Mythic Hero Battle: Naga - Dragon Divinity

[Alexmender]

4 minutes ago, Diovani Bressan said:

FEH isn't a game where you build only one team of 4 units and play with only this team. You need to try different teams, and not only use your favorites.

Not trying to butt in your argument but I really dislike this sentence. You absolutely can clear anything with only your favorites as long as you're willing to give them everything they need to succeed. I mean, that's one of the points I try to show in my Eirika videos, she's a Gen 1 infantry sword with mediocre skills and a pathetic 26 base Atk and even she can defeat bloated Abyssal monsters. Granted, it requires a specific team of cheerleaders and rare skills like DC/Wrath/Null Follow Up to bring the most out of her but that just proves that any unit can be godly as long as you put the effort of bringing them to that level.

FEH encourages using different teams with the x-emblem quests and the blessing system for Arena/AA/AR but it's up to you if you want to do them, in terms of beating maps you absolutely can do it with just 1 team.

[May]

7 minutes ago, Alexmender said:

FEH encourages using different teams with the x-emblem quests and the blessing system for Arena/AA/AR but it's up to you if you want to do them, in terms of beating maps you absolutely can do it with just 1 team.

I agree with this sentiment. You don't need to use a variety of units for hero battles. 

You only use a variety if you want to limit what units to use for strategizing or to create a challenge. And to be honest, these battles are only getting more challenging...

[Diovani Bressan]

7 minutes ago, Anacybele said:

That's not my fault, that's bad game design.

If someone can do it, but you can't, maybe because it's not bad game design. Just like in AR, this type of maps have units to counter most of the threats that can harm them. If Infernal Maps were easier, then it would be a bad game design, because something that should be hard isn't

4 minutes ago, Alexmender said:

Not trying to butt in your argument but I really dislike this sentence. You absolutely can clear anything with only your favorites as long as you're willing to give them everything they need to succeed. I mean, that's one of the points I try to show in my Eirika videos, she's a Gen 1 infantry sword with mediocre skills and a pathetic 26 base Atk and even she can defeat bloated Abyssal monsters. Granted, it requires a specific team of cheerleaders and rare skills like DC/Wrath/Null Follow Up to bring the most out of her but that just proves that any unit can be godly as long as you put the effort of bringing them to that level.

FEH encourages using different teams with the x-emblem quests and the blessing system for Arena/AA/AR but it's up to you if you want to do them, in terms of beating maps you absolutely can do it with just 1 team.

Yeah, that's true. Maybe I used the wrong words.

[Anacybele]

2 minutes ago, Diovani Bressan said:

If someone can do it, but you can't, maybe because it's not bad game design. Just like in AR, this type of maps have units to counter most of the threats that can harm them. If Infernal Maps were easier, then it would be a bad game design, because something that should be hard isn't

I never meant that infernal maps should be THAT easy. ?

[Vicious Sal]

38 minutes ago, Anacybele said:

Not anyone can beat infernal LHBs/MHBs though. I just said that I can't. And I'm certain I'm not the only one. And sure there's reason for getting stronger in the game, there's arena, AR, and lunatic maps and such. LHBs and MHBs aren't the only high difficulty maps out there.

Duh, I know trying with just one team won't always work, I'm not stupid. I try numerous units and teams and nothing I try on my own works.

I said I used a video, didn't you read my post? And nothing would've changed if I just tried tomorrow. I won't suddenly have a super different barracks. What I have should suffice anyway, there's no reason I shouldn't be able to find something out of nearly 180 5 star units on my own, and yet I didn't. That's not my fault, that's bad game design.

If I got a dollar for every time I saw you saying this or that is bad game design, I could probably do my groceries for a week.

Using different units and having 180 five stars is not the entire story. You said you tried every combination. I care to disagree, and though i will have to assume some things, i will be conservative with my estimates:

You have 180 five star units, and can build a team of four. For the sake of skipping teams that consist of 4 red or 4 blue units, we’ll cut down the amount of units to 1/4th so every colour gets represented. That lowers the amount of combinations of units drastically. 

We get 45 red x 45 blue x 45 green x 45 grey = just over 4.1 MILLION possibilities alone. Then you have to factor in A,B,C, Assist, Special skills and seals. The combinations are pretty much endless, even when lowballing the numbers.

 

So no, it is not bad game design, it is just you not putting in the effort, blaming outside sources, mismanaging resources, not having insight and lacking game knowledge that are the cause of your frustration. 

 

 

Just to drive this home even further, let’s say you couldn’t clear the infernal difficulty (yes i saw you managed with a guide, but stay with me here.) You still claim it is bad game design and are of the opinion that infernal should not have orbs as a reward. 

 

Then Jimmy comes along and he isn’t able to clear Naga’s HARD mode. He claims everthing after hard mode just has inflated stats and that it’s bad game design. Some people might be able to clear it but he can’t, and others might also not be able to. He tried multiple teams and still couldn’t beat the map on Hard mode. It’s just unfair from the game and the rewards from hard mode and above shouldn’t be orbs because they lock them away from players that can’t beat them and that’s unfair.

Should we now remove all orbs as rewards from hard mode and above because Jimmy wasn’t able to clear hard mode or is Jimmy just not good enough and does he have to practice more and try more strategies?

 

Abyssal is the current skill ceiling and it only gives cosmetic bragging rights, it’s for the best of the best. Everything lower than that is not yet the ceiling so IS is completely fair in expecting you to try to reach higher and reward you for good plays. And if you don’t succeed now, there is always later, and you can come back when you have progressed with your game knowledge. And if you grow, you’ll be able to climb, until you hit their ceiling.

 

Until that time, a quote from the Dark Souls(?) community: GIT GUD (and quit blaming everything except yourself)

Edited May 30, 2019 by Vicious Sal

[Anacybele]

6 minutes ago, Vicious Sal said:

So no, it is not bad game design, it is just you not putting in the effort, blaming outside sources, mismanaging resources, not having insight and lacking game knowledge that are the cause of your frustration. 

I put in a lot of effort, actually. And I do have game knowledge.

[Vicious Sal]

3 minutes ago, Anacybele said:

I put in a lot of effort, actually. And I do have game knowledge.

If you had enough of both you would have cleared it without a guide. So clearly that’s an overestimation of your own capabilities. The fact that you keep saying things like ‘i can’t find a solution for x’ and ‘i didn’t know light blessings combined with Eir raise maximum lift’  are testament to the apparent lack of effort and game knowledge.

[Sunwoo]

Having +spd units sometimes bites you in the ass.

PM1's guide didn't work for me because one of my characters has a +spd nature. Found another guide, but that also gave me a few issues because my Olivia was +spd and had higher speed than young Azura. Even with that issue, though, I found a way to get around it and beat abyssal with a guide.

[Anacybele]

2 minutes ago, Vicious Sal said:

If you had enough of both you would have cleared it without a guide. So clearly that’s an overestimation of your own capabilities. The fact that you keep saying things like ‘i can’t find a solution for x’ and ‘i didn’t know light blessings combined with Eir raise maximum lift’  are testament to the apparent lack of effort and game knowledge.

Just because I didn't know ONE thing doesn't mean I don't know other things.

[Vicious Sal]

2 minutes ago, Anacybele said:

Just because I didn't know ONE thing doesn't mean I don't know other things.

So do you know how to clear Naga’s infernal without a guide by now or...?

 

 

[Flying Shogi]

@mampfoid Every time I see your Cherche makes me want to build one. She apparently doesn't like showing up.

Infernal clear: Reinhardt needed to go north of Roy on turn 3 to bait the green manakete to the right.

Spoiler

 

Abyssal clear: Nino needed the Quickened Pulse seal to take out the archer on turn 1 because they think it's cute to give him +18 speed and I wasn't having it.

PA!Azura was able to tank and softens up 2 scary dragons thanks to LH!Azura's Res buff. LH!Azura's Res boost has come in handy more times than I'd like to admit but a clear is a clear so I'll take it. 

Spoiler

 

 

Edited May 30, 2019 by Flying Shogi

[KMT4ever]

1 hour ago, Anacybele said:

Not anyone can beat infernal LHBs/MHBs though. I just said that I can't. And I'm certain I'm not the only one. And sure there's reason for getting stronger in the game, there's arena, AR, and lunatic maps and such. LHBs and MHBs aren't the only high difficulty maps out there.

Duh, I know trying with just one team won't always work, I'm not stupid. I try numerous units and teams and nothing I try on my own works.

I said I used a video, didn't you read my post? And nothing would've changed if I just tried tomorrow. I won't suddenly have a super different barracks. What I have should suffice anyway, there's no reason I shouldn't be able to find something out of nearly 180 5 star units on my own, and yet I didn't. That's not my fault, that's bad game design.

Honestly if you have 180 5* units I find it extremely unlikely that nothing you have works except that one video strategy. More likely there's a combination of units/skills/seals that you could have used but didn't think of. Not calling you out since I have a tendency to stick to my favorites myself, but it can be surprising what switching one unit out can do. Do you give proper SI to most of your units? I'm not even talking 5*-exclusives, just a full set of workable skills (Reposition FTW). That's carried me through everything short of Abyssal LHBs/MHBs and I specifically stick to infantry (unless I'm very desperate) with no healers and especially no dancers.

Just as an example, I dumped L!Ike straight into this map and he had no more trouble than anyone else thanks to the buffs B!Lucina provides. Other than Julia he even did most of the work. Of course +5 Julia is basically the perfect anti-Naga unit, but I probably could have used Lewyn or Nino (too lazy to check) instead.

Anyway, my Infernal team. Perfect map for Julia to demonstrate her full might by defeating the same god who empowers her.

1. +Spd Julia+5 (Water): Divine Naga refine, Swap, Glacies, Fury 3, QR2, Drive Spd 2, Atk/Spd 2 seal
2. Neutral L!Ike+1: Reposition, Axebreaker 3, DD3 seal
3. +Def/-HP L!Alm: Draw Back, Res+2 seal
4. Neutral B!Lucina+2 (Earth): Reposition, Vantage 3, Hone Spd 3 seal

Spoiler

OHKO with ease. Not even Naga herself can withstand the might of the Naga Bomb.

 

[ChickenBits]

I'm so jealous of the awesome one turn clears. I hate reinforcements

This one was on the easier side of things for my team thanks to L!Marth. I might try a support solo with L!Marth, I'm just not sure if he'll be able to do it without DC.

 

[Anacybele]

55 minutes ago, Vicious Sal said:

So do you know how to clear Naga’s infernal without a guide by now or...?

No, I know more about how to do well in AR and stuff, I'm getting more into the habit of checking enemy skills before battling, I know how to do good builds on characters, and I CAN clear infernal content that isn't LHBs or MHBs. I can clear BHBs and GHBs fine.

22 minutes ago, KMT4ever said:

Honestly if you have 180 5* units I find it extremely unlikely that nothing you have works except that one video strategy. More likely there's a combination of units/skills/seals that you could have used but didn't think of. Not calling you out since I have a tendency to stick to my favorites myself, but it can be surprising what switching one unit out can do. Do you give proper SI to most of your units? I'm not even talking 5*-exclusives, just a full set of workable skills (Reposition FTW). That's carried me through everything short of Abyssal LHBs/MHBs and I specifically stick to infantry (unless I'm very desperate) with no healers and especially no dancers.

Just as an example, I dumped L!Ike straight into this map and he had no more trouble than anyone else thanks to the buffs B!Lucina provides. Other than Julia he even did most of the work. Of course +5 Julia is basically the perfect anti-Naga unit, but I probably could have used Lewyn or Nino (too lazy to check) instead. 

Yeah, but trying every possible combination would take an absurd amount of time. I'll do a bunch of tries, but I'm not going to spend my life attempting one map. xP

[Nowi's Husband]

Witch Nowi MVP avoiding that dragon killer damage, and having a range attack to soften Naga.  

 

Edited May 30, 2019 by Nowi's Husband

[Robert Stewart]

Don't have a lot of time now so I can't reply to pings yet, sorry. ?

@Nanima @Landmaster @Sasori @mampfoid @daisy jane

 

[Hilda]

3 hours ago, Anacybele said:

That, and anti-RD Ike or any other DC sword unit. And I say mainly RD Ike because he's a free unit.

I'm incapable of coming up with my own infernal strategies on LHBs/MHBs, so... I wish IS would just make these a little easier for people like me. I don't like having to use videos all the time, I feel lame doing it. I would rather accomplish these things on my own like I do a lot of other content in the game.

here we go again... just try different strategies out yourself.

[Icelerate]

This is the only LHB/MHB that I can't clear abyssal. That annoying gravity healer is the problem. 

[Anacybele]

31 minutes ago, Hilda said:

here we go again... just try different strategies out yourself.

I did. I tried a bunch.

[Hilda]

5 minutes ago, Anacybele said:

I did. I tried a bunch.

try harder

[LordFrigid]

@mampfoid

I was wondering what you were going to do with Cordelia all the way in the corner. I forgot the Sword Cav was such a slowpoke (and didn’t notice Cherche was Desperation until I saw the “x4” during the battle). Nice work!

~

This map gave Celica & company a run for their money, but in the end they triumphed.

I think I’ve moved on from hating Lance Dragons to hating Blarserpent Pegasus riders.

[kirauza343]

@mampfoid Awesome move having Azura get a kill before singing Cherche! Also Cherche fears nothing and it’s amazing. 

@Nanima I love a good Laguz clear, and your birds made this look easy! I love watching dancers actually take out enemies, and it was super satisfying to watch him defeat Naga.

@Alexmender Wow...just wow. I felt like this was pretty difficult even for the Abyssal maps, but Eirika made it look like a walk in the park. Nothing even comes close to taking her out! Great clear!

This one was rough and took every last merge and dragon flower and support Camilla had, but they did it!

I couldn’t believe that Camilla could still survive the green dragon on Abyssal (I’d used him to trigger WoM on the previous difficulties too), and I definitely couldn’t believe that Heavy Blade gave her just enough fire power to actually one round him. Bladetomes are one hell of a drug! I should probably water bless this team for the Abyssal maps that happen during water season, but I can’t bring myself to officially kick F!Grima off the team. 

[Roflolxp54]

This MHB wasn't too bad. Used Brave Lyn + 3 flier dancers to clear the Abyssal difficulty.

Brave Lyn (+Spd 5*+10+5)
Brave Bow+
Reposition
Blazing Wind
Swift Sparrow 2
Desperation 3
Savage Blow 3
Brash Assault 3

All flier dancers (Legend Azura, Olivia, New Years Azura) ran Wings of Mercy 3 and something that can buff Atk (Legend Azura has Atk Tactic 3 and Torrent Seal 3+Prayer Wheel, New Years Azura ran Spur Atk 3 + Drive Atk 3, Olivia has her Skuld weapon).

Basic strategy is quad everything to death, making sure to take advantage of Savage Blow chip damage so that the healer would focus on healing rather than attacking and to use AoE specials to take out the overly bulky archers. The dancers do eat hits a couple times but I make sure that they only tank hits from units they have color advantage against.

Edited May 31, 2019 by Roflolxp54

[Adrestian Scum]

I need an Abyssal solution

I know Pheonixmaster1 has one, but sometimes it doesn't work for me.

Any units I absolutely need for this one?

[Rezzy]

I hate this map.  When I beat it, I felt no sense of accomplishment, but only the regret of a wasted evening, not even realizing my SO had already gone to bed two hours prior.