Alastor15243 Posted February 28, 2021 Author Share Posted February 28, 2021 (edited) Birthright Day 12: Chapter 20 Alright, let's get going! I've upgraded the mess hall, so everyone got Jakob's strength, speed and skill meal. As I said, I changed Saizo to kinshi knight at the end of last chapter, though I'm having partial regrets about that. While giving Saizo and Mozu more synergy is gonna be great, I was probably on track to having a user of both the Pursuer and the Chakram with master ninja Saizo with the help of arms scrolls. Silas isn't gonna get much use out of it even if I did go to the trouble to get him S rank, since it cripples enemy phase ability. Still, aside from being slower, he's all-around better at being a kinshi knight than Mozu is, significantly outstripping her in several stats, which is surprising, considering Mozu's growth rates. But then, Saizo has just about the best growth rates in the entire game. Well, whatever. Let's get moving. I won't be doing castle visits today because I'm looking to reset the schedule so I can do it first thing on Monday. ...I just noticed the tall towers with lit windows in the background of Fort Dragonfall. They can't seriously be suggesting Fort Dragonfall is that fucking huge, right? It would have to be big enough to justify being a castle itself! And it's fucking tiny in-game. But yeah, Iago shows up, brings the dragon the fort is made out of partially back to life, and has it start releasing stomach acid to slowly digest (or, presumably, asphyxiate) us. And he can do this because Garon apparently “entrusted [him] with some rather fabulous new powers”. Huh? What, is he talking about the power Garon got from Anankos? What's going on here? That said, “There's only one way out of here, and it isn't pleasant. Also, you'll die, in case that wasn't clear” got a chuckle out of me. And Dakota's hesitant about Azura trying to sing because it's painful for her, and I'm like YOU'RE ALL ABOUT TO BE DIGESTED! I THINK THIS JUSTIFIES SOME PHYSICAL TRAUMA TO GET OUT. Yet again, faceless. Ridiculously weak faceless that my best units can take out with ease. They're also all meleelocked in a map with tons of walls when I have tons of fliers with tons of ranged weapons. Did I mention that every single one of them but the boss is below level 20? Fuck it, let's just rush through this shit and get the treasure. So, the game yet again makes enemies appear literally right after you start the map, and somehow damaging terrain effects fliers in this game. Yeah, the game doesn't tell you this explicitly, but enemies keep spawning from the stomach acid, so you have to use dragon veins to get rid of it or they'll keep respawning. At least this isn't a rout map, even though the implications of the story (that Azura needs us to get rid of all the monsters or else the song won't work) really suggest it should be. Christ, just before starting yesterday I said that I reached the part of Fire Emblem games where things really pick up speed, but every single map since I said that has been a dud. I really hope they get to the good shit soon. I hope there still is good shit. Anyway, yet again, that chapter barely warranted comment. I mostly used it to fuck around practicing battle maneuvers to mixed success. This really isn't the best practice after all. I got all the treasure without issue. None of the locktouch faceless even got close to it. Ah yes, the 5-breaker boss, who's annoyingly got every breaker except shurikenbreaker. No matter. I have Silas. Yeah, seeing how brutally this song magic is affecting Azura in Birthright, it's frankly ridiculous that we never see this shit in either other route and there's no “figuring out how to save her” payoff in Revelation. As for the “tied to the Valla curse” theory, this is clearly the sort of thing the curse of Valla is described to cause, but the way she describes it makes no mention of the song itself doing the damage. It's the power she's drawing from her amulet. And she sings this song for fun all the time, as she's said and demonstrated before. ...Also, uh... quick aside... it's pretty heavily implied by whole-game context that Azura knows she's going to have to die to stop Garon. And yet... she still gets married. Has kids. Doesn't say jack shit about any of this to her family. She's basically doing the same thing Claud did to Aideen in FE4, just as the opposite sex and not leaving her partner to raise children in a hellish oppressive regime. Kiiiiiiinda shitty if you ask me. But yeah, no way in hell I can stop here. Let's get a new party member. Day 12 Bonus: Paralogue 9 So yeah, we're getting Saizo's son, Saizo. Except no, that would be dumb as hell, because in reality Saizo the sixth, rather fucking understandably, has absolutely no interest in holding up the family name of some asshole he barely sees to serve some country he hasn't seen at all. So he goes by Asugi now, and he's gone rebellious and started using his ninja training to take part in heists. Also, due to some weird Awakening fanservice, he's the spitting image of Gaius. And he's the only one of the three Hoshidans to do this whose anagram name is actually spellable with Japanese characters. The others are Caeldori and Rhajat, which... yeah. Anyway, this chapter looks dangerous, but fuck it, I'm in the mood for that now. Dangerous sounds fun. The basic premise is that I've gotta race through the map as quickly as I can to stop Asugi from getting himself killed. Thankfully I have some strong enemy-phase units who can rip these guys to shreds, but I'm still worried the timetable here could be too strict. That is, of course, assuming I can't just rescue and recruit the fucker while he's in the room on the other side of this wall, like I can in all other cases of this game. If I can, I'll probably do that and start using him immediately. Otherwise... well, we'll just have to hope this works. Oh thank goodness, it's not like Awakening's Future Past. Yes, you can rescue Asugi. These enemies come very close to one-rounding Dakota, but thankfully with tonics I can still make it into a surefire way to activate vow of friendship. Hopefully tonics remain all that's needed. Maybe I can feed Dakota some kills if we get another dumb easy level. Well, I can rescue Asugi, but I can't recruit him. But that means all I have to do is babysit the guy and keep ahead of him so he doesn't get hurt. Simple enough. Silas's +9/-3 stack is still really putting in work. I set him to work plugging up the entrance to the third room so the second room could be player-phased, and these guys can barely touch him. And that's ignoring sol. … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … ...Asugi... ...Asugi escaped. On turn one. Through the entrance. That we started at. Causing a game over. I LOST THE IRONMAN AGAIN. HERE WE ARE, NO AMBUSH SPAWNS, NO FOG OF WAR, NONE OF THE HORSESHIT I ROUTINELY COMPLAIN ABOUT IN IRONMANS, AND I'M ZERO FOR FUCKING TWO. I am overflowing with rage right now, and I'm not sure whether to be more pissed off at the game or myself. On the one hand, gameplaywise, of course I should have considered that Asugi might accept literally any way out of the castle as acceptable. On the other, they don't even remotely make it clear that you can't recruit him with his father like you can with every other green child. And also, just from a logical perspective, that is the dumbest fucking game over condition I have ever fucking seen. If his objective were just to escape, and not to get some random unseen loot inside, then why would he have gone into the building in the first place? That conversation started outdoors! And if there weren't an unseen entrance in that room he started in that he could have escaped through, what the fuck was he doing behind several layers of locked doors that he presumably unlocked and re-locked behind him to get there... if he's just gonna go straight back through and unlock them again!? Holy shit. This is embarrassing. I am so mad right now. Fuck this. I'm stopping for the day. I can't move forward in this state. Stay safe, everyone. STAY SAFER THAN THE FUCKING RUN. Edited February 28, 2021 by Alastor15243 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shadow Mir Posted February 28, 2021 Share Posted February 28, 2021 (edited) 36 minutes ago, Alastor15243 said: ...Asugi... ...Asugi escaped. On turn one. Through the entrance. That we started at. Causing a game over. I LOST THE IRONMAN AGAIN. HERE WE ARE, NO AMBUSH SPAWNS, NO FOG OF WAR, NONE OF THE HORSESHIT I ROUTINELY COMPLAIN ABOUT IN IRONMANS, AND I'M ZERO FOR FUCKING TWO. I am overflowing with rage right now, and I'm not sure whether to be more pissed off at the game or myself. On the one hand, gameplaywise, of course it should have considered that Asugi might accept literally any way out of the castle as acceptable. On the other, they don't even remotely make it clear that you can't recruit him with his father like you can with every other green child. And also, just from a logical perspective, that is the dumbest fucking game over condition I have ever fucking seen. If his objective were just to escape, and not to get some random unseen loot inside, then why would he have gone into the building in the first place? That conversation started outdoors! And if there weren't an unseen entrance in that room he started in that he could have escaped through, what the fuck was he doing behind several layers of locked doors that he presumably unlocked and re-locked behind him to get there... if he's just gonna go straight back through and unlock them again!? Holy shit. This is embarrassing. I am so mad right now. Fuck this. I'm stopping for the day. I can't move forward in this state. Stay safe, everyone. STAY SAFER THAN THE FUCKING RUN. Ouch. This pretty much affirms what @Shanty Pete's 1st Mate stated earlier: On 2/25/2021 at 9:18 AM, Shanty Pete's 1st Mate said: The general point was, the more chapters you play, the more chances there are to get a Game Over. And I don't believe the rewards (i.e. units, items) are generally necessary to achieving victory in the main game. I would also say being a masochist didn't help your case... Edited February 28, 2021 by Shadow Mir Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alastor15243 Posted February 28, 2021 Author Share Posted February 28, 2021 3 minutes ago, Shadow Mir said: Ouch. This pretty much affirms what @Shanty Pete's 1st Mate stated earlier: Really, what he said is not a general rule. The issue here is more that this map just has a really stupid game over condition it's way too easy to accidentally achieve. With other paralogues the "risk" is totally worth it to keep your army strong. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shadow Mir Posted February 28, 2021 Share Posted February 28, 2021 15 minutes ago, Alastor15243 said: Really, what he said is not a general rule. The issue here is more that this map just has a really stupid game over condition it's way too easy to accidentally achieve. With other paralogues the "risk" is totally worth it to keep your army strong. I guess it may not be a general rule, but still, in the context of an ironman run, would it really be worth the chance of losing a unit, or in some cases (like this one, and especially Ignatius's), risking a game over just for that? I'm not sure it is. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alastor15243 Posted February 28, 2021 Author Share Posted February 28, 2021 (edited) 4 minutes ago, Shadow Mir said: I guess it may not be a general rule, but still, in the context of an ironman run, would it really be worth the chance of losing a unit, or in some cases (like this one, and especially Ignatius's), risking a game over just for that? I'm not sure it is. I just don't get that mindset at all. That's literally every chapter in every Fire Emblem game ever. Except, like, Battle Preparations from FE7. And why would you ever want to skip a chapter on principle, regardless of difficulty or rewards, just because it's another chapter and another chance to fail? If you could skip all the way from prologue to endgame, would you ever even entertain the idea that you'd be better off doing that? Edited February 28, 2021 by Alastor15243 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shadow Mir Posted February 28, 2021 Share Posted February 28, 2021 (edited) 15 minutes ago, Alastor15243 said: I just don't get that mindset at all. That's literally every chapter in every Fire Emblem game ever. Except, like, Battle Preparations from FE7. And why would you ever want to skip a chapter on principle, regardless of difficulty or rewards, just because it's another chapter and another chance to fail? If you could skip all the way from prologue to endgame, would you ever even entertain the idea that you'd be better off doing that? I was more thinking about when the defeat conditions include circumstances beyond your control, which Ignatius's paralogue has in spades (if you wait until enemies promote, are you sure you can save him when he starts getting attacked on turn 2, while odds are you're still too far away to do anything about it??? Because as stated earlier, his dying sets the stage for a game over). Edited February 28, 2021 by Shadow Mir Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alastor15243 Posted February 28, 2021 Author Share Posted February 28, 2021 3 minutes ago, Shadow Mir said: I was more thinking about when the defeat conditions include circumstances beyond your control, which Ignatius's paralogue has in spades (if you wait until enemies promote, are you sure you can save him when he starts getting attacked on turn 2, while odds are you're still too far away to do anything about it??? Because as stated earlier, his dying sets the stage for a game over). Yeah, but that's not an issue with paralogues in general, just certain bad apples. Most of them are great and have no issues. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eltosian Kadath Posted February 28, 2021 Share Posted February 28, 2021 1 hour ago, Alastor15243 said: ...Asugi... ...Asugi escaped. On turn one. Through the entrance. That we started at. Causing a game over. I LOST THE IRONMAN AGAIN. HERE WE ARE, NO AMBUSH SPAWNS, NO FOG OF WAR, NONE OF THE HORSESHIT I ROUTINELY COMPLAIN ABOUT IN IRONMANS, AND I'M ZERO FOR FUCKING TWO. Sorry about the lost ironman, but how it happened is kinda hilarious... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lenticular Posted February 28, 2021 Share Posted February 28, 2021 1 hour ago, Alastor15243 said: Also, due to some weird Awakening fanservice, he's the spitting image of Gaius. And he's the only one of the three Hoshidans to do this whose anagram name is actually spellable with Japanese characters. The others are Caeldori and Rhajat, which... yeah. What the hell is going on with all the Awakening stuff in Fates anyway? Did the devs ever explain what they were thinking with that one or why they decided to do it? Because it's just so incredibly weird and nonsensical. Even with all its references to older games, even Awakening didn't go so far as Fates does with its Awakening stuff. Did they think that they would only be able to keep the new fans from Awakening if they included all this stuff? If so, I dread what the next game will do to appease Three Houses fans. And I say that as someone who actually loves Three Houses. 1 hour ago, Alastor15243 said: I LOST THE IRONMAN AGAIN. HERE WE ARE, NO AMBUSH SPAWNS, NO FOG OF WAR, NONE OF THE HORSESHIT I ROUTINELY COMPLAIN ABOUT IN IRONMANS, AND I'M ZERO FOR FUCKING TWO. Oof. I'm sorry. That sucks. I guess the question is, which is worse for ironmanning, a situation where there's a high probability of unfairly losing a unit, or a situation where there's a low but non-negligible probability of getting a game over? Bad ambush spawns or fog of war can routinely kill characters off, but it's usually not going to be your lord because they are -- most of the time -- going to be strong enough to take an unexpected hit or two. And while it sucks to lose a character out of nowhere, it's usually possible to recover. On the other hand, we have this issue that you ran into which is a weird one that isn't going to hit very many people, except that it's instant game over, no chance of recovery. I honestly don't know which I think is worse. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Punished Dayni Posted February 28, 2021 Share Posted February 28, 2021 5 hours ago, Alastor15243 said: ...I just noticed the tall towers with lit windows in the background of Fort Dragonfall. They can't seriously be suggesting Fort Dragonfall is that fucking huge, right? It would have to be big enough to justify being a castle itself! And it's fucking tiny in-game. I think it's implied by the scene you see a segment in game and there's more to it than what you play through. Doesn't mean the segment shouldn't be bigger. 5 hours ago, Alastor15243 said: ...Asugi... ...Asugi escaped. On turn one. Through the entrance. That we started at. Causing a game over. The Ironman might as well have this as it's soundtrack. So there was no real thing about how he'd act? Jeez game. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shadow Mir Posted February 28, 2021 Share Posted February 28, 2021 10 minutes ago, Dayni said: The Ironman might as well have this as it's soundtrack. I don't get it. Personally, I think this is more fitting: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Punished Dayni Posted February 28, 2021 Share Posted February 28, 2021 22 minutes ago, Shadow Mir said: I don't get it. Personally, I think this is more fitting: Mostly because this ironman's been hit multiple times now. Speaking of, are we treating the Ironman as fully dead now? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alastor15243 Posted February 28, 2021 Author Share Posted February 28, 2021 1 minute ago, Dayni said: Speaking of, are we treating the Ironman as fully dead now? I think it's safe to say I've fully lost bragging rights by this point, but I don't really care. I'm still gonna play like the ironman's still going, because it's fun. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Punished Dayni Posted February 28, 2021 Share Posted February 28, 2021 1 minute ago, Alastor15243 said: I think it's safe to say I've fully lost bragging rights by this point You do have the bragging rights of causing a game over I wouldn't be surprised wasn't accounted for. I didn't know about it, so I had a laugh, though that's mostly because of my lack of experience with the child paralogues. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jotari Posted March 1, 2021 Share Posted March 1, 2021 (edited) 12 hours ago, Alastor15243 said: Birthright Day 12: Chapter 20 Alright, let's get going! I've upgraded the mess hall, so everyone got Jakob's strength, speed and skill meal. As I said, I changed Saizo to kinshi knight at the end of last chapter, though I'm having partial regrets about that. While giving Saizo and Mozu more synergy is gonna be great, I was probably on track to having a user of both the Pursuer and the Chakram with master ninja Saizo with the help of arms scrolls. Silas isn't gonna get much use out of it even if I did go to the trouble to get him S rank, since it cripples enemy phase ability. Still, aside from being slower, he's all-around better at being a kinshi knight than Mozu is, significantly outstripping her in several stats, which is surprising, considering Mozu's growth rates. But then, Saizo has just about the best growth rates in the entire game. Well, whatever. Let's get moving. I won't be doing castle visits today because I'm looking to reset the schedule so I can do it first thing on Monday. ...I just noticed the tall towers with lit windows in the background of Fort Dragonfall. They can't seriously be suggesting Fort Dragonfall is that fucking huge, right? It would have to be big enough to justify being a castle itself! And it's fucking tiny in-game. But yeah, Iago shows up, brings the dragon the fort is made out of partially back to life, and has it start releasing stomach acid to slowly digest (or, presumably, asphyxiate) us. And he can do this because Garon apparently “entrusted [him] with some rather fabulous new powers”. Huh? What, is he talking about the power Garon got from Anankos? What's going on here? That said, “There's only one way out of here, and it isn't pleasant. Also, you'll die, in case that wasn't clear” got a chuckle out of me. And Dakota's hesitant about Azura trying to sing because it's painful for her, and I'm like YOU'RE ALL ABOUT TO BE DIGESTED! I THINK THIS JUSTIFIES SOME PHYSICAL TRAUMA TO GET OUT. Yet again, faceless. Ridiculously weak faceless that my best units can take out with ease. They're also all meleelocked in a map with tons of walls when I have tons of fliers with tons of ranged weapons. Did I mention that every single one of them but the boss is below level 20? Fuck it, let's just rush through this shit and get the treasure. So, the game yet again makes enemies appear literally right after you start the map, and somehow damaging terrain effects fliers in this game. Yeah, the game doesn't tell you this explicitly, but enemies keep spawning from the stomach acid, so you have to use dragon veins to get rid of it or they'll keep respawning. At least this isn't a rout map, even though the implications of the story (that Azura needs us to get rid of all the monsters or else the song won't work) really suggest it should be. Christ, just before starting yesterday I said that I reached the part of Fire Emblem games where things really pick up speed, but every single map since I said that has been a dud. I really hope they get to the good shit soon. I hope there still is good shit. Anyway, yet again, that chapter barely warranted comment. I mostly used it to fuck around practicing battle maneuvers to mixed success. This really isn't the best practice after all. I got all the treasure without issue. None of the locktouch faceless even got close to it. Ah yes, the 5-breaker boss, who's annoyingly got every breaker except shurikenbreaker. No matter. I have Silas. Yeah, seeing how brutally this song magic is affecting Azura in Birthright, it's frankly ridiculous that we never see this shit in either other route and there's no “figuring out how to save her” payoff in Revelation. As for the “tied to the Valla curse” theory, this is clearly the sort of thing the curse of Valla is described to cause, but the way she describes it makes no mention of the song itself doing the damage. It's the power she's drawing from her amulet. And she sings this song for fun all the time, as she's said and demonstrated before. ...Also, uh... quick aside... it's pretty heavily implied by whole-game context that Azura knows she's going to have to die to stop Garon. And yet... she still gets married. Has kids. Doesn't say jack shit about any of this to her family. She's basically doing the same thing Claud did to Aideen in FE4, just as the opposite sex and not leaving her partner to raise children in a hellish oppressive regime. Kiiiiiiinda shitty if you ask me. But yeah, no way in hell I can stop here. Let's get a new party member. No comment here, just erasing text boxes is a massive pain on mobile. Quote Day 12 Bonus: Paralogue 9 So yeah, we're getting Saizo's son, Saizo. Except no, that would be dumb as hell, because in reality Saizo the sixth, rather fucking understandably, has absolutely no interest in holding up the family name of some asshole he barely sees to serve some country he hasn't seen at all. I would actually love it if they did do that some time, give two characters in the same game the same name. Fire Emblem manages to stick to the one Steve limit very admirably for a series with like over a thousand characters, for them to just say fuck it some time and name a bunch of characters Louis or something would be hilarious. And would be such a troll move for the fan base as we obsessively talk about the strengths and weaknesses of these units which would just be confusing if a bunch of them had the same name 10 hours ago, lenticular said: What the hell is going on with all the Awakening stuff in Fates anyway? Did the devs ever explain what they were thinking with that one or why they decided to do it? Because it's just so incredibly weird and nonsensical. Even with all its references to older games, even Awakening didn't go so far as Fates does with its Awakening stuff. Did they think that they would only be able to keep the new fans from Awakening if they included all this stuff? If so, I dread what the next game will do to appease Three Houses fans. And I say that as someone who actually loves Three Houses. I don't actually mind the Awakening fanservice in Fates. Well the identical kids is a bit unnecessary, but Owain and the like I have no issue, in concept. It is handled rather badly with the main game giving no explanation as to why they're there and the DLC that does explain it giving them a lot of responsibility when they do absolutely nothing in the story. But just in concept including a character in the previous title in the next is decent fanservice in my book. And it's not the first time they did that. Gaiden is. I wouldn't really object if it were a standard practice for the series to include a minor character in the last title in the next. Caspar and Linhardt would be particularly good characters to bring back from Three Houses as they have an ending saying they explored other continents. Edited March 1, 2021 by Jotari Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shanty Pete's 1st Mate Posted March 1, 2021 Share Posted March 1, 2021 19 hours ago, Alastor15243 said: I just don't get that mindset at all. That's literally every chapter in every Fire Emblem game ever. Except, like, Battle Preparations from FE7. And why would you ever want to skip a chapter on principle, regardless of difficulty or rewards, just because it's another chapter and another chance to fail? If you could skip all the way from prologue to endgame, would you ever even entertain the idea that you'd be better off doing that? I can understand the case that it's against the spirit of the game, yes, but the theory is sound. If I'm playing an Ironman, and I'm doing so optimally, then I should only make choices which increase or preserve my chances of success - not decrease it. Therefore, in an ironman setting, a Paralogue is only worth going to if the potential benefit of doing so (that is, resilience against getting a "Game Over" in subsequent chapters, perhaps through earned experience and items) is greater than the potential detriment of doing so (getting a Game Over, or simply losing a crucial unit). As for the bolded part - if I could go straight from the Prologue to the Endgame, and in so doing have a reliable way (so not an RNG fiesta) of beating that map, then yes, I would consider such a skip to be the optimal Ironman strategy. I don't believe any game presents such a scenario - especially assuming the skip means missing out not only on EXP, but also recruits, items, and weapons that come from playing the game. And even if it were possible, I imagine there would be separate categories for "megaskip", "playing the game normally", and "all chapters" Ironmans (er, "Ironmen"?). 20 hours ago, Alastor15243 said: Really, what he said is not a general rule. The issue here is more that this map just has a really stupid game over condition it's way too easy to accidentally achieve. With other paralogues the "risk" is totally worth it to keep your army strong. I haven't done a Birthright Ironman, so I'll have to assess this when the time comes. My experience with Hard Revelation was, I didn't need the experience or items that paralogues would have offered to achieve victory. Sure, Shura died, but that was a result of me being stupid about the Replicate skill. Of course, Lunatic Birthright may be a different beast. The Game Over does sound like a dumb one (if it can come from an enemy or NPC escaping, the map should clearly designate potential "Escape" tiles). But hey - the fewer chapters you play, the fewer chances you get at facing a bullshit Game Over condition *taps forehead*. 19 hours ago, lenticular said: I guess the question is, which is worse for ironmanning, a situation where there's a high probability of unfairly losing a unit, or a situation where there's a low but non-negligible probability of getting a game over? Bad ambush spawns or fog of war can routinely kill characters off, but it's usually not going to be your lord because they are -- most of the time -- going to be strong enough to take an unexpected hit or two. And while it sucks to lose a character out of nowhere, it's usually possible to recover. On the other hand, we have this issue that you ran into which is a weird one that isn't going to hit very many people, except that it's instant game over, no chance of recovery. I honestly don't know which I think is worse. cries in Lyn and Micaiah Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Venger_06 Posted March 1, 2021 Share Posted March 1, 2021 22 hours ago, Alastor15243 said: ...Asugi... ...Asugi escaped. On turn one. Through the entrance. That we started at. Causing a game over. I LOST THE IRONMAN AGAIN. HERE WE ARE, NO AMBUSH SPAWNS, NO FOG OF WAR, NONE OF THE HORSESHIT I ROUTINELY COMPLAIN ABOUT IN IRONMANS, AND I'M ZERO FOR FUCKING TWO. Big oof. These last two runs should be called "how to fail a Fates ironman in a spectacular way". Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alastor15243 Posted March 1, 2021 Author Share Posted March 1, 2021 (edited) Birthright Day 13: Paralogue 9, Take 2 Setting yesterday's incident aside, let's pick up right where we left off. I'm still gonna be playing this like it's an ironman, even though it very clearly isn't anymore. Ironmanning is just the way to go when playing these games for me, and this very unfortunate hiccup aside, I'll be way happier ironmanning than resetting in general. First, castle maintenance. Everyone gets a prince crown today. ...Would you look at that! Somebody got me emeralds! I didn't even notice until looking at my resources just now! I totally forgot to check for new buildings yesterday, and forgot we have the full rod shop now. So I just turned Takumi into a kinshi knight so he can nab darting blow. For those of you who didn't know, if you get a new class through friendship or partner access, and it's a base class that promotes into one of your pre-existing promotion options... then whether you heart seal, friendship seal or partner seal into that pre-existing promotion option, you'll start getting the skills of that added base class too. Speaking of kinshi knight skills, I'm looking to get Saizo two levels in kinshi knight so that Asugi will get quick draw when the chapter ends and he spawns as a proper unit and not the fake one we need to keep away from the exit or entrance. Weirdly, the sounds of the breaking walls cut off the usual dragon vein sound effects. Never seen that before. So far, everything's going as well as it did before Asugi abruptly shoved my ass to the game over screen. And thanks to fixed level rolls, Silas even got the same badass level up too. Yep. While this is a refreshingly tense situation, it's nothing I can't handle, and I'm getting through it pretty quickly. We start getting reinforcements and thieves opening the doors (which was terrifying, but turns out they had locktouch if I cared to look, and nobody was nearby them anyway), but it's too late for the enemy. I'm in position to one-round the boss with Ryoma. I really wish I had just tried to do it the normal way to begin with, really. They basically completely copy Gaius's “steal, but don't kill” attitude, and Saizo says he's off the hook with the family legacy. And now he's coming along. Awesome. Wish I managed to get him quick draw, but I couldn't figure out any way to give Saizo the boss kill. He wasn't close enough. He's getting skill+2. ...Wait... no? That's... weird. Apparently with Asugi, the one you get is the one who showed up in the level. Asugi didn't inherit skill+2, the skill Saizo got in the level. He has lethality, the skill that was Saizo's top skill at the start. Huh. Anyway, he's now a level 6 master ninja, and by far the most probable candidate for using the chakram if I can get him close enough to arms scroll up. Alright, time to do supports. I only have the family ones with Asugi for now, so we'll be able to go through this pretty quickly and move on to the next chapter. Mozu and Asugi just have a cute scene where Mozu's worried about her son's dangerous scouting missions and was staying up all night waiting for him to get home. As I said, cute, but... I'd be lying if I said I didn't hate the fact that a lot of these just go straight into normal family relationships like these haven't been the most distant and useless parents in human history. As for Saizo, I find it interesting that the second Asugi offhandedly mentions that the girls in town like the candy he makes, (wasn't even the first thing he mentioned), Saizo flips out like this candy-making hobby is just a pretense to pick up chicks. I'm curious how that's gonna turn out. Day 13 Bonus: Chapter 21 Burning Falls. I always remember finding this chapter super annoying, but then, I never had a bunch of fliers to deal with the (what I remember to be) annoying terrain before. Apparently Iago never actually went to Garon to make excuses like Dakota and company thought he would. He just fucked off, and we're seeing Garon... just... discover his failure at this moment... somehow... with no one present in the room. Is Anankos telling him? Why? Surely Anankos has better things to do. Xander catches Elise spying on Garon, and... somehow he thinks that winning the war will bring everything back to normal. Obviously not, since he's totally given up on bringing Dakota home. But yeah... like... holy shit, I'll have stuff to say about Xander, I'm sure. The fact that he thinks what he's doing is remotely justified is kind of ridiculous, as is... what happens. ...Why are we on the water? WHY. THE FUCK. ARE WE ON THE WATER? I'M LOOKING AT THE MAP RIGHT NOW. THERE'S NO FUCKING WATER BETWEEN FORT DRAGONFALL AND DEMON'S FALLS. WHAT HORSESHIT IS THIS!? Oh yeah, and while you're at it, sure, Ryoma! Just tell us the game's yet again flagrantly ignoring its own claim that fliers can't fly across the bottomless canyon because they're instantly struck by lightning! Yukimura sent “a young pegasus rider” from the bottomless canyon to deliver a message for us! FUCKING SURE! “Yukimura reports that the royal troops are still holding the line in Hoshido. But it appears that the soldiers from Mokushu have joined Nohr in attacking us. It sounds like it's only a matter of time before our defenses are breached.” Mokushu? You mean the people whose army we routed and whose leader we fucking killed? How are they still strong enough to make a difference in the tide of the battle!? Okay, so while the backdrop is indistinguishable from the open sea, Ryoma says they're traveling “upstream”, so, what, are we just going along a tiny river not marked on the map or something? Shit, game, that's lazy. This apparently isn't lava, but burning oily water. Interesting concept, though it really just looks like lava. Okay, I think this is the first time we see stoneborn in this marathon. I don't remember them ever showing up in Revelation. They're a cool idea, though it's all about the execution, and I'm not liking the execution here. They seem to be specifically set up to punish basically any use of any player-phase unit. I can do some player-phase combat, but only by heavily relying on my enemy-phase units to take the brunt of the enemies the rear stoneborn covers. I miscalculated Silas's strength and had to use a rescue rod to save someone I sent in to finish off the stoneborn so they wouldn't be slaughtered by the enemies on enemy phase. The dragon vein gimmick of this battle is suuuuper dumb. There are two dragon veins, and you have to pick the right one in order to advance without getting a brutal penalty, which I remember being a global terrain debuff and enemy reinforcements. Weirdly, the only way to escape from the burning floor... is into holes in the ground... which you'd presume the flaming water would seep into first. But yeah, anyway, the observant will notice pretty quickly that you're supposed to pick the dragon vein on the side of the statue that's holding the orb. And for some reason, I think due to this dumb “won't tell you which does which” gimmick, they don't actually tell you where the path you're opening up across the lava is going to be, which is annoying for playing blind. ...The... the lava. The dragon vein flavor text just flat-out calls it lava. Not burning water like the story said... lava. Alright, so, the enemies refuse to move unless approached, so that's annoying. So I'll be baiting enemies in with my tanks to kill them with my player-phasers. Saizo got quick draw and Takumi got darting blow pretty much one after the other. Saizo's been running into some issues doubling these guys, as a kinshi knight, which is a pain. Pity I can't teach him darting blow too. ...Wait... can't I? ...I can! Saizo and Subaki have a support chain! That's right! I got the first one already! Sweet! Well, I sure as hell know who I'm sticking Saizo to like glue from now on! Asugi's fast as hell, but unfortunately he's not very strong. Man I wish I had gotten quick draw on Saizo before doing his paralogue. Also, I'm taking any opportunity I have to feed some kills to Dakota. If I can keep her at least capable of surviving a single devastating round of combat with the enemy, that'll be awesome. That +3/-3 on Silas has been way too useful to have to give it up in the late-game. Honestly, this is another rather tedious map. There's absolutely no pressure here due to the non-aggressive enemies. I remember it getting more interesting towards the end, though. Dakota got a terrible single stat level up, but at least she also got the defender skill, which improves my options for controlling her stats for the first turn. Sweet, Scarlet just got rally defense. With that, my army's... pretty much invincible I think. Right, when you get near the boss things start getting ridiculous, so I'm just going to go and assassinate him with Silas. Weirdly, the only generic Vallite soldier I remember ever seeing talk... is the stoneborn boss on this map. It's the weirdest thing. Alright, we're clear. And then the party's arguing about how to explain the ridiculous plot contrivance that is the secret passage they miraculously found at the end of a dead-end wall they were moving towards for some reason (despite not knowing there was any exit in that direction at all) that will send them straight to Windmire. It's... pretty damned dumb. But the prevailing theory, with no evidence at all, is that it was built by the Rainbow Sage, who didn't tell them about it, or even that they should go to Demon's Falls, because he was worried about their “rat problem”. I mean, okay, fair enough, he is implied to be psychic, so if he could somehow predict how they'd figure out on their own while giving no time for Nohr to react... sure, I buy that. But still, this is ridiculously roundabout, and they have basically zero evidence that this is true. ...Takumi's back to suspecting a traitor again for some reason. He's been flip-flopping on this, and it's really weird. Anyway, back to base, and I unlocked Dakota's C support with Orochi, which is about Orochi telling Dakota stories about Mikoto. Apparently her future sight abilities left her... kinda spacey, which is an amusing thought that would have fucking been nice to see even once. I also got a support with Rinkah that was just... Rinkah refusing to socialize in any way, demanding a follow-up I'm never going to get. Now then... Takumi and Ryoma. They get into a fight over Takumi being too obsessed with getting stronger in order to defend the kingdom one day, and... really, that's it. Ugh, I never feel like I have much of value to say about any support since Path of Radiance. It's kind of annoying. It's only the odd support that prompts me to say anything of value. I just have no passion for it most of the time. But that's it for today. I'll see you guys tomorrow. Stay safe, everyone. Edited March 1, 2021 by Alastor15243 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shadow Mir Posted March 1, 2021 Share Posted March 1, 2021 On 2/27/2021 at 9:48 PM, lenticular said: I hate that level with a passion (it's definitely in my top three least favourite maps in all of Fire Emblem), but I don't think it should ding the ironmannability score. It's not unfair; it's just unfun. No, the levels that I count against Conquest's ironmannability are the Kitsune level (insufficiently explained gimmick), the defend chapter (changing the rules mid-map without warning) and to a lesser extent the Fort Dragonfall chapter (unfair reinforcements with unclear spawn conditions). The problem is that the wind triggers after player phase is over. That's on the level of cheap that same turn reinforcements are. While the Dragon Veins can deal with it, not only are there only so many to use, there's the opportunity cost to consider, because using them likely means I'm sacrificing one of my better units' turns. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alastor15243 Posted March 1, 2021 Author Share Posted March 1, 2021 51 minutes ago, Shadow Mir said: The problem is that the wind triggers after player phase is over. That's on the level of cheap that same turn reinforcements are. While the Dragon Veins can deal with it, not only are there only so many to use, there's the opportunity cost to consider, because using them likely means I'm sacrificing one of my better units' turns. The game tells you that they happen at the end of player phase. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shadow Mir Posted March 1, 2021 Share Posted March 1, 2021 Just now, Alastor15243 said: The game tells you that they happen at the end of player phase. Doesn't make it any less underhanded. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alastor15243 Posted March 1, 2021 Author Share Posted March 1, 2021 1 minute ago, Shadow Mir said: Doesn't make it any less underhanded. The game tells you what happens, it tells you when it happens, and telegraphs the spaces it happens on in big directional, color-coded visible wind gusts. There's nothing even remotely underhanded about this. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shadow Mir Posted March 1, 2021 Share Posted March 1, 2021 17 minutes ago, Alastor15243 said: The game tells you what happens, it tells you when it happens, and telegraphs the spaces it happens on in big directional, color-coded visible wind gusts. There's nothing even remotely underhanded about this. So being blown away no matter where you are (which is one formation) is not underhanded? Anyway, I still think gimmicks that move the player's units against their will are a deadly sin as far as strategy games go. I'd go so far as to say not even the worst gimmicks Revelation threw at me (except for this, of course) are as cheap as this. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lenticular Posted March 1, 2021 Share Posted March 1, 2021 15 hours ago, Jotari said: I don't actually mind the Awakening fanservice in Fates. Well the identical kids is a bit unnecessary, but Owain and the like I have no issue, in concept. It is handled rather badly with the main game giving no explanation as to why they're there and the DLC that does explain it giving them a lot of responsibility when they do absolutely nothing in the story. But just in concept including a character in the previous title in the next is decent fanservice in my book. And it's not the first time they did that. Gaiden is. I wouldn't really object if it were a standard practice for the series to include a minor character in the last title in the next. Caspar and Linhardt would be particularly good characters to bring back from Three Houses as they have an ending saying they explored other continents. I don't mind the inclusion of crossover characters in principle, but only when it actually makes a reasonable amount of sense. I've not played Gaiden itself, but I don't have a problem with the character crossovers in Echoes. The story there is just "we're on a different continent and a few of the people from Shadow Dragon traveled to that continent after the end of that game". It's simple, but it makes sense. Similarly, having "Marth" be referenced in Awakening makes sense. He's a legendary figure from the world's past. The problem I have with the Awakening characters in Fates is that they are seemingly entirely different worlds with different cosmologies and no interconnection, and then there's no explanation for how they got there. It basically feels like the writers saying "we don't give a shit about the lore and worldbuilding of our games and so you shouldn't either". Of course, this is Fates and Awakening that we're talking about here, so it's not as if they were ruining an otherwise-spotless track record, but it still irks me. 7 hours ago, Shanty Pete's 1st Mate said: cries in Lyn and Micaiah There's a reason I said "most of the time". 3 hours ago, Alastor15243 said: The dragon vein gimmick of this battle is suuuuper dumb. There are two dragon veins, and you have to pick the right one in order to advance without getting a brutal penalty, which I remember being a global terrain debuff and enemy reinforcements. Weirdly, the only way to escape from the burning floor... is into holes in the ground... which you'd presume the flaming water would seep into first. But yeah, anyway, the observant will notice pretty quickly that you're supposed to pick the dragon vein on the side of the statue that's holding the orb. And for some reason, I think due to this dumb “won't tell you which does which” gimmick, they don't actually tell you where the path you're opening up across the lava is going to be, which is annoying for playing blind. Yeah, this gimmick is terrible. One of the things I dislike about it is that the parallax scrolling here means that depending on what angle you're looking from, it can either be super obvious that the statue's hands are in front of the dragon veins or it can look as if they're completely unconnected. Another thing is that if you do trigger the wrong one, you then have to wait a few turns before the game will let you advance, so you have a few turns of doing nothing but sitting and dealing with reinforcements, which is deathly dull. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Samz707 Posted March 1, 2021 Share Posted March 1, 2021 (edited) Yeah I think character crossovers should either A: be explicitly non-canon or B: when they're already in the same world. (Actually what was the reason for them all being in Warriors? outrealms?) As for the Lava, who knows, maybe it's like No One Lives Forever and it's just fake Lava that's actually superheated water! Edited March 1, 2021 by Samz707 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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