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The one ACTUAL reason to side with Edelgard (Maybe spoilers)

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If you didn't know about the route split but are savvy enough to know that something is fishy when it comes up, you MIGHT realize that you may lose Edelgard and Hubert for good when you don't side with her.

Meaning any player who has invested resources (seals, EXP, teaching points, free day activity points for Tea Time or Meals) into them will of course want to side with her so all that stuff wasn't wasted.
There may also be a chance a player made one of the two their Dancer. Would be pretty bad if you lost that one, wouldn't it?

Edited by DragonFlames

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i spent those resources on Edelgard and Hubert

i couldn't care less about losing them, not because i don't like their characters, but simply because accepting to take part in her pretty much useless war felt like the wrong thing to do for me

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Such morally grey storytelling. I don't want to work alongside the group that had just killed my father and plan to use us to kill thousands more, but I ALSO don't want to lose out on those spent activity points. Hmmmmmmmmm

 

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9 minutes ago, Glennstavos said:

Such morally grey storytelling. I don't want to work alongside the group that had just killed my father and plan to use us to kill thousands more, but I ALSO don't want to lose out on those spent activity points. Hmmmmmmmmm

XD

7 minutes ago, Florete said:

But what about Flayn?

Well, she comes in late enough that people might not have had much time to invest in her when the decision comes around. But yeah, Flayn and Seteth are why siding with Edelgard hurts a lot. Especially if you do so after doing their Paralogue. It's like "Thanks for trusting me with your relics and secret, but I'mma kill you now, 'kay?"

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The reason to side with Edelgard:

 

Because you didn't say you were joining her, just you've spent almost a year with her and want answers and Rhea is too impatient for El's death and goes full berserk mode on you so I guess it's too late now?

Edited by Ivan Tridelan

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55 minutes ago, Florete said:

But what about Flayn?

I made Flayn my Dancer in the Black Eagles route, and I was so made when she left. It really made certain maps post time skip more difficult.

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14 minutes ago, Ivan Tridelan said:

The reason to side with Edelgard:

 

Because you didn't say you were joining her, just you've spent almost a year with her and want answers and Rhea is too impatient for El's death and goes full berserk mode on you so I guess it's too late now?

Well to be fair you also didnt say anything like "How about we just capture her to question her about TWSITD?" Its quite clear that Byleth is intending on joining her with this decision - you even turn your back at her. Even before she wen "full berserk mode" on you.

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1 hour ago, Yexin said:

 

i couldn't care less about losing them, not because i don't like their characters, but simply because accepting to take part in her pretty much useless war felt like the wrong thing to do for me

 

I think 'useless' is going quite far here. Like it or not, the situation in Fodlan only advanced because she wedged that 'useless war', regardless of if she wins or not. No action on her part? And I mean nothing, no Flame Emperor or literally anything but being a proper student then emperor, Byleth never becomes a thing on the radar, Rhea continues her little shadow war while going for next try on Revive Mommy plan,  corrupt nobility continues their little dealings... Nothing gets to move.

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4 minutes ago, Hardric62 said:

 

I think 'useless' is going quite far here. Like it or not, the situation in Fodlan only advanced because she wedged that 'useless war', regardless of if she wins or not. No action on her part? And I mean nothing, no Flame Emperor or literally anything but being a proper student then emperor, Byleth never becomes a thing on the radar, Rhea continues her little shadow war while going for next try on Revive Mommy plan,  corrupt nobility continues their little dealings... Nothing gets to move.

Well we dont know that. She already abolished most of Empire Nobillity after ascending to the throne BEFORE she started the war. And from all the Nobillities in Fodlan the impirial one wear clearly the worst offenders. Just compare how Black Eagly students see their families in comparision to lion or deer ones.

One could argue that the ascension was only possible because of TWSITD and that the war was their condition to help Edelgard out. But we dont know that for sure. Fact is that with Edelgard - as the emporer - and Dimitri - as King of Faerghus both despising the crest system they could make something against it diplomatical.

Spoiler

Exspecially if Byleth - through his continued interaction with Sothis - would propably sooner or later be drawn to the church anyways. And then is destined to become Archbishop (as we know from GD Route). We can assume that the moment he/she is told the real history behind the crest he/she will also be against it. That makes 3 out of 4 of the most powerful people in Fodlan activily trying to remove that system. 

I still have the theory that TWSITD have somehow foreseen this and there main reason to pitch Edelgard against the church (by e.g. lying about what happened at the red canyon) is to prevent the the anti-crest powers in fodlan to unite against TWSITD. The main reason besides killing Seiros and World Dominance I mean ofc.

 

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5 minutes ago, Nihilem said:

 

One could argue that the ascension was only possible because of TWSITD and that the war was their condition to help Edelgard out. But we dont know that for sure. Fact is that with Edelgard - as the emporer - and Dimitri - as King of Faerghus both despising the crest system they could make something against it diplomatical.

 

Not wrong, but that implies that TWSITD do sweet nothing against that, when they have already manipulated events to twart such attempts (Tragedy of Duscur, Rebellion of the Seven...).

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I don't know what you mean by actual reason. Having sided with Edelgard, I see her motivations and quite agree with them. Even if her methods were questionable (understandably so when you consider the logistics of forming a large enough organized rebellion against a tyrannical organization that has already demonstrated its willingness to stamp out and execute dissenters. If Edelgard had chosen to be diplomatic with Claude and Dimitri, she likely would have been found out and executed before consolidating power).

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47 minutes ago, Hardric62 said:

 

I think 'useless' is going quite far here. Like it or not, the situation in Fodlan only advanced because she wedged that 'useless war', regardless of if she wins or not. 

it is useless to me, since A LOT of students dislike/hate crests (dimitri, lysithea, mercedes, sylvain, marianne and so on)

yet edelgard's so dumb and closed in her own hatred and ideals that she doesn't notice this, when she could've created an allience of people who wanted to stop the crest system instead

but this is no place for this discussion, there's already a thread for that

Edited by Yexin

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Quote

I don't know what you mean by actual reason. Having sided with Edelgard, I see her motivations and quite agree with them. Even if her methods were questionable (understandably so when you consider the logistics of forming a large enough organized rebellion against a tyrannical organization that has already demonstrated its willingness to stamp out and execute dissenters. If Edelgard had chosen to be diplomatic with Claude and Dimitri, she likely would have been found out and executed before consolidating power).

Well at time we had to decide, the only evil thing the church has ever done that we know of is killing people that tried to murder their leader. Considering that Fodlan is a quite medieval inspired society it is fair to assume that all other powers in it would act entirely the same.

On the other side Edelgard have actively tried to kill you and your comrades multiple times (or at least her forces the "soldiers of the flame emperor" have tried that). So given the circumstances it is quite hard to understand why anyone under this conditions would join her.

Edited by Nihilem

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4 minutes ago, Nihilem said:

 

 

Well at time we had to decide, the only evil thing the church has ever done that we know of is killing people that tried to murder their leader. Considering that Fodlan is a quite medieval inspired society it is fair to assume that all other powers in it would act entirely the same.

On the other side Edelgard have actively tried to kill you and your comrades multiple times (or at least her forces the "soldiers of the flame emperor" have tried that). So given the circumstances it is quite hard to understand why anyone under this conditions would join her.

I suppose Byleth would have to share her ideals. Bearing in mind that to make this choice, Byleth had to have heard Edelgard's tragic story, and seen in her an example of damage done by the crest-based governmental system. Even Byleth is an example of a victim of this system, and by this point in the story, he/she has some understanding of what was done to them, by Rhea no less.

 

Byleth has also been advised by his or her father, the one person he or she trusts most, multiple times to not trust Rhea. 

 

It is telling that the choice is labeled as "Protect Edelgard." Because that is in essence what it boils down to. It isn't "betray the church" or "forgive Edelgard." It's "protect Edelgard." Edelgard is a victim with legitimate qualms against an oppressive and unhealthy system (not unlike Lonato). And Byleth has a choice to either stand idly by and let that system claim another victim (his/her precious student) or work with that victim to violently reform the system. It's a tough choice, and there isn't a right or wrong answer here.

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I know all of that. But the game does a poor job to properly convey that. A single line from Byleth saying something like "Wait Rhea, lets first arrest her and try to find out whats actually going on" with Rhea answering "No kill her now to proof that yo are on our side" would be enough to justify that argumentation in a first place.

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1 hour ago, Yexin said:

it is useless to me, since A LOT of students dislike/hate crests (dimitri, lysithea, mercedes, sylvain, marianne and so on)

yet edelgard's so dumb and closed in her own hatred and ideals that she doesn't notice this, when she could've created an allience of people who wanted to stop the crest system instead

but this is no place for this discussion, there's already a thread for that

 

I actually agree with that (and one of the reason I'm hell-bent on recruiting maximum amount of students no matter the route). Thing is, her 'dumbness' is ultimately in-character. She saw her siblings slaughtered and herself carved up like raw burger to become a lab rat with a doomed lifespan, all of it after betrayal of not just the better part of the Empire nobility, but her own family. Bluntly told, trust issues are to be expected after that, so the fact you end up being the one doing that regrouping because Edelgard has been hurt too much to do it herself? Regrettable, but I cannot really call the character dumb when the 'dumbness' is a natural consequence of the character's background. People's life will shape blind spots into them, no matter how smart/dumb they are.

Besides, there is the fact that she cannot know if these people would be ready to make the necessary jump from 'Death to Crests' to 'To the End of the Church' (especially for some with ostensibly 'pious' demeanour or background like Marianne, Mercedes...), since the latter will not accept the overthrow of one element at the heart of the creed smiling vapidly while the change happens. And well, it is Garreg March, heart of the Church's power. One bad choice, and she is surrounded by Knights of Seiros and at the mercy of an archbishop not shy about giving the axe to dissenters. Not exactly a conductive atmosphere for recruitment of the disgruntled.

 

(Well, it is a discussion about Edelgard, looks like it is an appropriate place).

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Also let's not forget that Edelgard feels the territories of the Kingdom and Alliance are rightfully the empires and because of the churches will to weaken the empire, they r allowed to exist. So it's just as much a unification war as it is a reformation of society.

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1 hour ago, Hardric62 said:

She saw her siblings slaughtered and herself carved up like raw burger to become a lab rat with a doomed lifespan

Are you certain? It's implied a couple times that she's the successful "result" while Lysithea is a half-failed experiment. Edelgard also never mentions it in her supports, while Lysithea talks about it with everyone.

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2 hours ago, Nihilem said:

I know all of that. But the game does a poor job to properly convey that. A single line from Byleth saying something like "Wait Rhea, lets first arrest her and try to find out whats actually going on" with Rhea answering "No kill her now to proof that yo are on our side" would be enough to justify that argumentation in a first place.

The game also biased against Rhea in pre-skip by letting you overheard bunch of Rhea’s private conversations but only one of Edelgard’s. Making Rhea sounds more conspiracist than Edelgard.

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I mean you can honestly make up for losing just two units because you can recruit literally everyone else in the monastery if you side with the Church. The actual only reason anyone would side with Edelgard is actually because

Edelgard did nothing wrong

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15 hours ago, Ivan Tridelan said:

The reason to side with Edelgard:

 

Because you didn't say you were joining her, just you've spent almost a year with her and want answers and Rhea is too impatient for El's death and goes full berserk mode on you so I guess it's too late now?

 

14 hours ago, Etheus said:

I don't know what you mean by actual reason. Having sided with Edelgard, I see her motivations and quite agree with them. Even if her methods were questionable (understandably so when you consider the logistics of forming a large enough organized rebellion against a tyrannical organization that has already demonstrated its willingness to stamp out and execute dissenters. If Edelgard had chosen to be diplomatic with Claude and Dimitri, she likely would have been found out and executed before consolidating power).

 

12 hours ago, SSbardock84 said:

I feel low key Edelgard hate in the title lol.

I'll be honest: the topic title was meant to poke a bit of fun at the argument that you would never under any circumstance side with Edelgard no matter what. It was meant to be at least a tad bit humorous.
I myself agree with a lot of the things she says and her motivation to do the things she does is completely fine, even if it may be founded on some misconceptions (like blaming things Rhea did on her own on the entirety of the Church).
Also, I'm all for getting rid of a system that oppresses people. Be it real life or video games.

11 hours ago, Book Bro said:

I mean you can honestly make up for losing just two units because you can recruit literally everyone else in the monastery if you side with the Church.

This is very true.
You'd still be at least two units short, though. And some recruitment requirements can be hard to meet (good luck getting enough Magic on Byleth to get Lysithea).

Edited by DragonFlames

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