Jump to content

Alastor plays and ranks the whole series! Mission Complete! ...For now.


Alastor15243
 Share

Recommended Posts

2 hours ago, Etrurian emperor said:

I was surprised about how incredibly hard Berkut's first boss fight was. Then it turned out that a separate cavalry army was standing on the same spot as Berkut, so I had to fight both the miniboss squad and a small cavalry army that shouldn't normally have been there.

 

 

2 hours ago, Jotari said:

Alm: I’m not quite sure how we just pulled that off… There were only three of them—how did they give us so much trouble?

 

Clive: Uh, Alm, didn't you see that whole other squadron standing beside them?

XD

 

XD

2 hours ago, Alastor15243 said:

Haha, uh, yeah, uh... exact same thing happened to me too.

Oof. Also, one thing I learned about this game is that letting enemy reinforcements get to you first is really really bad.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Replies 9.8k
  • Created
  • Last Reply

Top Posters In This Topic

22 hours ago, Ottservia said:

No but she is the only one in that argument to raise her voice and get overly emotional when Alm is relatively calm. Like Alastor said. She has an emotional outburst while Alm, at worst, is just innocently ignorant. In that way, Celica is definitively painted as the unreasonable one. Because she is the only one to raise her voice and get mad. Alm doesn’t shout back at her. He just acts like the dense harem protagonist he is. It paints him as the more reasonable party because he is which shouldn’t be happening if they’re both supposed to be wrong. 

 

1. that’s the only time his flaws are punished if at all.

2. Even then it’s not framed that way. because before the fight even begins, Alm direcly states that he cannot bring himself to hate Rudolf despite everything the man is supposedly responsible for. Which if this scene was supposed to highlight his supposed flaws, then he flat out would not have said that. Cause what flaw is it supposedly punishing? If it’s a blind hatred towards Rigel then that line before the battle makes no sense. You even have Rudolf calling Alm “a man of mercy” which if that was his flaw then that line of dialogue makes no sense. If it’s his recklessness, then it’s not emphasised enough. This is supposed to be the climax of his character arc and in that sense it is the story’s job to make sure we understand the flaw that is being punished. The story didn’t do a good job of building up that flaw to this point. In fact it was doing the opposite. So I ask again what flaw is it supposed to be punishing?

"The only time his flaws are punished" you do know that Celica is only punished at the end of Act 4 too, right with Jedah and all? She's always winning fights and getting allies otherwise. Wouldn't that make them even?

Link to comment
Share on other sites

11 hours ago, Alastor15243 said:

Nothing. He never said anything to her that he could possibly be in a position to think was hurtful even by accident. She's the only person with anything concrete to apologize about.

He could have (even should have) been in a position to actually know what he said to Celica was harmful, he even goes over the kind of questions he could have asked her to be in that position at the end of that fight. He doesn't know, but he could.

 

11 hours ago, Alastor15243 said:

 

Gee, it sure was nice of the game designers to hand-sculpt your entire journey as to ensure that your moral convictions about the pointlessness of war never have to be put to any practical test whatsoever.

Until the end of Act 3/ start of Act 4 that is, where she admits they have to invade Rigel. Much like Alm's abortive attempt at peace, she doesn't stick to this new path into Act 4 though, like him she is lured back to a more familiar, and misguided path.

 

11 hours ago, Alastor15243 said:

 

Celica: If we're attacked, I have faith we can prevail.

...Okay, this is the thing about Celica. Okay, yes, she does frequently explain the reasons for why she rushes into danger. Like, yes, she explained why she decided to charge Barth's stronghold and all that jazz. But it's always about why she thinks it's the right thing to do, and never why she thinks she can handle it. That thing she said up there? That's the closest thing she ever says on that subject. That she has faith. Possibly literally. So no, I don't really think she's better than Alm in this regard.

I will note that Valentia ties magic to faith a lot. That faith may have all the sharpness of a sword, but in magic form.

 

11 hours ago, Alastor15243 said:

 

Yeah, I'm just gonna put this out there right now: When we get to Three Houses? Every time I get a wall of supports unlocked due to reaching the latest progress gate? Reading those supports is literally all I'm going to do that day. Reading support after support after support after support without any immediate tangible gameplay benefits, in a game where you essentially unlock every combination of supports in your army without even trying... if I had to do anything other than that in one day, I think I'd just scream. Seeing the support menu light up in 3H frustrates me nearly to tears with the incoming tedium I don't feel I can skip.

Ugh...I am vicariously annoyed by just the thought of it. Honestly I was kinda expecting the burnout based hatred I have with Three Houses to have simmered down by now, but little reminders like that bring it back all the same. Sorry you will have to suffer through that...

 

11 hours ago, Alastor15243 said:

 

...Okay, a witch finally decided to teleport, and she teleported... behind my army. Without attacking anyone the same turn.

Does anyone know what the hell decides what goes through a witch's head?

A little. From what I  remember, they can only warp to the edge of their original attack range, target people on the points/outside of formations (so you can protect people, and bait the warp a bit...), and don't gang-up while warping.

 

3 hours ago, Shanty Pete's 1st Mate said:

Killing Desaix is a good thing, though. The man is presented as power-hungry and devoid of morals - so no better than Barth or Grieth. And any negotiations would have likely included Desaix remaining in a position of power, which would be intolerable to the Deliverance. And when his original rise to power came from deception, they have no reason to put any faith in his words.

The Deliverance was just fine letting Lima IV reign, and from what we see of him,  Desaix is a less corrupt, and more competent a ruler. If the Deliverance really wanted to remove Desaix from power, they should have a pretender ready to claim the throne when Desaix is gone, as this whole mess of a war is really putting the cart before the horse without one.

 

3 hours ago, Shanty Pete's 1st Mate said:

Rudolf will nonetheless attack other members of Alm's army, so as its leader, it's Alm's duty to stop him from killing them. And Rudolf won't negotiate, since Alm killing him is an integral part of his convoluted plan, so Alm's only option is to respind with lethal force. "Killing his own father" is not the result of any personal flaws, but of the circumstances in which Alm was placed.

Alm is in that circumstance thanks to his flaw. Just because he is flying over the edge now doesn't mean he couldn't have swerved to avoid it before. Alm had all the pieces he needed (even knew Clive had pieced some secret about him together) to figure out what his relation with Rudolph was, and knowing he was a Rigelian prince would have given him a chance to avoid this disaster. Alm helped build that circumstance as much as Rudolph did.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

6 hours ago, Eltosian Kadath said:

The Deliverance was just fine letting Lima IV reign, and from what we see of him,  Desaix is a less corrupt, and more competent a ruler. If the Deliverance really wanted to remove Desaix from power, they should have a pretender ready to claim the throne when Desaix is gone, as this whole mess of a war is really putting the cart before the horse without one.

Lima IV seems to have been more extremely neglectful than outright tyrannical. And its worth noting that Desaix was holding most of the power during Lima's reign so what went wrong under Lima can also be attributed to Desaix. 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

7 hours ago, Eltosian Kadath said:

He could have (even should have) been in a position to actually know what he said to Celica was harmful, he even goes over the kind of questions he could have asked her to be in that position at the end of that fight. He doesn't know, but he could.

She was the one who stopped the catching-up talk though, demanding to know if he really plans to fight Rigel. How could he have asked those questions without blowing her off like an asshole?

7 hours ago, Eltosian Kadath said:

Until the end of Act 3/ start of Act 4 that is, where she admits they have to invade Rigel. Much like Alm's abortive attempt at peace, she doesn't stick to this new path into Act 4 though, like him she is lured back to a more familiar, and misguided path.

I'll have to see for myself.

7 hours ago, Eltosian Kadath said:

Ugh...I am vicariously annoyed by just the thought of it. Honestly I was kinda expecting the burnout based hatred I have with Three Houses to have simmered down by now, but little reminders like that bring it back all the same. Sorry you will have to suffer through that...

Hahahahaha... Yeah, that's gonna be a thing. Guess we'll see...

Edited by Alastor15243
Link to comment
Share on other sites

7 hours ago, Eltosian Kadath said:

Alm is in that circumstance thanks to his flaw. Just because he is flying over the edge now doesn't mean he couldn't have swerved to avoid it before. Alm had all the pieces he needed (even knew Clive had pieced some secret about him together) to figure out what his relation with Rudolph was, and knowing he was a Rigelian prince would have given him a chance to avoid this disaster. Alm helped build that circumstance as much as Rudolph did.

Genuinely, how would he avoid disaster? Rudolf was insistent on being defeated by Alm, so that Alm proves he has the ability to stop Duma. Or something dumb like that. Figuring out their relationship in advance wouldn't be a bad thing, to be sure. But it wouldn't change what he has to do - so long as Rudolf is insistent on fighting Zofia's forces, and Alm is intent on leading them, their paths are due to cross.

1 hour ago, Etrurian emperor said:

Lima IV seems to have been more extremely neglectful than outright tyrannical. And its worth noting that Desaix was holding most of the power during Lima's reign so what went wrong under Lima can also be attributed to Desaix. 

Seconded. Lima is bad by neglect, Desaix is bad by malice. The point about someone ready to take the throne is a good one, though. Interestingly, Conrad could have filled such a role, were he not obsessed with fixing his sister's mistakes.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

2 minutes ago, Shanty Pete's 1st Mate said:

Genuinely, how would he avoid disaster? Rudolf was insistent on being defeated by Alm, so that Alm proves he has the ability to stop Duma. Or something dumb like that. Figuring out their relationship in advance wouldn't be a bad thing, to be sure. But it wouldn't change what he has to do - so long as Rudolf is insistent on fighting Zofia's forces, and Alm is intent on leading them, their paths are due to cross.

Seconded. Lima is bad by neglect, Desaix is bad by malice. The point about someone ready to take the throne is a good one, though. Interestingly, Conrad could have filled such a role, were he not obsessed with fixing his sister's mistakes.

There are no rumors of Conrad being alive though, while there are rumors of Celica being alive. So what would have been very interesting would be to add a Nyna archtype character that is actually a complete fake, propped up by the resistance as a figurehead to justify what is actually arguably a rebellion. Desaix's a piece of shit, but fighting against him is a bit like that "I am the senate" line from Star Wars. He does have more formal authority than anyone else, at least until anyone can prove counts of regicide on his part. Having a fake Anthiese along with using Alm as a figurehead would make the liberation army way more realistic in their methodology and goals, but would also tinge them more with that Zofian corruption as they are willing to lie in order to achieve control in their way. So yeah, rather than Faye or Conrad, I think this game needed Pelleas. Something like that would also be a really fun addition to actually bring intrigue for people who played Gaiden. Unlike most of their attempted changes like Slayde's survival or Berkut's mirror which mostly just end up as big fat nothings.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Shadows of Valentia Day 16: OH, MY MISTAKE!

Alright, let's get right back into things and fight these mages in the forest. I'm gonna see how things turn out if I have Kliff take care of them with his high res and range. Because otherwise these assholes are a massive pain in the ass to fight with anyone meleelocked.

He killed one right off the bat, which is encouraging. I'm gonna try and siphon some of them off the sides now that I've got most of them distracted at the core. Hopefully with physic and his high res, Kliff can handle the bulk of them. Gotta also make sure to steer clear of trees, since he can't pierce terrain like they can, and if I leave him in attacking range of any tree, the sorcerers will use it.

Kliff finally gets a good level up! Attack, skill, speed and defense! Excellent. Let's hope he can keep that speed up.

He doesn't, but he does get attack again (along with skill).

And then skill, speed and defense! Is the curse finally broken!? If this guy's speed picks up he's gonna be terrifying.

Well, next fight.

We get a scene talking about our plans to storm Desaix's fort while we're in the area, and Alm asks Lukas about Berkut.

There's this amusing little moment where Alm is like “does it really matter how important your father was?” and Lukas is like “I beg your pardon?” And both Alm and Lukas act like he accidentally said something mildly offensive to nobles. Kinda weird to think about how it technically is offensive by the metric of nobility.

Clive seems to be getting increasingly on edge. I'm interested in the payoff to this.

But then who should show up but Berkut?

Honestly? They couldn't afford to give Berkut some kind of lieutenant for this? This is such a bizarre battle. Two named units and a generic. And it gets even more bizarre when you see the FUCKING CG they made for this. Three guys, two all fancy and helmetless and character-y, and then one generic helmeted faceless fuck on Berkut's other side. Seriously? I mean, like Jotari said earlier with the earthquake mage, even if they wanted to be cheap on portraits, they have characters in the story they could use here. Canonically neither Fernand nor Berkut dies here. They both retreat. So just put Slayde here! Why not?

But yeah, Berkut's just here for shits and giggles, wanting to use our army for practice for his petty amusement.

Um...

...Isn't this literally the main force of the Zofian army, the defeat of which would end the war completely?

This is just practice to him, when winning would end the war?

And more importantly, this arrogant shit is attacking the entire Deliverance with three guys!?

But yeah, Berkut arrogantly attacks Alm, strikes a blow to his left hand that apparently (even though Alm's model does absolutely nothing to reflect this) destroys the armor on it and exposes the mark. Kiiiiinda lazy there. Should've been a place to put a CG or an alternate model.

Also, this brings up the question of how anyone notices the mark on his hand normally. Does he just... never fix his gauntlet? Or are they gonna come up with some “I was washing my hands during this conversation” excuse for why Zeke sees it? I can't remember. Guess I'll find out.

Still, it's just three guys. Thankfully I don't have to deal with the reinforcements that can make this a royal bitch. Let's see how it goes if I just wing it.

Nope, I swiftly realized before even letting the enemy move that I had to reset and re-think my plan at least a little if I wanted to do this quickly.

I had to repeat this reset several times, actually. Forgetting to save on three of them.

I'm having Python and Forsyth sit this one out. They're nothing but low-mobility dead weight here.

Ultimately I decided to have Gray take point with his lightning sword, doing heavy damage to all three from the safety of a forest.

...It was kinda hilarious doing this and then hearing three separate battle themes as they all charged him in turn.

But yeah, Tobin beats Berkut with an excalibur crit after Kliff takes out the paladin. Leaving only Fernand.

Berkut: They're stronger than I thought...

YOU DON'T SAY, BERKUT. HOW UTTERLY PERPLEXING THAT AN ENTIRE ARMY WAS STRONGER THAN THREE PEOPLE.

And he's rewarded for this with a skillsauce level up. Lame.

Alm gets chip damage on Fernand and gets... HP and skill. Only slightly less lame, and arguably lamer considering Alm's growths.

GRAY GETS SKILLSAUCE TOO.

Looks like Kliff actually getting good levels last fight was such unspeakable black magic that everyone else had to suffer for them.

Apparently in canon that was a brutal battle that makes Clive question if winning the war is even possible. Kinda hilarious, honestly, because once I worked out the right formation it was a two-turn joke.

Alright. So. Sounds like there's a big battle next, so let's just check out this town and be done with it for today.

Hahahahaha...

...Okay, so, reading the way Clive describes Mathilda, I have a feeling someone on the development team really, really likes her.

...Some woman seems to simultaneously think we're more thugs here to rob the place and know we're actually the deliverance here to beat the shit out of the people who did it to them. “You're too late! There's nothing left here for you” is a pretty weird way to start this sentence with her knowing that.

...A quest-giver... is actually voiced? Gargoyles apparently kidnapped his daughter so he's offering us treasure if we save her.

Ooh, got another memory prism! What's this one...? Well I can't see it here.

Oh yeah, and this time the armory/forge worker is a woman, when it's traditionally been a man. They carried that over into Three Houses, amusingly enough.

But yeah, we can use silver and gold to improve our items. Sadly, if you repair rusty weapons, the game doesn't tell you what the result is. I did it anyway since it was relatively cheap, and got a steel sword for my trouble. That'll be nice to put on Gray eventually when his strength makes the lightning sword outlive its usefulness. The other thing I do is have Kliff's iron bow forged to have 2 more might, since his strength is actually turning out pretty good and he could have a chance to do some serious damage now.

Huh, that's interesting. Talking to this random guy has Clive randomly pop in when Mathilda gets brought up. This feels like a story thing, but it's totally skippable.

Ah yes, and in the center we get the peddler and Luthier.

Apparently magic is a rare gift. Which is weird, because every single character in the entire game is technically capable of learning it.

Alright, I didn't find much of value besides some oranges and water. Makes sense, since the place has been robbed blind. So I'm gonna step out, see that prism scene, and call it here.

Clive talks with Alm as they leave asking if it's “wise to get involved” with the issue with Delthea. Now, I get the argument of whether or not it's worth the risk to your army to hobble yourself dealing with a dangerous but innocent girl while trying to take out a larger threat...

...But Alm quickly exposes that Clive wouldn't be saying the same thing if it were a noble instead of a villager.

Also, really? “I'm going to need your sword”, said to Clive? Who uses lances? “I'm going to need your lance” would've sounded just fine!

Seems like we've got a talk between Desaix and Slayde. And also it seems like memory prisms are shared between Alm and Celica, which is convenient but also kinda ridiculous to think about, given that Alm clearly hasn't watched the previous one or he'd know who Celica really is.

So this is a sort of “prequel” to the previous one. Here Slayde gets his orders from Desaix to kill Conrad and Celica.

This unfortunately means I have to sit through Desaix's lame voice acting, so it's hard to get emotionally invested.

Though I do like the “May I presume to – uh, presume – ” thing that Slayde does when asking if he was responsible for the other royal children dying.

It's also weirdly amusing and satisfying seeing Slayde clearly terrified of somebody after all of the shit we've seen him do to people weaker than him.

Desaix apparently has something against Mila, and says “I never suckled at that monster's teat!”... which seems an impossible thing to speak the truth about, given that... y'know... he's clearly had plenty to eat over the years.

Alright, well, I guess that's it. Tomorrow we free Mathilda.

...No wait, right, we'll shift to Celica. Okay. Since she's only one away from a town too, I guess we'll just quickly recruit Palla and Catria and then see if we can still free Mathilda.

Stay safe, everyone!

Link to comment
Share on other sites

5 hours ago, Etrurian emperor said:

Lima IV seems to have been more extremely neglectful than outright tyrannical. And its worth noting that Desaix was holding most of the power during Lima's reign so what went wrong under Lima can also be attributed to Desaix. 

4 hours ago, Shanty Pete's 1st Mate said:

Seconded. Lima is bad by neglect, Desaix is bad by malice. The point about someone ready to take the throne is a good one, though. Interestingly, Conrad could have filled such a role, were he not obsessed with fixing his sister's mistakes.

The talk Celica has with Imra about how Lady Liprica was

Quote

stolen away in the night.

and Lima IV

Quote

forced her to join his seraglio of countless brides

sounds like some clear malicious tyranny from Lima IV, and not just Desaix abusing the power Lima IV gave him.

 

4 hours ago, Shanty Pete's 1st Mate said:

Genuinely, how would he avoid disaster? Rudolf was insistent on being defeated by Alm, so that Alm proves he has the ability to stop Duma. Or something dumb like that. Figuring out their relationship in advance wouldn't be a bad thing, to be sure. But it wouldn't change what he has to do - so long as Rudolf is insistent on fighting Zofia's forces, and Alm is intent on leading them, their paths are due to cross.

Would Rudolf hold to those convictions if Alm had the knowledge to truly challenge them? If Alm leveraged his status as prince to sway the Rigelian army away from Rudolf's suicidal plans, how would Rudolf prevent Alm from simply bypassing him? Even if Alm has to use force, he could turn his efforts towards disarming, and capturing Rudolf, rather than killing him.

 

4 hours ago, Alastor15243 said:

She was the one who stopped the catching-up talk though, demanding to know if he really plans to fight Rigel. How could he have asked those questions without blowing her off like an asshole?

Its not that outlandish to transition from why he fights to that time as kids that knights tried to take her away, which probably plays a part in his attitude towards fighting. Or just ask more questions in general, he asks like two, and one of them clearly rhetorical

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

26 minutes ago, Eltosian Kadath said:

Would Rudolf hold to those convictions if Alm had the knowledge to truly challenge them? If Alm leveraged his status as prince to sway the Rigelian army away from Rudolf's suicidal plans, how would Rudolf prevent Alm from simply bypassing him? Even if Alm has to use force, he could turn his efforts towards disarming, and capturing Rudolf, rather than killing him.

This is speculative, but here goes: Rudolf would rebut Alm's claims of Rigelian princehood as a lie, an attempt to justify the Zofian invasion post-facto. There's no way the Rigelian army would abandon their king en masse for the invader who forced them to their knees. Anyway, I'd say Rudolf is too strong of ability and conviction to be taken alive. If he loses his lance, he'll continue to fight with his fists. And so long as he lives, the armies of Rigel will oppose Alm, thus forcing Alm (or one among his army) to take his life.

26 minutes ago, Eltosian Kadath said:

sounds like some clear malicious tyranny from Lima IV, and not just Desaix abusing the power Lima IV gave him.

Okay that was pretty bad, you got me there.

1 hour ago, Alastor15243 said:

And more importantly, this arrogant shit is attacking the entire Deliverance with three guys!?

Of course, if the villain comes to full bear against the player early in the game, then it's a guaranteed Game Over. Why didn't Ursula stay behind in 7x of Lyn's Story, or Zephiel in chapter 3 of Roy's? Because that would end the game.

1 hour ago, Alastor15243 said:

Clive talks with Alm as they leave asking if it's “wise to get involved” with the issue with Delthea. Now, I get the argument of whether or not it's worth the risk to your army to hobble yourself dealing with a dangerous but innocent girl while trying to take out a larger threat...

...But Alm quickly exposes that Clive wouldn't be saying the same thing if it were a noble instead of a villager.

Not sure if it was intentional, but this comes across like Rhys's lines in Path of Radiance, when they were discussing what to do with Princess Elincia as the Daein Army approached:

Spoiler

Greil:
“Well, Rhys? What’s your opinion?”

Rhys:
“I believe…that none of this hinges on whether she’s a princess or not. Refusing to aid someone in need is not something we should ever do. That’s what I think.”

 

1 hour ago, Alastor15243 said:

Apparently magic is a rare gift. Which is weird, because every single character in the entire game is technically capable of learning it.

Bit of a stretch, but this could be interpreted as having access to certain magical spells. Like Delthea's Aura, Silque's Warp, or Celica's Seraphim. Certain characters are "gifted" with better spell lists than others, even though anyone can potentially get the basics (i.e. Fire, Recover).

Link to comment
Share on other sites

3 hours ago, Alastor15243 said:

Honestly? They couldn't afford to give Berkut some kind of lieutenant for this? This is such a bizarre battle. Two named units and a generic. And it gets even more bizarre when you see the FUCKING CG they made for this. Three guys, two all fancy and helmetless and character-y, and then one generic helmeted faceless fuck on Berkut's other side. Seriously? I mean, like Jotari said earlier with the earthquake mage, even if they wanted to be cheap on portraits, they have characters in the story they could use here. Canonically neither Fernand nor Berkut dies here. They both retreat. So just put Slayde here! Why not?

Yeah, I was thinking literally the same thing. Slayde's survival is just so utterly pointless. Might as well have him hand around with Fernand and put them in the awkward scenario of working with each other when they were former enemies. And Desaix is still around right now. Slayde has business being in this part of the continent. Plus doesn't this happen right outside of Delthea's village? They could have actually utilized him selling out Delthea as an actual developed plot point rather than a random reference that wasn't required that would go completely over any first time player's head.

Quote

But yeah, Berkut's just here for shits and giggles, wanting to use our army for practice for his petty amusement.

Um...

...Isn't this literally the main force of the Zofian army, the defeat of which would end the war completely?

This is just practice to him, when winning would end the war?

And more importantly, this arrogant shit is attacking the entire Deliverance with three guys!?

But yeah, Berkut arrogantly attacks Alm, strikes a blow to his left hand that apparently (even though Alm's model does absolutely nothing to reflect this) destroys the armor on it and exposes the mark. Kiiiiinda lazy there. Should've been a place to put a CG or an alternate model.

Also, this brings up the question of how anyone notices the mark on his hand normally. Does he just... never fix his gauntlet? Or are they gonna come up with some “I was washing my hands during this conversation” excuse for why Zeke sees it? I can't remember. Guess I'll find out.

The aforementioned novel's approach to the brand was to ignore the reference to it being on his hand an moving it up to his arm, which isn't a terrible design choice.

3dNQBeO.png

Later Zeke manages to see it too and I don't think they even attempt any kind of explanation there like they do here. Zeke just apparently has X-Ray vision in addition to being able to cross an ocean while unconscious without any sustanance.

Quote

Still, it's just three guys. Thankfully I don't have to deal with the reinforcements that can make this a royal bitch. Let's see how it goes if I just wing it.

Nope, I swiftly realized before even letting the enemy move that I had to reset and re-think my plan at least a little if I wanted to do this quickly.

I had to repeat this reset several times, actually. Forgetting to save on three of them.

So really dedicated to resetting the game instead of acknowledging the existence of the Turnwheel XD

Quote

But yeah, we can use silver and gold to improve our items. Sadly, if you repair rusty weapons, the game doesn't tell you what the result is. I did it anyway since it was relatively cheap, and got a steel sword for my trouble. That'll be nice to put on Gray eventually when his strength makes the lightning sword outlive its usefulness. The other thing I do is have Kliff's iron bow forged to have 2 more might, since his strength is actually turning out pretty good and he could have a chance to do some serious damage now.

I think, similar to broken weapons in other games, you might be able to tell what the weapon is by the price it costs to forge it (honestly I usually just save scum such scenarios).

Quote

Apparently magic is a rare gift. Which is weird, because every single character in the entire game is technically capable of learning it.

Except Alm XD

Quote

Desaix apparently has something against Mila, and says “I never suckled at that monster's teat!”... which seems an impossible thing to speak the truth about, given that... y'know... he's clearly had plenty to eat over the years.

Maybe he meant it literally XD Who knows what kinky shit Mila was into. She was the kind of god who let Lima run rampant after all.

1 hour ago, Shanty Pete's 1st Mate said:

Of course, if the villain comes to full bear against the player early in the game, then it's a guaranteed Game Over. Why didn't Ursula stay behind in 7x of Lyn's Story, or Zephiel in chapter 3 of Roy's? Because that would end the game.

My personal headcanon (which I've mentioned a few times before), she was getting laid with some village stud that caught her eye. Because there aint any actual business matters more important to Nergal then and there than capturing Nils and Ninian. The only expalanation is Ursula was having some personal Ursula time, her bosses needs be damned.

Edited by Jotari
Link to comment
Share on other sites

24 minutes ago, Jotari said:

So really dedicated to resetting the game instead of acknowledging the existence of the Turnwheel XD

Turnwheel doesn't let you to back to the prep screen unless that's some quirk I never learned about.

 

26 minutes ago, Jotari said:

Except Alm XD

Right, ha, kinda funny he's the only one.

26 minutes ago, Jotari said:

Yeah, I was thinking literally the same thing. Slayde's survival is just so utterly pointless. Might as well have him hand around with Fernand and put them in the awkward scenario of working with each other when they were former enemies. And Desaix is still around right now. Slayde has business being in this part of the continent. Plus doesn't this happen right outside of Delthea's village? They could have actually utilized him selling out Delthea as an actual developed plot point rather than a random reference that wasn't required that would go completely over any first time player's head.

And now I'm even more confused they didn't do that now that you've pointed that out.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

So ... there's something I heard from one of my friends who was also on SF and knows way more about FE than I do. I believe she said something how somehow who worked on SoV (director, head writer, someone?) is a known sexist. And if that's true, that explains a lot about Celica's ... everything, and even Faye. I know that the female characters having to be saved is a carryover from the original Gaiden, but apparently Celica is just kind of bad even more so in some cases. And Faye ... oh, Faye. I actually don't dislike her as much as some of the other obsessive characters, but why did they have to do her dirty like that.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

20 minutes ago, Sunwoo said:

but apparently Celica is just kind of bad even more so in some cases.

Oh she most DEFINITELY is. That shit about Jedah talking her into giving up her soul for Duma? Totally made up by Echoes. And the landslide had nothing to do with Celica's stupidity in the original either.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

13 hours ago, Sunwoo said:

So ... there's something I heard from one of my friends who was also on SF and knows way more about FE than I do. I believe she said something how somehow who worked on SoV (director, head writer, someone?) is a known sexist. And if that's true, that explains a lot about Celica's ... everything, and even Faye. I know that the female characters having to be saved is a carryover from the original Gaiden, but apparently Celica is just kind of bad even more so in some cases. And Faye ... oh, Faye. I actually don't dislike her as much as some of the other obsessive characters, but why did they have to do her dirty like that.

Sounds like a "My uncle works at Nintendo" story. If it were true I think it's be pretty common knowledge among the community. People have certainly argued enough about Shadows of Valentia's plot for it to be ample ammo.

Edited by Jotari
Link to comment
Share on other sites

I think that often just the slightest tweaks could help improve Echoes story so much.

Take the Berkut mission for instance. Wouldn't it be so much better if Berkut actually won that fight and give Alm a bloody nose? The biggest problem of Berkut is that he's such a gigantic loser who fails at everything he does, so him starting out as a real threat who defeats the previously unstoppable Alm would have helped relieve that problem. Alm tasting the dirt would also help with Clive's character arc. Seeing the commoner Alm get defeated by the noble Berkut might have awakened Clive's dormant classism, steel him in the belief a commoner could never beat a noble,  and give him an actual reason to believe Alm being a commoner to be a problem, rather then him just being a scumbag who wants to use Alm and then dispose of him.

Edited by Etrurian emperor
Link to comment
Share on other sites

10 minutes ago, Etrurian emperor said:

I think that often just the slightest tweaks could help improve Echoes story so much.

Take the Berkut mission for instance. Wouldn't it be so much better if Berkut actually won that fight and give Alm a bloody nose? The biggest problem of Berkut is that he's such a gigantic loser who fails at everything he does, so him starting out as a real threat who defeats the previously unstoppable Alm would have helped relieve that problem. Alm tasting the dirt would also help with Clive's character arc. Seeing the commoner Alm get defeated by the noble Berkut might have awakened Clive's dormant classism, steel him in the belief a commoner could never beat a noble,  and give him an actual reason to believe Alm being a commoner to be a problem, rather then him just being a scumbag who wants to use Alm and then dispose of him.

Makes a lot of sense to me. And it would be an easy case to justify winning in the gameplay and losing in the cutscene, since this "battle" was never something Berkut seriously intended to actually win as he literally was just bringing two people along. Some him personally beating Alm, but still being forced to retreat makes sense. And would turn this into a major victory. Whereas now it's just a sort of silly thing he does. He attacks an army with three people and he loses exactly as one would expect him too. The only saving grace is the characters saying they apparently had a tough time of it. Which is classic telling over showing. Having Alm be defeated would accomplish the same thing only with showing instead. And not only would it make Berkut less of a loser and give more for Fernand and Clive to mull over, but it'd be better for Alm too as Berkut would be someone he actually needs to strive against, making his later victories meaningful, rather than Berkut being not much more than a random chapter boss to Alm.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

2 hours ago, Etrurian emperor said:

I think that often just the slightest tweaks could help improve Echoes story so much.

Take the Berkut mission for instance. Wouldn't it be so much better if Berkut actually won that fight and give Alm a bloody nose? The biggest problem of Berkut is that he's such a gigantic loser who fails at everything he does, so him starting out as a real threat who defeats the previously unstoppable Alm would have helped relieve that problem. Alm tasting the dirt would also help with Clive's character arc. Seeing the commoner Alm get defeated by the noble Berkut might have awakened Clive's dormant classism, steel him in the belief a commoner could never beat a noble,  and give him an actual reason to believe Alm being a commoner to be a problem, rather then him just being a scumbag who wants to use Alm and then dispose of him.

I like this narratively, but how would it work in gameplay? If it's a case where "Alm beats Berkut in battle, but then there's a cutscene where Berkut actually wins", that would feel pretty cheap. If it's a case where Alm needs to lose in battle, isn't that supposed to cause a Game Over? They could suspend permadeath for a map, but if the game isn't clear about it, that could really mess with players' heads. Maybe the win-con is "Alm fights Berkut", but the battle is scripted so that Berkut is guaranteed to win (say, a certain crit). They could overpower Berkut so he's almost impossible to beat, but in a game with grinding, I don't know if that's something they can guarantee (consider, plenty of people beat Desaix's double).

But yeah, this would make Berkut look more competent. How about, Desaix doesn't send out troops until after the Berkut encounter? Once that happens, Alm and co are forced to return to Zofia Castle, and Desaix starts sending the cavalry against him. That way, they could balance the battle without considering the implications of an additional squad showing up.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

"Win the battle, lose the cutscene" is disliked enough as it is, the only lesson we can garner from this is that you can't please everybody.

---

Anyway, I'd say, gatekeeping the supports to the Acts can certainly lead to amusing situations. I mean, Act 3 takes places two seasons from Act 1. Nevermind that it makes no sense since Acts 1 and 2 happened concurrently. Which means depending on when you triggered them, it took Faye around half a year to apologize. Yep. lol

Link to comment
Share on other sites

2 minutes ago, Acacia Sgt said:

Anyway, I'd say, gatekeeping the supports to the Acts can certainly lead to amusing situations. I mean, Act 3 takes places two seasons from Act 1. Nevermind that it makes no sense since Acts 1 and 2 happened concurrently. Which means depending on when you triggered them, it took Faye around half a year to apologize. Yep. lol

Beats taking five years.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Shadows of Valentia Day 17: Women in Prison

Okay, it's temporarily Celica's turn.

...They actually have the audacity to have a bandit named Garth... after we fought a pirate named Barth?

...Wait, Celica seems familiar with Garth... was he mentioned previously?

But yeah, as usual, really straightforward. I'm just blocking off these bridges with my tougher guys and using my ranged units to deal extra damage. Also, Mae gets a skill-speed-luck level up, which I'm happy with.

Okay, B support between Mae and Boey. That's the only support I can see right now, so either Act 3 isn't as progress-gated on Celica's side, or I just haven't gotten as many supports.

So she says that she wasn't shaken about fighting real people, and was just “saying what [she] was thinking”, which... makes no sense. If she was saying what she was thinking, and she was talking about all that... then that means she was thinking all that...

...This feels... like something got mistranslated.

Also, for the record, what a garbage thing to do in a B support. Literally just that. Invalidating everything raised in the C support. Bringing us right back to square one for the A support. Seriously?

So the boss quote suggests there's a thriving market for slaves of all kinds, not just women. Interesting, because whenever criminals in Fire Emblem talk about selling someone into the slave trade, it's always either women or non-humans (or both). I think the only male human slave the series has ever mentioned, unless I'm very much mistaken, is Ogma, who I think used to be a colosseum slave or something.

Interestingly, the archer in the enemy group, despite attack range saying he had Mae and Boey as targets, went for Leon.

Yeah, so, the archer is down, and that was the last thing that could go significantly wrong about this. I think. If he had a bow. I never checked.

...No, wait, I forgot. Catria and Palla have almost no self preservation instinct, and Catria has a crit-happy ring that'll risk her getting hit on way too many fronts.

Thankfully Catria didn't double-crit and thus kill that bandit and expose herself to more damage, but I'm really hoping she runs away to heal now that she's at less than half HP, rather than... continue to fight and almost certainly die.

...She's continuing to fight. What the actual flaming hell. AND she went further out of the way of Genny's healing range. Thankfully, miraculously, Valbar literally just learned the technique of Catria's salvation: the leather shield's swap. Valbar went and swapped her into the back lines behind Valbar and Palla, and we're golden.

Yep, battle's done.

...So Celica and company run off without even sparing the time to make sure Palla and Catria are okay, and Palla's all “Wait! We didn't get to properly- *Sigh* And they're gone.”

...You're on flying ponies, Palla. It's impossible for Celica to have anyone at this point in the army who isn't on foot without the villager's pitchfork. Go after her. You will catch her.

But no, they go right back to town and just wait there, forcing you to backtrack to recruit them, completely going against Celica's just-demonstrated canon reckless rush.

God damn it. Reinforcements from Desaix's place showed up the instant I got back to the map. That one single thing I did was enough apparently.

Anyway, I have Celica head back to town, and apparently in the time since we last saw them, they've managed to “dig up additional information”. That's utterly bizarre given that it could have happened seconds ago. This entire thing is utterly bizarre and feels like an excuse to keep them optional. And that optionality is coming at the expense of creating a lot of absurdity for an incredibly petty “convenience”.

Anyway, back to Alm. I use the wait command to get those cavalry reinforcements out into the open and fight them.

This is... a big platoon. It feels kinda ridiculous to just arbitrarily slap that on top of a pre-existing battle if you time things wrong.

So I got Clair's B support with Alm, and yeah, she's trying to play up that part of her that Alm mentioned because he found it charming.

...Yeah, Clair and Alm are really cute together.

...But unfortunately due to two consecutive unlucky misses, I wound up losing by a hair.

And again when a 7% missed. Kliff reducing the sorcerer to useless HP was pivotal to my strategy.

And then again I lost again due to poor placement of Clair.

Yeah, that's the thing about this game. While it's not consistently easy, when it is hard, it's... still not engaging. Battles feel like a clusterfuck with too much shit going on. And keep in mind, this is coming from someone who played and enjoyed Conquest's complex gameplay. In contrast to how I reacted to this kind of gameplay at the beginning of the marathon, the consistently inconsistent hitrates, enemy spam, and wacky attack ranges just kinda turn gameplay into a mess that makes my brain shut down even on the rare occasions where I actually need it.

But one thing I still do like, even though it takes some serious getting used to, is the fact that the increased thresholds for one-rounding (to the point of near impossibility at this point) mean you have to position everyone assuming they'll have to eat a lot of hits on enemy phase. Problem is that this makes certain builds, namely glass cannons... shockingly useless. So I don't like it that much, it's more that it's an interesting change of pace.

Incidentally, to change the subject completely, casually scanning TV Tropes caused me to read something that points out that Alm and Celica might have actually known each other as children for as long as 3 years, not a couple of weeks. Apparently the villa fire took place ten years ago, while the flashback to them as children took place seven years ago. Of course, this makes the things that the babby villagers say in the prologue... profoundly difficult to reconcile. This feels like a mistake, really, like the writers of that scene didn't actually know how long Celica had been there, or like the “ten years back” is a mistake instead.

Alright, time to save Mathilda at long last.

And now we get a scene of Fernand talking to Mathilda, and... Jesus Christ. They just had to have this CG of this dramatic moment with this woman who is about to be sentenced to death by arrowfire... show her on her knees with both her cleavage and her ass positioned to be full view of the camera while both Fernand and the camera are looking down on her?

Who the fuck drew this? What were they told this was for!?

...Moving on though, ignoring the cheesecake so cheesecake-y it could've been used to smuggle her a file for the bars...

...The voice acting here is pretty great. Though I have to wonder what specifically Fernand means when he describes Zofia as “the proud kingdom whose riches fell to wild and ignorant savages”. He could be talking about either Rigel (which makes no sense since he's now joined them proudly) or the general encroachment of the peasantry upon the upper class caused by the Deliverance (a biiiiiig stretch). Both confuse me greatly.

Fernand reveals that he has a thing for Mathilda, but apparently not enough of a thing to try and help her escape in any way. Makes me wonder why he even talked to her. I mean he's not even trying to do that pathetic and unbelievably shitty thing of “I'll convince them to let you go if you marry me” or some shit like that. Why's he even here? This seems both painful and pointless for him.

Anyway, Mathilda has some ridiculously good stats for a level 1 paladin, far outstripping what Clive is capable of. I'll be happy to have her, once we're done with this.

...I remember this map looking more painful. I must be remembering it when I had to fight all those reinforcements too. Alright, I think I can take this. Let's go.

...But Desaix talks like he literally just decided to have Mathilda executed, just as Clive showed up, when Fernand made it sound like this was already planned.

Ugh.

And yes, of course, the absurdity of her having her weapons and armor inside of her cage is still just as ridiculous as when it happened in that big defense chapter in Thracia.

Desaix attacks right away, which I wasn't expecting. And Alm takes just enough damage to die. Damn it.

This time I'm sending the high-defense Kliff in first, since he can double every enemy here and do some pretty good damage if he hits.

Nooooooope, not even he can handle that. I could've figured that out if I just did the math, but uh... let's just say I'm no longer in ironman mode.

So any hopes of busting into there early and avoiding the massive plague of zombies that will make this a massive time sink is dashed. I do, in fact, as I feared, have to bottleneck this to avoid getting hit by all of the knights at once. Laaaaaame.

Okay, then I'll have Kliff take out the archers that don't attack Mathilda before moving in to choke the point. That'll make things a lot simpler.

Kliff just got an HPsauce level up. I almost feel tempted to reset for that, but no. Let's see how this goes.

Anyway, Mathilda's in no danger when we have Faye and her physic. The witch was a pain but I eventually took her out. Being in the forest really didn't help matters.

With the thunder witch out of the way though, we can start moving forward.

Tobin got an attack and defense level up, which is pretty great.

Finally! Alright, we're through. It took a looooot of having Kliff wall while Tobin used excalibur from behind, but we did it. And As Desaix dies, he just... flat-out says for anyone paying even the slightest bit of attention that Alm is Rudolf's son. What the actual shit.

With nothing left but the zombies and the cantor, this is gonna be a walk in the park.

Um... Thunderclap says it's supposed to halve terrain bonuses. If so... it isn't reflecting that on the combat status screen.

Aaaand Kliff snipes the cantor, and we're done.

AND ALM HEARD DESAIX'S DYING WORDS AND STILL DOESN'T GET WHAT'S GOING ON WHAT THE ACTUAL FUCK.

Alm: Something about my grandfather and Emperor Rudolf.

...Seriously? He only vaguely heard it? Why give us this story-breaking information then? Especially when you're gonna drop other blatant clues in a few minutes and make the whole cast look like idiots for not connecting the dots?

Alright, now we get a scene with Tatarrah...

...Okay, so, I'm gonna have to check out if Delthea actually has warp magic. It'd be weird if you can get it without permanently surrendering your soul, given that's supposed to be the whole point of witches. They don't get any other fancy magic, just teleportation. But if Delthea has it from something that's temporary, what's the point of sacrificing your soul?

Anyway, let's check out the castle and then be done for the day.

So we find a steel sword, and then Alessio the merchant, who gives us...

...Fuck, we don't have 30 silver marks? Really? Damn it. Guess I'll have to scrounge some up somehow. I could've sworn we got a silver wallet after the forging session...

...But ooh, a pegasus cheese! That's for Kliff for sure.

Aaaand... the Royal Sword. Which apparently... was taken all the way here... despite the fact that it seems almost literally immovable in the hands of anyone without royal blood.

And Alm promptly lifts it successfully.

The fact that these characters do not immediately have an hour-long discussion about the world-shattering revelations this implies... is psychotic. They actually somehow manage to be like “But... WHAT COULD THIS POSSIBLY MEAN!?”

And Alm convinces himself it's just an old myth, despite accepting that he's the only person who can use the thing.

...On the plus side, we found a silver purse ++, which means we have enough for that coral ring! Awesome! That's going on one of our magic users for sure!

Andanothercogfortheturnwheelmovingon

Time to release Mathilda! Which apparently doesn't require a prison key this time. Unless the game's trying to imply that the prison key from the cell that had Clair in it works here too. Has anyone hacked to see what happens if you don't have the prison key here?

Hahaha, apparently Alm either finds Mathilda hot or is just flustered by Mathilda and Clive being sickening sweethearts.

And apparently Mathilda got the memo in prison that Alm is in charge now.

...And apparently that scene with Fernand and Mathilda took place... days ago.

And then we have a scene with everyone talking about Clive's doubts about making Alm leader, and... I don't really know what to say about this scene. It's just kinda... annoyingly weird. And yeah, Alm's a bit too perfect here. Especially with him saying that Fernand “deserves [his] respect, no matter how he's treated [him] in the past”.

...Yeah, I'm done here. We'll pick this up tomorrow. I'd give Kliff the pegasus cheese now, but I'm gonna wait until promotion (which is next level), juuuust in case the bow knight promotion gains are enough to boost his should-not-be-remotely-this-meager speed.

Stay safe, everyone.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

18 minutes ago, Alastor15243 said:

...Okay, so, I'm gonna have to check out if Delthea actually has warp magic. It'd be weird if you can get it without permanently surrendering your soul, given that's supposed to be the whole point of witches. They don't get any other fancy magic, just teleportation. But if Delthea has it from something that's temporary, what's the point of sacrificing your soul?

Despite how it was in Gaiden, where Enemy!Delthea was an actual Witch, at least in class (though Enemy!Sonya was too despite clearly still having her own soul), and how in SoV she's not, and considering it is brought up some women are forced to become witches, it's likely that the good old brainwashing (which is what Delthea's currently under) is how they force them to. So Delthea's not quite a Witch yet. Since it's also stated nothing reverses the process... outside killing them. There is a reversal, but the situation is quite extraordinary as well as the explanation. But if Delthea was truly a Witch already, she'd be unsalvageable.

On that subject, she still has the Teleporation skill that Witches have while as an enemy. But then, she can learn Rewarp. Though it's hard to say which was derived from which. Still, at the worst she was going through the process which then gets interrupted, so it was still reversible her condition. Or so.

---

Also, I like how Desaix comes to the wrong conclusion about Rudolf's machinations. Thinking it's so he can take over the continent by engineering his son to become Zofia's hero and becomes King, thus securing the inheritance of both realms under his dynasty (as I'd assume he thinks Berkut will get Rigel, or Alm too if he is aware the two don't see eye to eye, or eventually Rudolf might force them to play nice now).

Edited by Acacia Sgt
Link to comment
Share on other sites

37 minutes ago, Alastor15243 said:

So the boss quote suggests there's a thriving market for slaves of all kinds, not just women. Interesting, because whenever criminals in Fire Emblem talk about selling someone into the slave trade, it's always either women or non-humans (or both). I think the only male human slave the series has ever mentioned, unless I'm very much mistaken, is Ogma, who I think used to be a colosseum slave or something.

Linda also got captured by slavers when she disguised herself as a boy. Apparently they hadn't caught on. The manga version of the event also have the slavers catch Merric and Gordin, with the head slaver amusingly being a sweet looking old granny. 

39 minutes ago, Alastor15243 said:

And apparently Mathilda got the memo in prison that Alm is in charge now.

I like to think Desaix went all ''And I would have gotten away with it too, if not for that damned kid!'' loud enough for Mathilda to hear from her cell. 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

8 minutes ago, Etrurian emperor said:

Linda also got captured by slavers when she disguised herself as a boy. Apparently they hadn't caught on. The manga version of the event also have the slavers catch Merric and Gordin, with the head slaver amusingly being a sweet looking old granny. 

Oh yes, that particular slave market went after children and young boys for the most part.

That's how it was in Mystery of the Emblem if I recall, though I think the old woman slaver wasn't sweet-looking. A bit amusing, since in the NES original it was a repurposed Manakete portrait (and interesting implication there), while in Shadow Dragon it was a generic ruffian (and the mentions to slavery were removed anyway, even in the Japanese script if I recall).

Edited by Acacia Sgt
Link to comment
Share on other sites

1 hour ago, Alastor15243 said:

..But ooh, a pegasus cheese! That's for Kliff for sure.

Give it to the cheese merchant at Zofia Castle! In turn, he'll give you the Exotic Spice, which can be sold for 3 Gold Marks. This opens up a wealth of forging opportunities - for instance, you can instantly boost the Royal Sword to Rank 2, for 2 extra Might and 5 more Hit.

1 hour ago, Alastor15243 said:

And then we have a scene with everyone talking about Clive's doubts about making Alm leader, and... I don't really know what to say about this scene. It's just kinda... annoyingly weird. And yeah, Alm's a bit too perfect here. Especially with him saying that Fernand “deserves [his] respect, no matter how he's treated [him] in the past”.

Clive's doubts work better here if you failed to save Mathilda. That said, Alm failing to call Fernand a "punk-ass bitch" really strains my immersion. 

1 hour ago, Alastor15243 said:

And yes, of course, the absurdity of her having her weapons and armor inside of her cage is still just as ridiculous as when it happened in that big defense chapter in Thracia.

And horse, don't forget her horse. I wonder if he was scheduled to be executed as well?

1 hour ago, Alastor15243 said:

The voice acting here is pretty great. Though I have to wonder what specifically Fernand means when he describes Zofia as “the proud kingdom whose riches fell to wild and ignorant savages”. He could be talking about either Rigel (which makes no sense since he's now joined them proudly) or the general encroachment of the peasantry upon the upper class caused by the Deliverance (a biiiiiig stretch). Both confuse me greatly.

Almost certainly that one. Fernand can't stand the peasants getting all uppity.

1 hour ago, Alastor15243 said:

.You're on flying ponies, Palla. It's impossible for Celica to have anyone at this point in the army who isn't on foot without the villager's pitchfork. Go after her. You will catch her.

But no, they go right back to town and just wait there, forcing you to backtrack to recruit them, completely going against Celica's just-demonstrated canon reckless rush.

In my first playthrough, I assumed "oh, I'll encounter them again on a future map". A la Cath in FE6. I had no idea of returning to Zofia Harbor to pick them up. So I actually got Est first among the sisters!

1 hour ago, Alastor15243 said:

They actually have the audacity to have a bandit named Garth... after we fought a pirate named Barth?

"Barth and Garth and Grieth and Dolth... the 'League of -th's, you might say!"

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.

 Share

  • Recently Browsing   0 members

    • No registered users viewing this page.
×
×
  • Create New...