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SF's "Write Your Butt Off" Competition HD II.5 Remix

Round 33 Voting Phase  

1 member has voted

  1. 1. Which story from this round did you most enjoy?

    • Meeting Marik Ishtal
      0
    • Stop the Vampires
      1


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30 minutes ago, Ottservia said:

Y’see this is the kind of paradox I was talking about. You can’t really talk about these kinds of things without showing the other side. That my dear friends is the key to good morally ambiguous storytelling 

Even if you disregard that, as someone who believes you honestly don't belong on the internet if you require trigger warnings, the whole 'we must protect the gays so no homophobia'(slight strawmanning there) mostly just pisses me off. The Jews were hated on and beat down for way longer than the ABCDEFG+s(which is somewhat partially their own fault for saying they are God's holy chosen people, regardless of how true that statement may be I can understand people wanting to 'take them down a peg' as it were), but does it help anyone or anything for me to try to force anyone who doesn't want to write a story with a Judaistic theology to take a penalty in the name of raising awareness for the Jews?

You also can't just say 'no discrimination' because it's impossible to write an objective story if you as a writer have any semblance of an opinion - your own views will inevitably seep into your work, even if you aren't using characters with emotions or opinions of their own, and if you are, those characters will color your work with their own opinions, which will inevitably be considered 'discrimination' by someone because it's impossible to say something and not offend anyone on the internet.
This is of course also not bringing up the irony of saying 'in the name of anti-discrimination, I will discriminate against and forcefully silence those whose opinions I happen to not like' which also always drives me up the wall, and the fact that it's inevitably about the LGBT community when someone says that is extra frustrating because then I get to get eclipse or some equivalent moderator-personage called on me as the bad guy who hates anything LGBT, which frankly is not true - two of my Cipher friends are dudes who are married and we get along very well, I have no issue with someone being LGBT but this attempted forced protection of any party, no matter the reasoning, is always going to bug me.

...In case it wasn't obvious at this point, I'm passing on this round. Hypothetically I could put something together, but honestly I was thinking I was going to do so anyways so I could try to catch up some of my own work.

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10 minutes ago, SoulWeaver said:

Even if you disregard that, as someone who believes you honestly don't belong on the internet if you require trigger warnings, the whole 'we must protect the gays so no homophobia'(slight strawmanning there) mostly just pisses me off. The Jews were hated on and beat down for way longer than the ABCDEFG+s(which is somewhat partially their own fault for saying they are God's holy chosen people, regardless of how true that statement may be I can understand people wanting to 'take them down a peg' as it were), but does it help anyone or anything for me to try to force anyone who doesn't want to write a story with a Judaistic theology to take a penalty in the name of raising awareness for the Jews?

You also can't just say 'no discrimination' because it's impossible to write an objective story if you as a writer have any semblance of an opinion - your own views will inevitably seep into your work, even if you aren't using characters with emotions or opinions of their own, and if you are, those characters will color your work with their own opinions, which will inevitably be considered 'discrimination' by someone because it's impossible to say something and not offend anyone on the internet.
This is of course also not bringing up the irony of saying 'in the name of anti-discrimination, I will discriminate against and forcefully silence those whose opinions I happen to not like' which also always drives me up the wall, and the fact that it's inevitably about the LGBT community when someone says that is extra frustrating because then I get to get eclipse or some equivalent moderator-personage called on me as the bad guy who hates anything LGBT, which frankly is not true - two of my Cipher friends are dudes who are married and we get along very well, I have no issue with someone being LGBT but this attempted forced protection of any party, no matter the reasoning, is always going to bug me.

...In case it wasn't obvious at this point, I'm passing on this round. Hypothetically I could put something together, but honestly I was thinking I was going to do so anyways so I could try to catch up some of my own work.

I must thank you for saying the kind of stuff I was restraining myself from saying tbqh

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My uneducated guess:

If I have to come in here and mod this topic like Serious Discussion, it's an issue.

That being said, I'm not a fan of forced romance (or lack thereof), and I don't have the time.  Sorry.

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I was just gonna write an angsty BL(as in boy’s love) fic anyway. Though like I said I feel like there should be line drawn somewhere so I know what not to cross.

Edited by Ottservia

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19 minutes ago, Ottservia said:

I must thank you for saying the kind of stuff I was restraining myself from saying tbqh

Honestly I'm tired and not sure I care about being banned any more, since this is the only thing I do on here with any degree of serious consistency, and frankly I find it insulting that people just assume we can't use basic human decency on this thread especially considering our track record indicates that we absolutely can so long as Chloey and Ana don't critique each other's work. Yes, my religion doesn't align with the LGBT community, but that doesn't mean I have to be an (self-censored) about it, and I know how frustrating it is to be dismissed on no other grounds than 'you're going to hell anyways' so I see no reason to be so dismissive myself.

18 minutes ago, eclipse said:

My uneducated guess:

If I have to come in here and mod this topic like Serious Discussion, it's an issue.

That being said, I'm not a fan of forced romance (or lack thereof), and I don't have the time.  Sorry.

My issue is more that the prompter wants to say 'no discrimination or homophobia' but doesn't outline where their idea of discrimination or homophobia lies - if you intend to punish someone for not following a rule, and you are the one who made the rule, it falls to you to clearly and concisely outline that rule so it is understandable to those who will be held to it. I have different ideas about what counts as discrimination than say Anon, and we both probably have different ideas than what Morgan's thinking.

This is of course assuming we're going to uphold this as a rule, I still argue that's a risky precedent to set when we can all just agree to be decent human beings instead.

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Just now, SoulWeaver said:

My issue is more that the prompter wants to say 'no discrimination or homophobia' but doesn't outline where their idea of discrimination or homophobia lies - if you intend to punish someone for not following a rule, and you are the one who made the rule, it falls to you to clearly and concisely outline that rule so it is understandable to those who will be held to it. I have different ideas about what counts as discrimination than say Anon, and we both probably have different ideas than what Morgan's thinking.

This is of course assuming we're going to uphold this as a rule, I still argue that's a risky precedent to set when we can all just agree to be decent human beings instead.

I hear you.  I think there's a line between "gay bad" and working homophobia as a theme in a story. . .granted, the latter is extremely hard to pull off, but I don't want something like that off the table.

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12 minutes ago, eclipse said:

I hear you.  I think there's a line between "gay bad" and working homophobia as a theme in a story. . .granted, the latter is extremely hard to pull off, but I don't want something like that off the table.

I mean, it's really not hard so long as you go at it from the basic premise that blind hatred of any kind is not only ethically hypocritical, but realistically self-damaging - I could probably bang out something along that line in about a day and a half if I got in a good writing mood just using Arilon and Marita, or go for a more heavy-handed approach with an original setting about a group of scientists throwing out the one gay scientist only to realize too late he was the only one intelligent enough to figure out the last piece of the equation they needed to prevent the apocalypse. The main issue I see with that kind of writing is that the writer generally lets their own personal issues or feelings on the matter color their piece too much, and that's easily avoided one way or another.

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8 minutes ago, SoulWeaver said:

I mean, it's really not hard so long as you go at it from the basic premise that blind hatred of any kind is not only ethically hypocritical, but realistically self-damaging - I could probably bang out something along that line in about a day and a half if I got in a good writing mood just using Arilon and Marita, or go for a more heavy-handed approach with an original setting about a group of scientists throwing out the one gay scientist only to realize too late he was the only one intelligent enough to figure out the last piece of the equation they needed to prevent the apocalypse. The main issue I see with that kind of writing is that the writer generally lets their own personal issues or feelings on the matter color their piece too much, and that's easily avoided one way or another.

The scientist example isn't a good one IMO.  For a proper story involving this, it'll need a very subtle touch.  "Just because you're gay" is A Thing, but it also doesn't really capture the specific issues with homophobia.

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2 hours ago, eclipse said:

The scientist example isn't a good one IMO.  For a proper story involving this, it'll need a very subtle touch.  "Just because you're gay" is A Thing, but it also doesn't really capture the specific issues with homophobia.

 

Alternatively it could go the route I'm thinking mine might, which is to say a religious character goes on about the 'moral issues' of a chacter who is lgbt and said religious character stands on the actual problematic people that exist aka cultists who force people to choose between their faith and family and show case why this is a terrible thing, but as I said I have absolutely no desire to tread on any toes if said story is going to cause problems in any shape or form and being taken out of its intended context aka being a commentary on such things, because a, I don't need that shit and B nor do I have the time to waste with that shit.

 

If it is going to be a problem then I'll just as well sit this round out.

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1 hour ago, Morgan--Grandmaster said:

(Hears all the commotion) Dear Naga, what have I done? 😓

I don't see how this is entirely bad.  It is a challenging prompt which is nice.

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3 hours ago, Morgan--Grandmaster said:

(Hears all the commotion) Dear Naga, what have I done? 😓

Look man all I ask is that you lay out some more clearly defined boundaries on what is and isn’t allowed for this prompt

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2 hours ago, TheSilentChloey said:

I don't see how this is entirely bad.  It is a challenging prompt which is nice.

Phew. That, at least is a relief.

46 minutes ago, Ottservia said:

Look man all I ask is that you lay out some more clearly defined boundaries on what is and isn’t allowed for this prompt

The only thing I wouldn't want is an audience to read one of the stories and leave with the impression that those out of the straight, heterosexuality "deserve" not to have the same rights as everyone else. It's all about the story's message.

Acknowledging discrimination is okay. Glorifying it is not.

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1 hour ago, Morgan--Grandmaster said:

Glorifying it is not.

Depends on what you mean by that. Cause what if I wanted to kill off(or almost kill off) one of the characters in the relationship as that can be seen as homophobic to some even if it’s something I don’t intend cause if you know me I just like killing off characters in general. You see now what I mean by slippery slope?

Edited by Ottservia

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How about this guys: just use common sense.

If you think it’s inappropriate for the prompt, don’t do it.

If you do it and the reader thinks it is, them telling you why they think it’s inappropriate will be part of your critique 

...come on...be adults about this...

Edited by Shoblongoo

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3 hours ago, Shoblongoo said:

How about this guys: just use common sense.

If you think it’s inappropriate for the prompt, don’t do it.

If you do it and the reader thinks it is, them telling you why they think it’s inappropriate will be part of your critique 

...come on...be adults about this...

Creative writing is a unique set of challenges, so I think having some clearly-defined rules on what flies and doesn't is a good thing.  Especially since this intersects some of the forum rules.

'sides, if my experiences in SD are any indication, there's people who read first and fire from the hip, instead of asking things like "what did you mean by that?".  If I find the time today, I could probably crank out a very short example of what I mean.

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5 hours ago, Shoblongoo said:

How about this guys: just use common sense.

Part of the issue is that this is precisely my problem - as I stated earlier:

17 hours ago, SoulWeaver said:

frankly I find it insulting that people just assume we can't use basic human decency on this thread especially considering our track record indicates that we absolutely can so long as Chloey and Ana don't critique each other's work. Yes, my religion doesn't align with the LGBT community, but that doesn't mean I have to be an (self-censored) about it, and I know how frustrating it is to be dismissed on no other grounds than 'you're going to hell anyways' so I see no reason to be so dismissive myself.

I feel that we as a thread have made a pretty concerted effort to not be anal about things - like, nobody jumped on me about my piece for Round 14 despite it basically being a rape story - so having a prompter assume out the gate that I'm not going to 'just use common sense' about what's obviously a touchy subject for many people is, as I said, kind of insulting, at least to me.

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No offense to anyone whatsoever, but given the disagreement in here lately, maybe Morgan--Grandmaster should pick a different prompt, one nobody has to debate about... I know no one intended for this much confusion to happen and I know some people like this prompt, so it'd be unfortunate to change it, but yeah...

Edited by Anacybele

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1 hour ago, Anacybele said:

No offense to anyone whatsoever, but given the disagreement in here lately, maybe Morgan--Grandmaster should pick a different prompt, one nobody has to debate about... I know no one intended for this much confusion to happen and I know some people like this prompt, so it'd be unfortunate to change it, but yeah...

Keep the prompt. It’s a good prompt.

Genuinely curious to see how people approach this one.

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52 minutes ago, Shoblongoo said:

Keep the prompt. It’s a good prompt.

Genuinely curious to see how people approach this one.

Doesn't seem like many people want to though, given what's going on in here. I still advise a different prompt, though if Morgan--Grandmaster doesn't want to change it, I can't force her.

Edited by Anacybele

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16 minutes ago, Anacybele said:

Doesn't seem like many people want to though, given what's going on in here. 

There’s like 2 or 3 people griping, and no one’s holding a gun to their head and forcing them to write this round. 

I skipped the last one because the prompt wasn’t something I wanted to work with.

People are allowed to do that.

 

 

Edited by Shoblongoo

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Just now, Shoblongoo said:

There’s like 2 or 3 people griping, and no one’s holding a gun to their head and forcing them to write every round. 

I skipped the last one because the prompt wasn’t something I wanted to work with.

people are allowed to do that.

People are allowed to skip a prompt, sure, but there's been a bit of an argument and confusion over this one and that's just not fun.

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11 minutes ago, Anacybele said:

People are allowed to skip a prompt, sure, but there's been a bit of an argument and confusion over this one and that's just not fun.

There’s an element of knee-jerk reaction here that falls under the umbrella of bullshit internet drama.

But the fact that this has generated this much discussion this early is a level of engagement that speaks to why this is a good prompt.

And I’m hoping that translates to some ambitious writing. (Obligatory reminder there’s so much more you can do with this one then generic romance fluff and slice-of-life couple scenes) 

Edited by Shoblongoo

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29 minutes ago, Shoblongoo said:

There’s an element of knee-jerk reaction here that falls under the umbrella of bullshit internet drama.

But the fact that this has generated this much discussion this early is a level of engagement that speaks to why this is a good prompt.

And I’m hoping that translates to some ambitious writing. (Obligatory reminder there’s so much more you can do with this one then generic romance fluff and slice-of-life couple scenes) 

Well, that is one way of looking at it, I suppose. I could even come up with something and change my mind about not entering this one, for all I know.

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Reap what you sow. If people find it offensive, they won't vote for it. If it is highly inflammatory, well then I'm sure we have over arching site rules covering that stuff. There's no need for mini moderation here. Offense shouldn't really be any more or less permitted here compared to any where else on the site.

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