Best Classes of your Students (and Faculty) Encore: Edelgard, Dimitri and Claude

[Flere210]

2 hours ago, Silly said:

This sort of discussion happens every time someone brings up "best" or "tier list".

No Fire Emblem game is hard enough to the point where you are pretty much required to play in a specific way to beat it, outside of "dumb" difficulties like early game Awakening Lunatic. Given that this game is a single player game, you are free to experience it however you like. If you want to play using only "low tier" units or classes, that's up to you. If you want a run using only your lord, or only females, or only sword users, that's also up to you. I've personally done many of these things, despite most of this being what is supposedly "inefficient". (As a side note, don't do all mages RD, 4-E-3 is basically impossible and requires grinding Kurth for 50+ turns to clear the map.)

But despite doing dumb stuff all the time, I do my best to look at things objectively.

Is Paladin Amelia better than General Amelia? Definitely. Does this mean that General Amelia won't be able to beat the game? Not at all. Does Paladin Amelia being better than General Amelia mean that I'm only going to be using Paladin? Heck no. Gimme dat big General hunk of metal. My Amelia will tank enemies just as hard as she tanks my turn count, and I'll like it that way.

However, when talking about things like tier lists or optimal class paths online, I'm not going to say that General Amelia is the best unit just because I have used her in that way and beaten the game with it.

I think a lot of it is in the kind of language used. 

D tier for me is a codeword for "worthless trash" and i can't think of a single 3H character that is "worthless trash", so imo a d tier should'n t even exist in the first place, and i am inclined to debate any character that is put there.

To me in this game there are 3 type of characters: stomp the game, stomp the game hard, and stomp the game super hard. 

 

[freewaffles]

17 minutes ago, LegendOfLoog said:

Small point regarding the number of flying battalions. At least in BL, there are more than 4. You get two Seiros Pegasus battalions (one from shop and one from Seteth), one Kingdom Pegasus Battalions, and one Kingdom Wyvern Battalion. On top of this, you get one Cichol Wyvern Battalion from Flayn/Seteth paralogue and one Galatea Pegasus Battalion from Ingrid’s paralogue. However, the Cichol battalion is locked at A rank Authority, making it difficult to achieve for most units. Also, the lower level ones are fairly weak, so riding and infantry units might be able to get better stats simply from battalions.

Perfect.  I think the other routes have the same but named Empire/Alliance instead of Kingdom (not sure about Church route).  So that's three D (Serios X2, Kingdom Peg), one C (Kingdom Wyvern), one B (Ingrid), and one A (Cichol). 

Do any other paralgoues give flyers?  Where is Almyra Wyvern Co (might be enemy only)?

Edited August 27, 2019 by freewaffles

[Shadow Mir]

5 minutes ago, Flere210 said:

I think a lot of it is in the kind of language used. 

D tier for me is a codeword for "worthless trash" and i can't think of a single 3H character that is "worthless trash", so imo a d tier should'n t even exist in the first place, and i am inclined to debate any character that is put there.

To me in this game there are 3 type of characters: stomp the game, stomp the game hard, and stomp the game super hard. 

 

That's...to put it mildly, very generous of you.

[Flere210]

1 minute ago, Shadow Mir said:

That's...to put it mildly, very generous of you.

Honestly, every time you post i am more inclined to do a Raphael solo challenge, or at least a playtrought in wich i kill every single boss by warping Raphael on them.

[freewaffles]

2 minutes ago, Flere210 said:

Honestly, every time you post i am more inclined to do a Raphael solo challenge, or at least a playtrought in wich i kill every single boss by warping Raphael on them.

If you warp Raphael on top of the boss, he will definitely kill them.  He's a big boy.

[magnetic_cactus]

2 hours ago, Jayvee94 said:

The true purpose of picking the best class is to make the difficulty easier. I'm not gonna stop you guys from having a bit too much fun. 😆

To be honest, outside the context of reliable LTC runs, I think a lot of characters have, after putting aside obvious misclasses (e.g. Bishop Felix) many multiple classes that are roughly equal in this department. For example, running Swordmaster Felix instead of Warmaster Felix, or vice versa, will probably be of no real consequence in terms of how "hard" the game is, as both Felixes will mostly annihilate enemies with little risk to themselves. This is even true of more gimmicky comparisons, such as Mortal Savant Dorothea (with Levin+) vs. Gremory Dorothea. The game simply isn't hard enough where a few points of Str or Mag or whatever, or the extra move, will appreciably alter your experience (again, outside the context of reliable LTC). And frankly, if your goal is LTC, you really just need a Dancer, a Wyvern Lord, a Stride-user and a Warper to essentially cheese half the game anyway, so who really cares even then?

Not saying the thread/poll has no merit, just offering my 2c, especially given the fact that this thread has become a little heated over the last few pages (but really, I think that just boils down to different ideas regarding what makes a unit "good"/"optimal").

Edited August 27, 2019 by magnetic_cactus

[Shadow Mir]

24 minutes ago, Flere210 said:

Honestly, every time you post i am more inclined to do a Raphael solo challenge, or at least a playtrought in wich i kill every single boss by warping Raphael on them.

Whatever. To fail to see that he's gutter trash is rather naive and idealistic, if you ask me.

[LegendOfLoog]

29 minutes ago, freewaffles said:

Do any other paralgoues give flyers?  Where is Almyra Wyvern Co (might be enemy only)?

Claude’s personal Battalion, Immortal Corps, is a flier battalion. Also, there’s a list of Battalions on Serenes in the Three Houses info. Black Eagles get an A rank Pegasus Battalion, and Golden Deer get an A rank Wyvern Battalion. So it looks like the highest number of flier battalions comes from going Golden Deer and recruiting Ingrid. You get a grand total of three D rank, two C rank, one B rank, and two A rank flier battalions. Eight fliers is the absolute maximum in GD if you want everyone to have a battalion. Seven in BE, and six in BL. 

[Jayvee94]

Do I have to start the next round prematurely?

Let me remind you that this round, we're talking about Dorothea, Ferdinand and Felix.

The next round will probably be Bernadetta, Petra and Sylvain.

[magnetic_cactus]

1 minute ago, Jayvee94 said:

Do I have to start the next round prematurely?

Let me remind you that this round, we're talking about Dorothea, Ferdinand and Felix.

The next round will probably be Bernadetta, Petra and Sylvain.

Nice. Sylvain is a very flexible character (and that's actually saying quite a bit, since this game is already full of flexibility). Will be a fun topic. 

[Dark Holy Elf]

16 minutes ago, magnetic_cactus said:

For example, running Swordmaster Felix instead of Warmaster Felix, or vice versa, will probably be of no real consequence in terms of how "hard" the game is, as both Felixes will mostly annihilate enemies with little risk to themselves.

I would argue that running him as a Bow Knight does have an appreciable effect on game difficulty compared to either of those. Felix's durability is a bit shaky so I disagree that he can fight in melee indefinitely at little risk to himself. Letting him use his amazing offensive growths to strike enemies from anywhere he needs then canto either to safety or where he will best be useful for the next turn is really great.

It's not a massive effect because no one class change has a massive effect on game difficulty, but I definitely think the performance upgrade is appreciable, as someone who has personally experienced both versions of Felix.

[Jayvee94]

20 hours ago, magnetic_cactus said:

Nice. Sylvain is a very flexible character (and that's actually saying quite a bit, since this game is already full of flexibility). Will be a fun topic. 

So do you suggest I start the next round NOW? Especially if this topic is gonna be derailed otherwise.

[LegendOfLoog]

1 hour ago, freewaffles said:

Do any other paralgoues give flyers?  Where is Almyra Wyvern Co (might be enemy only)?

There is a Serenes page listing all battalions. BE and GD routes both get an extra A rank battalion at the shop, and Claude has a personal flier battalion. So GD has 8, BE has 7, and BL has 6. Fairly certain no other paralogues have fliers as rewards since it seems to be based off canon classes for the character. Cyril doesn’t give you one iirc for completing his paralogue, and only he, Seteth, and Ingrid are canonically fliers. 

Back to the subject at hand, I decided to give War Master Felix a try after seeing how popular it was. I have been very whelmed so far. There has rarely been a scenario where he couldn’t have one rounded a generic enemy or boss as a Bow Knight that he can now as a War Master. The only appreciable difference is that he reliably takes out monster health bars and crits once a round, but that isn’t particularly impressive when he already ORKOs.

You have other options for the niche that War Master Felix provides. Dedue is set from the start to fulfill that role, and if you want the great rewards from the Caspar Mercedes paralogue, you probably have Caspar as well on the BL route to use if you want. Losing out on 3 move (+1 from A+ Riding and Bow Knight movement), Bow Range +2, and Canto in exhange for overkill damage against everything relevant is not worth it when there are other units who are better suited to War Master. 

Edited August 27, 2019 by LegendOfLoog

[magnetic_cactus]

4 minutes ago, Dark Holy Elf said:

I would argue that running him as a Bow Knight does have an appreciable effect on game difficulty compared to either of those. Felix's durability is a bit shaky so I disagree that he can fight in melee indefinitely at little risk to himself. Letting him use his amazing offensive growths to strike enemies from anywhere he needs then canto either to safety or where he will best be useful for the next turn is really great.

It's not a massive effect because no one class change has a massive effect on game difficulty, but I definitely think the performance upgrade is appreciable, as someone who has personally experienced both versions of Felix.

Meh, I have to disagree. The game is really easy on Hard, arguably one of the easier FEs. And partly because of how easy Avo is to obtain in a game with low hit enemies, even on a non-grind run (wouldn't call it LTC, but I did next to zero non story battles and did not go out of my way to obtain mastery skills), I had no issues at all with Felix's survivability as a Swordmaster, including, for example, 1v3 enemy phase scenarios. In the few circumstances where I truly overextended, I could always use another character to snipe one of his would-be attackers, rescue him, dance-in a backup unit, etc; at some point about halfway through the difficulty just doesn't keep pace with your options. Perhaps there are a handful of corner cases where range+canto might have enabled a substantially riskier play (with a commensurately higher reward), but missing out on these handful of *maybe* 1-turn timesaves is, in my opinion anyway, essentially inconsequential in the grand scheme of a non-LTC game. 

Of course, like I hinted above, obvious misclasses (or, although not mentioned above, doing plainly stupid things like running a full team of Lance-using Bishops), will clearly hamstring you. But playing reasonably and catering sufficiently, even if not exclusively, to your units' general strengths should be more than enough in almost every circumstance.

[Cysx]

9 hours ago, Dark Holy Elf said:

Critical hits do not deserve serious hype because they're unreliable and hence inferior to methods of reliably ORKOing enemies which demonstrably exist, particularly on the player phase.

I think this kind of arguments really isn't helping. Warmaster has the highest crit rate in the game, with brave weapons that will apply the rate twice before counter, and the only crit brave weapon the series has ever seen outside of like, Dime thunder?(Edit: it only has 10 crit actually, then again most brave weapons are crit weapons in FE5, #JustThraciathings) Demonic Beasts also take inspiration from monsters in Echoes in the sense that a majority of them have 0 Lck, making crits a genuinely reliable source of damage vs them(outside of when their shields negate them and are up). Furthermore, if we're going to say bad hit rates don't matter because of Divine Pulse, then similarly >40 crit rates *2 are plenty reliable because of it.
And not every enemy dies reliably to WLs all the time, that's hyperbole, even without considering Demonic Beasts.

10 hours ago, Silly said:

For example, let's take a look at your numbers on Raphael. Since you set Raphael at level 30 let's assume enemies are roughly level 30 as well (ch 15 GD). In this chapter, Raphael with your stats (plus a damage boosting battalion) has pretty similar combat against all enemies with either gauntlets or axes except for the following:

Hey, apologies I didn't address your answer to my post. I took too much time and it didn't feel worth it anymore, especially since I didn't have that much to say apart from talking class balance directly, which wasn't the original purpose. Also I get that you don't make the conversation, and you have enough people on your back as of late anyway. So moving on.

It is true that gauntlets struggle with armors to an extent(it's typically fine but might require a crit or two), and have bad EP. I do think it's a disservice to anyone trying to be better at the game however to pretend everything gets ORKOed with ease with axes though, as said above. We're talking stats so let's do that

Swordmaster, lv 30, ch 15:
45 HP, 21 Prt, 29 AS, 42 Avo

Reaching the 33 AS required to double might be troublesome even with darting blow. Safe to say that without it(aka any male, or on EP), WLs aren't doubling. OHKOs are dicey, 66 atk is high for that point in the game. Weapons that would allow for a ORKO are generally either relics/devil or a brave, all of which can be expected to have ~70 displayed hit, and most being very bad for EP. This is of course made even worse with any kind of avoid terrain, but basically, suffice to say axes aren't the best way to deal with them.
A gauntlet user needs 44 Atk instead. The common deathblow warmaster build provides 36, before battalions, weapon, or character stats.  Accuracy is in the 80s, crit rate >40%, making the kill reasonably reliable even on a miss.

Hero, lv 30, ch 15:
51 HP, 24 Prt, 23 AS, 36 Avo

This one is interesting, because Death blow WLs can easily struggle with doubling with weapons strong enough to get the kill(speedsters like Petra aside), and Darting blow ones need 50 Atk to kill. Which might seem easy, but characters will rarely have more than 25+9(from WL) base Str at lv 30, meaning most accurate axes won't cut it and there's a hit problem here too. Either way, they'll likely eat a counter.
In comparison with a Darting Blow WL, a Warmaster will have better Str(about +2 thanks to a consistent +10% growth throughout their class progression), +1 from class base, and of course, +6 from Death Blow, for a combined +9. Meaning that despite weaker weaponry, they'll still have an easier time reaching the 50 atk threshold with respectable accuracy, and much better crit. In fact, with a Killing gauntlet+, ~70 crit rates become possible, which results in a  >90% chance of a crit if both attacks hit; this is also a factor vs armors, by the way.

Those two are just examples of speedsters because that what WLs struggle to kill the most, but another thing to address is their EP; gauntlets users have perhaps the worst EP in this game, unless they're given infinite counter range through gambits, and even then, they'll need to crit and/or double to take down a good amount of threats. However, I take issue with the pretense that WLs are that much better, because to put it simply, 1-2 range sucks in this game. It has low enough Mt and hit, as well as high enough Wt that it's highly impractical when it comes to killing anything that isn't a mage. It also doesn't counter bow users. The real enemy phase units in this game are bow classes, and magic users when used carefully. Using WL de-facto because they're the best class in the game doesn't change the fact that this isn't something they're particualrly stellar at, not enough to make gauntlet users blush. And:

10 hours ago, Silly said:

I want to point out that as a War Master you should probably just use axes as your primary weapon type and have gauntlets as a backup for the occasional situations where it's actually beneficial to use them. The extra attack on gauntlets is kind of unnecessary, considering an axe snags important KOs just as easily.

The above is also why this quote is incorrect. Axes provide very little to a WM outside of mediocre 1-2 range on enemy phase and armor effectiveness it may or may not need with gauntlets, and since they don't get a free 20 base +4 speed(16+2 instead, yeah welcome to the world of non wyvern lords)and cannot get Darting blow no matter what, their AS can easily be lacking with anything above an iron axe; gauntlets will most always avoid a counter either way, and their inherent brave effect applying crit chance twice is a great fit for them, as a safety net for misses, to save up durability, and to kill tougher targets such as the above two examples.

2 hours ago, Jayvee94 said:

Let me remind you that this round, we're talking about Dorothea, Ferdinand and Felix.

R-right, but hm, in Felix's case both WL and WM can be argued to be his best classes, so it's still relevant maybe...?

Edited August 27, 2019 by Cysx

[Jayvee94]

20 hours ago, Cysx said:

R-right, but hm, in Felix's case both WL and WM can be argued to his best classes, so it's still relevant maybe...?

It's fine, dude. This topic was on the verge on getting derailed earlier.  I was contemplating on starting the next round.

Edited August 27, 2019 by Jayvee94

[ApocaLips]

10 hours ago, Jayvee94 said:

It's fine, dude. This topic was on the verge on getting derailed earlier.  I was contemplating on starting the next round.

Completely up to you, but I might suggest rotating bi-weekly. 3-4 days is really enough for the conversation to run, especially for characters like Petra that are pretty straightforward. 

[Elspeth]

On 8/26/2019 at 3:44 PM, timon said:

Why use a Levin Sword when you can cast spells?

Swordfaire is 5 damage, not enough to justify using it over Thoron, Sagittae or Agnea's Arrow. Not only that, but contrary to faith, raising her sword skill is a nightmare since she does absolutely no damage unless you use Hexblade (which can't double). Considering Dorothea's Str you're also never going to double anyone with the Levin Sword, especially with the speed loss of MS.

I'd rather spam crit Thoron 16 times with 2 Meteors than having that faire bonus. In the meantime getting 10 Physics is not exactly a bad thing either.

I guess it all comes down to your last sentence. "You basically lose out on +3 Magic, an extra cast of Meteor, and some Speed growth by going Savant rather than Gremory. That seems like a worthwhile tradeoff to me in exchange for Swordfaire plus a Levin Sword, Black Tomefaire, and better movement." This sounds like a terrible deal, the 1 Mov is the only thing you're gaining (but you're falling behind mounted units anyways, so I don't know how much that matters).

A Levin Sword+ basically IS a Thoron, minus some Crit. Except that, when in Mortal Savant and compared to a Gremory's Thoron, it hits harder thanks to Swordfaire, with her actual Thoron also hitting harder thanks to Black Tomefaire. Losing a single cast of Meteor and two casts of Agnea's Arrow seems like a very worthwhile tradeoff in exchange for her entire kit hitting harder, while also retaining magic uses thanks to the Levin Sword. You can also just give her a good physical sword and Hexblade, which is a nice bonus against anything you wouldn't be doubling anyway (which is an entirely realistic scenario, given her distinctly average Speed growth). I would much, much rather have extra damage on every single cast than have a single extra Meteor per fight, but maybe that's just me. You also lose some casts of Physic, but I have no idea why you would ever need more than five Physics out of Dorothea in the first place, given Linhardt with 10 of them in Bishop plus a potential Dancer with Physic.

Sword also very much isn't hard to train on her. You can easily raise it just through instruction, and if you find that you need more, you can get a Levin Sword and Hexblade as early as Chapter 6 and go to town. Hexblade doesn't need to double when you're using it explicitly for training purposes, after all.

I also think that you underrate the movement bonus. Falling behind mounted units doesn't make extra movement useless; it's still incredibly valuable. It allows you to straight up be more flexible in every single situation.

I will say, however, that I respect your arguments (and how well you've articulated them), and that I think that she makes a fantastic Gremory. I just think that people generally aren't considering her value as a Mortal Savant, when they should be.

23 hours ago, Azure, Roundabouted Out said:

Dang, I am just changing opinions a lot here, am I? First, I had Dorothea as a Dancer, but then I heard the Mortal Savant argument, then the argument against it.

I’ll say, Gremory (or Warlock) Dorothea sounds sick.

Besides, I am considering not recruiting Leonie this time around in Black Eagles now and recruiting Lorenz instead. Which he’ll be a Dancer then instead of Flayn. For spoiler reasons.

 

I think that this really just speaks to how good Dorothea is, to be honest. She's both incredibly strong and incredibly flexible. Not quite as much of a nuke as Lysithea, but I'd put her as the clear second best mage in the game.

[ApocaLips]

32 minutes ago, Elspeth said:

A Levin Sword+ basically IS a Thoron, minus some Crit. Except that, when in Mortal Savant and compared to a Gremory's Thoron, it hits harder thanks to Swordfaire, with her actual Thoron also hitting harder thanks to Black Tomefaire.

Without commenting on the rest of the post, note that gremory provides +5 mag while mortal savant provides only +2. So mortal savant with swordfaire/tomefaire is only doing 2 more damage than gremory in those circumstances. 

 

My two cents on the topic overall is that Dorothea has pretty mediocre growths across the board, so I’m much more interested in a class that emphasizes her utility/great spell list over straight combat. That points me to gremory most of the time, and dancer some of the time depending on how my team shakes out. 

If I want combat and movement on her for some reason, I’d go dark knight instead of mortal savant, which is just kinda better at both for her. I second that there’s not a big benefit to using Levin sword when you already have range 1-3 about as often as you’ll want it on a healer with growths like hers. 

Edited August 27, 2019 by ApocaLips

[Jayvee94]

On 8/27/2019 at 7:05 AM, ApocaLips said:

Completely up to you, but I might suggest rotating bi-weekly. 3-4 days is really enough for the conversation to run, especially for characters like Petra that are pretty straightforward. 

Thanks, I'll take that suggestion.

The Results (when no absolute majority is reached, more than one class will be listed)

• Dorothea - Gremory
• Ferdinand - Wyvern Lord, Great Knight, Paladin
• Felix - Mortal Savant, Swordmaster
• Next Round: Bernadetta, Petra, Sylvain

stay tuned for the updated poll

How do I reset the votes back to zero?

The poll has officially begun, this is what I can say.

• Bernie is pretty straightforward
• For Petra, has a lot of chest keys or recruited Ashe, she may not need to stay as an Assassin
• For Sylvain, for some weird reason, I've seen him appear as a Great Knight as an enemy. (even though I prefer him as a Dark Knight)

Edited August 28, 2019 by Jayvee94

[Dark Holy Elf]

Bernadetta: Has talent in both Bows and Riding, and Bow Knight is an excellent class.

Petra: Has talent in both Axes and Flying, and Wyvern Lord is an excellent class.

Sylvain: I like him in something that makes use of his Black Magic Avo +20 and his access to Physic, and he has talent in both Riding and Reason, so Dark Knight sounds cool to me. One of the best mixed attackers in the game.

[Azure the Scale Tipper]

Bernadetta: Bow Knight. I think we can all agree that this one is no contest.
Looks real nice as a Gremory tho. But that applies to all females.

Petra: While she may be a good swordie, Wyvern Lord is something she can thrive in. And that’s almost too good.

Sylvain: Dark Knight is an honorable mention, but I think Paladin is best. Mostly because you do not have to worry about raising Reason and having it be dead, and you can focus on Lances (with Lancefaire) so the man can get Swift Strikes. Also, Pallies have 8 movement as opposed to the Dark Knight’s 7. I really could have said the same for Ferdinand von Aegir, but Ferdinand can actually raise his Bow rank, unlike our philanderer here.
Great Knight is an option, too, but who said you can’t just go the route of Lance/Axe Pally?
Edit: Oh yeah, and Wyvern Lord. Technically, that is the best option, but this is for viability and levels of sheer fitting.

Edited August 28, 2019 by Azure, Roundabouted Out

[Jakkun]

Bernie: lol Burger King

Petra: lol Wyvern. I actually voted Falcon Knight because I like the class more but just go Wyvern

Sylvain: Donkey Kong. I didn't know this guy learned Physic which makes DK even more appealing to me than it did before. Monk > Mage > Pal > DK sounds like a pretty good class line for him netting him Fiendish Blow along with being able to Physic, taking some of the heat off of only having 4 move as a mage.

[LegendOfLoog]

Bernadetta: I've used her a few times as a Bow Knight, and I can't say I've ever been incredibly impressed. If she goes down the Archer line, she is highly susceptible to being Strength screwed, and neither Archer, Sniper, or Bow Knight have particularly good Strength modifiers. On average as a Level 30 Bow Knight, she has 22 Strength and 22 Speed. This gives her 21 AS with an Iron Bow+ dealing 29 per hit. A Silver Bow+ deals 35 damage at 18 AS. Compare this to Petra as a Wyvern Lord at Level 30, who has 27 Strength and 32 Speed, along with a much better skill from her Intermediate class (Darting Blow or Death Blow, depending on your preference). With an Iron Axe+, Petra has 36 Atk at 30 AS, and with a Silver Axe+, she has 44 Atk at 27 AS. This doesn't include potential benefits from her Intermediate Class that Bernie will likely not have, seeing as she will either have Hit +20 or Desperation. 

As nice as 4 range is, your range advantage doesn't matter much if you're not able to deal much damage with it. Outside of Fliers and Mages, Bernie will struggle to ORKO enemies with her regular attacks. Deadeye has its uses, but once you've reached Bow Knight, there will rarely be a scenario where the drawbacks are worth it anymore. Encloser is actually fairly good when you need to stop an enemy from moving, but again, I would much rather have a unit who can ORKO than one who can temporarily stop a single enemy from moving. After all, many Gambits accomplish the same thing. As a combat unit, Bernie is mediocre at best. However, she is one of only two units in the entire game who can learn Rescue. Even more importantly, the other (Flayn) has a weakness in Riding while Bernie is strong in it. Couple this with her ability to use Physic, and Bernadetta has a niche no other unit does as a Holy Knight. 3 uses of Rescue is usually enough, especially with the other tools she has at her disposal. 

With 7 move and +1 more from getting an A+ in riding, she can Rescue foot units who normally lag behind your other cavalry and fliers, or she can Rescue units that have gone in too deep, allowing you to play quicker and take more risks. She can gain Reposition, essentially a better Smite,  from mastering Soldier, and since she isn't going to see combat very much if at all, her generally mediocre offense doesn't weigh her down as a Holy Knight. In a bind, she can use Physic to help with healing. She does have a low Magic stat, but at least in Black Eagles, Linhardt and Dorothea can pick up her slack if necessary. And since her stats don't really matter much, she can equip support battalions that incur stat penalites but have a good Gambit (Stride or Dance of the Goddess, for example) to further improve her support ability. Finally, Canto ensures she keeps up with the rest of the team. Of course, this is all theorycrafting. But I would rather have a unit who allows me to play a map faster than a unit who deals chip damage against most enemies. 

Petra: I don't have nearly as much to say about her as I think she's a pretty straightforward unit, and I already sort of talked about her in the Bernadetta part. She has high Speed, and she has an easy path to Wyvern Lord, one of the best classes in the game. It's an easy choice.

Sylvain: He's an incredibly flexible unit, so I don't think you can really go wrong with him. He probably is best as a Wyvern Lord as well, but he can take on an interesting role as a Dark Knight.Talents in Reason, Riding, and Lances makes it easy to slot him into it with minimal investment, allowing you to give further investment to other units instead. Unlike most other mages, he has fairly good Strength and Speed bases (9/8 respectively) and growths (45/50 respectively) which makes his doubling more reliable with higher weight tomes. I'll compare him to Annette, the main mage of BL, when they're both Level 30 Dark Knights. With Ragnarok, his highest weight spell, Sylvain has an AS of 17 and an Atk of 44. With Fire, his lowest weight spell, he has an Atk of 32 and an AS of 21. Annette's Excalibur, her highest weight spell, gives her 11 AS and 47-48 Atk while Wind, her lowest weight spell, gives her 16 AS with an Atk of 38-39. These calculations include Mag+2 and Black Tomefaire from the Dark Knight class, but they do not include Fiendish Blow. As you can see, Sylvain is significantly faster than Annette, allowing him to double more often while still dealing a decent amount of magical damage. On top of this, he has access to Lifetaker and better physical bulk than her. His HP/Def growths are 55/40 compared to Annette's HP/Def growths of 25/20. This allows him to actually frontline as a mage and make good use of the Lance of Ruin or some other lance when against a high Res enemy, something Annette cannot do with her 7 less Strength and 5 less speed at Level 30. Add his ability to use Physic, and he's probably one of the best all-rounders in the game who can handle pretty much any situation. 

Edited August 28, 2019 by LegendOfLoog

[freewaffles]

If not making Sylvain a Wyvern, I tend to go Paladin to take advantage of Swift Strikes with Lance of Ruin.  I've also made him a Great Knight with decent success, but Paladin is a superior class.  

Early joining Petra goes into Flying.  Late joining Petra goes Assassin

Bernie is primed to be a Bow Knight.

Edited August 28, 2019 by freewaffles