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TheGoodHoms

Fire at Notre Dame Cathedral

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https://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-47941794

Notre Dame is one of the most recognizable landmarks in Paris and it's currently in flames. This is a catastrophic loss on an artistic, cultural, historical, and religious scale. Firefighters are at the scene, but there's already been significant structural damage. I pray when it's over we can still salvage what's left.

Edited by TheGoodHoms

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I turned on the news after a long session of game playing to see this. Not as bad as losing lives, but still quite sad. Centuries of history, being destroyed in minutes, hopefully by sheer accident and not arson.

May there indeed be something left to preserve at the end of this.

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Damn, that really sucks! :( I've been inside Notre Dame once and it was beautiful. It's awful to think that what I saw could be destroyed! I hope they can still save a lot of the building.

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On a personal note I had just gotten out of Art History class when I heard the news and today we had just finished the Gothic Art unit which includes Notre Dame. The irony of those circumstances just makes it hurt even more.

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You are right that it was under renovations. I have heard that there have been events that have transpired against Christians in Paris so this fire might have something to do with what has happened over the past couple weeks with these attacks. 

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the fire started where they were restoring the cathedral, so the most likely scenario is that someone started the fire by accident (nothing 100% official though)

but man, if someone actually did all of this mess by accident, he'd better kill himself right now, 'cause if they find him he's SO dead

EDIT: it looks as though they managed to save every art piece inside the cathedral, so that's already something

 

 

Edited by Yexin

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The two towers of Notre-Dame de Paris have been saved right now thankfully. Pretty sad but at least not everything has been lost.

The firefighters have done a good job.

 

Edited by Thunderstar

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I heard this evening. It's been years since I went by it and the idea of it being destroyed, whether by malice or foolishness kind of tripped me over, especially when I (incorrectly) heard a coffee pot was the cause.

Least it's not been a catastrophic destruction, much was saved and repairs can be made as well.

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I just saw on TV. The artworks and towers and all might be saved, but the lovely steeple in the back is gone and the roof is completely razed. The inside looks terrible now too. They also said the building's frame is completely gone. It's still never going to be the same...

I am thankful for what they did save (especially since my own country lost a certain other pair of towers 17 years ago) but still.

Whoever caused this, even if it was an accident, deserves to die. THIS GORGEOUS PIECE OF HISTORY WAS 850 YEARS OLD!

Edited by Anacybele

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19 minutes ago, Anacybele said:

Whoever caused this, even if it was an accident, deserves to die. THIS GORGEOUS PIECE OF HISTORY WAS 850 YEARS OLD!

Let's not get irrational. I agree that if this was indeed arson the responsible party should be punished. However, if it's just an accident the death penalty would be going way too far. Forgiveness is always the first step on the road to healing.

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3 minutes ago, TheGoodHoms said:

Let's not get irrational. I agree that if this was indeed arson the responsible party should be punished. However, if it's just an accident the death penalty would be going way too far. Forgiveness is always the first step on the road to healing.

Imo, some people don't deserve forgiveness. I don't know if the responsible party in this case does or not, I admit, so maybe the death penalty would be a bit much. But there still should be some form of punishment.

Edited by Anacybele

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1 hour ago, UNLEASH IT said:

Were there any casualties?

None have been reported throughout the day.

Cause of the fire appears to still be unknown. There was mention that it may have been an accident by some workers but that's said to be unlikely as none of them were there at the time. Right-wingers are already declaring the fire was intentional and linked other recent events of this nature... some of them even blaming "multiculturalism" and Muslims.

Edited by Dr. Tarrasque

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Can't be the only one whose mind is wandered in this direction.

 

4 hours ago, Anacybele said:

I just saw on TV. The artworks and towers and all might be saved, but the lovely steeple in the back is gone and the roof is completely razed. The inside looks terrible now too. They also said the building's frame is completely gone. It's still never going to be the same...

I am thankful for what they did save (especially since my own country lost a certain other pair of towers 17 years ago) but still.

Whoever caused this, even if it was an accident, deserves to die. THIS GORGEOUS PIECE OF HISTORY WAS 850 YEARS OLD!

 

4 hours ago, TheGoodHoms said:

Let's not get irrational. I agree that if this was indeed arson the responsible party should be punished. However, if it's just an accident the death penalty would be going way too far. Forgiveness is always the first step on the road to healing.

France doesn't have the death penalty. What kind of barbaric country do you think it is? America? For the record, the only country in Europe where the government legally murders its people is Belarus (though I wouldn't publicly decry Putin too heavily if I lived in Russia).

Edited by Jotari

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21 minutes ago, Jotari said:

Can't be the only one whose mind is wandered in this direction.

 

 

France doesn't have the death penalty. What kind of barbaric country do you think it is? America? For the record, the only country in Europe where the government legally murders its people is Belarus (though I wouldn't publicly decry Putin too heavily if I lived in Russia).

. . .okay, seriously?

The burning of the church sucks.  But FFS, this isn't the time or the place to inject your opinion of America's penal system.

---

Actual opinion: Glad the art pieces were moved out.  Hope the stained glass windows are okay.

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5 minutes ago, eclipse said:

. . .okay, seriously?

The burning of the church sucks.  But FFS, this isn't the time or the place to inject your opinion of America's penal system.

---

Actual opinion: Glad the art pieces were moved out.  Hope the stained glass windows are okay.

Point taken, though I'll clarify my opinion isn't limited to just America. The dig was more a joke and the content of the post was to inform that there is no death penalty in France so even if this was grade A anti Christian preplanned arson, the person wouldn't be executed for it (at least not without the rewriting of several French and EU laws). 

Edited by Jotari

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1 hour ago, Jotari said:

Can't be the only one whose mind is wandered in this direction.

 

No. I thought it too. But then I like that song way more than someone should and have it on my computer in 8-bit, Russian, Arabic, German, French, Spanish, the classic English version, the cover Lukario'sklaw did, and that triumphant version for the Frollo show. So I thought I might just be a little unhinged.

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3 minutes ago, Mad-manakete said:

No. I thought it too. But then I like that song way more than someone should and have it on my computer in 8-bit, Russian, Arabic, German, French, Spanish, the classic English version, the cover Lukario'sklaw did, and that triumphant version for the Frollo show. So I thought I might just be a little unhinged.

There's certainly worse songs to have twenty different versions of on your computer. Which performance do you think is the best?

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17 minutes ago, Jotari said:

There's certainly worse songs to have twenty different versions of on your computer. Which performance do you think is the best?

Actually a tough question. I really like a line in the German version which translates roughly to "the sinners I despise them, I'm of a different, better stamp". I've said it elsewhere, but that line embodies Frollo. He has contempt for everyone else because he considers them all to be sinners. On a different note, I find the Russian variation has a vocal asthetic that I enjoy. The English variation is again, top notch, though I have a native language bias there. If we look at play count, I seem to have played the Lukarios'klaw version the most times, curiously, so there's obviously something to be said there. Ultimately picking between them, I might just say the German version for the line, but it's tough by any metric because each version has merits, hence why I couldn't settle for one in the first place like I would under other circumstances. Another piece of music I love and have saved is Bloody Tears from Castlevania, but despite numerous iterations of that song, I was able to single out my favourite as the take from Dracula X Chronicles (whether that's popular as a choice or not I'll never know), and settle for it alone. Here I couldn't for reasons I'm not fully sure of.

Naturally, my thoughts on the incident on initially hearing of the fire (while it was underway) wandered to the song (Hellfire, not Bloody Tears) and whether future generations would think of Notre Dame as distantly as I would the Hanging Gardens of Bablyon or the Colossus of Rhodes. A bygone wonder.

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5 minutes ago, Mad-manakete said:

Actually a tough question. I really like a line in the German version which translates roughly to "the sinners I despise them, I'm of a different, better stamp". I've said it elsewhere, but that line embodies Frollo. He has contempt for everyone else because he considers them all to be sinners. On a different note, I find the Russian variation has a vocal asthetic that I enjoy. The English variation is again, top notch, though I have a native language bias there. If we look at play count, I seem to have played the Lukarios'klaw version the most times, curiously, so there's obviously something to be said there. Ultimately picking between them, I might just say the German version for the line, but it's tough by any metric because each version has merits, hence why I couldn't settle for one in the first place like I would under other circumstances. Another piece of music I love and have saved is Bloody Tears from Castlevania, but despite numerous iterations of that song, I was able to single out my favourite as the take from Dracula X Chronicles (whether that's popular as a choice or not I'll never know), and settle for it alone. Here I couldn't for reasons I'm not fully sure of.

Naturally, my thoughts on the incident on initially hearing of the fire (while it was underway) wandered to the song (Hellfire, not Bloody Tears) and whether future generations would think of Notre Dame as distantly as I would the Hanging Gardens of Bablyon or the Colossus of Rhodes. A bygone wonder.

Even if it burned right to the ground, I actually expect they'd rebuild it. Cultural icon and all that it is. Paris would have to be wiped out (or France really economically sunk) for them to give up Notre Dame (in no small thanks to Victor Hugo who's Hunchback of Notre Dame story was actually an easy advocating its restoration disguised as fiction).

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5 minutes ago, Jotari said:

Even if it burned right to the ground, I actually expect they'd rebuild it. Cultural icon and all that it is. Paris would have to be wiped out (or France really economically sunk) for them to give up Notre Dame (in no small thanks to Victor Hugo who's Hunchback of Notre Dame story was actually an easy advocating its restoration disguised as fiction).

While that may be true, the loss of some of the art (an eventuality that thankfully was avoided to my understanding) would have been a bit more difficult to turn back. Though, they could possibly be duplicated, I can't feel that'd be any more the real thing than a repro cart is in gaming. Just a substitute for those who cannot access the originals... for one reason or another. A cynical view point some might say, but I've dealt in collecting more than a few things (videogames being a fairly obvious one) and know how authenticity is valued.

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3 hours ago, Mad-manakete said:

While that may be true, the loss of some of the art (an eventuality that thankfully was avoided to my understanding) would have been a bit more difficult to turn back. Though, they could possibly be duplicated, I can't feel that'd be any more the real thing than a repro cart is in gaming. Just a substitute for those who cannot access the originals... for one reason or another. A cynical view point some might say, but I've dealt in collecting more than a few things (videogames being a fairly obvious one) and know how authenticity is valued.

Victor Hugo said something similar in his pamphlet War on the demolishers.

´And then, a laudable regret would take over: we would want to reconstruct these prodigious edifices, but we will not be able to. We no longer possess the genius of centuries past. Industry has replaced art.´ Victor Hugo, War on the demolishers.

Something you also can't replicate is the history of a building like Nôtre Dame. A building as old as Notre Dame has experienced so many different centuries and even if you you rebuild Nôtre Dame, these events you're simply unable to replicate.

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4 hours ago, Mad-manakete said:

While that may be true, the loss of some of the art (an eventuality that thankfully was avoided to my understanding) would have been a bit more difficult to turn back. Though, they could possibly be duplicated, I can't feel that'd be any more the real thing than a repro cart is in gaming. Just a substitute for those who cannot access the originals... for one reason or another. A cynical view point some might say, but I've dealt in collecting more than a few things (videogames being a fairly obvious one) and know how authenticity is valued.

Oh no doubt. It's not like it'd be all just okay. The replica would long be viewed as not up to scratch with the original until it Garners a long history of its own (like the white house which had its entire interior destroyed in the war of 1812). But it would be something. Any destruction of a historic monument is a tragedy and a replica is definitely not the same as the original. But it would serve as a monument to the monument and would eventually become a mounment in itself.

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