Jump to content

Thinking of doing Birthright Lunatic


Comycat_Aleu
 Share

Recommended Posts

I have played through Birthright on a normal difficulty (I lowered only bc I wanted to breeze through the story) and I am looking to Lunatic it. I played Lunatic awakening YEARS ago so I don’t remember much.

 

I don’t have any DLC besides the free ones (before awakening and Anna’s gift) 

Units are probably my biggest question. I found the only tanks I had were Oboro and Hinoka+Subaki. My Silas ended up falling behind but it may have been due to bad rng, and I didn’t have any good magic users besides Izana and Sakura (and they were busy healing.). What units are the tankiest and worth using. Also, who should I use the paragon on? (I threw it on Takumi) 

 

My only actual “troubles” came from me being stupid and only using Takumi to try to make him the most absolutely broken Pineapple, and thus didn’t play around with the other units. I also didn’t touch the children, besides Midori and Selkie. 

Also, should I worry about who marries who, or can I just go wild again

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Well if you wanna do it go on ahead.

Well, if you want the best stats possible for the children, you should worry a little bit about your pairings. But if you don't care about that than it doesn't really matter much.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Paragon is probably good on Sakura or Azama, so you can get them to level 20 before class upgrade by the time everyone else does.

The children aren't that big of a deal. Midori's chapter gives dragon herbs. Most of the kids will end up being similar to their parents that are in the same class, but have more evened out stats. Like Caeldori will be like Subaki, but with less defense and more speed.

For marriage just put the characters that go well together in pair-up that you find yourself using a lot. You have decreased experience gain and the enemies are stronger, so grinding will get mundane after a while, but Birthright Lunatic isn't that difficult where you really need to grind.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Scarlet should be worth using as a tank.

Also, if you want Shiro, you may as well do some paralogues to get Ryoma to S-support with someone before chapter 18 so as to not risk getting the boy killed. And bring a Rescue Staff.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

1 hour ago, Azure in a Roundabout said:

Also, if you want Shiro, you may as well do some paralogues to get Ryoma to S-support with someone before chapter 18 so as to not risk getting the boy killed. And bring a Rescue Staff.

This. A thousand times this. His paralogue is one of those that is flat-out poorly designed for lategame.

1 hour ago, Azure in a Roundabout said:

Scarlet should be worth using as a tank.

A tank, and the only axe user worth anything in Birthright, you mean.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

1 minute ago, Shadow Mir said:

A tank, and the only axe user worth anything in Birthright, you mean.

Well, there is reclassing, but I am no expert in who to reclass into what. Of the two Oni Savage promotions, which is better? (Asking others, too.)

Not saying that you’ll need more axes to cover the triangle, as Takumi, Kiragi, and maybe Reina cover it well enough despite a lack of enemy phase. And Dual Katanas.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

5 hours ago, Comycat_Aleu said:

Units are probably my biggest question. I found the only tanks I had were Oboro and Hinoka+Subaki. My Silas ended up falling behind but it may have been due to bad rng, and I didn’t have any good magic users besides Izana and Sakura (and they were busy healing.). What units are the tankiest and worth using. Also, who should I use the paragon on? (I threw it on Takumi) 

Oboro, Hinoka, and Silas are the only good tanks apart from avatar and possibly the children, at least in their base classes.  Silas was screwed over because of RNG - he should be one of the more tanky units in Birthright.  Hinata can be good, but should either become a Master of Arms or a Blacksmith, because samurai isn't particularly good for him.  Rinkah's tanky, but her strength is so atrocious you can only scarcely expect her to actually deal substantial damage.  Same with Subaki if you keep him as a sky knight.  And Mozu can be tanky, but you have to feed her kills to get her off her feet or change her into one of the DLC classes (since you have only free DLC, you'll only be able to make one Great Lord and maybe one or two Dread Fighters and Dark Fliers depending on how many paths you downloaded) so that she isn't stuck with the awful base stats of the villager class.  And of course, Scarlet's probably the absolute tankiest unit in Birthright when she joins (though low enough growths that it may not last if she gets particularly unlucky), but you have to consider whether or not you want to bring along a unit that only has one support chain.  It could be worth it, but you'll have to see how your team is shaping up to see if she's worth it or not.

For mages, Sakura's the only one worth anything.  Well, Sakura, Hayato, and possibly Mitama.  Hayato requires investment like Mozu, but he'll turn out with fairly balanced stats all around.  Sakura isn't the tankiest, but she certainly can survive more than Orochi can.  Orochi has really awful speed and defense, so she's about as easy to kill as Azura and overall just isn't worth the investment unless you really want the capturable units.  Mitama's role depends on her mother - if her mother is more of a physical combatant (like Hinoka or Hana), she's better as a Priestess than an Onmoyoji.

For paragon, it depends on what you want more of.  Do you want a good all-around physical combatant who could tank?  Do you want a good mage?  If it's another tank you want, Mozu could use it.  If you want an immediate mage, give it to Sakura or Hayato.  Personally would recommend going for another tank first.

5 hours ago, Comycat_Aleu said:

I also didn’t touch the children, besides Midori and Selkie. 

Be careful how you word things.

The offspring are the primary reason to concern yourself with marriages.  And generally speaking, pairing units of the same or similar classes/stats isn't a terrible idea.  Personally, I'm a fan of Selkie, Shiro (Ryoma's kid; listen to what everyone says about him and reserve a rescue staff for him if you want him to survive his paralogue), Caeldori (Subaki's kid), and Mitama (Azama's kid).  You may also find that Saizo's, Subaki's, and Hayato's kids are all rather familiar...

But...

Offspring are entirely optional.  You could go through the entire game without even seeing one of them.  They could bolster your numbers or take on roles that are lacking.  For example, Shiro and Caeldori are the most ideal units for the role of tank, at least if their mothers are either Mozu, Oboro, or Hinoka.  Mitama is good if you need another healer, archer, or mage, and Selkie can be more flexible than her father.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

1 hour ago, Azure in a Roundabout said:

Well, there is reclassing, but I am no expert in who to reclass into what. Of the two Oni Savage promotions, which is better? (Asking others, too.)

They're not exceedingly different, and BR doesn't really give you the tools to easily have a strong Oni savage around(because Rinkah is limited and reclassing Hayato/Hinata is a bore), so it doesn't matter much.

Chieftain can reasonably get access to Horse Spirit as a 1-2 range tanking weapon, and can make good use of the Bolt axe, with accuracy issues. It gets a better -/5 skill and gives slightly better pair up bonuses.

Blacksmith is more well rounded, although E sword doesn't really help it much. Think of it as a Sol-less axe Hero, because that's exactly what it is.
Edit: It does give Ryoma access to lancebreaker, which gets rid of his only weakness, so in his case it's pretty good; not so much for the actual Oni savages though

I'd say Chieftain is a bit better, but that's arguable.

Edited by Cysx
Link to comment
Share on other sites

1 hour ago, Azure in a Roundabout said:

Well, there is reclassing, but I am no expert in who to reclass into what. Of the two Oni Savage promotions, which is better? (Asking others, too.)

Birthright doesn't really give you the tools for a good Oni Savage (though then again, I'd argue that the game as a whole doesn't do it either). But honestly, I'd say Blacksmith is better, if only because it's not an awkward hybrid class.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

55 minutes ago, Ertrick36 said:

For mages, Sakura's the only one worth anything.  Well, Sakura, Hayato, and possibly Mitama.  Hayato requires investment like Mozu, but he'll turn out with fairly balanced stats all around.  Sakura isn't the tankiest, but she certainly can survive more than Orochi can.  Orochi has really awful speed and defense, so she's about as easy to kill as Azura and overall just isn't worth the investment unless you really want the capturable units.  Mitama's role depends on her mother - if her mother is more of a physical combatant (like Hinoka or Hana), she's better as a Priestess than an Onmoyoji.

Don’t forget about Rhajat. Though she does sometimes have skill issues. She requires one of Sakura, Felicia, or Orochi to be truly viable, but her, Mitama, and maybe Dwyer are the only possible Mage/healer hybrids without reclassing. With reclassing, Asugi is an option, too, with his high magic growth compared to other physical units.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

45 minutes ago, Shadow Mir said:

Birthright doesn't really give you the tools for a good Oni Savage (though then again, I'd argue that the game as a whole doesn't do it either). But honestly, I'd say Blacksmith is better, if only because it's not an awkward hybrid class.

To be fair, hybrids typically suffer from sacrificing their main attack stat for a largely useless amount of the secondary attack stat; Chieftain doesn't really do that, since it has the better strength of the two. Instead it sacrifices skill(-7 base and -15% growth). Doesn't lose out on caps or max weapon ranks either.
If you just wanted the damage and survivability you'd still go Chieftain.

Edited by Cysx
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Paladin Jakob will carry you far, without any fear of dying. Just keep gaining skills and use tonics.

Enemies will attack anything in range, they don't care if the do zero damage and get killed in a counter, unlike CQ.

There is also the Guard Katana for units like Silas and Hinoka. You can even marry those two for a great Sophie.

Maybe it's just me, but I also found that Kaze paired with Rinkah is much more useful than he ever was in CQ. Super fast, magic resistant and enough strength for those squishy enemy mages.

Did you give Subaki x Hanna a go? It actually works for a decent while. Hanna giving the speed he needs. He gets a beastlance early IIRC, so he can ORKO most cavs. Later on he keeps his flight, to move around other units.

The only real mage I ever considered was Rhajat. I just glued Hyata onto Sakura. He gives her more MAG and can sometimes grab a kill.

Other units to consider outside Ryoma, Takumi and Scarlett are Oborro, Reina and Saizo. Last one actually never has been as good in any of my playthroughs as he could be.

Have fun playing, keep up with meals and tonics and you'll be fine. If not, use Ryoma paired with Kagero more XD

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I'm currently doing lunatic birthright right now. MY small piece of advice,  be very careful with Mitama's paralogue. When I did this paralogue, it was before chapter 20. Most of the enemies were advanced level 4's. Because of a miscalculation and bad placement, I watched in horror as Oboro was decimiated with Silver arrows. I thought she would be fine with guardian naginata, full health, and pair up. Alas no - losing her cost me my perfect run.

 

Be careful; it's tempting to try to get Azama to Mitama's house...but it's not worth it. Just lest the Adventurers trash the house; Mitama still will be perfectly fine. Because I desired to wake Mitama a bit too strongly, Oboro is now gone...leaving behind a distressed husband and kid. (Takumi and his kid.) If there's any danger, forget the house and retreat to a more defensive position.

Edited by DarkDefeater
Link to comment
Share on other sites

On 4/11/2019 at 3:42 PM, Azure in a Roundabout said:

Don’t forget about Rhajat. Though she does sometimes have skill issues. She requires one of Sakura, Felicia, or Orochi to be truly viable, but her, Mitama, and maybe Dwyer are the only possible Mage/healer hybrids without reclassing. With reclassing, Asugi is an option, too, with his high magic growth compared to other physical units.

I'd say her dismal base skill growth destroys any chance she has a good skill growth. Scrolls being inaccurate doesn't really help matters.

On 4/11/2019 at 4:04 PM, Cysx said:

To be fair, hybrids typically suffer from sacrificing their main attack stat for a largely useless amount of the secondary attack stat; Chieftain doesn't really do that, since it has the better strength of the two. Instead it sacrifices skill(-7 base and -15% growth). Doesn't lose out on caps or max weapon ranks either.
If you just wanted the damage and survivability you'd still go Chieftain.

Not by enough to matter. Scroll access doesn't really add much of anything, either, since in general, their magic is gonna be too low to make them worth using. The fact that most of the options for Oni are clearly physically inclined doesn't help this at all.

On 4/11/2019 at 2:43 PM, Ertrick36 said:

For mages, Sakura's the only one worth anything.  Well, Sakura, Hayato, and possibly Mitama.  Hayato requires investment like Mozu, but he'll turn out with fairly balanced stats all around.  Sakura isn't the tankiest, but she certainly can survive more than Orochi can.  Orochi has really awful speed and defense, so she's about as easy to kill as Azura and overall just isn't worth the investment unless you really want the capturable units.  Mitama's role depends on her mother - if her mother is more of a physical combatant (like Hinoka or Hana), she's better as a Priestess than an Onmoyoji.

Speaking of Sakura, I would recommend Priestess for her since Renewal is great.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

45 minutes ago, Shadow Mir said:

Not by enough to matter. Scroll access doesn't really add much of anything, either, since in general, their magic is gonna be too low to make them worth using. The fact that most of the options for Oni are clearly physically inclined doesn't help this at all.

As I said, Horse Spirit. It's D rank and pretty much a 1-2 range guard naginata. Outside of that you're not wrong, but it's not like E-rank swords help much either.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I want to know what gender Corrin you are using now, because I thought about Jakob. What if we make him a Blacksmith? Sure, I’d most likely level him up in Paladin a little first, but yeah.

Besides, E-rank is not too big of a problem since they are cheap to buy and forge. Thanks @DehNutCase. We deal with it with Jakob as a Paladin already, so why worry over doing it with Blacksmith?

Yes, that does mean Dwyer may not be as good, and Ryoma loses a Pair-up bot he can use (not like he really needs one, anyway. Others like Scarlet can take in the late game Generals with a Hammer anyway).

Link to comment
Share on other sites

1 hour ago, Cysx said:

As I said, Horse Spirit. It's D rank and pretty much a 1-2 range guard naginata. Outside of that you're not wrong, but it's not like E-rank swords help much either.

A 1-2 Guard Naginata... that runs off Oni Chieftains' weaker stat (unless it's a reclassed Hayato or Rhajat, in which case you have to worry about accuracy issues). Yeah, no. Color me unimpressed. Especially since most of the ranged fighters on the enemy side are mages, which laugh at Oni Chieftains, or outlaws and their promotions, which will just no-sell magic because Oni Chieftains are shit at using it (again, excepting Hayato and Rhajat).

Edited by Shadow Mir
Link to comment
Share on other sites

3 hours ago, Azure in a Roundabout said:

Besides, E-rank is not too big of a problem since they are cheap to buy and forge. Thanks @DehNutCase. We deal with it with Jakob as a Paladin already, so why worry over doing it with Blacksmith?

Speaking of E-rank weaponry, reclassing to classes that use weapons the character hasn't trained in yet (e.g. reclassing Oboro to apothecary, which gives her E-rank bows) should be done early on.  Don't reclass into those kinds of classes in mid-or-late game, because you really don't want any unit to get stuck with awful E-rank weapons on, like, Chapter 23.

Though if you're willing to do skirmishes, this won't matter as much because you can spend the time to grind those weapon ranks up.  However, in a no-grind run, having a unit rely on E-rank weaponry can turn them into a liability.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

7 hours ago, Shadow Mir said:

A 1-2 Guard Naginata... that runs off Oni Chieftains' weaker stat (unless it's a reclassed Hayato or Rhajat, in which case you have to worry about accuracy issues). Yeah, no. Color me unimpressed. Especially since most of the ranged fighters on the enemy side are mages, which laugh at Oni Chieftains, or outlaws and their promotions, which will just no-sell magic because Oni Chieftains are shit at using it (again, excepting Hayato and Rhajat).

And you shouldn't be impressed. But it's not like the guard naginata itself doesn't have problems; it's weak, its accuracy is suboptimal and it lowers avoidance; it also cannot counter 2 range, period. Yet it's still considered as one of the best weapons in BR, because damage mitigation is that useful. Obviously your damage will be awful with the horse spirit, but the idea is, Oni Chieftain gets a tanking weapon, and Blacksmith does not(outside of random drops). Countering at all from range also builds guard gauge(and you'll likely be doubling because of the +3 spd) , or can be taken advantage of to attack stance through enemy phase with proper positioning. Compensates for the negligible damage, and helps build weapon ranks for characters with bad enemy phase(that's most of your units).

None of that is top tier, obviously, but it's still stuff Chieftain has, that Blacksmith doesn't.
 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

On 4/13/2019 at 8:19 PM, Ertrick36 said:

Speaking of E-rank weaponry, reclassing to classes that use weapons the character hasn't trained in yet (e.g. reclassing Oboro to apothecary, which gives her E-rank bows) should be done early on.  Don't reclass into those kinds of classes in mid-or-late game, because you really don't want any unit to get stuck with awful E-rank weapons on, like, Chapter 23.

Though if you're willing to do skirmishes, this won't matter as much because you can spend the time to grind those weapon ranks up.  However, in a no-grind run, having a unit rely on E-rank weaponry can turn them into a liability.

Just so I know, what is considered to be when mid-game starts?

Link to comment
Share on other sites

1 hour ago, Azure in a Roundabout said:

Just so I know, what is considered to be when mid-game starts?

In Fates, I'm gonna say when promoted units start showing up among the regular forces and when you have the vast majority of your team.  That's anywhere around Chapters 14-16.

That is about when E-rank weapons start sucking, because they have a hard time chipping into the enemies' increased HP pools and defenses.  By that time most units' main attack stats will barely be getting into the 20's, and most E-rank weapons only have 1-7 in might.  So overall, they have total attack stats of 21-27 against enemies with HP stats in the 20's, 30's, and 40's and defenses in the lower-mid-to-upper teens, which ultimately means all E-rank weapons will be dealing, at best, a third of these enemies' HP values in damage, which is unacceptable when it's against run-of-the-mill generics.  Sure, iron weapons aren't much better, but at least at D-rank you can start using effective weaponry (unless you're a mage, but then again mages kind of suck in this game in general - they didn't just get nerfed, they got neutered and spayed), which helps most of the time.

On 4/13/2019 at 11:51 PM, Cysx said:

But it's not like the guard naginata itself doesn't have problems; it's weak, its accuracy is suboptimal

Name Rank Mt Hit Crit Avoid Rng Worth Description
Guard Naginata C 5 75 0 -10 1 2700 Defence and Resistance +5
Horse Spirit D 4 70 0 0 1~2 2100 Skill, Speed, Defence and Resistance +3

Hmmm...

I don't know, last time I checked, 4 was lower than 5 and 70 was lower than 75.

I feel like instead of relying on Rinkah to, first of all, even promote in the first place and then get to D-rank tomes (or to do the same with Hinata or Hisame) is more of a hassle than just handing Oboro or Hinoka a Guard Naginata and calling it a day.  I'm not too keen on relying on exploitation of the Defense Stance of pair-up either, especially if I have to go through all the trouble to train up shaky units in the first place.  Even if I did want to rely on Defense Stance getting proc'd via constant combat with a 1-2 range unit, I'd better place my bets on Saizo than any of the possible Oni Chieftains.

Heck, maybe I'd even go so far as to train Oboro in magic usage and just have her use the Horse Spirit as a Basara.  Less of a hassle, imo, even with her crummy magic.  Or, if one has access to the class, just change her or Sakura into a Dark Falcon as soon as you recruit them and train them in magic immediately.  Even less of a hassle than waiting until promotion, thanks a lot DLC classes.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

19 minutes ago, Ertrick36 said:

Hmmm...

I don't know, last time I checked, 4 was lower than 5 and 70 was lower than 75.

Well yeah, the Horse spirit is even weaker, I wasn't denying that. I brought up the guard naginata as an example because it's also weak and imprecise, yet receives almost unanimous praise. Also, Horse spirit gives +3 skill, which translates to 4.5 hit, so they essentially have the same hit. Not that it matters.

This also wasn't about Rinkah, or even demonstrating that Oni Chieftain is good(it is, but doesn't really get a chance to shine) but determining what was the best promotion between Blacksmith and Oni Chieftain. That's all.
Also yeah, Oboro can use the Horse spirit too, absolutely. That does stop her from using the waterwheel, but it's gotten super late anyway.

Guard stance is obviously not the only factor, it's just an additional defense layer that's always good to have. Chieftain has great def and okay res aside from that.

Edited by Cysx
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.

 Share

  • Recently Browsing   0 members

    • No registered users viewing this page.
×
×
  • Create New...