Jump to content

Who is the worst unit, gameplay wise?


Who is the worst unit, gameplay wise?  

60 members have voted

  1. 1. Who is the worst unit? (I'm going to make a fight video with said characters)

    • Micaiah
      4
    • Edward
      1
    • Leonardo
      6
    • Nolan
      1
    • Laura
      2
    • Sothe
      1
    • Ilyana
      1
    • Aran
      2
    • Meg
      16
    • Volug
      1
    • Zihark
      0
    • Tauroneo
      1
    • Jill
      0
    • Fiona
      19
    • Tormod
      2
    • Muarim
      1
    • Vika
      3
    • Nailah
      0
    • Rafiel
      2
    • Elincia
      0
    • Marcia
      1
    • Leanne
      0
    • Nealuchi
      2
    • Haar
      1
    • Nephenee
      0
    • Brom
      2
    • Heather
      2
    • Lucia
      2
    • Mordecai
      2
    • Lethe
      2
    • Geoffrey
      1
    • Kieran
      1
    • Makalov
      1
    • Astrid
      2
    • Devdan
      1
    • Calill
      2
    • Ike
      1
    • Titania
      1
    • Oscar
      1
    • Boyd
      1
    • Rolf
      2
    • Shinon
      1
    • Soren
      1
    • Mist
      3
    • Gatrie
      1
    • Rhys
      1
    • Mia
      0
    • Ranulf
      1
    • Kyza
      4
    • Lyre
      36
    • Reyson
      0
    • Janaff
      2
    • Ulki
      2
    • Sigrun
      1
    • Tanith
      1
    • Naesala
      0
    • Skrimir
      1
    • Sanaki
      2
    • Tibarn
      0
    • Pelleas
      2
    • Stefan
      1
    • Oliver
      2
    • Bastian
      1
    • Volke
      1
    • Renning
      1
    • Caineghis
      0
    • Giffca
      0
    • Ena
      2
    • Kurthnaga
      1
    • Nasir
      1
    • Gareth
      4
    • Lehran
      3


Recommended Posts

8 hours ago, Shadow Mir said:

but I do have issue with your reasoning for not considering Lyre worst - I don't see how good Rend is as much of an argument in her favor

5x base strength is not something to ignore (if she gained 0 strength by level 30, you still have an 80 base power attack which is stupid), which more than what I can say for 3x calculated damage fiona gets (she still gets the raw end of the deal). Lyre also can actually get around in the maps she's allowed in. Doing damage, well that's a problem both of them share.

By not putting lyre as the worst I never said she was good. I'm saying fiona is worse.

 

I could even go into the lore about Fiona being the child of a four rider and still being hot garbage, but that's not relevant.

Edited by Chocolate Kitty
Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Replies 93
  • Created
  • Last Reply

Top Posters In This Topic

1 hour ago, Chocolate Kitty said:

5x base strength is not something to ignore (if she gained 0 strength by level 30, you still have an 80 base power attack which is stupid), which more than what I can say for 3x calculated damage fiona gets (she still gets the raw end of the deal). Lyre also can actually get around in the maps she's allowed in. Doing damage, well that's a problem both of them share.

By not putting lyre as the worst I never said she was good. I'm saying fiona is worse.

 

I could even go into the lore about Fiona being the child of a four rider and still being hot garbage, but that's not relevant.

Well, I do not see it as noteworthy when one, getting Lyre to that point WILL be arduous for various reasons (have fun working with someone who levels up at a snail's pace transformed, and dies easily untransformed! Which begs the question, how in the name of the Adephagos would you get Lyre to level 30?), and second, as @Jotari stated earlier, most units get busted as fuck mastery skills anyhow. I have no reason to give a damn about Rend when most other mastery skills instantly delete the poor sap on the bad end of them. And while you say that they both struggle to do damage, which is true to some extent, I would say Lyre loses out because of the status as a laguz (if a beorc struggles to deal damage, I can just give them a stronger weapon. What can I do to help a laguz that struggles to deal damage???).

Edited by Shadow Mir
Link to comment
Share on other sites

1 hour ago, Chocolate Kitty said:

5x base strength is not something to ignore (if she gained 0 strength by level 30, you still have an 80 base power attack which is stupid), which more than what I can say for 3x calculated damage fiona gets (she still gets the raw end of the deal). Lyre also can actually get around in the maps she's allowed in. Doing damage, well that's a problem both of them share.

By not putting lyre as the worst I never said she was good. I'm saying fiona is worse.

 

I could even go into the lore about Fiona being the child of a four rider and still being hot garbage, but that's not relevant.

Rend is undoubtedly better than Sol when it comes to killing potential (though it would be about equal to Luna with it's triple strength and ignoring defense). But it's not like Sol is a bad skill, it's basically the only mastery skill that's not a guaranteed kill, but it still deals decent damage and heals. And Fiona caps her defensive stats, so absorbing blows and recovering does suit her style (probably why she comes with innate Imbue too). Even taking Rend to be superior to Sol by only looking at damage potential, I don't think it's fair to say one unit is better than another simply because they have a better proc. Fiona can pull 1-2 range and has full canto capabilities. Basing quality purely on procs is basing quality on the most unreliable aspect of a unit.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Rend is meaningless. In endgame fiona would orko everything that doen't have nihil whit a sol proc. And even if she miss some rare orko, the healing and not needing a satori sign makes up for it. 

Lategame Fiona has a niche of being a paladin whit 34 speed and good skills. Few paladin are better than her at max level, if any.

Lyre face competition whit all the other beast, and even whit a ridicoulus amount of investment, she would be weaker than ranulf, any tiger or any lion whit similar investment, because cats were cursed whit terrible caps. There is no point into bringing her instead of Nailah, Giffca and Caineghis, and 4 beast is serioualy pushing it.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

you can disagree with me lol, but you're not going to sway me in a direction; I've played this game enough times to have cemented my decision.

lyre needs 13 levels to get rend, fiona needs 31 to get sol (unless you waste master seals promoting a level 10 fiona, which is just an awful decision for a lackluster skill).

fiona has awful base stats for her level and can't be used for the majority of chapters where she would get a chance to grow.

therefor in my opinion (which you seem to forget is my opinion), fiona is the worst character in this game.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

2 hours ago, Chocolate Kitty said:

you can disagree with me lol, but you're not going to sway me in a direction; I've played this game enough times to have cemented my decision.

lyre needs 13 levels to get rend, fiona needs 31 to get sol (unless you waste master seals promoting a level 10 fiona, which is just an awful decision for a lackluster skill).

fiona has awful base stats for her level and can't be used for the majority of chapters where she would get a chance to grow.

therefor in my opinion (which you seem to forget is my opinion), fiona is the worst character in this game.

Answer me this then: how in the seven hells would you plan on getting Lyre to level 30??? Also, I would say that Lyre also has awful base stats, and while she has more availability, it means nothing between her being completely atrocious and requiring me to bench someone who's not a complete failure just to deploy her. Worse yet, even if I do beat the odds and make something out of her, she still has to deal with being outclassed by Giffca, Caineghis, and Skrimir. In addition, Ranulf is already forced, and he's not that great; I would consider fielding two cats to really be pushing it. That being said, I respect your opinion, just not your reasoning. Also, I'll admit that I have managed to make something out of Fiona (btw, her not being able to leave the starting area in 3-6 isn't that bad, to be frank, since the enemies come to you; I see no need to go to them, and in fact see it as asking to die). I think it would be much harder to dig Lyre out of her bad start since she's limited in what she can do by design.

Edited by Shadow Mir
Link to comment
Share on other sites

3 hours ago, Chocolate Kitty said:

you can disagree with me lol, but you're not going to sway me in a direction; I've played this game enough times to have cemented my decision.

lyre needs 13 levels to get rend, fiona needs 31 to get sol (unless you waste master seals promoting a level 10 fiona, which is just an awful decision for a lackluster skill).

fiona has awful base stats for her level and can't be used for the majority of chapters where she would get a chance to grow.

therefor in my opinion (which you seem to forget is my opinion), fiona is the worst character in this game.

Fiona grows way faster than Lyre, though, so that level comparison is disingenuous. It's also easier to raise her at all because 1) she has ranged options (she may suck with them, but it's an option Lyre doesn't have), 2) she can actually attack on every turn, and 3) she can re-position herself after attacking. In addition, Lyre is stuck with an 8 Mt weapon until she's hit enemies 70 times, whereas Fiona has the option of strong forges and Arms Scrolls to increase her per-hit damage.

"In my opinion" is not an argument. If you're going to debate, leave that out.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

20 minutes ago, Florete said:

"In my opinion" is not an argument. If you're going to debate, leave that out.

Except this isn't a debate, it's literally a question of opinion.

3 hours ago, Shadow Mir said:

Answer me this then: how in the seven hells would you plan on getting Lyre to level 30??? Also, I would say that Lyre also has awful base stats, and while she has more availability, it means nothing between her being completely atrocious and requiring me to bench someone who's not a complete failure just to deploy her.

you could replace lyre with fiona in that sentence it would read exactly the same, if not better

Link to comment
Share on other sites

7 minutes ago, Chocolate Kitty said:

you could replace lyre with fiona in that sentence it would read exactly the same, if not better

Except not really, since Fiona isn't competing with anyone else for a unit slot in part 3.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

7 minutes ago, Chocolate Kitty said:

where was part 3 in the sentence i grabbed

There was no mention of it, because that segment was Lyre-centric. Anyhow, Fiona has free deployment for a few chapters, while Lyre doesn't.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

8 minutes ago, Chocolate Kitty said:

put on your glasses; I didn't start this debate

It doesn't matter who started it. It takes two.

8 minutes ago, Chocolate Kitty said:

last fucking time i post outside of rom hacking jesus christ

What you should have done from the beginning if it was just "your opinion."

Link to comment
Share on other sites

You can reduce this to Meg, Fiona, and Lyre. Anyone else is objectively wrong.

From these three I would argue that Fiona has the least amount of problems. She is a Cavalier meaning she still enjoys the advantages of canto (despite movement penalty being a thing in this game) and rescue dropping. That's more than Meg and Lyre can do at base.
Still terrible since not even an early promotion can salvage her stats to useable levels. Like she is only a single level away from promotion through a Master seal but with promotion bonuses and her own stats being incredibly lacklustre her combat will stay bad. That's the same problem for all 3 though.

Meg is Wendy 2.0 who can't even shove properly despite being an Armor, let alone be shoved. Fantastic!

Lyre on the other hand is the pinnacle of unnecessary. Non-Royal Laguz without wings are pretty terrible units between being limited by Laguz gauges, lack of 2 range and other weapon utilities. Somehow this kitten thinks having even less stats than her terrible sister is acceptable. If I'm not mistaken you even get both Lethe and Ranulf when she joins so what's the point of her?

Link to comment
Share on other sites

No, we are NOT going to argue opinions.  This is a poll.  Use your vote to express it.  Sheesh.

16 hours ago, VideoGamesEpic said:

So I should PM you the video before posting it here?

Yes, please!

Edited by eclipse
Link to comment
Share on other sites

I'm really surprised more people aren't saying Astrid. I remember reading old tier lists (no longer recall if it was here or GameFAQs) that had her along with Fiona and Lyre in their own tier named "Unholy Trinity". I don't know which of those three are the worst, but I'm pretty sure it's one of them, at least as far as units who have enough availability to be worth rating are concerned.

Astrid has absolutely putrid bases across the board and growths that don't really help much either, since they're weak in the two stats archers actually want, Str and Spd (as well as Def, in case you think of making her a lance-user upon promotion instead). Paragon can be removed from her unlike PoR so that's not an advantage any more, and even as far as long-term investment goes she misses out on the 3-range that other SS-rank archers get.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

43 minutes ago, Dark Holy Elf said:

I'm really surprised more people aren't saying Astrid. I remember reading old tier lists (no longer recall if it was here or GameFAQs) that had her along with Fiona and Lyre in their own tier named "Unholy Trinity". I don't know which of those three are the worst, but I'm pretty sure it's one of them, at least as far as units who have enough availability to be worth rating are concerned.

Astrid has absolutely putrid bases across the board and growths that don't really help much either, since they're weak in the two stats archers actually want, Str and Spd (as well as Def, in case you think of making her a lance-user upon promotion instead). Paragon can be removed from her unlike PoR so that's not an advantage any more, and even as far as long-term investment goes she misses out on the 3-range that other SS-rank archers get.

...???

Are you sure it was Astrid and not Meg? Because I always thought it was Meg who was the third of the unholy trinity...

Link to comment
Share on other sites

89X6Zjw.jpg
Reminds me when Astrid pretty much solo'ed 4-2 and capped everything at about level 15.

 

Even if her bases and growths are bad, it is very possible to fix them. 

Give her some levels in part 2 not to let her fall too much behind statwise and slap blossom on her in 3-11, and she will do fine. 

Edited by Necrofantasia
Link to comment
Share on other sites

1 hour ago, Flere210 said:

Astrid has transfers, wich alone makes her bases much better as long as you make sure to cap strenght jn Por(is an archer whit canto, her defenses are not too much of a problem.)

And even whitout transfers, she is easier to train compared to Fiona.

Also of note, she can use Blossom along with Paragon, which is something only she can do (technically, that's not true, but the only other units that could do it are Geoffrey, who has less availability, and laguz, most of whom are either beyond help or are broken enough to not need it).

In any instance, I think the voting patterns in this thread are going as expected, with the unholy trinity getting the lion's share of the votes.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

3 hours ago, Dark Holy Elf said:

I'm really surprised more people aren't saying Astrid. I remember reading old tier lists (no longer recall if it was here or GameFAQs) that had her along with Fiona and Lyre in their own tier named "Unholy Trinity". I don't know which of those three are the worst, but I'm pretty sure it's one of them, at least as far as units who have enough availability to be worth rating are concerned.

Astrid has absolutely putrid bases across the board and growths that don't really help much either, since they're weak in the two stats archers actually want, Str and Spd (as well as Def, in case you think of making her a lance-user upon promotion instead). Paragon can be removed from her unlike PoR so that's not an advantage any more, and even as far as long-term investment goes she misses out on the 3-range that other SS-rank archers get.

Being able to take Paragon off her isn't a disadvantage. You can argue that you're better off dumping her and giving paragon to someone else because she's bad, but the fact that she can be exchanged for a resource doesn't actually make her worse as a unit. She still has that resource and if you choose to utilize her it's an effective resource. Especially when paired with Blossom. Also she can use the Double Bow which is like the best weapon in the game (and yeah, she has competition for it with arguably better units, but in an argument of not being last, that's irrelevant as being able to use the best weapon in the game is a point in her favor if you choose to use her).

Edited by Jotari
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.

 Share

  • Recently Browsing   0 members

    • No registered users viewing this page.
×
×
  • Create New...