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Why the game kinda hates Edelgard?


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So, I've been playing Three Houses for about two weeks non-stop, and I got some questions... 
Spoiler warning for the game here, and also forgive me, if grammar would be bad. English not my main language. 


After playing Two routs, GD and BE, I kinda get the feeling that the game doesn't like El. No, not because she is a villian. Well... Not all that. My points:

- Her route is short. And clunky. I consider it almost a miracle, that i liked it the same as GD route, despite how rushed it was. And it the only one like that. Even Chearh route is longer. 
- She didn't have a confrontation with Cult. I mean, come on, she has the most connection to them. They tourchered her, and killed off (indirectly) her family. And yet, nothing? Also, Byleth in this route kinda forgets about them. They killed his/her father, and now El sided with them, and he/she doesn't mind? Also, it would made her significantly less evil in the eyes of players, because we would see that she isn't fond of their methods not just on words. 
- She is only one lord who dies on screen in every possibility. For example, on BE route I let Claude go, and Dima was killed like normal unit. Edelgard? Turn into monster (BL route), gets beaten, and then try to stub Dimitri in the back, like some lowlife traitor, only to get impeled. That's kinda harsh.... And also the reason I still didn't start the BL route. 
- With other lords, if you chose them, you stay with them. With El you can kill her if you like, and her class stays with you. 
- Depite being one of the main villians of the game, her motives ain't cleer in other routs, but her's. Thanks to that I'm gonna need to explain to my friends why I fell in love with Daenerys Crestborn. Myeh...
- Her face on S-rank art is kinda weird... And all other cheracters get wounderfull artworks. 

That's all I can think off right now. My point is that despte being one of the most popular cheracters in the game, in game itself she has much less care and love put in her route and image in other routes. Because of that I have to deal with harassment on fact that I willingly S-rank her after GD route. I understand that she is moraly wrong. And I made my choice being aware of that. But the game itself is given the impression that I made the choice it would not be preapered for, starts to panic and throw some half-beaked storyline at me. 

But maybe it's just me, and my opinion could be wrong. That's why I want to know that other people think about that. Thanks.

Edited by AlexKostrov
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23 minutes ago, AlexKostrov said:

- She didn't have a confrontation with Cult. I mean, come on, she has the most connection to them. They tourchered her, and killed off (indirectly) her family. And yet, nothing? Also, Byleth in this route kinda forgets about them. They killed his/her father, and now El sided with them, and he/she doesn't mind? Also, it would made her significantly less evil in the eyes of players, because we would see that she isn't fond of their methods not just on words. 

I don't think that's correct. Hubert spells it out pretty clearly that they are just biding their time until taking on Those that Slither in the first mission after the timeskip. This once again comes up in his paralogue and in the last chapter Edelgard and Arundal have some passive agressive combat about who's going to backstab the other first. 

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10 minutes ago, Etrurian emperor said:

"...in the last chapter Edelgard and Arundal have some passive agressive combat about who's going to backstab the other first."

Yes, i shoud have adress that. I remember this, but my point was that the route didn't SHOW us that. They build up that hatred to Arundal, and then...... Title screen. We only get words on the ending that they delt with them. 

Edited by AlexKostrov
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2 hours ago, Etrurian emperor said:

I don't think that's correct. Hubert spells it out pretty clearly that they are just biding their time until taking on Those that Slither in the first mission after the timeskip. This once again comes up in his paralogue and in the last chapter Edelgard and Arundal have some passive agressive combat about who's going to backstab the other first. 

 

That and the killing off Cornelia, that they know is an associate of 'TWSITD' (and the actual reason for the attack), show that it is already happening, with preemptive elimination of the other side's assets.

 

Edit: Whoops, typo for the name corrected.

Edited by Hardric62
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3 minutes ago, Hardric62 said:

 

That and the killing off Cordelia, that they know is an associate of 'TWSITD' (and the actual reason for the attack), show that it is already happening, with preemptive elimination of the other side's assets.

Wait fe has another cordelia name character or at least thesame VA

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12 minutes ago, Mikethemaster2018 said:

Wait fe has another cordelia name character or at least thesame VA

It's Cornelia here, not Cordelia. Different VA, actually it's Panne's VA.

Edited by Humanoid
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There's parts in the game that shows that they needed more time. 

It's not just the BE route (though that's the obvious answer) but also other stuff like how they didn't bother making another cutscene for Ch. 21 for the GD route. Or, you know all the identical maps.

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27 minutes ago, Mikethemaster2018 said:

Oh okay why does NA keep chaning names. Sad to not have Cordelia VA in a main game again. At least Panne VA doing FE work. No other Awakening VA in the game?

There are a few but I'm not good with VA recognition so someone else may be better placed to provide more names. Anna returns of course, as do Flavia/Miriel and Basilio/Gerome. Huh, never noticed the parallel there.

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14 minutes ago, Humanoid said:

There are a few but I'm not good with VA recognition so someone else may be better placed to provide more names. Anna returns of course, as do Flavia/Miriel and Basilio/Gerome. Huh, never noticed the parallel there.

Oh yeah tara platt is El and Mirial/Flavia. Never knew Gerome VA was Basilio either lol. Man I might play Awakening just for fun. Been having it since 2013. Been 6 years wow time flies away sometime.

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Cordelia's VA is Julie Ann Taylor, who appears to be missing from Three Houses.

 

On topic, I feel that sort of bias, not only anti-Edelgard, but pro-Rhea. You have to go out of your way (and, without care, sacrifice resources) to allow yourself the chance to side with Edelgard. I have failed to see eye-to-eye on the glorification of Rhea since hearing her views on the Lonato rebellion, and while I still need more time to get to the route to hear the full story from the game, I have what I believe to be a general picture from external sources, and said picture dissatisfies me.

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36 minutes ago, bethany81707 said:

Cordelia's VA is Julie Ann Taylor, who appears to be missing from Three Houses.

 

On topic, I feel that sort of bias, not only anti-Edelgard, but pro-Rhea. You have to go out of your way (and, without care, sacrifice resources) to allow yourself the chance to side with Edelgard. I have failed to see eye-to-eye on the glorification of Rhea since hearing her views on the Lonato rebellion, and while I still need more time to get to the route to hear the full story from the game, I have what I believe to be a general picture from external sources, and said picture dissatisfies me.

That’s because from neutral perspective, Byleth is unlikely to choose Edelgard to begin with.

 

From Byleth’s perspective in the Holy Tomb, Edelgard was the one murdering Jeralt, sent you to the darkness and she just order you and rest of the class to be killed by her soldiers. She also never explains her plan to you yet. While the diary implies Rhea has some secrets, it’s not open threat or hostility like Edelgard. So the game makes the neutral path as going against Edelgard.

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49 minutes ago, bethany81707 said:

On topic, I feel that sort of bias, not only anti-Edelgard, but pro-Rhea. You have to go out of your way (and, without care, sacrifice resources) to allow yourself the chance to side with Edelgard. I have failed to see eye-to-eye on the glorification of Rhea since hearing her views on the Lonato rebellion, and while I still need more time to get to the route to hear the full story from the game, I have what I believe to be a general picture from external sources, and said picture dissatisfies me.

Well, I'm still a bit confused on what exactly Rhea does that's so evil. I feel a little lost on that point.

That said, it's not like this has stopped people from siding with Edelgard.

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I've played BL, GD, and most of BE, leaving the Church route as the only one I haven't gotten to yet and honestly, while I can get where you're coming from, I think it's because she's meant to be at the very best an anti-villain. In most other routes you're directly opposing her because, let's face it, her methods are atrocious so there's no wonder she's cast in a bad light there. In her own route it's because while they try to portray her as sympathetic, she's still doing all these horrible things. I think it's kinda deserved personally and if I had to pick a lord that the game continually messed over it would be Dimitri. Poor guy doesn't get any help except in his own route and unlike Edelgard they don't even have the decency to give his deaths a scene. Claude doesn't have to die at all. He's the true favorite lol.

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13 minutes ago, dragonlordsd said:

Well, I'm still a bit confused on what exactly Rhea does that's so evil. I feel a little lost on that point.

That said, it's not like this has stopped people from siding with Edelgard.

Quote

However, we must punish any sinner who may inflict harm upon believers, even if those sinners are civilians. I pray the students learned a valuable lesson about the fate that awaits all who are foolish enough to point their blades towards the heavens.

I'm not sure how the game intends to change my mind on her after hearing that. I've heard Golden Deer was supposed to be one of her better showings, and yet that was my first route and I came out of it just as Rhea-negative as I came in.

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I'm sure the Edelgard Route was since the beginning intented to exist (it was implied it's existence since the first trailer); however it's very clear that the game wanted you to know the tragic story of "Edelgard the Lady of Hresvelg" before actually trying to reach her hand (which probably feels the most interesting if you accidently enter in the Church Route)

 

That probably affected the priorities developing the game's chapters and the cutscenes (after all Edelgard only appears as a hero in one of them).

Edited by Troykv
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2 hours ago, bethany81707 said:

I'm not sure how the game intends to change my mind on her after hearing that. I've heard Golden Deer was supposed to be one of her better showings, and yet that was my first route and I came out of it just as Rhea-negative as I came in.

I mean, I get that. That's super cold and all.

But proportionally speaking, compared to everyone but Claude, that's pretty much par for the course. I mean, looking at what Edelgard or Dmitri does, I don't see any super clear distinction.

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3 hours ago, dragonlordsd said:

Well, I'm still a bit confused on what exactly Rhea does that's so evil. I feel a little lost on that point.

That said, it's not like this has stopped people from siding with Edelgard.

About Rhea... a Tome of spoilers is required. You can see who she truly is if you side with Edelgard. Or she would tell you a bit about the past if you side with Claude.

Edited by RasaelKunn
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3 hours ago, bethany81707 said:

I'm not sure how the game intends to change my mind on her after hearing that. I've heard Golden Deer was supposed to be one of her better showings, and yet that was my first route and I came out of it just as Rhea-negative as I came in.

Well to fair those "sinners" were armed rebells that tried to murder her (and probably all others in the church of the middle). To my knowledge the church never had someone executed, imprisoned or in any other way harmed for the simple fact that he/she didnt believe in the churchs teaching. Quite the contrary they even have employed them in high positions.

I think the reason why many people quickly assume Rhea to be a evil doer is because she is the leader of an institunal religion. And in most japanese fantasy lores those guys are always up to same secret, corrupt stuff. Similiar to how people more easily believe an empire to be evil than a kingdom etc.

And to also be fair ... the language she uses is really something one expects from a representative of the internally rotten and corrupt churches in a final fantasy game. But to my knowledge she never supported that attitude with actual actions.

Edited by Nihilem
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3 hours ago, Timlugia said:

That’s because from neutral perspective, Byleth is unlikely to choose Edelgard to begin with.

 

From Byleth’s perspective in the Holy Tomb, Edelgard was the one murdering Jeralt, sent you to the darkness and she just order you and rest of the class to be killed by her soldiers. She also never explains her plan to you yet. While the diary implies Rhea has some secrets, it’s not open threat or hostility like Edelgard. So the game makes the neutral path as going against Edelgard.

1) Flame Emperor makes it clear she doesn't approve of TWSITD's methods and while you have no reason to believe her, you don't have much reason not to considering FE is anti-church while TWSITD are just twisted as hell and all for mass suffering

2) Just because FE cooperates with TWSITD doesn't mean they're always aware of what the other is doing. Jeralt's murder happens completely separate from anything involving the FE.

3) While both of the above don't excuse the fact that FE is cooperating with TWSITD, it's actually Rhea who pushes it too far. She repeatedly comes across as a hard-liner who tolerates no opposition and in that scene she wants to kill Edelgard NOW. No questions about why she's doing this and more importantly no questions about what she knows about TWSITD (and that's a big one). Furthermore, from the cutscene after the choice, I get the impression you're just like "I don't want to kill Edelgard" (she's your student and a source of information on what's going on and you want to know) and Rhea instantly goes off the deep end with the whole "HOW DARE YOU BETRAY ME??" As far as I can tell you're just telling Rhea to keep her kill urges in check and she takes it as a betrayal

Edited by Ivan Tridelan
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Bringing imperial soldiers in the tomb, not mercenaries, not bandits, but soldiers, is an act of war. If the heir of the empire is this hostile there are not many hopes of sorting things peacefully. 

And by the times edelgard is revealed, you don't even know that TWSITD exist, you just have FE having a discussion whit Thales, but for all you know it may be FE not being able to control her minions.

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4 hours ago, bethany81707 said:

I'm not sure how the game intends to change my mind on her after hearing that. I've heard Golden Deer was supposed to be one of her better showings, and yet that was my first route and I came out of it just as Rhea-negative as I came in.

Edelgard is not much different though. She is “my way or the highway.”

Yet, in every route, even her own, Edelgard pretty much goes “surrender and let yourself be conquered or I will run you over” to her opponents. Minimal explanations were seen from her end. If people didn’t actively go looking for explanations (Claude), everyone would be confused. Imagine how the continent is supposed to react since they are just caught in the cross-fire. They aren’t nearly as omniscient as us. 

 

Edited by MessengerIris
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1 hour ago, Ivan Tridelan said:

1) Flame Emperor makes it clear she doesn't approve of TWSITD's methods and while you have no reason to believe her, you don't have much reason not to considering FE is anti-church while TWSITD are just twisted as hell and all for mass suffering

2) Just because FE cooperates with TWSITD doesn't mean they're always aware of what the other is doing. Jeralt's murder happens completely separate from anything involving the FE.

3) While both of the above don't excuse the fact that FE is cooperating with TWSITD, it's actually Rhea who pushes it too far. She repeatedly comes across as a hard-liner who tolerates no opposition and in that scene she wants to kill Edelgard NOW. No questions about why she's doing this and more importantly no questions about what she knows about TWSITD (and that's a big one). Furthermore, from the cutscene after the choice, I get the impression you're just like "I don't want to kill Edelgard" (she's your student and a source of information on what's going on and you want to know) and Rhea instantly goes off the deep end with the whole "HOW DARE YOU BETRAY ME??" As far as I can tell you're just telling Rhea to keep her kill urges in check and she takes it as a betrayal

Just saying "But I dont like their goals" but continuing to cooperate with them is a really weak excuse.

But I agree with you that the game did a poor job in this particular scene. As "I dont want to kill Edelgard" directly leads you to joining her with no further explanation. And the only other option is to directly kill her. While any sane protagonist with the knowledge of Byleth would propaby go for "For FU*** Sake Edelgard, are you crazy? You are under arrest for serious crimes until you spit out wtf is going on." They could at least add a line where Byleth is trying to go for a reasonable way but letting Rhea hear none of it and saying something like "you either kill her now or you are a traitor" - sort of stuff. Given Rheas emotional status that wouldnt be too far fetched and give the player an actual reason to go with Edelgard.

Edited by Nihilem
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7 hours ago, Flere210 said:

And by the times edelgard is revealed, you don't even know that TWSITD exist, you just have FE having a discussion whit Thales, but for all you know it may be FE not being able to control her minions

FE says they work together. So I don't see an interpretation of Thales & Co. being FE's minions as possible. I think the game is quite clear on FE and the shadow gang being two different parties. 

 

16 hours ago, AlexKostrov said:

Her face on S-rank art is kinda weird... And all other cheracters get wounderfull artworks

Tbh I think most of them are weird. Some I think are even creepy.

I agree with this thread topic though. The fact that TWSITD were dealt with offscreen on El's route combined with the lower amount of chapters makes it pretty clear.

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8 hours ago, dragonlordsd said:

But proportionally speaking, compared to everyone but Claude, that's pretty much par for the course. I mean, looking at what Edelgard or Dmitri does, I don't see any super clear distinction.

Rhea is actively leading people into blind faith in her through fear- and just because that's not faith as in 'devout believer' doesn't mean it's not faith as in 'you can keep your world order as it is'. Edelgard is after societal revolution and while I'm still getting through Blue Lions (and don't have Church route), the narrative I have seen so far calls out Edelgard and Dimitri more often than Rhea, who doesn't have a setting of war to explain her actions.

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