Fire Emblem Three Houses Unit Tier Lists

[Silly]

1 hour ago, Vorena said:

I have not played the golden deer, but that growth rate in non-combat/defensive stats and being 2+ range locked sort of hurt him. Access to flying later on is just that. I can see Claude resting somewhere around mid-upper on a long term list eventually.

Except Bows aren't really 2 range locked in this game. Close Counter is learned by everyone at C rank Bows (which is easily achievable after a small number of tutoring sessions) and completely removes the "bows have a bad enemy phase" drawback, which turns them into arguably the best physical weapon type in the game.

Not to mention that you could just uh... not use a bow. If it's super early in the game and you really need to counterattack at 1 range, just use a sword or an axe or something. No unit is actually locked into a specific weapon type in this game.

Claude is definitely comparable to the other two lords, if not better. All three lords share good base stats an an experience boosting ability, which is a big strength that puts them above most regular units that they all have in common.

In terms of pros compared to the other lords, Claude has a few really good things going for him. The first is strengths in some of the best skills in the game: Bows, Flying, and Axes (hidden talent). The second is that Claude's exclusive class is really good, as it is essentially a Wyvern Lord (one of the best classes) that trades Axefaire for Bowfaire, a reasonable tradeoff when you actually take into account how good bows are in this game. Compare that to Edelgard and Dimitri's exclusive classes, which are... a lot less good, and arguably worse than just keeping them in a regular class.

-----------------------------------------------

One thing that needs to be established here is that there isn't actually that much that differentiates most students.

They are all growth units that have basically perfect availability (on at least one of the three routes). In addition, outside of a small number of genderlocked classes, each student can basically reclass into whatever they want.

The main factors that I think should differentate students on a tier list are as follows:

* Unique Abilities/Spells/Combat Arts: This includes things like personal abilities (for example, Byleth's personal ability is very good, which should be taken into account), spells learned (for example, Lysithea learns Warp at B rank faith magic), and personal combat arts (for example, Bernadetta is one of only two units that get Deadeye, allowing her to attack from 5-6 spaces away).
* Growth rates: These actually are fairly relevant, considering basically everybody starts at level 1 and you will likely end your game around level 40ish.
* Skill Strengths/Weaknesses: How well does the unit's proficiencies align with particular classes? Greater emphasis should be placed on classes that are "good", such as Wyvern Lord, Bow Knight, etc.

What is less relevant:

* Base stats: In some cases this actually matters. For example, Byleth and the Lords start off with better bases than everyone else, which should be noted. But for the most part, all students start with pretty similar (low) base stats, so for the sake of most comparisons they will be roughly equal in this department.
* Personal Weapons: This is probably not super relevant, considering relic weapons are not actually exclusive in this game (though matching the weapon's crest gives you a small upside most of the time), but it's technically a thing that differentiates units.

Edited August 3, 2019 by Silly

[Errorik]

1 hour ago, Silly said:

Except Bows aren't really 2 range locked in this game. Close Counter is learned by everyone at C rank Bows (which is easily achievable after a small number of tutoring sessions) and completely removes the "bows have a bad enemy phase" drawback, which turns them into arguably the best physical weapon type in the game.

Not to mention that you could just uh... not use a bow. If it's super early in the game and you really need to counterattack at 1 range, just use a sword or an axe or something. No unit is actually locked into a specific weapon type in this game.

Claude is definitely comparable to the other two lords, if not better. All three lords share good base stats an an experience boosting ability, which is a big strength that puts them above most regular units that they all have in common.

In terms of pros compared to the other lords, Claude has a few really good things going for him. The first is strengths in some of the best skills in the game: Bows, Flying, and Axes (hidden talent). The second is that Claude's exclusive class is really good, as it is essentially a Wyvern Lord (one of the best classes) that trades Axefaire for Bowfaire, a reasonable tradeoff when you actually take into account how good bows are in this game. Compare that to Edelgard and Dimitri's exclusive classes, which are... a lot less good, and arguably worse than just keeping them in a regular class.

-----------------------------------------------

One thing that needs to be established here is that there isn't actually that much that differentiates most students.

They are all growth units that have basically perfect availability (on at least one of the three routes). In addition, outside of a small number of genderlocked classes, each student can basically reclass into whatever they want.

The main factors that I think should differentate students on a tier list are as follows:

* Unique Abilities/Spells/Combat Arts: This includes things like personal abilities (for example, Byleth's personal ability is very good, which should be taken into account), spells learned (for example, Lysithea learns Warp at B rank faith magic), and personal combat arts (for example, Bernadetta is one of only two units that get Deadeye, allowing her to attack from 5-6 spaces away).
* Growth rates: These actually are fairly relevant, considering basically everybody starts at level 1 and you will likely end your game around level 40ish.
* Skill Strengths/Weaknesses: How well does the unit's proficiencies align with particular classes? Greater emphasis should be placed on classes that are "good", such as Wyvern Lord, Bow Knight, etc.

What is less relevant:

* Base stats: In some cases this actually matters. For example, Byleth and the Lords start off with better bases than everyone else, which should be noted. But for the most part, all students start with pretty similar (low) base stats, so for the sake of most comparisons they will be roughly equal in this department.
* Personal Weapons: This is probably not super relevant, considering relic weapons are not actually exclusive in this game (though matching the weapon's crest gives you a small upside most of the time), but it's technically a thing that differentiates units.

Looks right to me. I'd call weaknesses in the best skills (with no budding talent) a death sentence based off the criteria you've listed. Weaknesses in riding/lances/flying/faith? Go sit on the bench!

[Vorena]

Getting to C rank bows will likely take 2-3 chapter months for any unit starting at rank E with dedicated focus. Bows will always deal with +2 range player phase attack. This can be hindrance for formation, but will depend as it can make you deal with awkward spots in clustered areas and early on you'll be lacking mobility. Canto alleviates most of the player phase issues bows provide. Depending upon the unit going from C bows -> riding/flying is just another requirement to make using Bows great. 

Getting into a riding/flying class just means you need to meet the class requirement to reclass into it further lengthening the time/resources needed to make bows worthwhile for any particular unit. Granted I cannot recall how soon you can get 1-2 weapons like levin sword, hand axe, and javelin early in the game. 

 

[Technoweirdo]

4 hours ago, Vorena said:

Getting to C rank bows will likely take 2-3 chapter months for any unit starting at rank E with dedicated focus. Bows will always deal with +2 range player phase attack. This can be hindrance for formation, but will depend as it can make you deal with awkward spots in clustered areas and early on you'll be lacking mobility. Canto alleviates most of the player phase issues bows provide. Depending upon the unit going from C bows -> riding/flying is just another requirement to make using Bows great. 

Getting into a riding/flying class just means you need to meet the class requirement to reclass into it further lengthening the time/resources needed to make bows worthwhile for any particular unit. Granted I cannot recall how soon you can get 1-2 weapons like levin sword, hand axe, and javelin early in the game. 

 

You get Javelins and Hand Axes (no Levin Sword) the same time as the Mini Bow -- the 1-2 range option for bow users.
The Mini Bow is as light as it sounds at 3 Wt. Meanwhile, Javelins and Hand Axes are 8 and 10 Wt respectively.
To note, it can't double up close while Havelins and Hand Axes can double up close or afar, but 8 Str isn't enough to to make Javelins weightless this time around;
No, Javelin weight is too much in the early game to the point that you'll be the one getting doubled.

Really, black mages (not white 'cause Nosferatu weighs a lot) are the only ones with "I can be anywhere" positioning. Well, at least in the early game.
Once you hit Lv. 10 though, suddenly bow users can be anywhere. They can go Cavalier for 7 Mov and Canto or Archer for 5 Mov and +1 bow range.
Both will definitely have Close Counter by that time unless you're making someone who can't use bows use a bow.
By that time, they'll also have access to the Training Bow+ via the Blacksmith which basically turns it into a Mini Bow capable of doubling up close.
Meanwhile, mages? Stuck at 4 Mov and their range is the same. Takes until Lv. 30 to get a mount and S-rank Reason/Faith for extra range w/o special, limited equipment.

 

[virtu333]

Aside from Byleth and the 3 main lords, I'd say Leonie is the next best character.

• Personal Skill: +2 attack/-2 damage when next to male character
  • Arguably one of the best personal besides Sylvain/Lord personals
• Key base stats: 9 strength, 9 speed, 7 defense
  • Compare to Claude's 11/8/6 base stats
• Key growths; 40% str / 60% spd /40 % defense
  • Tied for highest speed growth
  • Only Dedue / Raphael have a higher defense growth (50/45 respectively)
• Key proficiencies: Lance, Bow, Riding
  • No weaknesses

Leonie is a really min-maxxed character that can succeed real fast - her bases are just about comparable to your main lords but very importantly, she gets a personal boost that basically makes her 11/9/9.

Combine that with her very solid growths, she's really well suited to both double AND tank early - perfect for snowballing and she can do so at a level only the lords can do.

Most importantly, she has really good proficiencies, given how good bows and bow knights are in this game. The proficiencies are so good that even if you recruit her from another house, she'll have ranks in the right spots so you don't have to train her from scratch. And having optimal profiencies means you can start ranking authority for better battalions sooner.

Sylvain seems like he should come close given his personal, but his slightly less min-maxxed bases (9/8/6) and, kind of important, weakness in bows, hurts his performance relative to Leonie. That said, Sylvain is also free in another house if you pick female Byleth.

Her main weakness is that res - luckily, mages don't exist early game, the promotion process gets her big res gains, Paladin gives access to Aegis, and archers outrange mages.

Edited August 3, 2019 by virtu333

[Errorik]

I've been noticing I don't use my mages very much. They barely leave the starting area and the map is already completed. I've been following solo goal reason or faith and then solo riding once A is reached. Even then, stumbling around with 4-5 move for so long really puts them behind, especially reason units. Faith has physic at least as well as ways to spam spells for xp (rescue/warp/ward/heal lvld units).

[Thane]

1 hour ago, Centh said:

I've been noticing I don't use my mages very much. They barely leave the starting area and the map is already completed. I've been following solo goal reason or faith and then solo riding once A is reached. Even then, stumbling around with 4-5 move for so long really puts them behind, especially reason units. Faith has physic at least as well as ways to spam spells for xp (rescue/warp/ward/heal lvld units).

Lysithea with Lorentz's family heirloom, and maybe Shoes of the Wind if you want to go ham, has a good chance of making her one of your most valuable members, I'd say. Honestly I don't know what I'd do without her sometimes.

[Errorik]

You know, I think I'll spend some time tiering casters. They seem to have the largest constraints given how mounted heavy the rest of the roster will be using efficient/best classes. Within faith users, not having physic is horrendous. I'm currently doing BE (only done BL so far) and I recruited Lysithea for the first time given her growths/spells/etc. I'm finding Lindhardt is out performing her. She does have a much much better offense, which Lindhart doesn't even get close to, but I don't have to baby Lindhardt. He can keep up in xp with physic, which makes it easier to access his warp at A. Perhaps going Golden Deer would put Lysithea higher, since you'd have more time when everyone has crap move to get her going, but only having 1-2 as a caster is problematic.

[ra2bk]

Here's a look at the units' expected stats with the same class growths (Fighter->->Mercenary->Wyvern Rider->Wyvern Lord for the record) by level 40, including individual base stats and character growths, color scaled for each stat. Threw in a couple roles by simply adding a few stats together. This does not include any class base stats or class change minimum boosts, which can help characters with min-maxed stats the most (essentially fixes their min a bit).

Edited August 3, 2019 by ra2bk

[dragonlordsd]

Nice. Ingrid is surprisingly tanky, so it's interesting to see that confirmed.

Lysithea's low ranking is a little obvious once you realize she has the lowest strength and defense by 3 points each.

I thought I got lucky with Hubert being almost as powerful as her, but he's only got slightly lower magic and speed growths.

[Silly]

2 hours ago, Centh said:

I've been noticing I don't use my mages very much. They barely leave the starting area and the map is already completed. I've been following solo goal reason or faith and then solo riding once A is reached. Even then, stumbling around with 4-5 move for so long really puts them behind, especially reason units. Faith has physic at least as well as ways to spam spells for xp (rescue/warp/ward/heal lvld units).

I think having too many mages on your team is a bad thing, but having a couple of mages is really nice. Magic users as a whole pretty much suffer from the fact that they are really squishy and have terrible movement (until level 30 at the minimum), which are very big negatives. However, they also bring very big positives too, which means that if your team doesn't have any mages at all then you will really feel it.

The first benefit is obviously free healing from faith users, though I do find healers without Physic to be much worse than those that have Physic, given how difficult it is to keep your mages right next to your physical units due to the movement difference. The second is the extreme utility that comes with some of the higher level faith spells, namely Warp and Rescue. The third is the nuke potential from many mages, especially reason users with high level magic. Though mages have relatively poor enemy phases in this game due to being weak defensively, they have really good player phases, basically being able to delete a single unit with no questions asked. This is really helpful because you sometimes really need to remove a problematic enemy here or there, and is very good at handling otherwise difficult bosses.

[timon]

I'd say it also depends on the way you play. I rarely rush, and by moving my army slowly my mages can keep the pace just fine, also yes their defense is shit, but they're your best bet to lure out enemy mages.

Maybe I'm overdoing it, but in my current playthrough I consistently use 4-5 mages + dancer Dorothea, and they're all amazing. I tend to turtle up and bait people out to remove them in player phase, and having that many magic users makes that job extremely easy. Never been one to Rescue rush the boss with cavalry, so it works for me I guess.

Also I've rarely found enemies with good Res, the exception being Pegasus Knights (of which I haven't faced many), even opposing mages/healers go down surprisingly easy.

[Tharne]

Just finished GD, all my units ended between lvl 47 (Byleth) and 44.

Here are the battles/victories stats at the end :

Byleth [Mercenary  -> Hero -> Enlightned One (mastered during last chapter)] = 241/148 
Claude  [Lord -> Wyvern Rider-> unique class -> unique class] = 167/111
Lorenz [Mage -> Warlock -> Dark Knight] = 190/113
Raphael [Armored Knight -> Fortress Knight -> War Master]  = 224/111
Ignatz [Thief -> Assassin -> Mortal Savant] 198/120
Lysithea [Mage -> Warlock -> Gremory] = 125/98
Marianne [Priest -> Bishop -> Holy Knight] = 133/90
Hilda [Pegasus Knight -> Brigand...(don't do that people) -> Falcon Knight] = 195/125
Leonie [Archer -> Sniper -> Bow Knight] = 187/118
Cyril = [Brigand -> Warrior (wanted to stay Warrior for that good old Axe + Bow feeling from GBA and was really late to pick up Gauntlet to go War Master by the end)] 156/101
Flayn just danced

They all are pretty close to each other. I am happy.

From how I felt while playing : 

-Byleth (got speed screwed toward the end) I didn't really know what to do with him to be honest, he was just kinda there but strong...and mastering Enlightned One took too long. N°4
-Claude got a bit speed screwed but still really effective. N°3
-Lorenz got pretty screwed in everything except HP and Res but he was still okay. N°9
-Raphael that dude couldn't really die and was hitting like a truck. N°2
-Ignatz a.k.a. One who slither in the Crit, got a bit screwed early on but 55% crit minimum on every attack for the last third of the game is a good feeling . N°7
-Lysithea got really fucking screwed Mag and Spd wise before timeskip while gaining so much Lck it was absurd (still strong though) but it seems that the few lvl they gained during the timeskip rectified that a little which was weird (and Lucky) ; still all of her spells are crazy with effectiveness against beast, high res, horses + warp...and with the Gloucester Staff it's kinda stupid. N°1
-Marianne a.k.a. The Crit Goddess, all of her spells having good crit made her useful a lot of times + Physic. N°8
-Hilda was awful (maybe because I changed her from Pegasus to Brigand ? but since I had mastered it and that the Brigand mastery is pretty cool) for like 3/4 of the game. N°10
-Leonie Spd screwed (a little) but Dex and Str blessed, Bow Range +2 is stupid (would have given it to Sniper and not Bow Knight to be honest...). N°5
-Cyril STRONK, no really he's really good. N°6
 

Final Ranking :
Lysithea
Raphael
Claude
Byleth
Leonie
Cyril
Ignatz
Marianne
Lorenz
Hilda

[Kuralul]

Uhmmm. I finished the church route and my most valuable units were basically my 3 swordmasters. Byleth, Petra and Catherine. With Sword Crit+10, Swordfaire, Sword Prowess and Alert Stance (and Vantage if you want). By the end of the game, the three reach around 50 speed and 40 str at lvl 47 or something. You can just send them with Wo Dao+ and Evasion Rings to ten enemies and no one can hit them, and oneshot crit everything (you get around 85 crit with that build). 

For mages I'll go with Dorothea that can get around 40 speed and 40 mag by the end of the game. Also Thoron and Meteor are really useful skills. 

Mercedes is insanely useful with Psychic and Fortify. 

[Ciaran]

I have found fliers to be more valuable than cavalry in the Empire and GD routes just given the number of maps with difficult cavalry terrain (desert, stairs, waters, etc). Might be an attempt to help re-balance how powerful cavalry classes have been in previous games? 

Having said that -- I suspect there will end up being different tier lists for each route? Given character availability differences and all.

I feel like given how the class/ability systems work in this game "potential" is going to be weighted far more heavily than in previous installments -- most of the characters start out with low bases and your influence in their growth becomes vital very early on, but strengths, spell lists, inherent skills and battle skills are going to have heavy influence over the "practicality" of the students, at least.

For example -- Ashe's stat growths might matter less than him being able to be a flying lock picker. He might not be the strongest Wyvern Lord in terms of pure combat potential, but he's likely a highly valuable team member all the same. Similarly Dorothea gets such great spell lists she makes a great Gremory even if her stats aren't anything amazing -- Thoron, Meteor and Physic mean she can contribute meaningfully from a distance, especially if you give her one of the range extending staves.

[timon]

2 hours ago, Ciaran said:

For example -- Ashe's stat growths might matter less than him being able to be a flying lock picker. He might not be the strongest Wyvern Lord in terms of pure combat potential, but he's likely a highly valuable team member all the same.

I see where you're coming from and I thought the same going in, but the thing is: you're mostly covered in gold and keys are really cheap, before going into a fight you can just check the map for chests and give the keys to whoever you want to go get it. That said, I still think Ashe makes a fine WyvernLord, strength in Axe let's you get there without sacrificing Bows, and once you're on a wyvern just drop the axe and embrace the flying archer power.

[Vorena]

 

3 hours ago, Ciaran said:

I have found fliers to be more valuable than cavalry in the Empire and GD routes just given the number of maps with difficult cavalry terrain (desert, stairs, waters, etc). Might be an attempt to help re-balance how powerful cavalry classes have been in previous games? 

Having said that -- I suspect there will end up being different tier lists for each route? Given character availability differences and all.

 I feel like given how the class/ability systems work in this game "potential" is going to be weighted far more heavily than in previous installments -- most of the characters start out with low bases and your influence in their growth becomes vital very early on, but strengths, spell lists, inherent skills and battle skills are going to have heavy influence over the "practicality" of the students, at least.

 For example -- Ashe's stat growths might matter less than him being able to be a flying lock picker. He might not be the strongest Wyvern Lord in terms of pure combat potential, but he's likely a highly valuable team member all the same. Similarly Dorothea gets such great spell lists she makes a great Gremory even if her stats aren't anything amazing -- Thoron, Meteor and Physic mean she can contribute meaningfully from a distance, especially if you give her one of the range extending staves.

There is even surprisingly few number of archers as well where the bonus effect on fliers is harmful. I am unsure of other routes, but you get a flying effect nullify by 2/3 to 3/4 of the way through the game on Edie's route or just S+ flying. Granted, increasing flying to S+ feels like it takes forever with how hard it is to increase, but for something like pegasus knight you even get free evasion on top of high speed for just doing nothing into enemy phase which is the strongest attack portion anyway? +15/+30 avoid? Geez. Even getting a massive +6 AS on player phase for initiating combat. 

If only Meteor double in usage on Gremory >;(

[BaKaDaNaa]

What do you guys think is the best class line for Petra? Swordmaster? Wyvern Lord? Falcon Knight? Seems like she could be pretty good in any of those, so I don't know what to do with her (recruited her into Golden Deer, if that matters).

[dragonlordsd]

3 hours ago, BaKaDaNaa said:

What do you guys think is the best class line for Petra? Swordmaster? Wyvern Lord? Falcon Knight? Seems like she could be pretty good in any of those, so I don't know what to do with her (recruited her into Golden Deer, if that matters).

Assassin worked best for me.

My petra looked something like this at level 20:

Str: 21

Mag: 9

Dex: 12

Spd: 28

Def: 13

Res: 8

So, I went with Assassin, and I've really liked that. Overall, Assassin seems to be objectively better than Swordmaster, but I'm still messing around.

Assassin gives Swordfaire, Locktouch, and Stealth, and both Lethality and Assassinate for mastery.

Swordmaster has Swordfaire, Sword crit +10 (Which is pretty good), but only gives Astra.

On my next playthrough, I'll probably go all in on making her a flier. She's strong in Flying, and I think she's well specced to be a wyvern.

Edited August 5, 2019 by dragonlordsd

[Nio]

3 hours ago, BaKaDaNaa said:

What do you guys think is the best class line for Petra? Swordmaster? Wyvern Lord? Falcon Knight? Seems like she could be pretty good in any of those, so I don't know what to do with her (recruited her into Golden Deer, if that matters).

For me Wyvern and it is not even close. As always, Flying units are broken and that class gives her +speed and strength growths, so her amazing base growths get even better. She is good with Axes and Flying, so going Wyvern Rider is easy for her, then you just need a little lance levels (not even C, someting like D/D+ gives you 60+ pass rate).

All that with Axefaire, Canto, Avoid +10 and Alert Stance from her Flying skill makes her one of (if not the best, at least for me) dodge tanks thanks to her speed and abilities and can double almost anything.

So yeah, for me, Wyvern Petra is not even a question. Best class for her and best unit for that class.

[Ciaran]

6 hours ago, Vorena said:

If only Meteor double in usage on Gremory >;(

It does, though -- Gremory doubles all magic usage amounts. Class is nuts.

[pikahu]

I just finished my Black Eagle Edelgard route run on Hard/Classic and just wanted to leave some of my thoughts on the characters I used. Due to the nature of the route, I probably had the least characters available to use and I'll probably go back to my branching save and play through church to get some opinions on characters I couldn't use fully, and then wait until Lunatic comes out to begin another campaign (thinking GD)

TLDR/Intro: I take the belief that this is a very player phase focused game, relying on attacking out of range/repositioning with Canto on mounted ranged high damage units while having tankier units keep enemies away from your high damage units. My general impressions are that magic can be pretty overpowered, but you can really only have 2 since they must use the relics that increase magic range (Thyrsus, Caduceus) and they don't deal damage to late-game monsters that are immune to magic damage pre-armor break. I think spell lists really dictate which spellcasters are more useful over anything else. Other than that, mounted characters that can reposition after attacking are very useful for minimizing damage (Flyers > Bow Knights > other mounts) for offensive units. The fact that the unique classes for MC and Edelgard weren't mounted made them harder to use, but they still ended up decently strong. I typically always have a dancer and healer unit for support, and I initially chose based on how much utility they can provide, but throughout hard mode there were often situations that they would need to take at least one attack, so having high enough HP/Spd is crucial and I would imagine even more so in harder difficulties.

My 10-unit comps always ended like this: MC, Edelgard, 2 Offensive Magic, 2 Flyers, Dancer, dedicated healer, 1 bow knight, and 1 filler mounted unit (bow knight/dark knight/great knight). I ended up not using combat arts/gambits much because I preferred the damage of doubling, but I can see how experimenting with them might change my opinions on some units, particularly elevating slower ones. I also never used Brawling, but from what I saw from the enemies that used it, I have little interest in it.

Characters not recruited: Dmitri, Dedue, Sylvain, Ashe, Claude, Hilda, Raphael, Seteth, Cyril, Catherine, Gilbert

S-Tier (Essential)

- Dorothea (Mercenary --> Warlock --> Mortal Savant): Glass cannon mage archetype. Theoretically, she is just an okay unit (not so great growths, doesn't have a crest), but she did get MVP on more than half of my battles. She had high Mag/Spd in my run to double units/oneshot them, had better movement than other casters as a Mortal Savant (Gremory not too useful for her since she doesn't have a lot of white magic utility, though I really like Psychic), and having Thoron/Meteor/Agnea's Arrow offensively allowed her to be very flexible. Maybe spending time in Mercenary helped with her Spd growth (made her Merc for Vantage, but I didn't really didn't need it on her since she was never in range to be damaged). Her personal ability was very convenient for early game, an area where magic classes are usually lacking, and her sword capability quickly let her use Levin Sword+ for early 1-3 range (she also gets Thoron early for additional range as well). I could see her dipping into lower tiers with RNG (relatively poor growths) and less investment though, but mages with the additional magic range are immediately S-tier IMO and Dorothea is a great choice with her Black magic spell list (and Psychic).

- Lysithea (Mage --> Warlock --> Gremory): Glass cannon mage archetype. She will probably consistently be one of the best units in the game. She got a bit Spd screwed in my run so it took a while before she came online, but she started one-shoting a lot of units before she could double them anyway. She probably has the best spell list in the game, her growths are perfect for a mage glass cannon, she comes with two crests (though one is not so useful since I never used combat arts with her), and her ability makes her master skills so quickly. Could see her as being a good choice for mortal savant with Thunderbrand, but she came a bit too late to raise her sword, and Gremory does give an additional cast of Warp (also didn't get Thunderbrand since didn't have Catherine).

A-Tier (Great units, minor flaws)

- Byleth (Merc --> Hero --> Warrior --> Enlightened One): Hero Archetype. So a bit of context, when I was planning builds for this game I was more focused on getting abilities from mastering classes. I felt abilities were OP in Awakening and Fates and was under the impression that Byleth would be the most flexible character to get them. Turns out, if you want to spend time recruiting/training your students (my preferred way to play, one of my favorite things to do is the recruit everybody even if don't use them), it'll be pretty hard for Byleth to gain skill experience required for the certifications. So my plan for him to have Vantage/Wrath/Lifetaker went out the window and next time I would just focus on his sword talents. Regardless, Byleth still held his own, with getting 1-2 range weapon very early on and still doubling units later into the game. Could have greater potential if more optimized, but with my team composition, he ends up being one of the tanks for my more powerful ranged units.

- Petra (Merc --> Wyvern Rider --> Wyvern Lord): If a swordmaster could fly archetype. She ended up with 50 spd in my playthrough. Petra ended up being a doubling monster could oneshot units and relied on evasion to dodge counterattacks. In past games Wyvern lords were pretty tanky but that's not the case with Petra, but it wasn't too bad since she could reposition with Canto if she got hit. I ended up giving her some Dex boosting items since she had some difficulty hitting with axes, but she could reliably go ahead, take care of squishy units, then reposition out of the way so the enemy can't retaliate. She's a bit too squishy though, so I often had to retreat after getting hit once.

- Ingrid (Pegasus --> Paladin --> Falcon): Pegasus Knight arcetype. She ended up being very balanced with high stats all around, but lacking a little in Str. Wasn't too much of an issue in hard as she could one shot squishier units, but I could see how she can turn out a lot worse with some RNG. I tag team her with Petra, letting Ingrid focus on magic enemies since she took no damage from them and tanking shots for Petra if she couldn't far enough away with Canto. She's a very good well rounded unit, but I feel like she's hampered by not being min-max.

- Leonie (Cav --> Paladin --> Bow Knight): If an archer was buff and speedy at the same time archetype. I got Leonie pretty late because the B-tier support was locked until certain events transpired and I was not about to train Byleth in lances. But she ended up being a stud anyway. I feel like archers in this game can be pretty OP because Bow Knight naturally gives +2 range AND Canto, letting you reliably attack without retaliation. The major drawback of a lot of archers in this game is that they are hindered by low damage, which was not a problem with her due to her abnormally high Str. She's also not even squishy, she had like 30 Def by end of game. Would be S-tier on GD, but availability hinders her on other routes since you really can't rush recruiting her unless you want Byleth to train in lances.

- Edelgard (Merc --> Warrior --> Fortress --> Emperor): Hector archetype, but not as good. I always though that Edelgard should be really strong, but a lot of things must not have went my way during my playthrough. She ended up with 15 speed at the end of the game, which is hilariously bad but shouldn't be too concerning since she is an armored lord and shouldn't be taking damage. But swordmasters in the later levels were still taking out 1/3 of her health every time and she didn't do enough damage to consistently oneshot them back. My build for her ended up doing wonders for most of the game, having vantage and wrath allowed her to take out opponents before they can attack, and Pavise helped her survive a lot of melee attacks. She's theoretically a great unit with good growths, two crests, unique weapon, etc. But unfortunately she didn't scale very well into late-game for me.

B-Tier (Role Players)

- Ignatz (Archer --> Sniper --> Bow Knight): Actual archer archetype. Ignatz doesn't look very good on paper, but he worked out pretty well when I played him. His personal skill helped out a lot with max range bow attacks, where you can reliably use it to attack out of range (largely 90-100 hit chance opposed to 70-80 from Leonie). Like a typical archer, his Str held him back from dealing damage to tankier targets, but he was definitely useful to chip away at targets to allow characters like Byleth and Edelgard to kill enemies without retaliation. I would say he's very reliable due to how his personal skill synergizes with Bow Knight, one of the strongest units imo, but he isn't spectacular in any way.

- Hubert (Merc --> Paladin --> Dark Knight): Tankier mounted mage archetype. I have to admit, I really screwed up Hubert's build, so much so that he wasn't usable for the majority of the game (I didn't invest in Reason and couldn't change him to Dark Knight until the final two chapters). The correct thing to do would've been to stick to magic classes. The fact that I screwed up so much but he was still useful in the last two battles speaks to how good of a unit he should be. Perhaps with the proper investment, he would've taken Dorothea's place as the most useful unit in my playthrough: his stats are better and dark knight gives him more mobility. But having played with Dorothea carrying my team, it's a hard argument to make, and you only have 2 items that increase magic range (and you definitely want Lysithea using one of them).

- Ferdinand (Merc --> Paladin --> Fortress --> Great Knight): Speedy Tanky Knight archetype. Ferdinand to me is a very well balanced unit. His skill aptitude made it very easy to get certifications for skills I wanted for a tanky unit (Vantage, Pavise, Aegis), but he will not be as tanky or do as much damage as Edelgard. He has more mobility as a great knight and actually got enough speed to double a lot of units at end game, but he doesn't seem to excel in any particular area, making him good to take a couple of hits, particularly if he is at full health and is hiding in evasion boosting terrain. He mainly fills the role of another tank on my team, maybe units like Sylvain or Hilda can be used in his place.

- Manuela (Priest --> Bishop --> Holy Knight): Healer/Utility archetype. Manuela is a character with pretty good stats/growths and a good spell list (Warp/Silence/Bolting if you get her Reason to A). Unfortunately, she's all over the place. It feels like her stats/growths/skills are split between making her a pegasus knight and a healer, so she'll never be truly optimized. She might make a pretty good dancer if she could become one, but I'm not sure if that's possible. Anyway, her spell list provides a lot of utility so she makes a great choice to fill in as a healer and her stats do make her strong enough to not get one-shotted by enemies that do manage to attack.

C-Tier (Unrealized Potential)

- Bernadetta (Archer --> Bench): Archer archetype. I was using Bernie as my primary archer early on, and theoretically I think she may be better than Ignatz. Archers typically suffer from not doing enough damage, her personal skill gives +5 atk when not at full health. Additionally she has a creat that sometimes allows her to attack multiple times, and her skills make it much easier for her to get that riding and lance skill levels for Bow Knight. Unfortunately she felt too frail, as in when she couldn't really survive two hits to take advantage of her passive ability. Maybe with investment she can really shine, and I will consider recruiting her if I need another bow knight in addition to Leonie.

- Linhardt (Priest --> Bench): Healer/Mage archetype. Linhardt ties Lysithea with having 10 learned spells, the highest in the game. He has access to Warp and Psychic on the white magic side, which provides pretty good healing and utility. However, his 5 black magic spells lack variation, and he ends up being a bit too frail/slow in case an enemy slips by and doubles him. I could see how he could fit in as your healer (his crest sometimes gives him extra healing power), but I ultimately went with Manuela as mine, as she has higher speed and health for survivability. 

D-Tier (Just Bad)

- Annette (Mage --> Dancer): Mage/Rally archetype. I theorized that Annette could have pretty good utility as a rally bot/dancer. Her personal skill already gives her rally str, so I figured leveling Authority for more Rally skills and making her a dancer could be a good idea. Don't get me wrong, it worked out but I ended up not needing to rally too much in this game, as I valued dancing much more (re-positioning, extra damage). And anyone can be a dancer. Her problems are her terrible HP and Spd, making her a goner if enemies manage to attack, and her spell list is not that great either. She probably makes for the best Rally bot in the game, but unless that is useful on harder difficulties, I would never use her again.

- Caspar (Brigand --> Bench): Brawler archetype. Caspar is pretty well optimized to become your Brawler. Unfortunately, he was just okay before trying out brawling, and once I tried out brawling it just wasn't very good. Brawling IMO is good on slower units with high STR to get in a double with fists and a follow-up with Warmaster mastered ability. Caspar is not that slow, and his other stats don't make him particularly strong or tanky. I also don't feel a need for Warmaster as a class since it's not great vs tankier units, and would rather have high mobility units attack the squishier ranged units (may change with more experimentation). You could make Caspar a Wyvern Lord, but I bet he'll just be worse than Petra.

Characters recruited but ended up not using much (Doesn't mean they're bad, but likely are unless otherwise noted)

- Flayn (Priest --> Bishop --> Effectively Benched): Healer/Utility archetype. I probably would've had Flayn in my main party as a healer if I could use her. She is effectively the only unit in the game that could use Rescue, and I could see how Foritfy would be useful for healing a lot of units at once. The main problem would be her HP/Spd growth, I would need to keep her far far away from enemies if I wanted to use her. Even so, I could see myself trying to make her a Germory for extra utility uses or a Dancer. I would tentatively put her high B-tier.

- Marianne (Priest --> Bench): Healer archetype. She was an option for my healer unit. She is pretty well optimized to become a Holy Knight, and has some pretty good spells like Psychic, Silence, and Thoron. I went with Manuela though because she ended up tankier, faster, and had Warp. I woudl tentatively put her low B-tier/high C-tier.

- Felix (Myrm --> Bench): Swordmaster/Assassin (RIP) archetype. I could see how he could be a great early game unit, but I didn't recruit him in the early game. His passive effectively lets him do +5 damage in the early game where battalions were weaker, his crest occasionally lets him do more damage, and his relic occasionally mitigates incoming damage. If there was a master swordmaster-type class in this game, he could carry into end game, but unfortunately mortal savant doesn't do that for him. It's seemingly a good fit with his hidden talent in reason, but he only learns 2 black magic spells. From what I experienced so far, dodge tanking is also not that great in this game, which is unfortunate as I like those types of characters from older games. I can see how he can definitely carry the BL early game in Lunatic+ though, so he'll definitely be useful. I'm considering trying out dancer Felix though, with sword avoid stats and damage mitigation he might definitely survive pretty well and transition into late-game as a utility role. I would tentatively put him high B-tier just because his early game is so good.

- Shamir (Sniper --> Bench): Archer archetype. I wish I spent more time with Shamir. She came pre-promoted as a Sniper (pre lvl 20) with very good bases, but to me her growths seemed like it'll be tough for her to survive any hits. I had to use her once for a Paralogue and she held her own though. I would tentatively put her high C-tier.

- Lorenz (Cav --> Bench): Paladin/Magic hybrid archetype. I feel like he could make a pretty good Dark Knight. As a cavalier he certainly held his own when I had to play though his paralogue, I would be a bit concerned about his magic growth if he does go down that route. Definitely recruit him for his paralogue though, that +2 mag range staff is too good. Tentatively mid to low B-tier.

- Alois (Warrior --> Bench): Brawler archetype. Bad growths, got him too late, no time to use. Tentatively D-tier.

- Mercedes (Bishop --> Bench): Healer archetype. I feel like she could be a great healer, her passive skill makes it so she's self sufficient in healing herself and her stats seem like they will just let her survive. She doesn't have a lot of variability in her spells (a lot of 1-2 damage black magic, a lot of healing and not other utility for white magic), but I don't know if she needs more than that. Would've probably used her over Manuela. Tentatively mid to high B-tier.

- Hanneman (Mage --> Bench): Mage archetype. Has a relatively easy path to dark knight, but his very low speed growth is a detriment to what would normally be a damage carry role. He does have pretty good variety of spells though (Thoron, Meteor) so I could definitely see a world in which he's useful. Tentatively low B-tier high C-tier.

[redlight]

I think I should mention that the best users of Stride are units with Physic and/or siege magic, but Physic is obtained rather early. Physic units don't need to really catch up all that much because of their massive healing range. If you're dispatching your units against enemies, chances are that you're not using up all of your movement every turn letting Physic users catch up probably when they've just run of out Physic uses so they can Stride again. I've only experience with Mercedes (who's great BTW), but I should've focused on making her a Holy Knight. She might have a weakness in lances, but she only needs it to be at C.

Flayn can see use on maps with demonic beasts as their AOE attacks inflict status effects. Her spell being AOE does wonders. Also on maps with many gambit users. Unfortunately she has a weakness in riding (needs A to be Holy Knight) and her lance rank is E+. She's pretty niche.

I think you can you can Canto with rallies. In that case Annette can be a peg knight that gives atk/res+4 to anyone across the map and occasionally finish off low health enemies. Because she has an affinity for axes she can jump into Wyvern Rider after Pegasus Knight.

[Garlyle]

As I completed my Golden Deer route, here's my tier list for their house. I include units that I recruited and used as well.

Top Tier

Lysithea - She is probably the best mage in the game. Can access magic skills earlier than others, and her repertoire contains Luna, Warp and Seraphim. Her only issue is how squishy she can be, so once you completed Lorenz's paralogue, the Thyrsus can be automatically given to her to attack in long range. Very useful until the lategame thanks to her high Mag stat, which went above 40 for me.

Catherine - She was probably the only unit I didn't class change, because she was amazing in the one she starts with. Comes with a Thunderbrand, a weapon that kills almost everything. Very solid stats, and she can easily catch up in levelling even if she falls behind.

High Tier

Claude - after the timeskip, Claude gets the classes he deserve, and becomes the archer you need. Comes with his Prf weapon as well, which will be useful for taking down monsters. Only reason he's not top tier is the range on his weapons in his class, other archers had much better bow range values.

Petra - she was probably my fastest unit in the game, and I went with the plan to make her an amazing Swordmaster - it went pretty well. Then I changed her to Mortal Savant, making her more versatile with magic, in case the sword was not enough to defeat her enemies. Contributed a lot, her stats really helped me out.

Raphael - Raphael was the wall. Making him a Fortress Knight was the best choice, but Great Knight is also a good option. As a Fortress Knight he took no damage from monsters and brawlers, making him a great bait unit as well. Great Knight was the same - a bit more mobile, but it can only use Gauntlets when dismounted. Gauntlet is a solid choice of weapon for him to double his enemies. A healer adjutant would make him basically invincible.

Ignatz - Went all the way with the bows, turning into a fine Bow Knight. For others there might be better units for that job, but his growths really helped him out for that. Going from Sniper to Bow Knight is the best choice for him, making him into a 4-range mounted unit that can do damage without taking any counterattacks - except if the enemy had Counterattack of course. Very useful against hard to reach targets and monsters.

Seteth - Seteth is amazing. Once he reaches A lances and paralogues, his lance will make him deadly against cavalry units. Going with Wyverns he's a solid flying unit from the start.

Flayn - She might not look good in battle at first, but she has the tools to make herself useful. Her Caduceus Staff increases her magic range, so the enemy cannot counterattack her. She also has great Faith skills, including Rescue and Fortify to name the best. I did put her on the bench for a long time, but just because of these 2 skills, she came back as a Holy Knight. Really good support unit.

Mid Tier

Lorenz - I struggled with Lorenz a lot. His low speed is not very good in my eye, and some classes were just painful with him. The only way to make him work is to turn him into a dark mage, and later a Dark Knight. Lorenz could get a few kills with that, but there are better options if you want to have a good mage in your class.

Marianne - She will be the early game healer with her Faith skills. Physic is a lifesaver, and honestly I never really used Silence with her. I was hoping to make her a flying healer, but unfortunately that's not possible in this game, so I struggled a lot on her training. She became my dancer, so I boosted her movement stats, and as a dancer she was actually High Tier. Still, anyone is better with that class.

Leonie - Leonie was a solid cavalry unit in the mid game, but her strength was not much impressive in the late game. She started off as a Paladin and evolved into a Bow Knight, but her hit rates were falling behind the others, and couldn't do too much damage with lances later on.

Shamir - I though she'll replace Ignatz in no time, but unfortunately my Shamir got bad growths and got benched in the long run. I believe she has potential to be the best archer in this route, but she needs the Str and Spd to do so. Still, she was a solid unit in the mid game.

Bench Tier

Hilda - I tried to save Hilda for a long time, and she can do a lot of damage - but her accuracy was never really that great to rely on her. Since she has a Legendary Axe in her paralogue, I tried to stick her in axe-wielding classes, but she didn't really make it to the end-game.

Manuela - now I know that she has really good Magic spells, but she needs training to get good. I couldn't do it - in her paralogue with Hanneman she actually struggled to stay alive - I had to use Flayn to Rescue her. Wasn't a good start, but it didn't got any better due to her low level.

Hanneman - this old man can give some punch with Reason magics, but she fell into the same fate as Manuela, sticking to the bench for the long run. I don't know, maybe I should turn him into a Grappler in my next run.

Cyril - how should I put this - my Cyril did not turn out great, and as I heard from others he is someone who is hard to train into a good unit. Just don't worry too much about using him.

Also Ingrid and Dorothea was also on my bench, but I'd rather write about them when I had more chance to use them.

Edited August 5, 2019 by Garlyle

[dragonlordsd]

As far as I can tell, Hanneman is just an objectively worse version of Dorothea, but I still use him sometimes just for fun.

I don't think there's any reason to use him over her, unless she gets really, really bad rng and he gets really really good rng (excusing personal preference, of course).

Meteor is pretty darn ridiculous for exploiting maps, and I imagine bolting is too, so for me that puts Dorothea just below Lysithea as a mage.

I'm interested in Hilda's axe, which has 23 might (second highest might, period) and has a +15 might combat art. That's a lot of damage.

Edited August 5, 2019 by dragonlordsd