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Change a Fire Emblem Game's story and main characters

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I'd replace the entire 2nd act of awakening, and replace it with something else based around grima, and dealing with plegia under Validar's command. That way it keeps the entire story set one one big threat, instead of just trying to create another story out of nowhere and shove it in. Basically expanding the 3rd arc to cover everything from arc 2.

Give Lucina more importance to the story. She barely does much outside of a few chapters. And most of her role is basically telling people not to do something. Maybe more of what happened with Emmeryn like this. Lucina fixes the problem, only for it to find another way to happen regardless.

 

Edited by Faellin

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Conquest/Birthright- Make Xander and Ryoma more relevant, it'd be harder to make them the main characters but I'd prefer it. If possible, cut Corrin. Make it so you can recruit people. Not much point for that since there's Revelation, but the story for that one isn't as good as Conquest or even Birthright tbh.

I won't do Three Houses yet since I haven't played all routes. But there are already a lot of changes I would want.

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On 7/27/2019 at 11:47 AM, Jotari said:

Remove the second act of Awakening from that game and give it a game to itself, either having the Grima stuff part of the first Plegia arc or make the game into a trilogy. Then, instead of it being Robin and Chrom central, have Say'ri be the protagonist with the game chronicling the rise of Walhart. Virion and Cherhce would be major characters, with Chrom and Robin arriving towards the end of the game as Gotoh archetypes (not sure how Robin's gender and appearance would work, using previous save data is the obvious solution, but the 3DS doesn't do that. Most likely it'd just be the default design with some factor earlier in the game determining their gender). Tiki can work her way in there too if she's not utilized in the other Awakening that's created here. Have more faithfulness to the geography of Valentia in Gaiden and give distinct boarders and histories to the countries. Because like three or four countries are mentioned on Valm in Awakening but we have no clue as to where they actually are aside from assuming Wallhart's castle is located in the country of Valm. Lastly give Walhart Alm's Falchion as his weapon to play up his connection to Alm and his parallel to Chrom as the other hero king (Chrom wouldn't necessarily have to steal the show narratively speaking, but the parallel is still nice and works well if it's only present in battle conversations alone). And just to appease me and me alone, depict Valentia as a remote island like it's originally described instead of a full continent.

Radiant Dawn Part 1 is also something I'd like to see split to made into it's own game. Not because it flat out doesn't work like Awakening's second Act (in fact Part 1 is paces pretty will imo), but because if it was a full game then Micaiah getting sideline hard in the finale wouldn't be as insulting.

I might not fully agree on the remote island part, but other than that I'd agree. Like for instance, Walhart might usually go with Wolf Berg, but the Falchion is something he'd also wield (I just like Wolf Berg, alright? Hell, another idea him having to seek out that Falchion as his birthright if it was previously lost). Also, you could influence how Robin is if you don't have a save by, for instance, answering a few questions in a scene introducing Chrom's arrival to the continent. 

I had been thinking on if RD had been broken up actually, allowing for some more time with the DB and maybe add Crimea as well to said first game. But I think I'll say more when I've actually finished RD.

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9 hours ago, Dayni said:

I might not fully agree on the remote island part, but other than that I'd agree. Like for instance, Walhart might usually go with Wolf Berg, but the Falchion is something he'd also wield (I just like Wolf Berg, alright? Hell, another idea him having to seek out that Falchion as his birthright if it was previously lost). Also, you could influence how Robin is if you don't have a save by, for instance, answering a few questions in a scene introducing Chrom's arrival to the continent. 

I had been thinking on if RD had been broken up actually, allowing for some more time with the DB and maybe add Crimea as well to said first game. But I think I'll say more when I've actually finished RD.

Wolfberg being a back up weapon he has that allows him to cover himself on 1-2 range would work since that's not something Falchion does. Especially if he has a skill that auto equips Wolfberg for counter attacks (and if Falchion auto heals at the start of a turn like in Gaiden instead of like an item in Awakening). The clashing of two Falchions wielded by the decedents of two parallel hero kings trying to live up to the legend of their forefathers is just too good themeing to ignore. Biggest missed opportunity in Awakening imo.

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I'll cover Judgral and Binding Blade:

Judgral

*Reverse the scenario of Julia becoming enslaved by Manfroy. Instead of the master schemer suddenly declaring to throw his life's work down the drain just to be mean to Seliph, have Julius order Manfroy who reluctantly goes along with it.

*Actually address how nobody noticed Deirdre's Mark of Naga behind her circlet. Even if you have to say that Sigurd DID see it when Seliph was conceived and wasn't ignorant enough of his history to know what it means, so he kept quiet about it.

*Give more detail on how the conspiracy worked. Old he may be, Azmur should consider it suspicious that the men who head the court are the ones yelling that two from all evidence loyal men are behind his son's murder, especially with how those same men had a history of feuding with one of those men.

*Actually include background info that makes Raydrick the big shot he's supposed to be. I actually find him a neat character knowing all I do about him and the idea suggested on reddit that his dynamic with Veld is something of a dark mirror of August's with Leif.

Binding Blade

*Jahn exposition needs to be available earlier in the game to avoid plot dumping.

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15 hours ago, Eryon said:

I'll cover Judgral and Binding Blade:

Judgral

*Reverse the scenario of Julia becoming enslaved by Manfroy. Instead of the master schemer suddenly declaring to throw his life's work down the drain just to be mean to Seliph, have Julius order Manfroy who reluctantly goes along with it.

*Actually address how nobody noticed Deirdre's Mark of Naga behind her circlet. Even if you have to say that Sigurd DID see it when Seliph was conceived and wasn't ignorant enough of his history to know what it means, so he kept quiet about it.

*Give more detail on how the conspiracy worked. Old he may be, Azmur should consider it suspicious that the men who head the court are the ones yelling that two from all evidence loyal men are behind his son's murder, especially with how those same men had a history of feuding with one of those men.

*Actually include background info that makes Raydrick the big shot he's supposed to be. I actually find him a neat character knowing all I do about him and the idea suggested on reddit that his dynamic with Veld is something of a dark mirror of August's with Leif.

Binding Blade

*Jahn exposition needs to be available earlier in the game to avoid plot dumping.

Best way to fix the Naga mark plot hole is to make it so the symbol is a secret thing known only to the royal family put of tradition (wouldn't do to have people trying to impersonate royalty to fake a symbol). Azmur is the only one who sees to recognize it in the original anyway so I don't think it would contradict any existing canon.

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Hmm, that works too. That'd require more detail on the place of Marks in Judgrali society. It could also work as a deterrent against rabble rousers rallying around bastards or something.

Another one would be giving more info on Arvis' relation with Saias. Confirmation whether he knew the boy was his son or not.

Edited by Eryon

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On 7/3/2019 at 12:44 PM, Ertrick36 said:

This is definitely baiting people to just write walls of text about how Fates was awful (some of whom I'm sure will only give the laziest of answers).

Instead, I'll talk about Gaiden/Echoes.

Problem is precisely the protagonists and how they're handled.  Change them up so that they're more minor/all around different and change the roles of the new protagonists so that they have a reason to be leading their respective armies towards their goals.  On Alm's side, make the protagonist either one of the villagers or Clive (yeah, I know, everyone seems to shit on him).  On Celica's side, I could see it be interesting if Saber was the protagonist, hired on by Mila clergy (Celica's group) to escort them across the waters and through lands infested with monsters and bandits.

The idea of Alm's side would shift from a gradual reveal of Alm's royal lineage to a proper focus on the conflict between nobles and villagers.  If the protagonist is one of the villagers, it could very well be a "rising to greatness" story - one detailing the exploits of a common fellow who took charge and earned the trust of doubters and reluctant folks alike.  If the protagonist is Clive, it becomes a story focused more on the nobility side, as he struggles to convince fellow nobles to accept the aid of commoners while simultaneously pushing back against a strong invading force.

As for Celica's side, what I had envisioned is you see things from the perspective of a man who isn't even aware of what's actually going on with the monsters and whatnot.  I think it'd be a lot more interesting to see the plot gradually unfold and details get revealed that you didn't know before.  For example, not knowing that the terrors and the poor harvests had anything to do with the gods would make the revelation of Rudolf's sealing away of Mila much more shocking and intriguing.  Instead of being treated to scenes where you see Jedah or some of the other antagonists monologuing about their nefarious plans, you only hear about what they already have been doing and meet them when you meet them.  That way, the ambiguity of their plans actually is solidified, so you may very well choose to trust Jedah as someone who may not be much of a believer and who, as the player, hasn't seen him cackling to Duma about how he'll return him to glory or whatever.  Either that, or the protagonist could be Mae, Boey, or Genny following a Celica-like character.  I just feel it'd be more interesting to play this path from the perspective of one less knowledgeable of the main conflicts on the continent.

I think I'd also just remove Rudolf's family entirely.  I just feel one of the greatest strikes against him is how he's portrayed as a sympathetic villain, yet he treats the family he has like complete fucking garbage.  His only son, he sends off to a village to be raised under false pretenses by one of his subordinates, and his nephew - whom he is essentially the adoptive father of - is neglected and lied to his entire life.  With this removal, he comes across as more of a Walhart type of character - one who instigates bloody wars believing he's doing it for the greater good.  I mean, perhaps he could have some heir to the throne, but the way it was done before was incredibly obtuse and made him seem a much worse father than any of the Fates parents.  Moreover, it ruined the whole "commoner rising to greatness" angle Alm had going for him.

I think you hit the nail with it. The main problem is Shadows of Valentia is that the protagonists contradict their own themes, but having a different main character following the same story would do wonders for the plot providing the right tone. Tobin or Gray would make great protagonists in Alm's route, especially considering Grey's romance with Clair that could be expanded on, focusing  on their different social classes. Faye is just crazy and Kliff is not a constant in the team cause he can be recruited by Celica.

Edited by Mylady

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Binding Blade

Perhaps more as a early-game optional DLC for BB Echoes, but have Elphin/Prince Mildain be the protagonist as he journeys from metropolitan Etruria to the colonies on the west and finds out just how messed up the colonial government is. Ironically, the very same people who resented the Etrurian government came to look up to Elphin as the leader that brings hope in people yearning for freedom. This is an minor alternate timeline where some other characters travel differently; main characters will include Lalam and Echidna, but other canon characters such as Klein and Tate will also be recruitable. The merge with the canon game will be around Chapter 12, where Elphin and Co will join forces with Roy and Co to overthrow Arcard at the colonial capital of Jutes. Just a bit more fleshing out of the world and geography and politics.

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I'll take a crack at Tellius now:

Ike and Mist: Both are the children of the lost Heron daughter. That being where they draw their strange abilities. 
-Complaint with Note: The plot introduced tangents from Mist's being able to carry the Medallion of Lehran without corruption that don't go really anywhere. I suspect that this is a remnant of the earlier point in development where Mist was planned to have a bigger role as another Lord. Ike being one of the Branded helps with his role of being the one who bridges the gap between Beorc and Laguz, since he'd of both yet belong with neither (rather than being more or less a Token Good Human who's totally not like other humies).

The Black Knight: Consolidated into Ashnard and Betram. Zelgius on the other hand remains a character who serves Sephiran and is a foil to Ike as another branded warrior.

-Complaint with Note: I maintain that the Black Knight is no doubt one of the worst written elements of Tellius. In PoR, he distracts spotlight that could''ve been granted to Ashnard (who's the more interesting character but doesn't have the room to show it outside of battle convos) and Bertram (who's Elincia uncle). RD tries to re-envision him as some noble rival whose death was a tragedy except it's at odds with PoR's depiction of him (see him threatening to torture and/or violate Mist). I recommend to split the role of Ike's rival off onto Ashnard (who's already something of a Dark Ike anyway), the superweapon onto Bertram, and the noble servant of Sephiran onto Zelgius.

Micaiah: No longer Sanaki's elder sister. Instead belongs to a bastard branch of the divine lineage whose presence was covered up by conspiratorial elements for leverage.

-Complaint with Note: There was really no need for Micaiah's status as the missing "real" empress. Her being able to communicate with Yune ends up canceled out by the Dual Goddesses manifesting and communicating with those outside of her bloodline anyway.

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On 7/27/2019 at 12:47 PM, Jotari said:

Remove the second act of Awakening from that game and give it a game to itself, either having the Grima stuff part of the first Plegia arc or make the game into a trilogy. Then, instead of it being Robin and Chrom central, have Say'ri be the protagonist with the game chronicling the rise of Walhart. Virion and Cherhce would be major characters, with Chrom and Robin arriving towards the end of the game as Gotoh archetypes (not sure how Robin's gender and appearance would work, using previous save data is the obvious solution, but the 3DS doesn't do that. Most likely it'd just be the default design with some factor earlier in the game determining their gender). Tiki can work her way in there too if she's not utilized in the other Awakening that's created here. Have more faithfulness to the geography of Valentia in Gaiden and give distinct boarders and histories to the countries. Because like three or four countries are mentioned on Valm in Awakening but we have no clue as to where they actually are aside from assuming Wallhart's castle is located in the country of Valm. Lastly give Walhart Alm's Falchion as his weapon to play up his connection to Alm and his parallel to Chrom as the other hero king (Chrom wouldn't necessarily have to steal the show narratively speaking, but the parallel is still nice and works well if it's only present in battle conversations alone). And just to appease me and me alone, depict Valentia as a remote island like it's originally described instead of a full continent.

So much this, though in regards to the Falchion I would point out that Walhart may not want to wield a weapon that he can only wield due to a special lineage that makes him chosen by Duma.

I know that Fates is kinda the punching bag for this thread, but I'm gonna suggest something that nobody else here has suggested. I'm gonna suggest that with the exception of Anankos and his undead underlings, absolutely nobody needs to change. Corrin is perfectly fine as is, Mikoto is perfectly fine as is (though she could use some more screentime), Xander is absolutely fine as is, and even Garon is absolutely fine as is (though without Anankos you'd probably have to scrap his slime form, which is a shame because it's one of my favourite boss designs).

What I would absolutely do is to restructure the routes. The goal of the game should be for Corrin to defeat Garon, with each route being a different, well, route to doing so. In Birthright he fights against Garon directly even though it means fighting his own family (and the focus should be on said war against his own family, and not "let's go find my missing brothers for seven chapters and then go on a hiking trip through Nohr until we stumble upon the enemy capital." Conquest should be about Corrin, having seen the good inside his siblings, believing that they can be convinced to do the right thing. Over the course of the game Corrin would convince them one by one until they all join together to topple Gron and make peace with Hoshido. Revelation should be Corrin, unable to fight against either side, becoming a vigilante outcast determined to end the war by assassinating Garon. Instead of the route where you recruit everyone, this should be the route where the least people want to join you.

Edited by Druplesnubb

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5 minutes ago, Druplesnubb said:

So much this, though in regards to the Falchion I would point out that Walhart may not want to wield a weapon that he can only wield due to a special lineage that makes him chosen by Duma.

I know that Fates is kinda the punching bag for this thread, but I'm gonna suggest something that nobody else here has suggested. I'm gonna suggest that with the exception of Anankos and his undead underlings, absolutely nobody needs to change. Corrin is perfectly fine as is, Mikoto is perfectly fine as is (though she could use some more screentime), Xander is absolutely fine as is, and even Garon is absolutely fine as is (though without Anankos you'd probably have to scrap his slime form, which is a shame because it's one of my favourite boss designs).

What I would absolutely do is to restructure the routes. The goal of the game should be for Corrin to defeat Garon, with each route being a different, well, route to doing so. In Birthright he fights against Garon directly even though it means fighting his own family (and the focus should be on said war against his own family, and not "let's go find my missing brothers for seven chapters and then go on a hiking trip through Nohr until we stumble upon the enemy capital." Conquest should be about Corrin, having seen the good inside his siblings, believing that they can be convinced to do the right thing. Over the course of the game Corrin would convince them one by one until they all join together to topple Gron and make peace with Hoshido. Revelation should be Corrin, unable to fight against either side, becoming a vigilante outcast determined to end the war by assassinating Garon. Instead of the route where you recruit everyone, this should be the route where the least people want to join you.

When I first heard about Revelations one of the few things I knew about it was that Fuga was recruitable in it. This lead me to erroneously believe Revelations would be about recruiting the "neutral" parties of the land, like Kilma, the Ice Tribe Chief and Izana (whom I didn't know was recruitable in Birthright/Conquest at the time). This would have been interesting, if only because those guys tend to be older characters who may as well not exist when it comes to the main plot of recent Fire Emblem games.

Spoiler

Barring the immortals of Three Houses, I think Fredrick is the oldest character that's been plot relevant ever since the post 3DS era began. We'll maybe Basilio. 

 

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15 hours ago, Druplesnubb said:
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Gunter is fairly plot relevant. He specifically raised Corrin to turn against Garon in a convoluted revenge scheme that succeeds on all three routes. Gunter is the true hero of Fates.

 

This is true. Albeit after the prologue he's never seen again in Birthright and is regulated to extra as soon as he shows up again in Conquest. Pretty relevant in Revelations though. Although he does slip into villain territory there (where it's much more acceptable to be a villain, especially is you use magic).

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