to Bruno's quest every once in a while. They did talk about the Embla issue before, but slowly, they're shedding more and more light on it (not that we didn't already know about Veronica's dark god-cursed blood possessing her.) As I said in the Tempest Trials thread, the script content is serious, but everyone's in bunny suits, and even the music on Veronica's map is silly. The clash just makes me laugh since it's serious but hard to take seriously with all that other stuff going on.

The main thing that was revealed in the Tempest Trials thing was that Embla (the dragon) wants to kill Askr (the dragon.) True, this is my conjecture based on possessed Veronica being all "Must kill Askr" again and again, but given her situation, that really seems to be what's going on. We'll probably see more on this (as in, main story focus) in either book 4 or 5. I'm kind of excited since I've been waiting to see these four dragons. Can't wait to see their designs!

Yeah, it's nice that Embla is more or less established at this point of being the dark god behind the blood curse (as they were kind of ambiguous about it in earlier Books).

Edit: You know, after going through that entire Twitter section, it's too bad there wasn't any preview on Lif. I would have loved to know what special talents he had, if Thrasir was capable of razing realms.

Edited by Sentinel07

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Gotta say, I think that was one of the better chapters in the game. Pretty heavy in terms of what happened.

Man....Eir's backstory is depressing as heck. And Alfonse taking it to Hel like that was nice, and Lif will likely get some big focus in the next chapter.

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Interesting, since I found this one to be kind of disappointing... I mean, it sure seems like Eir's dad is the life/light dragon Valhalla (opposing Hel), hence the numerous lives, but otherwise, Hel's acting less like an interesting take on someone with a legitimate mental disorder, and more like (as much as I hate to say it) a Surtr clone... I hope the game proves me wrong.

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There was an interesting premise then ...we're off to another land for some side adventures. Feels like some serious padding is coming up.

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3 minutes ago, Jingle Jangle said:

Wow Eir has a hilariously abusive past I didn't expect. Also we are back to Alfonse having 9 days left to live.

We don't actually, right? Hell recalled her curse in order to give Alfonse something worse, or because his words frightened her. 

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1 minute ago, Etrurian emperor said:

We don't actually, right? Hell recalled her curse in order to give Alfonse something worse, or because his words frightened her. 

 

Quote

Very well. I can withhold my death curse That fate is too easy  for you...

Oh I see. Here I thought we were going through the same plot again. 

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6 hours ago, Mercakete said:

Interesting, since I found this one to be kind of disappointing... I mean, it sure seems like Eir's dad is the life/light dragon Valhalla (opposing Hel), hence the numerous lives, but otherwise, Hel's acting less like an interesting take on someone with a legitimate mental disorder, and more like (as much as I hate to say it) a Surtr clone... I hope the game proves me wrong.

I feel like Hel is already better than surtr. Because unlike him, She's actually doing her f*cking job in terms of being a proper force of nature villain. Like already we'd have had significant development for not only alfonse but also Gustav and Eir which is all due to Hel and the threat she presents. Which is more than what could be said of book II.

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Can anyone else already see the twist coming from miles away that Hel isn't Eir's actual mother? The mother who smiled so kindly at Eir was probably a different person altogether at a time Eir was too young to fully realize Hel came in and pulled a Sonia. 

Also if his battle quotes are anything to go by then Lif may be working to bring down Hel from the inside. 

''I must be ruthless'' and ''I'll get what i want'' don't seem the words of a puppet.  

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2 minutes ago, Etrurian emperor said:

Also if his battle quotes are anything to go by then Lif may be working to bring down Hel from the inside. 

''I must be ruthless'' and ''I'll get what i want'' don't seem the words of a puppet.  

I could see that happening. Gustav did say that Hel's death cursed has plagued askrian kings for generations and he was the first king of askr so the curse that took the lives of so many kings started with him. It's gonna be interesting to see where they go with this

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9 minutes ago, Etrurian emperor said:

Can anyone else already see the twist coming from miles away that Hel isn't Eir's actual mother? The mother who smiled so kindly at Eir was probably a different person altogether at a time Eir was too young to fully realize Hel came in and pulled a Sonia. 

It will take Alfonse pointing out to Eir that Hel can't smile without a jaw.

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4 hours ago, Etrurian emperor said:

Can anyone else already see the twist coming from miles away that Hel isn't Eir's actual mother? The mother who smiled so kindly at Eir was probably a different person altogether at a time Eir was too young to fully realize Hel came in and pulled a Sonia. 

Also if his battle quotes are anything to go by then Lif may be working to bring down Hel from the inside. 

''I must be ruthless'' and ''I'll get what i want'' don't seem the words of a puppet.  

That all sounds pretty likely. Explains Eir's different appearance compared to Hel. I really hope we get to see whatever this dragon was that Eir came from.

On the topic of Lif, I hope he has some special power of his own. If Thrasir was strong enough to raze entire realms, Lif better have something cool too.

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So Eir got Gunnthrá'd many times already. I hope she does not get Gunnthrá'd permanently.

Hel is going to have... uh... hell to pay. I cannot wait until the final map comes out so I can shove Thunder's Fist and Sword so violently and morbidly into Hel that she wish she were dead.

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So, Chapter 7 doesn't really move things too far, though there are some nice moments.

Veronica is getting involved, we see an alternate Askr where everyone has already been killed (complete with a new music piece I believe), and we see a little more of Lif.

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Yeah, I know! There's a bit of worldbuilding and background/character reveal here. Hel was taking over Askr at least 3 times, including her current encroachment: when Lif was king, when Gustav was a young king, and during current story events. The first time, it can be assumed (given what details have been given to us) that Lif made a pact with the dragon Askr, pushed Hel's forces out with the newfound power, and then founded the country of Askr. I don't know what caused Hel's next known encroachment, exactly, though I do have some guesses. But the important thing is that Gustav's solution was to erect a temporary, magical barrier around the portal to Hel (which the Emblan royalty at the time refused to close.) (Honestly, this time, all Veronica has to do is close the way to Hel...unless undead Lif/Gustav/any other Askran royals still have the ability to open portals.)

Given the history, it's not much of a stretch to figure that where the Order is now was once a part of Askr, rather than another version of it. This could be the bit of Askr that Hel managed to conquer before she was pushed back, and so managed to further her borders into Askr's territory. Especially given Lif's implied behavior at the end (flowers and all) it could be that this is the place in Hel's realm that he came to live in, mourning the Askrans who had been under his protection but died. Given Eir's memory problems (which is getting to be a bit overdone as a plot device, honestly, not that it isn't realistic given what she went through, dying 1000 times or whatever it was) it could be that her reaction to Alfonse and Sharena comes from a memory of being treated well by Lif (and potentially Thrasir) when she first met them, either before or after the founding of their countries. It'd also explain part of the opening movie where Eir's in a field of flowers remembering Alfonse and Sharena before the landscape turns terrible and dead. She has an inkling of a memory of talking with Lif in this chapter, to which Lif responds that it's better to forget, perhaps partially out of his own pain, and out of a desire to protect the mind of his friend from his living days from trauma.

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I think the Sharena who died in the trailer is the Sharena of that alternate Askr because Sharena mentioned that the flowers in the bouquet are her favorites flowers.  Alternate Sharena probably died there.

"Lif" is probably alternate Alfonse (or more like Alfonse Alter)  since it's implied he is the one who lays the flowers and that he "isn't that bad of a guy" and we don't see Alfonse dying in the trailer. "Thrasir" is probably Veronica Alter. It wouldn't be the first time we have a character using his ancestor's name. IS did this already in Awakening with Lucina/Masked Marth.

I wouldn't be surprised if Eir betrayed the alternate Order of Heroes and helped Hel to kill people from this alternate Askr.

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1 hour ago, Thunderstar said:

I think the Sharena who died in the trailer is the Sharena of that alternate Askr because Sharena mentioned that the flowers in the bouquet are her favorites flowers.  Alternate Sharena probably died there.

"Lif" is probably alternate Alfonse (or more like Alfonse Alter)  since it's implied he is the one who lays the flowers and that he "isn't that bad of a guy" and we don't see Alfonse dying in the trailer. "Thrasir" is probably Veronica Alter. It wouldn't be the first time we have a character using his ancestor's name. IS did this already in Awakening with Lucina/Masked Marth.

I wouldn't be surprised if Eir betrayed the alternate Order of Heroes and helped Hel to kill people from this alternate Askr.

Good theory!

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2 hours ago, Thunderstar said:

I think the Sharena who died in the trailer is the Sharena of that alternate Askr because Sharena mentioned that the flowers in the bouquet are her favorites flowers.  Alternate Sharena probably died there.

"Lif" is probably alternate Alfonse (or more like Alfonse Alter)  since it's implied he is the one who lays the flowers and that he "isn't that bad of a guy" and we don't see Alfonse dying in the trailer. "Thrasir" is probably Veronica Alter. It wouldn't be the first time we have a character using his ancestor's name. IS did this already in Awakening with Lucina/Masked Marth.

I wouldn't be surprised if Eir betrayed the alternate Order of Heroes and helped Hel to kill people from this alternate Askr.

Yeah, that is pretty much how I felt at the end of this chapter.

The Lif in Hell isn't the first Askr King, which is why Alfonse said that he's missing something. They've been assuming he was. That is older Alfonse from another, destroyed Askr in which Sharena was killed. From there, it becomes easy to assume the same for Thrasir, especially now that it's made clear that Veronica will enter the realm of the dead as well, as she was shown doing so in the Book's trailer. 

The one thing I'm wondering about is Loki's role. 

Edited by Vince777

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36 minutes ago, Vince777 said:

The one thing I'm wondering about is Loki's role. 

My thoughts since the Adrift banner have been that Loki is trying to manipulate someone to kill Hel, possibly because she wants to usurp Hel or maybe because Hel is a threat to her in some way. Either way I would guess she becomes the true big bad for Book 4.

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Edgy Altfonse is alright as far as idea's go, but i'm not really sure I like the idea of AltSharena being dead. It feels a bit like a cop out when you so heavily tease a main character's death. I mean I knew it would't stick, but I thought they'd at least do it.

Does this mean that Alfonse was actually in the top 10 of most popular males during CYL3? Probably not.

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4 hours ago, Thunderstar said:

I think the Sharena who died in the trailer is the Sharena of that alternate Askr because Sharena mentioned that the flowers in the bouquet are her favorites flowers.  Alternate Sharena probably died there.

"Lif" is probably alternate Alfonse (or more like Alfonse Alter)  since it's implied he is the one who lays the flowers and that he "isn't that bad of a guy" and we don't see Alfonse dying in the trailer. "Thrasir" is probably Veronica Alter. It wouldn't be the first time we have a character using his ancestor's name. IS did this already in Awakening with Lucina/Masked Marth.

I wouldn't be surprised if Eir betrayed the alternate Order of Heroes and helped Hel to kill people from this alternate Askr.

Gotta say, that is interesting. Would certainly give a reason for Lif and Thrasir basically just looking like an older Alfonse and Veronica (outside of a designer laziness. :D ).

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So there seems to be more foreshadowing and build up before the scene that had been teased at the beginning of this book… With the implication that Alfonse’s sister (or an ancestor of hers) has already died once, and Veronica wanting to go down into the realm of Hel in order to end things once and for all… I predict that said scene from the trailer will happen soon…

 

Nice to get a bit more info on Lif, and insight into his personality… Also is pretty interesting, because it implies that Lif and Thrasir may have been fighting Hel, but died doing so (since Lif seems to be a fairly neutral character when he's not fighting under Hel’s command, and wouldn’t probably show any interest in mortals otherwise). And we've seen from Gustav’s situation that anyone killed by Hel is forced to become soldiers in her realm, regardless of who they were when alive… So the two ancestral rulers may not be serving Hel because of some crime they committed, but because they fought against her and had no choice… Not much is known about Thrasir at the moment, but this would certainly match up to what history remembers about Lif… It makes the entire situation very sad, though…

 

It also destroys my headcanon that Lif and Thrasir fell in love and got married to each other, and their union resulted in some grave sin, enough for the populace to see them as evil enough to be sent to Hel’s realm upon dying, and to erase both events from the history books… If Lif and Thrasir really had any positive connections to each other in life, she probably would've gone with him to the ruined realm… But perhaps more of a relationship that will be revealed eventually…

 

And Eir still feels like a cliché at this point… It's too bad she's a main character when the other two I mentioned above are not… There's just not that much about her that's interesting, or hasn't been done before…

I don't buy the idea of Lif and Thrasir being older versions of themselves in the present, though… Lif shows no reaction to anyone of the main cast other than wanting to fight them, and the same goes for Thrasir. In addition, a lot of what is known about Lif’s personality goes completely against Alfonse’s, and people forced to become soldiers of Hel seem to retain their original personalities upon death (illustrated by both Gustav and Surtr). Not to mention I don't think Alfonse and Veronica would've any reason to hide their names, especially since their ancestors would be remembered in the alternate realms. And, if Alfonse is anything like the one in the present, Hel would have no issues killing him out right and ending his reign early, as opposed to simply killing everything else when he was older.

Edited by wheelsonfire

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Interesting to see Veronica getting involved. I guess she realized Hel was as much a threat to Embla as it is to Askr/

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On 5/10/2019 at 5:35 AM, Thunderstar said:

I think the Sharena who died in the trailer is the Sharena of that alternate Askr because Sharena mentioned that the flowers in the bouquet are her favorites flowers.  Alternate Sharena probably died there.

"Lif" is probably alternate Alfonse (or more like Alfonse Alter)  since it's implied he is the one who lays the flowers and that he "isn't that bad of a guy" and we don't see Alfonse dying in the trailer. "Thrasir" is probably Veronica Alter. It wouldn't be the first time we have a character using his ancestor's name. IS did this already in Awakening with Lucina/Masked Marth.

I wouldn't be surprised if Eir betrayed the alternate Order of Heroes and helped Hel to kill people from this alternate Askr.

Welp, congratulations good sir. Your theory is right on the money! 😄

Well half of it at the very least. Thrasir is still up in the air but given what we know now, chances are it's probably the same.

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