So far, what route would you call canon? (OBVIOUS SUPREME SPOILERS)

[Timlugia]

41 minutes ago, 0 Def Cleric said:

With... one guy? 
Anyway, good night to this argument. You're making more and more reaches, so I'm going to go do constructive things instead. 

lol, you were the one suggesting one warrior with warp could make difference and end the war early in Fire Emblem just a few posts earlier no?

Now you are trying to say lending her best general (with warp) away means nothing.

 

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Sure, Dimitri may look like a fool in the BE route, where he goes against Edelgard and side with Rhea. But does Edelgard ever gives him a reason for why she’s doing things? No wonder Dimitri and others think of her as power hungry tyrant. He never had a reason for not attacking Edelgard.

Not just to Dimitri, she never explains her motivation pre-skip to any lords or Byleth, completely relied on player's faith in her. It's literally showing up saying "I am Flame Emperor, you will join me or you will die". Even some of her own classmates responded with "why are you doing this?"

[ChickenBits]

2 hours ago, Spectrum said:

When Dimitri knew he was losing anyways, she asked him to surrender, but he still refused and blamed her for the Tragedy of Duscar which she DENIED involvement in it more than once. In Dimitri's route, she agreed to meet Dimitri and explain things to him.

The only thing she says is that she wasn't involved. Not once did she try to explain things but instead calls him a king of delusion and burns him alive in her own route. In the BL she only agreed to the meeting so she could try to kill him. Edelgard even used the dagger he gave her as a gift to show his affections. Edelgard's motives are understandable but so is Dimitri, he has survivors guilt and pstd. Not to mention when he thought Edelgard was behind the tragedy it completely broke him because he valued their childhood friendship.

2 hours ago, Spectrum said:

Even though she was conquering, she still tried to avoid unnecessary bloodshed as much as possible like, as long as people stop opposing her and surrender, she will gladly spare them.

I don't know how you can defend this and give the Church crap for the exact same thing. Rhea doesn't kill based on dissatisfaction/disbelief in the goddess. The only times we see her order an execution for opposition is when someone takes up arms against the church. Rhea leaves you alone otherwise. Lanato's conflict was a known issue but he wasn't executed until he tried to start a rebellion. 

2 hours ago, Spectrum said:

"Reforming" the church while crests still exists seems more like a dream tbh. Uniting Fodlan and free them from the false gods and the entire crest system and give humanity a chance to live for themselves seems a very much better ending

I wouldn't say it's a dream when the vast majority of it's members are decent people. It also depends on how they reform the Church, religion isn't evil when practised in good faith. Fodlan is united in all of the other routes as well, just with a different government put in place. The crests are where it's get muddied since it's shown how they effected people's lives in the worst way possible. What contributed the most though was the system around the crests and the lack of order. Terrible people abused these crests and the whole system encouraged an unhealthy obsession. They did contribute to some good since the crest's power were a huge reason why Fodlan was able to defend itself from invasions. So again, it comes back to how the system changes.

2 hours ago, Spectrum said:

I wish people would stop bashing Edelgard because of the "she's a waifu material" stuff. 

I really don't understand why people say this, she's the furthest thing from shallow waifu bait. Edelgard is not only an interesting character but she generates a lot of good discussion because of her questionable morals and actions. I love the character because of her complexity.

[Altrosa]

Shoot, you learn as much about her motivations from inferring things in the library as you do from her actions in other paths. Dimitri, by the end, was willing to negotiate, too. 

 

Speaking of inferring, I get the feeling most players who happen to unlock Edel’s hidden path in the blind runs jump to Edel’s side because Rhea is conveniently terrifying just before those events. 

[Timlugia]

3 hours ago, Altrosa said:

Speaking of inferring, I get the feeling most players who happen to unlock Edel’s hidden path in the blind runs jump to Edel’s side because Rhea is conveniently terrifying just before those events. 

This is an interesting mention. I read a few people saying Rhea was "cruel" when she calls for Edelgard's execution after they were defeated.

But every path I already played, didn't Edelgard calls for death for everyone in the room first? She gave order for no quarter in the name of the emperor. 

Assuming Byleth/Claude/Dimitri and Rhea lost, they would likely be executed as well. So I really don't get how Rhea's order was anymore brutal than Edelgard here.

[Tenzen12]

As far as I could see Fodlan is that terrible place to live under church. Knights of Seiros does protect civilians, nobles can marry commoners (even if it is looked down on) and officers school is open to almost anyone. 

Most terrible seems what nobles doing each other and even discrimination based on Crest isn't right down endorsed by church. 

I certainly don't think status quo warrant full scale war. 

[AKAI]

I think the Fouth Route is the canon ending because it closed most of the major loose ends. On that note, in my first play through (Black Eagle) I just went with what seemed right to me. I got go to Edalgard's coronation, but still choose not to side with her since I just don't agree with her emo ideals. In the end, I kill Edalgard, destory those that slither in the dark, slay Rhea in dragon form, discovered all the truth about the Professor, married Flayn and become a God/King. If that is not something a canon ending sounded like I don't know what is. Other ending don't really seemed complete, especially Edalgard's route. She is just like a typical bad guy in a story, but just so happened to win. That is my opinion anyway.

[SSbardock84]

I haven't beaten the Silver Snow route yet, but I've done all the others. Each route has a bit of stuff that can definitely make it feel like it's the canon one. So I don't think any of them are meant to be the canon route. But if I had to choose one, it'd be Azure Moon. Especially in Part 1 there are more connections to enemies than the other routes and being the house that's blue, though that's a small detail, kind of makes you immediately think they're the main. The way Dimitri is written (though he's drastically different from any character before) makes you seem like he's the main good guy. It all feels very traditional for main FE heroes. It definitely feels like they put the most work into the Azure Moon route too.

[AbsoluteZer0Nova]

17 minutes ago, SSbardock84 said:

I haven't beaten the Silver Snow route yet, but I've done all the others. Each route has a bit of stuff that can definitely make it feel like it's the canon one. So I don't think any of them are meant to be the canon route. But if I had to choose one, it'd be Azure Moon. Especially in Part 1 there are more connections to enemies than the other routes and being the house that's blue, though that's a small detail, kind of makes you immediately think they're the main. The way Dimitri is written (though he's drastically different from any character before) makes you seem like he's the main good guy. It all feels very traditional for main FE heroes. It definitely feels like they put the most work into the Azure Moon route too.

Agreed, especially when Dimitri is suppose to be a deconstruction of the Marth arcehtype given his character development and then there's the fact his class of Lord goes to High Lord sounding similar to Chrom's Great Lord and other main lords prior. You have Ashe connected to Lonato, you have Sylvain connected to Miklan and you have Mercedes connected to Jeritza the Death Knight and but of course Dimitri connected to Edelgard being step siblings who both have a tragic past due to the ones who slither in the dark. Then add on the fact Edelgard is essentially the Hardin archetype character with others like Arvis and Walhart who have been on the opposing side and for Dimitri's path Edelgard is his foil like the others and their shared dynamic with their own opposition main lords of their games and she's red which for npcs are the enemies for the blue player control units. Claude on the other hand is the neutral ally type of character given his yellow though it's usually green in which for the other paths he's fittingly the 3rd party as such but the problem with what I would think would discredit GD being not canon is the fact it makes one of the three main lord characters dropped out of the story in a dull thoughtless way that really hurts its story like the writers couldn't think of anything to do with Dimitri here so had to write him off screen with such a baffling death.

Edited August 13, 2019 by AbsoluteZer0Nova

[timon]

They're probably all canon tbh, or better, there's no canon. For most players it'll be the first route they play.

For me, having played Crimson Flower and read the others, I'd say it definitely feels right. Edelgard is obviously the most "pushed" lord in the game (and in advertising), her route is "softlocked" and a bit hidden, and I think her point of view makes sense for how the game gives you hints about the Church in the first part.

But most of all, I feel like it's canon because it's the only path where Byleth gets to be himself, to free himself from what others made him to be, to get back his life. That feels like a good "canon" story.

[Mikethemaster2018]

29 minutes ago, AbsoluteZer0Nova said:

Agreed, especially when Dimitri is suppose to be a deconstruction of the Marth arcehtype given his character development and then there's the fact his class of Lord goes to High Lord sounding similar to Chrom's Great Lord and other main lords prior. You have Ashe connected to Lonato, you have Sylvain connected to Miklan and you have Mercedes connected to Jeritza the Death Knight and but of course Dimitri connected to Edelgard being step siblings who both have a tragic past due to the ones who slither in the dark. Then add on the fact Edelgard is essentially the Hardin archetype character with others like Arvis and Walhart who have been on the opposing side and for Dimitri's path Edelgard is his foil like the others and their shared dynamic with their own opposition main lords of their games and she's red which for npcs are the enemies for the blue player control units. Claude on the other hand is the neutral ally type of character given his yellow though it's usually green in which for the other paths he's fittingly the 3rd party as such but the problem with what I would think would discredit GD being not canon is the fact it makes one of the three main lord characters dropped out of the story in a dull thoughtless way that really hurts its story like the writers couldn't think of anything to do with Dimitri here so had to write him off screen with such a baffling death.

Seem like to me your kind of bias. you have fe 8 main male lead as your avatar lol. no hate though seem like you like the 'Hero' type of lead. I made this post because I been just looking at post and all your post I haven seen. put Eldegard as the villain he does everything evil and Dimitri as everything good.

[MaskedMaskoftheMasks]

15 minutes ago, timon said:

They're probably all canon tbh, or better, there's no canon. For most players it'll be the first route they play.

For me, having played Crimson Flower and read the others, I'd say it definitely feels right. Edelgard is obviously the most "pushed" lord in the game (and in advertising), her route is "softlocked" and a bit hidden, and I think her point of view makes sense for how the game gives you hints about the Church in the first part.

But most of all, I feel like it's canon because it's the only path where Byleth gets to be himself, to free himself from what others made him to be, to get back his life. That feels like a good "canon" story.

It involves you killing Judith and Hilda though, so that is bad 😛

(also I might be wrong, but isn't Edelgard's paralogue basically Hilda's and Cyril's paralogue?)

[timon]

6 minutes ago, MaskedMaskoftheMasks said:

It involves you killing Judith and Hilda though, so that is bad 😛

(also I might be wrong, but isn't Edelgard's paralogue basically Hilda's and Cyril's paralogue?)

Yeah, I was incredibly underwhelmed, I was hoping for something related to her past, not a copy past without true meaning for her character. Felt rushed, like many things in Crimson Flower.

[Mikethemaster2018]

8 minutes ago, timon said:

Yeah, I was incredibly underwhelmed, I was hoping for something related to her past, not a copy past without true meaning for her character. Felt rushed, like many things in Crimson Flower.

I haven't the game yet waiting for the switch light to drop got the game though lol.  is Eldegard route insanely rush or filter to the hilt with scenes from other routes. planing  on doing hers first because she interest me most.

Edited August 13, 2019 by Mikethemaster2018

[MaskedMaskoftheMasks]

7 minutes ago, Mikethemaster2018 said:

I haven't the game yet waiting for the switch light to drop got the game though lol.  is Eldegard route insanely rush or filter to the hilt with scenes from other routes. planing  on doing hers first because she interest me most.

I mean, she does have her own scenes and maps and such(and on maps that appear on other routes it seems you start from the defensive location where enemy is located in in other maps so that makes them different enough). But apparently she doesn't have as many anime cutscenes and her route is shortest(18 chapters compared to 22 blue lions and golden deer have)

And as said, she is only character who doesn't have her own unique paralogue story. Sure Shamir and Alois' use Derdriu's map from her route, but at least story wise its not identical to another character's paralogue.

[Mikethemaster2018]

12 minutes ago, MaskedMaskoftheMasks said:

I mean, she does have her own scenes and maps and such(and on maps that appear on other routes it seems you start from the defensive location where enemy is located in in other maps so that makes them different enough). But apparently she doesn't have as many anime cutscenes and her route is shortest(18 chapters compared to 22 blue lions and golden deer have)

And as said, she is only character who doesn't have her own unique paralogue story. Sure Shamir and Alois' use Derdriu's map from her route, but at least story wise its not identical to another character's paralogue.

Alright I understand  now. weird she was pushed the main lord of the game but she got the shortest route. probably to show she not one to prolong war even though she the antivillian character. hopefully some dlc come to expand on eldegard and the other lords character come out. I know they are adding new characters and locations DLC. also when part 2 star is it just chapter whatever number or does it start with part 2 chapter 1 for all the routes.

Edited August 13, 2019 by Mikethemaster2018

[BZL8]

Not sure this is the right place to post, but someone made a very nice infographic. Credits to SolvanderLyn on Reddit for making this.

 

[AbsoluteZer0Nova]

6 hours ago, Mikethemaster2018 said:

Seem like to me your kind of bias. you have fe 8 main male lead as your avatar lol. no hate though seem like you like the 'Hero' type of lead. I made this post because I been just looking at post and all your post I haven seen. put Eldegard as the villain he does everything evil and Dimitri as everything good.

I wouldn't necessarily say that, but more so I like the hero character that rises up from their past/hatred or just in general not succumbing to despair. Characters in point being like Batman, Guts and Velvet which I can say Dimitri joins them especially since he's the 1st FE lord that is as I said earlier a deconstruction of the Marth archetype so about time we had a lord like that. I don't count Lucina despite that she does follow the not succumbing to despair but it doesn't change her in a tragic sense as the others do. Also don't see how I'm wrong as like I said in other places Edelgard uses her tragic past as justification to meet the end result she wants giving her a Freudian excuse but it doesn't make her right. The reason why I view Lelouch from Code Geass who has been compared to her in a brighter light is because most of the overwhelming he fought were racists and when he did kill some innocents he did felt regret for his actions while Edelgard on the other hand doesn't. I like Edelgard but as a character not as a person. She's my 2nd favorite antagonist to Lyon and while she does have good in her having shades of gray not all grays are equal as she steps more into darker gray.

[Sentinel07]

There is one thing I do find a little curious. That Dimitri's path is the only route in the game where you can reunite the Heroes Relics from the 10 Elites plus Byleth's Sword of the Creator and Marianne's Blutgang if you want to count it.

Not saying at all that indicates canon of any kind. It's just a little fact I discovered that I find kind of funny.

[virtu333]

I did BL, BE, and GD and GD felt like the most "complete", other than doing my boy Dimitri dirty with his ending there.

But it handles the other two lords in a sensible way and actually tackles TWSITD. The number of cutscenes it has post time skip is somewhat indicative of it getting a lot of attention/being fleshed out.

I did love the deconstruction of the lord archetype in Dimitri's arc, but it ignored too much of the greater context to count. Edelgard's felt far too rushed and short for a path that was highlighted so much by the marketing.

[Mikethemaster2018]

3 hours ago, AbsoluteZer0Nova said:

I wouldn't necessarily say that, but more so I like the hero character that rises up from their past/hatred or just in general not succumbing to despair. Characters in point being like Batman, Guts and Velvet which I can say Dimitri joins them especially since he's the 1st FE lord that is as I said earlier a deconstruction of the Marth archetype so about time we had a lord like that. I don't count Lucina despite that she does follow the not succumbing to despair but it doesn't change her in a tragic sense as the others do. Also don't see how I'm wrong as like I said in other places Edelgard uses her tragic past as justification to meet the end result she wants giving her a Freudian excuse but it doesn't make her right. The reason why I view Lelouch from Code Geass who has been compared to her in a brighter light is because most of the overwhelming he fought were racists and when he did kill some innocents he did felt regret for his actions while Edelgard on the other hand doesn't. I like Edelgard but as a character not as a person. She's my 2nd favorite antagonist to Lyon and while she does have good in her having shades of gray not all grays are equal as she steps more into darker gray.

good point but you are overall bias with your views on heroes and villians. Eldegard is distinct and she keep her thoughts to herself we really dont know  how she feels for real. War ugly and it brings the worse out of us your looking at Eldegard as a civil modern mind.

[wissenschaft]

I think they promoted Edelgard so much because they new she would be quite the controversial and popular character. The endless discussion about her is proof enough of that.

@BZL8 That infographic is pretty awesome. Personally I will probably like the church route the best because resolves a lot going on in the plot while also making my avatar the divine hero. I guess I don't like sharing the spotlight. lol

Edited August 14, 2019 by wissenschaft

[Karimlan]

Reading that awesome infographic (props to whoever made that), we are reminded (I guess) of getting a full, 360-degree view of Fodlan and its environs, backstory, geopolitics and all that, such that no one path can be considered canon, but that might be a stretch on my part.

[MrPerson0]

20 hours ago, Sentinel07 said:

That Dimitri's path is the only route in the game where you can reunite the Heroes Relics from the 10 Elites plus Byleth's Sword of the Creator and Marianne's Blutgang if you want to count it. 

Not only that, but it's the route that you can recruit/have the most characters due to Dedue and Gilbert being locked there.

[Mylady]

On 8/1/2019 at 4:29 PM, Lord Otto said:

Look I am not trying to not be "nice", the whole point is what would you call canon. The reason why I pointed that out is due to RPG's and Roy's game. In Roy's is you miss those weapons which most people will do on the default play through is the default path sense you have to go out of your way/make sure to get those to get the canon ending. My point is about forcing others to prefer that ending my point is if one had to be made canon for a sequel that would most likely be the one due to that tradition. I don't see how that is disrespecting people. And it only matters if they make a sequel and make that ending or one of the another a canon ending. 

The hero getting the sacred weapons is a classic and obviously is canon, it's a matter of common sense. Theres no problem if the developers want to canonize a path or an event, it's their franchise and can do whatever they wish (though it's unececessary and takes out the players enjoyment of making their own choices, that is the point of this game beyond strategic playing, that's why the devs let everything open mowadays ). But the problem is some people that think they are more knowledgeable than others and spread misinformation creating a toxic behavior in the fandom like trying to say what is correct or not, using the word canon incorrectly. Sometimes default is canon, sometimes the hidden path is the "true" one, also trailers and promotional material don't point of canonicity for tons of reasons. 

 

As stated prior, there's no rule or pattern of what is canon or not, unless the developers or a sequel states so.

Edited August 19, 2019 by Mylady

[Humboldt]

I think that the Golden Deer route is the most canon. All of the important things that happen in the Church route also happen in the Golden Deer route. Additionally, the Golden Deer route is an official route. The Church route was kind of secretive, which leads me to believe it was just an easter egg. Golden Deer, on the other hand, was its own choice.